Theocracy In America--Who wants this?

[sky dancer]

"Christians have an obligation, a mandate, a commission, a holy responsibility to reclaim the land for Jesus Christ -- to have dominion in civil structures, just as in every other aspect of life and godliness. But it is dominion we are after. Not just a voice. It is dominion we are after. Not just influence. It is dominion we are after. Not just equal time. It is dominion we are after. World conquest. That's what Christ has commissioned us to accomplish. We must win the world with the power of the Gospel. And we must never settle for anything less... Thus, Christian politics has as its primary intent the conquest of the land -- of men, families, institutions, bureaucracies, courts, and governments for the Kingdom of Christ."

(From The Changing of the Guard: Biblical Principles for Political Action by George Grant, published in 1987 by Dominion Press)
http://www.brucegourley.com/christiannation/theocracy.htm

A question came up about theocracy in Israel on another thread. Israel was founded as a theocracy.

What concerns me more is that some Americans want the US to be a Christian theocracy--which goes against everything the founders intended. I thought this may be an interesting topic.

What do you think?

 

[sky dancer]

Here's another article to stimulate discussion:

"Reconstructionism is a theology that arose out of conservative Presbyterianism (Reformed and Orthodox), which proposes that contemporary application of the laws of Old Testament Israel, or ''Biblical Law,'' is the basis for reconstructing society toward the Kingdom of God on earth.

Reconstructionism argues that the Bible is to be the governing text for all areas of life--such as government, education, law, and the arts, not merely ''social'' or ''moral'' issues like pornography, homosexuality, and abortion. Reconstructionists have formulated a ''Biblical world view'' and ''Biblical principles'' by which to examine contemporary matters. Reconstructionist theologian David Chilton succinctly describes this view: ''The Christian goal for the world is the universal development of Biblical theocratic republics, in which every area of life is redeemed and placed under the Lordship of Jesus Christ and the rule of God's law.''

More broadly, Reconstructionists believe that there are three main areas of governance: family government, church government, and civil government. Under God's covenant, the nuclear family is the basic unit. The husband is the head of the family, and wife and children are ''in submission'' to him. In turn, the husband ''submits'' to Jesus and to God's laws as detailed in the Old Testament. The church has its own ecclesiastical structure and governance. Civil government exists to implement God's laws. All three institutions are under Biblical Law, the implementation of which is called ''theonomy.''

Epitomizing the Reconstructionist idea of Biblical ''warfare'' is the centrality of capital punishment under Biblical Law. Doctrinal leaders (notably Rushdoony, North, and Bahnsen) call for the death penalty for a wide range of crimes in addition to such contemporary capital crimes as rape, kidnapping, and murder. Death is also the punishment for apostasy (abandonment of the faith), heresy, blasphemy, witchcraft, astrology, adultery, ''sodomy or homosexuality,'' incest, striking a parent, incorrigible juvenile delinquency, and, in the case of women, ''unchastity before marriage.''

According to Gary North, women who have abortions should be publicly executed, ''along with those who advised them to abort their children.''
Christian Reconstructionism - religious cults, sects and movements

 

[Anguille]

"Christians have an obligation, a mandate, a commission, a holy responsibility to reclaim the land for Jesus Christ -- to have dominion in civil structures, just as in every other aspect of life and godliness. But it is dominion we are after. Not just a voice. It is dominion we are after. Not just influence. It is dominion we are after. Not just equal time. It is dominion we are after. World conquest. That's what Christ has commissioned us to accomplish. We must win the world with the power of the Gospel. And we must never settle for anything less... Thus, Christian politics has as its primary intent the conquest of the land -- of men, families, institutions, bureaucracies, courts, and governments for the Kingdom of Christ."

(From The Changing of the Guard: Biblical Principles for Political Action by George Grant, published in 1987 by Dominion Press)
American Theocracy: Who Wants to Turn America into a Theocracy?

A question came up about theocracy in Israel on another thread. Israel was founded as a theocracy.

What concerns me more is that some Americans want the US to be a Christian theocracy--which goes against everything the founders intended. I thought this may be an interesting topic.

What do you think?

Great thread topic! I can say lots later but need to go to lunch. I was listening to a radio interview with the author of Crazy for God, the son of a Christian misionary and a former anti choice advocate who knew Jerry Falwell and who came to the conclusion that he and others of his ilk were calling for Christians to destroy our government and defy the Constitution.

 

[sky dancer]

I only caught a small portion of that interview, Ang. Look forward to discussing that with you later.

 

[sky dancer]

Check out House Resolution 888:

Therefore:

(2) recognizes that the religious foundations of faith on which America was built are critical underpinnings of our Nation's most valuable institutions and form the inseparable foundation for America's representative processes, legal systems, and societal structures;

(3) rejects, in the strongest possible terms, any effort to remove, obscure, or purposely omit such history from our Nation's public buildings and educational resources; and......
The Beginning of an American Theocracy

Here you have it ladies and gentlemen. The beginnings of a theocracy.

 

[RodISHI]

"Christians have an obligation, a mandate, a commission, a holy responsibility to reclaim the land for Jesus Christ -- to have dominion in civil structures, just as in every other aspect of life and godliness. But it is dominion we are after. Not just a voice. It is dominion we are after. Not just influence. It is dominion we are after. Not just equal time. It is dominion we are after. World conquest. That's what Christ has commissioned us to accomplish. We must win the world with the power of the Gospel. And we must never settle for anything less... Thus, Christian politics has as its primary intent the conquest of the land -- of men, families, institutions, bureaucracies, courts, and governments for the Kingdom of Christ."

(From The Changing of the Guard: Biblical Principles for Political Action by George Grant, published in 1987 by Dominion Press)
American Theocracy: Who Wants to Turn America into a Theocracy?

A question came up about theocracy in Israel on another thread. Israel was founded as a theocracy.

What concerns me more is that some Americans want the US to be a Christian theocracy--which goes against everything the founders intended. I thought this may be an interesting topic.

What do you think?

I think your precepts concerning what the founding fathers of this country are flawed. I also think that you may be misinformed or lumping too many Christians into a perception that you have about all Christians is because of what is being taught by a few or more misguided preachers that are not teaching what Jesus/Yahushua taught.

 

[sky dancer]

I think your precepts concerning what the founding fathers of this country are flawed. I also think that you may be misinformed or lumping too many Christians into a perception that you have about all Christians is because of what is being taught by a few or more misguided preachers that are not teaching what Jesus/Yahushua taught.

Show some evidence please. I am not lumping all Christians together at all. The articles clearly shows which Christians promote theocracy.

 

[Care4all]

Show some evidence please. I am not lumping all Christians together at all. The articles clearly shows which Christians promote theocracy.

if it does, then, Which Christians are clearly doing this? the two ministers you quoted?


if having the 10 commandments carved on the supreme court walls is the beginning of a theocracy then why didn't it turn in to a theocracy the decades ago when they carved them there? Those things are ridiculous, skydancer....they have nothing to do with the federal government supporting an "Established Church" which is what they are forbid to do?

The first article is from 1987, and these people have failed to do what they wanted, it has been 20 years since then and, we the people still have our democracy....because our constitution is strong....

I'd be more worried about Secular Corporations taking away our freedoms (and rape of us our money and liberty), than these fanatical religious groups that purposely misrepresent Scripture for their own political gain....not religious gain, but political power and gain imo.

ya know?

Care

 

[sky dancer]

Care--

If you go back to the article and actually check it out there is an entire list of organizations that support the theocracy movement.

In 20 years this movement has made many gains. The legislation I listed is one of them.

 

[RodISHI]

if it does, then, Which Christians are clearly doing this? the two ministers you quoted?


if having the 10 commandments carved on the supreme court walls is the beginning of a theocracy then why didn't it turn in to a theocracy the decades ago when they carved them there? Those things are ridiculous, skydancer....they have nothing to do with the federal government supporting an "Established Church" which is what they are forbid to do?

The first article is from 1987, and these people have failed to do what they wanted, it has been 20 years since then and, we the people still have our democracy....because our constitution is strong....

I'd be more worried about Secular Corporations taking away our freedoms (and rape of us our money and liberty), than these fanatical religious groups that purposely misrepresent Scripture for their own political gain....not religious gain, but political power and gain imo.

ya know?

Care

Amen, very good points care thank you!

 

[RodISHI]

Show some evidence please. I am not lumping all Christians together at all. The articles clearly shows which Christians promote theocracy.

I'll get back to answer this a little later today sky when I have a bit more time.

 

[sky dancer]

Let me ask you two Christians a question? What is your view of religious freedom in America?

I'm interested in preserving religious freedom because I am NOT a Christian, but I do have a spiritual path. Currently, I consider being an American valuable because of having religious freedom.

If the US adopts Christianity as a national religion that would go against the motivation of the pilgrims who came to America to be able to freely practice their religion.

 

[xsited1]

What do you think?

It's unconstitutional. End of story.

 

[Care4all]

Care--

If you go back to the article and actually check it out there is an entire list of organizations that support the theocracy movement.

In 20 years this movement has made many gains. The legislation I listed is one of them.

Oh there is no denying they have garnered support from time to time, but this election has shown that this movement is DEAD imo....dead in the sense that there is no way in the world would they be able to turn this secular country of ours in to a theocracy....

I despise this movement mainly because I am religious....and i believe in prophesy and in prophesy it is the various governments that end up being corrupt....(short version of the prophesy)

And to cohabitate with politicians who we all know would sell their soul to Satan is a big mistake for anyone promoting a loving and caring and honest and just God, imho.

So when I see these kind of Pastors promoting political agendas, my alarm system is triggered and larms go off like mad!!!

Care

 

[glockmail]

.....
What concerns me more is that some Americans want the US to be a Christian theocracy--which goes against everything the founders intended. I thought this may be an interesting topic.

What do you think?

America was founded on Christian principles, which include respect and tolerance of those who aren't believers. Perhaps the non-believers should show a similar level of respect and tolerance of the society that gives them the right to believe whatever they damn well please.

 

[Father Time]

America was founded on Christian principles, which include respect and tolerance of those who aren't believers. Perhaps the non-believers should show a similar level of respect and tolerance of the society that gives them the right to believe whatever they damn well please.

What exactly have they done that's so intolerant?

 

[ABikerSailor]

A Christian theocracy is a bad idea. Matter of fact, there are Biblical, as well as Torah references concerning this. Israel (which is the nation of priests to the world, as designated by God), is the only country that God said should be set up like that. But, just like Christians have done to the Jews for many years, they are trying to take that concept for themselves, and they end up bastardizing it. Check the 7 Noahide Commandments for what the rest of the world is supposed to be doing.

And.....given the way that most churches here in America operate today (exclusion principle big time), by being bigoted because of your appearance, how much money you make, what you drive, etc., if there was a Christian theocracy in place, you would see the "undesirables" shut out (or worse), and the rest of us would become lobotomized sheep for the select few greedy bastards at the top.

Matter of fact, a good example of what could happen is currently reflected in George Bush telling people that God wanted him to run for president, sucking up to the Christian Coalition, and all that other good stuff.

What did we end up with? Economy crashing, people going broke, and the fat cats at the top, robbing us blind.

Nope. Bad idea.

 

[Mr. President]

Only extremist want a religious theocracy in America. Their ideals are much like the Klan and Panthers.

 

[Anguille]

Let me ask you two Christians a question? What is your view of religious freedom in America?

I'm interested in preserving religious freedom because I am NOT a Christian, but I do have a spiritual path. Currently, I consider being an American valuable because of having religious freedom.

If the US adopts Christianity as a national religion that would go against the motivation of the pilgrims who came to America to be able to freely practice their religion.

Actually the colonists were incredibly intolerant concerning religion. Quakers were hanged.
It wasn't till later that tolerance and the understanding that the US was to be a secular, multi religious nation came about.

 

[strollingbones]

What exactly have they done that's so intolerant?

not bowing at their altars...is what we have done....odd how we do not try to convert them but they are continually trying to prove how great their god is ...and how very tolerant they are...having our own holidays that came before theirs...need i go on? not being in a god for an insurance plan....having the nerve to be different....the list just goes on and on