The Way Obama Is Treating Our Military Is Worse Than I Thought

[SteadyMercury]

WTF does a police force need a MRAP for????

Surely you've seen where they have hostage or barricade situations and the police use some sort of armored vehicle to enable them to approach or engage safely?

Why build custom ones if you can get military surplus for cheaper or free, makes sense to me.

 

[jillian]

WTF does a police force need a MRAP for????

why does a private citizen need an M-16?

oh...and the answer to your question: to blow the bejeezus out of armed insurrectionist anti-gubmint loons.

 

[mudwhistle]

WTF does a police force need a MRAP for????

Surely you've seen where they have hostage or barricade situations and the police use some sort of armored vehicle to enable them to approach or engage safely?

Why build custom ones if you can get military surplus for cheaper or free, makes sense to me.

Not if we spent $600,000.00 for each of them a couple of years ago and dumped them for $2000.

Our troops don't have enough of them and the White House is giving them away.

Does that sound frugal to you?

 

[mudwhistle]

WTF does a police force need a MRAP for????

why does a private citizen need an M-16?

oh...and the answer to your question: to blow the bejeezus out of armed insurrectionist anti-gubmint loons.

A private citizen can't own an M16.

They're AR15s. They look the same but don't have the same capabilities.

I wouldn't own one. I'd rather have an AK47.

 

[SteadyMercury]

Found some stuff but nothing like a nice year over year chart I'd hoped was out there.

Apparently in 2012 the Navy did their largest force reduction which had about 3,000 involuntary separations.

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/03/navy-thinning-forcing-out-thousands-sailors

Humburg's husband, who chose not to be interviewed for this story, is one of about 3,000 sailors who will lose their jobs in the coming months as part of an unprecedented and drastic effort to thin the Navy's ranks in overcrowded job fields.

While the Navy's ranks are slowly shrinking - the service now keeps 324,000 active-duty personnel, about 50,000 fewer than a decade ago - officials say the enlisted retention board layoffs are not simply about cutting, and they're not directly driven by larger efforts to reduce military spending. Rather, they are about rebalancing the force.

The Navy explains it this way: Because of the economy, far fewer sailors are leaving the service than in years past. As a result, 31 of the Navy's 85 enlisted fields have become badly overcrowded. For sailors in those job categories, such as aircraft maintenance, that has meant fewer opportunities for promotion, which has swelled the midcareer ranks. While the Navy can compensate to a degree by enlisting fewer new sailors into overmanned fields, it cannot stop altogether; for budgetary reasons and for longer-term force effectiveness, it needs to keep a particular number of sailors in each field and in each pay grade.

More on force reductions in 2014 here: Soldiers survive combat, then lose their jobs

In its first effort to thin the ranks under budget pressure, the Army is letting 3,000 G.I.s go in order to thin ranks to 490,000 by the end of next year.

About 500 Army non-commissioned officers ranging from staff sergeants to command sergeants major are slated to lose their jobs this year; another 484 are receiving notices this month that they are being fired in 2015. All have been or will be given at least a year's notice to prepare, Seamands says. The Army has involuntarily separated soldiers during at least two previous drawdowns — after the Vietnam and Persian Gulf wars.

Lt. Cmdr. Chris Servello, a Navy spokesman, says the service reduced its ranks during the war years to 323,000 this year and does not anticipate further cuts for now.

 

[mudwhistle]

Michelle said yesterday her husband's program has found jobs for 500,000 separated military members since it began.

???

Weren't we talking about involuntary separations? What does total separated have to do with proving how many suffered same fate as your boomer buddy?

500,000 is a lot.

I've tried to look into the numbers, but the DoD hasn't updated them since 2011. Every link to a current military strength tally goes to nothing or is diverted to something unrelated. I'm tired of searching.

Maybe you can get somebody inside of the administration to post some real current numbers.

 

[SteadyMercury]

Not if we spent $600,000.00 for each of them a couple of years ago and dumped them for $2000.

They bought a lot of these for wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Our military was designed (and equipped) to fight Soviet tanks rolling across Europe and Soviet bombers attacking our carriers. When we ended up in long campaigns in Iraq and Afghanistan our needs changed so the military purchased a shit-ton of these types of vehicles to better protect our troops.

Those wars have ended or are drawing down, so there is surplus military equipment.

Our troops don't have enough of them and the White House is giving them away.

I don't believe this is true, from what I've heard there are thousands of excess and one of the bigger jobs right now is hauling them back to the US.

Does that sound frugal to you?

Yes, sounds frugal for the police department. Wasn't that your original question, why would police have one?

 

[NLT]

Something stinks about this story.

He had 18.5 years in the NUCLEAR SUB service and he's only an E6?!

You don't even get on the subs until you're an E-4 or above.

Your advancment is automatic at least until E-5 and this guy spent at least 6 years in the NUKIE NAV and was ONLY a THIRD CLASS?

No we are NOT getting the whole story.

More right wing whining about obama that is based on lies.

All the real stuff that the right ought to be bitching about about Obama they don't get so they are left making shit up.

Idiots.

Wasnt that way when I served (1979-2002) I was sationed at New London Sub base (85-87) and the were plenty of E-3 and below on subs.

 

[mudwhistle]

Found some stuff but nothing like a nice year over year chart I'd hoped was out there.

Apparently in 2012 the Navy did their largest force reduction which had about 3,000 involuntary separations.

Navy thinning is forcing out thousands of sailors | HamptonRoads.com | PilotOnline.com

Humburg's husband, who chose not to be interviewed for this story, is one of about 3,000 sailors who will lose their jobs in the coming months as part of an unprecedented and drastic effort to thin the Navy's ranks in overcrowded job fields.

While the Navy's ranks are slowly shrinking - the service now keeps 324,000 active-duty personnel, about 50,000 fewer than a decade ago - officials say the enlisted retention board layoffs are not simply about cutting, and they're not directly driven by larger efforts to reduce military spending. Rather, they are about rebalancing the force.

The Navy explains it this way: Because of the economy, far fewer sailors are leaving the service than in years past. As a result, 31 of the Navy's 85 enlisted fields have become badly overcrowded. For sailors in those job categories, such as aircraft maintenance, that has meant fewer opportunities for promotion, which has swelled the midcareer ranks. While the Navy can compensate to a degree by enlisting fewer new sailors into overmanned fields, it cannot stop altogether; for budgetary reasons and for longer-term force effectiveness, it needs to keep a particular number of sailors in each field and in each pay grade.

More on force reductions in 2014 here: Soldiers survive combat, then lose their jobs

About 500 Army non-commissioned officers ranging from staff sergeants to command sergeants major are slated to lose their jobs this year; another 484 are receiving notices this month that they are being fired in 2015. All have been or will be given at least a year's notice to prepare, Seamands says. The Army has involuntarily separated soldiers during at least two previous drawdowns — after the Vietnam and Persian Gulf wars.

Lt. Cmdr. Chris Servello, a Navy spokesman, says the service reduced its ranks during the war years to 323,000 this year and does not anticipate further cuts for now.

Here's a great idea.

Push a bunch of Native Americans out and offer illegals a chance to join the military and earn citizenship.

This is something that members of Congress proposed a couple of weeks ago.

Many of them are Repugs.

What a great idea. Bounce out loyal Americans and bring in a bunch of non-English speaking America haters and give them guns.

Exclusive: House Republicans' Secret Immigration Ploy

 

[SteadyMercury]

500,000 is a lot.

It sure is, but I don't understand why you are using it to counter assertions about involuntary separations.

I think we can all agree that the military is undergoing a drawdown, from a combination of budget cuts and wars ending/ended. They do this thru a combination of natural attrition and some involuntary cuts. From what I have found the involuntary cuts haven't been that significant in numbers, with the Navy's biggest purge in 2012 which might be what your coworker got caught up in.

 

[mudwhistle]

Not if we spent $600,000.00 for each of them a couple of years ago and dumped them for $2000.

They bought a lot of these for wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Our military was designed (and equipped) to fight Soviet tanks rolling across Europe and Soviet bombers attacking our carriers. When we ended up in long campaigns in Iraq and Afghanistan our needs changed so the military purchased a shit-ton of these types of vehicles to better protect our troops.

Those wars have ended or are drawing down, so there is surplus military equipment.

Our troops don't have enough of them and the White House is giving them away.

I don't believe this is true, from what I've heard there are thousands of excess and one of the bigger jobs right now is hauling them back to the US.

Does that sound frugal to you?

Yes, sounds frugal for the police department. Wasn't that your original question, why would police have one?

Dude, STFU.

An MRAP is a vehicle designed to protect our troops from IEDs and sniper fire......not Soviet tanks.

Unloading these vehicles while they're still in great working condition is bogus. You wait till they become outdated and or useless for the mission, not when they are still needed by troops currently in harms way. Who's to say that once these have been dumped to the BLM or police we don't have to go into some Middle Eastern country to protect the oil fields. This kind of short-sighteness is what gave us every war in our history.

 

[SteadyMercury]

Here's a great idea.

Push a bunch of Native Americans out and offer illegals a chance to join the military and earn citizenship.

Even when undergoing force reduction you need new recruits, and as my link showed the Navy was mainly doing it to rebalance overcrowded job fields.

What a great idea. Bounce out loyal Americans and bring in a bunch of non-English speaking America haters and give them guns.

Hah you don't know anything about the people that could be in this program, have no idea what they hate or their level of language proficiency. I served with US military members from Mexico, Puerto Rico, South Africa, etc. and I observed no difference in commitment to the job.

To be honest the way you're bouncing from boomer guy to vehicles to immigration reform it sounds like it is more about some general anger and ranting than anything particular to your coworker.

 

[SteadyMercury]

Dude, STFU.

An MRAP is a vehicle designed to protect our troops from IEDs and sniper fire......not Soviet tanks.

I know this, my point sailed past your head. Let me try again:

The US military wasn't designed for the wars against insurgents, it was designed to fight the cold war so our equipment, tactics, and expertise where geared towards stopping Soviet armor in Europe and Soviet bombers over the Atlantic.

For that reason we required a massive buildup of MRAPs which are better suited for the roles in Iraq and Afghanistan. We bought a lot, and now we have extra.

 

[mudwhistle]

500,000 is a lot.

It sure is, but I don't understand why you are using it to counter assertions about involuntary separations.

I think we can all agree that the military is undergoing a drawdown, from a combination of budget cuts and wars ending/ended. They do this thru a combination of natural attrition and some involuntary cuts. From what I have found the involuntary cuts haven't been that significant in numbers, with the Navy's biggest purge in 2012 which might be what your coworker got caught up in.

From what you've seen?

Just how accurate is that?

Do you have all of the numbers at your fingertips?

If not what you've seen isn't the whole story.

Read the Army Times.

They're talking 100,000. The VA isn't taking care of what they had, much less the influx of new veterans needed screening.

I repeat the question: Was Michelle lying when she said her husband's program helped 500,000 since it was started? If it's only a few thousand where did she get this 500,000 number from. Out of her ample ass?

 

[Sallow]

Here's a great idea.

Push a bunch of Native Americans out and offer illegals a chance to join the military and earn citizenship.

Even when undergoing force reduction you need new recruits, and as my link showed the Navy was mainly doing it to rebalance overcrowded job fields.

What a great idea. Bounce out loyal Americans and bring in a bunch of non-English speaking America haters and give them guns.

Hah you don't know anything about the people that could be in this program, have no idea what they hate or their level of language proficiency. I served with US military members from Mexico, Puerto Rico, South Africa, etc. and I observed no difference in commitment to the job.

To be honest the way you're bouncing from boomer guy to vehicles to immigration reform it sounds like it is more about some general anger and ranting than anything particular to your coworker.

He's deflected several times from his OP.

That's BAU for Mr. Mudwhistle.

 

[Howey]

We just hired another WG-10 this week.

He's prior service Navy with over 18 years. He was a crewman on a nuke Sub. A year and a half ago (October 2012) he was told that he had 10 days to get his things in order because they were processing him out......for the good of the Navy.

Problem is, his record was clean, he had no idea before hand that he was even being considered for early separation. Today would have been 20 years of military service and he would have been able to retire. Now, his military retirement is shot to hell.

This is the way Obama is gutting the military. Giving them days, not months, to prepare for unemployment.

On a side note, it's nice that Michelle was on post (Ft Campbell) telling everyone all of the wonderful shit they're doing for the people they're getting ready to involuntarily shove out into the street.

How nice of her.

Source?

 

[mudwhistle]

Here's a great idea.

Push a bunch of Native Americans out and offer illegals a chance to join the military and earn citizenship.

Even when undergoing force reduction you need new recruits, and as my link showed the Navy was mainly doing it to rebalance overcrowded job fields.

What a great idea. Bounce out loyal Americans and bring in a bunch of non-English speaking America haters and give them guns.

Hah you don't know anything about the people that could be in this program, have no idea what they hate or their level of language proficiency. I served with US military members from Mexico, Puerto Rico, South Africa, etc. and I observed no difference in commitment to the job.

To be honest the way you're bouncing from boomer guy to vehicles to immigration reform it sounds like it is more about some general anger and ranting than anything particular to your coworker.

He's deflected several times from his OP.

That's BAU for Mr. Mudwhistle.

I haven't deflected anything.

You just don't pay attention to the answers. You don't like them so you call them a deflection.

I mention something related and you call it a deflection.

 

[mudwhistle]

We just hired another WG-10 this week.

He's prior service Navy with over 18 years. He was a crewman on a nuke Sub. A year and a half ago (October 2012) he was told that he had 10 days to get his things in order because they were processing him out......for the good of the Navy.

Problem is, his record was clean, he had no idea before hand that he was even being considered for early separation. Today would have been 20 years of military service and he would have been able to retire. Now, his military retirement is shot to hell.

This is the way Obama is gutting the military. Giving them days, not months, to prepare for unemployment.

On a side note, it's nice that Michelle was on post (Ft Campbell) telling everyone all of the wonderful shit they're doing for the people they're getting ready to involuntarily shove out into the street.

How nice of her.

Source?

Read it retard.

This is a personal testimony, not an internet story posted by some journalist.

Want a source?
[MENTION=20102]mudwhistle[/MENTION]

 

[Howey]

Dude, I gave you the facts. You just can't believe this is going on......

Those of us who are in the DoD are having trouble dealing with this happy horseshit, but it has been a fact of life since the prick got in the White House. Like the fact that on post gas prices currently are 20 cents/gal higher than off post. I've been in or around the military since 1974 and I've never seen such asinine treatment of the military.

Dude...you are full of shit. I was the NCOIC of Separations when I was in the service. This is not allegorial. It's the truth.

a. It didn't go on before the "prick" got in the White House because the "prick" who was in the White House before him escalated the military and recruited drug dealers and gang members to fight two unnecessary wars for him. b. Congress, particularly the republican-led House, has stripped subsidies for on-base niceties like BX's, comissaries (which they're now trying to close), MWR, etc. Particularly gas subsidies. c. Why is this? Because of the sequester demanded by the teabaggers and republicans in congress in 2011.

Plenty of soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen have faced involuntary separation despite clean records. Force requirements go up and they go down, specialties are in demand then they are glut.

Sucks for that guy, glad he found work with your organization.

Yeah, right. Usually it comes during Democrat administrations.

I remember it was pretty bad during the Clinton years.

First they bounced people out for old drug and alcohol offenses, DUIs.

Then they started bouncing them out for being overweight.

Then it was anyone who couldn't make E7 by their 20th year of active service, they were gone within a few months.

This guy was a highly qualified E6 next in line to get promoted to Chief Petty Officer, and they bounce him out with only enough time to out-process. I've never seen that kind of thing. Before they always knew it was coming and had time to do something about it. Obama is simply gutting the military that he brags got Bin Laden for him.

That's the way it's always been, under every president. Do drugs? You're out. Overweight? You're out. Can't pass promotion exams? You're out.

Finally...force reductions are the same as they've always. First, volunteers are solicited and given a healthy severance or early retirement. Then, those that don't enhance the goals of the military peace time efforts, are discharged - and unless it's "for cause" they get the same benefits.


Now. What were you kicked out for?

 

[mudwhistle]

Dude, I gave you the facts. You just can't believe this is going on......

Those of us who are in the DoD are having trouble dealing with this happy horseshit, but it has been a fact of life since the prick got in the White House. Like the fact that on post gas prices currently are 20 cents/gal higher than off post. I've been in or around the military since 1974 and I've never seen such asinine treatment of the military.

Dude...you are full of shit. I was the NCOIC of Separations when I was in the service. This is not allegorial. It's the truth.

a. It didn't go on before the "prick" got in the White House because the "prick" who was in the White House before him escalated the military and recruited drug dealers and gang members to fight two unnecessary wars for him. b. Congress, particularly the republican-led House, has stripped subsidies for on-base niceties like BX's, comissaries (which they're now trying to close), MWR, etc. Particularly gas subsidies. c. Why is this? Because of the sequester demanded by the teabaggers and republicans in congress in 2011.

Plenty of soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen have faced involuntary separation despite clean records. Force requirements go up and they go down, specialties are in demand then they are glut.

Sucks for that guy, glad he found work with your organization.

Yeah, right. Usually it comes during Democrat administrations.

I remember it was pretty bad during the Clinton years.

First they bounced people out for old drug and alcohol offenses, DUIs.

Then they started bouncing them out for being overweight.

Then it was anyone who couldn't make E7 by their 20th year of active service, they were gone within a few months.

This guy was a highly qualified E6 next in line to get promoted to Chief Petty Officer, and they bounce him out with only enough time to out-process. I've never seen that kind of thing. Before they always knew it was coming and had time to do something about it. Obama is simply gutting the military that he brags got Bin Laden for him.

That's the way it's always been, under every president. Do drugs? You're out. Overweight? You're out. Can't pass promotion exams? You're out.

Finally...force reductions are the same as they've always. First, volunteers are solicited and given a healthy severance or early retirement. Then, those that don't enhance the goals of the military peace time efforts, are discharged - and unless it's "for cause" they get the same benefits.


Now. What were you kicked out for?

I wasn't.

I retired 20 years ago.....back when our government could be at least halfway trusted. They don't make it easy to apply for benefits, but during the Bush years they gave classes on how. Now they pay lip-service to it, give speeches about how great their programs are, then shitcan everyone like a bad habit.