UNBELIEVABLE! Barney Franks wants to LOWER standards for Fannie/Freddie on condo's!

oreo

Gold Member
Sep 15, 2008
18,102
2,926
290
rocky mountains
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Two U.S. Democratic lawmakers want Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to relax recently tightened standards for mortgages on new condominiums, saying they could threaten the viability of some developments and slow the housing-market recovery, the Wall Street Journal said.

In March, Fannie Mae (FNM.N)(FNM.P) said it would no longer guarantee mortgages on condos in buildings where fewer than 70 percent of the units have been sold, up from 51 percent, the paper said. Freddie Mac (FRE.P)(FRE.N) is due to implement similar policies next month, the paper said.

In a letter to the CEO's of both companies, Representatives Barney Frank, the chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, and Anthony Weiner warned that a 70 percent sales threshold "may be too onerous" and could lead condo buyers to shun new developments, according to the paper.

The legislators asked the companies to "make appropriate adjustments" to their underwriting standards for condos, the paper added.

In an interview with the paper, Weiner said the rules have "had a real chill on the ability to get these condos sold," at a time when prices of condos have fallen enough to attract potential buyers.

In addition to the 70 percent sales threshold, Fannie Mae will also not purchase mortgages in buildings where 15 percent of owners are delinquent on condo association dues or where one owner has more than 10 percent of units, as the firm sees these as signals that a building could run into financial trouble, the paper added.

Both Fannie and Freddie are preparing a response to the lawmakers, according to the paper.

Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac could not be immediately reached for comment by Reuters.
 
Last edited:
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY. When he was asked if he planned on tightening restrictions on Fannie/Freddie he said NO.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.
 
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY. When he was asked if he planned on tightening restrictions on Fannie/Freddie he said NO.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.


You may want to refer to this article again:

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending - The New York Times

If you want to co-sign your name to guarantee these mortgages go ahead--leave my name off of them.
 
Well, why destroy the housing industry once when you can destroy it twice?

After all, utter collapse doesn't happen overnight, you have to plant the seeds early for them to bear fruit.
 
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY. When he was asked if he planned on tightening restrictions on Fannie/Freddie he said NO.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.

Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?
 
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY. When he was asked if he planned on tightening restrictions on Fannie/Freddie he said NO.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.

Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?

You would have to read his posts to see the irony. I only read his posts when I'm looking for a rant or a diatribe. Or, when I'm looking for a foil to use to make a point.
 
I have been in the construction industry for 30+ years in my own business. I have also have had several rental properties. NEVER ONCE--did I need 298 MILLION co-signers.

I also know that if the price is "right" on these condo's there will be investors & "qualified" home buyers that will soak these condo's up--without the need of 298 MILLION co-signers.

To ADD--Freddie/Fannie have "tightened" their regulations based upon RECENT experience! I agree--if homeowner association dues are not being paid by home-owners--it is a clear indication that these homeowners are going to walk on their mortgages. If you don't have a high occupancy rate--this probably indicates this property is in a undersirable location--& anyone knows that when it comes to real estate--it's always-location-location-location.

So for you libs out there that are supporting this--you march behinds right into Barney Franks office & sign your names to these mortgages, keep mine name the hell off.
 
Last edited:
Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.


I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.

Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?

You would have to read his posts to see the irony. I only read his posts when I'm looking for a rant or a diatribe. Or, when I'm looking for a foil to use to make a point.

Do you want to clarify yourself--or are you just farting right now. BTW--did you read

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending - The New York Times

Or was it too much for your brain to comprehend? Pay special attention to the warning in this article if you are are capable of getting past 4th paragraph.
 
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY. When he was asked if he planned on tightening restrictions on Fannie/Freddie he said NO.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.


You may want to refer to this article again:

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending - The New York Times

If you want to co-sign your name to guarantee these mortgages go ahead--leave my name off of them.

Not your decision. The government also guarantees pensions. That too is not your decision. Not anymore, thank God.

And the funny thing is, the GOP spent 6-8 years socializing losses while privatizing the profits. You saw nothing but losses the last 8 years. Did you complain?

And again, if you want things to change, vote. After that, call your Senator. That's about all you can do. But it won't do any good because 72% of us approve.
 
Here we go again. Are you just as tired as I am of Barney Frank co-signing OUR names to mortgages?

DID YOU KNOW:

Last week--our new secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner--while announcing new banking regulations--was asked during the hearing--if he thought Fannie/Freddie had anything to do with the current economic collapse. Geithners reply--DEFINITELY. When he was asked if he planned on tightening restrictions on Fannie/Freddie he said NO.

Well--it turns out that our Banking Queen-Barney Frank-is a little upset because Fannie/Freddie will not guarantee mortgages with our signatures on any condo's that do not have "at least" a 70% occupancy rate. And somehow this is hurting somebody.

Fannie, Freddie asked to relax condo loan rules: report | Reuters

Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.

Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?

Not me.
 
Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?

You would have to read his posts to see the irony. I only read his posts when I'm looking for a rant or a diatribe. Or, when I'm looking for a foil to use to make a point.

Do you want to clarify yourself--or are you just farting right now. BTW--did you read

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending - The New York Times

Or was it too much for your brain to comprehend? Pay special attention to the warning in this article if you are are capable of getting past 4th paragraph.

Most people don't attack people that are on their side of an issue. Interesting technique though.

In case it wasn't clear, I was responding to the post about bobo's post. I didn't say anything about your post. Further, I didn't even post on the content of Sealy's post, just the fact that it may have been ironic.
 
Well, why destroy the housing industry once when you can destroy it twice?

After all, utter collapse doesn't happen overnight, you have to plant the seeds early for them to bear fruit.

Why did people lose their homes? Because they lost their jobs. Why did they lose their jobs? Because Corporations sent all their jobs overseas and the GOP's policies and decisions (deregulations) caused the economic collapse.

Not to mention predatory lending, which we all know happened.

Govt to crack down on predatory lending - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

What does the GOP say about this?

Think Progress » Conservative Congressman Blocking Crackdown on Predatory Lenders Targeting U.S. Troops

A Pentagon report last month found that as many one in five U.S. service members “are being preyed on by loan centers set up near military bases” that can charge interest of 400 percent or more. Increasingly, soldiers have debt levels so high they are barred from serving overseas; others suffer from “bankruptcies, divorces and ruined careers.” (More facts HERE.)

You right wingers are scum to me. If you don't realize this is happening, then you are idiots. One or the other.
 
Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.


I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.

Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?

You would have to read his posts to see the irony. I only read his posts when I'm looking for a rant or a diatribe. Or, when I'm looking for a foil to use to make a point.

Do you want to clarify yourself--or are you just farting right now. BTW--did you read

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending - The New York Times

Or was it too much for your brain to comprehend? Pay special attention to the warning in this article if you are are capable of getting past 4th paragraph.
 
Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.

Does anyone else see the irony in bobo's post?

You would have to read his posts to see the irony. I only read his posts when I'm looking for a rant or a diatribe. Or, when I'm looking for a foil to use to make a point.

Have you ever made a point?
 
Don't you want the housing market to pick up? And these condo's are generally cheaper than homes, so its less of a risk. And what are the requirements? You do realize banks and car companies are being real tight with their money right now. We need to get them to loosen up the purse strings.

And because now that Democrats are in charge, the banks have to keep the appropriate amount of cash on hand in case of an economic emergency, PLUS, they aren't bundling up all the "TOXIC ASSETS" and selling them up the ladder. PLUS, they aren't predatory lending. So people won't be losing their homes because of adjustable rates.

And yes, people might lose their jobs and then not be able to pay. So do you want to just stay in this recession or work to get out of it?

You right wingers spin everything the way you want.

I can not imagine a scenerio where I would vote GOP ever again in my lifetime. You guys are just so intellectually dishonest. Maybe if I hit the lotto I'll change my mind, but that's about it. You guys are liars, greedy and ignorant.


You may want to refer to this article again:

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending - The New York Times

If you want to co-sign your name to guarantee these mortgages go ahead--leave my name off of them.

Not your decision. The government also guarantees pensions. That too is not your decision. Not anymore, thank God.

And the funny thing is, the GOP spent 6-8 years socializing losses while privatizing the profits. You saw nothing but losses the last 8 years. Did you complain?

And again, if you want things to change, vote. After that, call your Senator. That's about all you can do. But it won't do any good because 72% of us approve.



I pay into my "pension"--it's called Social Security--DUH! Did I notice anything over the last 8 years. No, I can go back to 1995--& actually listen per video tape democrat banking boards laughing at all the warnings from independant agencies-- along with context from warnings from the Bush administration starting in 2001 & up. Democrats on the hill--just like Barney is trying to do right now "de-regulate" or lessen the requirements for Fannie/Freddie--against everything that we have learned the hard way. GET A CLUE: Fannie/Freddie are GROUND ZERO for this economic collapse.
 
Last edited:
I have been in the construction industry for 30+ years in my own business. I have also have had several rental properties. NEVER ONCE--did I need 298 MILLION co-signers.

I also know that if the price is "right" on these condo's there will be investors & "qualified" home buyers that will soak these condo's up--without the need of 298 MILLION co-signers.

To ADD--Freddie/Fannie have "tightened" their regulations based upon RECENT experience! I agree--if homeowner association dues are not being paid by home-owners--it is a clear indication that these homeowners are going to walk on their mortgages. If you don't have a high occupancy rate--this probably indicates this property is in a undersirable location--& anyone knows that when it comes to real estate--it's always-location-location-location.

So for you libs out there that are supporting this--you march behinds right into Barney Franks office & sign your names to these mortgages, keep mine name the hell off.

You never needed it? Oh, so I guess then no Americans should get it if you never needed it. You never needed welfare either, right? So we should cut everyone off on that too.

Because you are at the bottom of the economic ladder, right?
 
I am not sure what the big deal with this is. According to the OP the standards that are being relaxed are that the government will not guarantee mortgages for condos that are not more than 70% full. What difference does that make and why should someone who wants to purchase a condo in which only 50% of the units have been sold not be able to secure a guarantee on their loan like everyone else? I am not understanding this one.

Now, if it were based on the credit worthiness of the creditor, I can understand, but why does the percentage of condos sold matter?

Immie
 
Well, why destroy the housing industry once when you can destroy it twice?

After all, utter collapse doesn't happen overnight, you have to plant the seeds early for them to bear fruit.

Why did people lose their homes? Because they lost their jobs. Why did they lose their jobs? Because Corporations sent all their jobs overseas and the GOP's policies and decisions (deregulations) caused the economic collapse.

Not to mention predatory lending, which we all know happened.

Govt to crack down on predatory lending - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

What does the GOP say about this?

Think Progress » Conservative Congressman Blocking Crackdown on Predatory Lenders Targeting U.S. Troops

A Pentagon report last month found that as many one in five U.S. service members “are being preyed on by loan centers set up near military bases” that can charge interest of 400 percent or more. Increasingly, soldiers have debt levels so high they are barred from serving overseas; others suffer from “bankruptcies, divorces and ruined careers.” (More facts HERE.)

You right wingers are scum to me. If you don't realize this is happening, then you are idiots. One or the other.

The biggest precipitating factor of the financial meltdown was when Fannie and Freddie became insolvent and had to be rescued by the government.

Add this article from 2002 Washingtonian Magazine to OREO's collection Fannie Mae issues circa 2001-2002

Of course the logical outgrowth of such problems would be an investigation and attempt to regulate the potential troublemaker right? But, Bush wasn't for regulating anything so that never happened, right? Yeah, except it did. (September 11, 2003)

The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.

Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry.

The new agency would have the authority, which now rests with Congress, to set one of the two capital-reserve requirements for the companies. It would exercise authority over any new lines of business. And it would determine whether the two are adequately managing the risks of their ballooning portfolios.

Here's the link: New Agency to regulate Fannie and Freddie

But, stupid ass Barney's Frank had this to say,

''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

And, we know that just a few year's later they were so out of balance that they could no longer meet their obligations. That would make Frank wrong. He was wrong then and he's wrong now. He's almost always wrong about everything.

Meanwhile, Franklin Delano Raines, was pilfering all the money from Fannie Mae, to the tune of $14 million dollars a year. Raiding the sweet little Democrat piggy bank that was Fannie Mae. And he wasn't the only one. Jamie Garelic, you remember her? No? She's the one that made the rule that the FBI and CIA couldn't talk to each other when she was at the justice department under Bill (not literally, just figuratively). As her reward, she got to raid millions from Fannie Mae. Then she got on the 9-11 commission to make sure she didn't get busted for stove-piping the FBI and CIA.

And you call the Repubs scum? :cuckoo:
 
Last edited:

Forum List

Back
Top