The Troops are concerned about gays serving openly.

[bodecea]

Under DADT, if you were male you could say that all you want. If you were female, it would get you discharged.

Of course, under DADT, some males saying that were just covering. Now they don't have to....which makes me wonder how much of that macho talk will melt away now that the gay soldier/sailors don't have to try to out-macho everyone else for cover.

Hmm...so your theory is the military macho talk was driven by gays pretending they were straight. I wasn't in the military, yet I somehow doubt that.

Of course they pretended to be straight (lied) to get in.
We wouldn't have accepted them otherwise. No one wants to serve with a polesmoker/carpet muncher.

It's filthy....

And yet, you sure think about it a lot and pepper your language with references to gay sex a lot. An awful lot.

 

[bodecea]

There was no gay test prior to DADT repeal. They simply said that homosexuals can't divulge the fact that they're homosexuals. If they don't admit to it, they can serve honorably for as long as they want.

They can't judge you on shit you don't divulge in the first place. Don't ASK, don't TELL.

Then straights should be don't ask, don't tell too. I don't want to hear about your girlfriend. I don't want to hear about your date. I don't want to hear about your marriage. I don't want to see pictures of your wife and kids. I don't want to hear you tell about who you picked up at the bar. If I do hear about them, you can be discharged. It's equal treatment under the UCMJ and DADT.

If you were in the military, you could tell them that. I'd love to see the response you'd have gotten, but I mean, you could still say it. Like it or not, homosexuality is deviant in that most people aren't gay. So it's unlikely that they would ever consider someone talking about an opposite-sex spouse as being inappropriate. But you knew that.

"Equal treatment" isn't entirely important to the military. I don't think it's a virtue unless you can rationalize it. Wanting to be as forthcoming about your sexual endeavors as all those ungrateful straight people doesn't strike me as a good reason, but YMMV.

Actually, equal treatment is very important to the military.

 

[kaz]

Under DADT, if you were male you could say that all you want. If you were female, it would get you discharged.

Of course, under DADT, some males saying that were just covering. Now they don't have to....which makes me wonder how much of that macho talk will melt away now that the gay soldier/sailors don't have to try to out-macho everyone else for cover.

Hmm...so your theory is the military macho talk was driven by gays pretending they were straight.

No. My theory is that a fair amount of the macho talk is gays trying to cover up...not that they drive the conversation.

You sounded stronger then that the first time. But no matter, so you think they were trying to cover up because of DADT? I doubt that.

I wasn't in the military,

Ah.

yet I somehow doubt that.

[/quote]
I always said that

 

[bodecea]

Same thing with us. My partner could not legally adopt our children until I had retired. Up to that point she had zero legal standing as their parent.

It was a dicey time. If something had happened to my wife, I would have had NO legal rights to our daughter.

Actually you could have been named in the will as the guardian. The real issue is if you had an ugly split up.

Did you not know the rules when you joined the military? At what point did it surprise you that there were consequences to that decision?

I did not come out til I was in the military....I did not meet my wife til we were both in the military. We both love the military and our country and chose to continue to serve. Too bad some people take that as a bad thing. What kind of world is it where they say the things that are being said to those who CHOOSE to serve this country in the military?

 

[kaz]

Hmm...so your theory is the military macho talk was driven by gays pretending they were straight. I wasn't in the military, yet I somehow doubt that.

Of course they pretended to be straight (lied) to get in.
We wouldn't have accepted them otherwise. No one wants to serve with a polesmoker/carpet muncher.

It's filthy....

And yet, you sure think about it a lot and pepper your language with references to gay sex a lot. An awful lot.

Yet I never see this sensitivity to how liberals phrase their arguments to non-liberals. A standard not applied to yourself isn't a standard, it's a weapon

 

[bodecea]

It was a dicey time. If something had happened to my wife, I would have had NO legal rights to our daughter.

Actually you could have been named in the will as the guardian. The real issue is if you had an ugly split up.

Did you not know the rules when you joined the military? At what point did it surprise you that there were consequences to that decision?

You're right. Liar. Plain and simple.

A dishonorable douche.

Gh0ster is one of those people who can't seem to understand love of country and service to one's country regardless of sexual orientation.

He spends his time watching, not doing.

 

[bodecea]

I'm guessing that you did not like being shown up by the gay sailors getting better evals than you.

Oh yeah...SNAP!!

Oh yeah, snap?
How does a ****** excel in an eval after he's NJP'd and discharged for sucking cock aboard ship?

Braindead much?

Snap...

Idiot.

We see what you like to think and talk about...we get it.

 

[kaz]

It was a dicey time. If something had happened to my wife, I would have had NO legal rights to our daughter.

Actually you could have been named in the will as the guardian. The real issue is if you had an ugly split up.

Did you not know the rules when you joined the military? At what point did it surprise you that there were consequences to that decision?

I did not come out til I was in the military....I did not meet my wife til we were both in the military. We both love the military and our country and chose to continue to serve. Too bad some people take that as a bad thing. What kind of world is it where they say the things that are being said to those who CHOOSE to serve this country in the military?

I don't know, but it's not a fair world and there is nothing fair about the left. I'm sick of defending the rich just because I don't think they should be singled out. My wife calls me prejudiced against Christians while liberals say I'm prejudiced for them. A black has zero right to not be a liberal. Or a Hispanic, or a woman, or a gay, they belong to the Democrats and are destroyed if they aren't. Blacks will not only defend the right of a black to not be Democrat, they'll take the lead in destroying them. Same with women and Hispanics, it's pathetic.

Maybe when I see you take issue with someone for for singling out Palin or Buchannan in what is clearly sex driven because you're a woman or gay or whatever before you're a Democrat you'll start to have more credibility.

 

[bodecea]

I had a conversation with my oldest son yesterday. He is career military. He just finished his fourth sensitivity training class about gays serving openly in the military. The troops can't comment on this issue or make disparaging remarks about the CinC. They've been advised that this is the way it will be; live with it.

In all of the classes they've been given one thing has been left out. The danger of HIV infection through direct contact with blood. Blood is the biggest bio-hazard on any accident scene. Civilians will say put on surgical gloves. A soldier would say that when you're wearing your buddies brains all over your face that wont do any good.

As a soldier I could count on my buddies doing everything in their power to bring me or my body back home. My buddies could count on the same thing from me. An openly gay soldier on the battlefield will lay where they fall. This is a very real degradation of military core values. Yet the troops feel that touching the openly gay soldiers blood would expose them to the very really threat of AIDS. That is a death sentence that will be resisted.

Morale is already being affected in a very negative way. The troops feel like they're being kicked in the stomach, and that they're being put into a life threatening situation. Once again people who've never served a second in uniform are making life threatening decisions that will carry dire consequences for the young men and women that this country sends into harms way. I think that congress, and the president need sensitivity training.

Hey stupid......speaking as someone who IS career military (I retired 8 years ago), I can tell you that your post is full of shit.

Why? Because........every 6 months, you get tested for HIV no matter what (at least I did until 2002). It doesn't matter if you're straight, gay, lesbian or bisexual. If you're on active duty, you will get tested every 6 months. Oh yeah.....if you ever pop positive on an HIV test, you are immediately sent to shore duty at one of a few hospitals that the Navy has designated for that purpose.

Oh yeah.........got news for you..........gays actually make better military types than straights do. Wanna know why? Because attention to detail (one of the military's favorite terms) is something they're good at. How do I know? Because for 20 years, I was a Personnelman, which meant that I had to do the worksheets every time advancement time came around for the whole command, and oh yeah........we have to factor in things like evaluations and personal (not unit) awards. Gays generally had a higher eval average and more awards. And........because I wasn't as bigoted as you or your child appear to be, all the people in each of my commands trusted me enough to tell me what was and wasn't true and going on.

Try again chumpsteak, both you and your spawn are bigoted assholes.

Hey maggot, why is it that every time one of you sexual deviants log in you spout a bunch of BS about a military career that you never were privileged enough to enjoy. "A personnelman", give me a break. You don't even know how to spell the word. The Army didn't have an MOS with that title, and I'll bet the Navy didn't either.

Navy doesn't have MOS, we've got ratings...Rating + paygrade = Rate. Personnelman or PN is indeed a rating, similar to Yeoman or YN and is in the Seaman catagory.

As far as gays having a higher evaluation then a straight soldier I'll say BS again.

Well, you didn't even know what a Personnelman was and you didn't even know that the Navy doesn't have MOS....so I'm not exactly concerned about what YOU consider BS.

Under DADT if you were getting evaluated as a gay service member you were being out processed with an undesirable discharge.

Not true again. YOu would be discharged based on your evals. If you earned an Honorable Discharge, you got an honorable discharge even tho it was involuntary. You sure you were in the military? You're not too good on knowing what goes on.

Before DADT, if you were found out to be a sexual deviant you were out processed with an undesirable discharge. The results were the same. If you had really worked in personnel for 20 years you would have known that.

Wrong again....it was an administrative discharge (very quick) but based on your evals. If you earned an honorable discharge, that's what you got.

I know this because I was an Admin Division officer before DADT and an Admin Dept Head and XO under DADT. You're not doing too well on knowing what really went on, are you?

I have also noticed that none of you have been able to present any evidence on how having gays serve openly in the military would improve the combat readiness of any unit. That isn't surprising. Having gays in any unit will only diminish established high standards. I have to admit that seeing you all dance around the subject has been comical.

You don't think allowing your soldiers to be honest will improve their morale and therefore their combat readiness?

You don't think KEEPING soldiers who might otherwise be kicked out for just being gay would improve combat readiness?

Really?

Since none of you could answer my last question maybe you'll have better luck with this question. How can the word gay be realistically related to sexual deviance? What is gay about being a sexual deviant?

I just did.

And still waiting for you to define a sexual deviant....why do you keep avoiding that question?

 

[kaz]

Actually you could have been named in the will as the guardian. The real issue is if you had an ugly split up.

Did you not know the rules when you joined the military? At what point did it surprise you that there were consequences to that decision?

You're right. Liar. Plain and simple.

A dishonorable douche.

Gh0ster is one of those people who can't seem to understand love of country and service to one's country regardless of sexual orientation.

He spends his time watching, not doing.

Ah, cool. Like Chauncey the Gardner?

 

[bodecea]

Of course they pretended to be straight (lied) to get in.
We wouldn't have accepted them otherwise. No one wants to serve with a polesmoker/carpet muncher.

It's filthy....

And yet, you sure think about it a lot and pepper your language with references to gay sex a lot. An awful lot.

Yet I never see this sensitivity to how liberals phrase their arguments to non-liberals. A standard not applied to yourself isn't a standard, it's a weapon

Could you give an example of what you are talking about there?

 

[Gunny]

I had a conversation with my oldest son yesterday. He is career military. He just finished his fourth sensitivity training class about gays serving openly in the military. The troops can't comment on this issue or make disparaging remarks about the CinC. They've been advised that this is the way it will be; live with it.

In all of the classes they've been given one thing has been left out. The danger of HIV infection through direct contact with blood. Blood is the biggest bio-hazard on any accident scene. Civilians will say put on surgical gloves. A soldier would say that when you're wearing your buddies brains all over your face that wont do any good.

As a soldier I could count on my buddies doing everything in their power to bring me or my body back home. My buddies could count on the same thing from me. An openly gay soldier on the battlefield will lay where they fall. This is a very real degradation of military core values. Yet the troops feel that touching the openly gay soldiers blood would expose them to the very really threat of AIDS. That is a death sentence that will be resisted.

Morale is already being affected in a very negative way. The troops feel like they're being kicked in the stomach, and that they're being put into a life threatening situation. Once again people who've never served a second in uniform are making life threatening decisions that will carry dire consequences for the young men and women that this country sends into harms way. I think that congress, and the president need sensitivity training.

The US Military is the political correctness testing ground for the US Gov't. Real "hard" to do when you can order everyone to shut up or face bullshit charges.

Last I checked, the US Military and or service therein did NOT deprive me of my Constitutional 1st Amendment Right.

We went through this same bullshit with "Women in Combat" (otherwise known as women are as good at being men as men), and "Don't Ask, Don't Tell".

It's all a bunch of leftwing, bullshit agenda that has watered down what was once the greatest fighting force on Earth.

We can't even kick Third World country's asses anymore what with all the damned pansy-assed rules.

 

[bodecea]

Actually you could have been named in the will as the guardian. The real issue is if you had an ugly split up.

Did you not know the rules when you joined the military? At what point did it surprise you that there were consequences to that decision?

I did not come out til I was in the military....I did not meet my wife til we were both in the military. We both love the military and our country and chose to continue to serve. Too bad some people take that as a bad thing. What kind of world is it where they say the things that are being said to those who CHOOSE to serve this country in the military?

I don't know, but it's not a fair world and there is nothing fair about the left. I'm sick of defending the rich just because I don't think they should be singled out. My wife calls me prejudiced against Christians while liberals say I'm prejudiced for them. A black has zero right to not be a liberal. Or a Hispanic, or a woman, or a gay, they belong to the Democrats and are destroyed if they aren't. Blacks will not only defend the right of a black to not be Democrat, they'll take the lead in destroying them. Same with women and Hispanics, it's pathetic.

Maybe when I see you take issue with someone for for singling out Palin or Buchannan in what is clearly sex driven because you're a woman or gay or whatever before you're a Democrat you'll start to have more credibility.

Does any of those examples refer to how the government must treat people equally under the law?

 

[kaz]

And yet, you sure think about it a lot and pepper your language with references to gay sex a lot. An awful lot.

Yet I never see this sensitivity to how liberals phrase their arguments to non-liberals. A standard not applied to yourself isn't a standard, it's a weapon

Could you give an example of what you are talking about there?

So you're looking for me to post every sweeping generalization and attack on this history of this board that was directed from the left to the right you didn't respond to? Um..sure.

How bout you just show one where you chastised a liberal for the words they used ala your objection here

 

[bodecea]

You're right. Liar. Plain and simple.

A dishonorable douche.

Gh0ster is one of those people who can't seem to understand love of country and service to one's country regardless of sexual orientation.

He spends his time watching, not doing.

Ah, cool. Like Chauncey the Gardner?

Exactly...rep to you for picking up the reference.

 

[kaz]

I did not come out til I was in the military....I did not meet my wife til we were both in the military. We both love the military and our country and chose to continue to serve. Too bad some people take that as a bad thing. What kind of world is it where they say the things that are being said to those who CHOOSE to serve this country in the military?

I don't know, but it's not a fair world and there is nothing fair about the left. I'm sick of defending the rich just because I don't think they should be singled out. My wife calls me prejudiced against Christians while liberals say I'm prejudiced for them. A black has zero right to not be a liberal. Or a Hispanic, or a woman, or a gay, they belong to the Democrats and are destroyed if they aren't. Blacks will not only defend the right of a black to not be Democrat, they'll take the lead in destroying them. Same with women and Hispanics, it's pathetic.

Maybe when I see you take issue with someone for for singling out Palin or Buchannan in what is clearly sex driven because you're a woman or gay or whatever before you're a Democrat you'll start to have more credibility.

Does any of those examples refer to how the government must treat people equally under the law?

Gays are treated according to the exact same rules as straights. You can argue "fair" but the law isn't about fair, it's about literal. Straights can't talk about gay sex, gays can talk about heterosexual sex. You can't use formulas, sorry. You picked the topic of "the law."

 

[bodecea]

I had a conversation with my oldest son yesterday. He is career military. He just finished his fourth sensitivity training class about gays serving openly in the military. The troops can't comment on this issue or make disparaging remarks about the CinC. They've been advised that this is the way it will be; live with it.

In all of the classes they've been given one thing has been left out. The danger of HIV infection through direct contact with blood. Blood is the biggest bio-hazard on any accident scene. Civilians will say put on surgical gloves. A soldier would say that when you're wearing your buddies brains all over your face that wont do any good.

As a soldier I could count on my buddies doing everything in their power to bring me or my body back home. My buddies could count on the same thing from me. An openly gay soldier on the battlefield will lay where they fall. This is a very real degradation of military core values. Yet the troops feel that touching the openly gay soldiers blood would expose them to the very really threat of AIDS. That is a death sentence that will be resisted.

Morale is already being affected in a very negative way. The troops feel like they're being kicked in the stomach, and that they're being put into a life threatening situation. Once again people who've never served a second in uniform are making life threatening decisions that will carry dire consequences for the young men and women that this country sends into harms way. I think that congress, and the president need sensitivity training.

The US Military is the political correctness testing ground for the US Gov't. Real "hard" to do when you can order everyone to shut up or face bullshit charges.

Last I checked, the US Military and or service therein did NOT deprive me of my Constitutional 1st Amendment Right.

We went through this same bullshit with "Women in Combat" (otherwise known as women are as good at being men as men), and "Don't Ask, Don't Tell".

It's all a bunch of leftwing, bullshit agenda that has watered down what was once the greatest fighting force on Earth.

We can't even kick Third World country's asses anymore what with all the damned pansy-assed rules.

I hardly call women being wiling to fight and die for this country and FINALLY being allowed to be armed and defend ourselves adequately "bullshit", Gunny.

 

[WorldWatcher]

well lets see, when it comes ot christians and athiests, is there equal treatment? Christians want the ability to pray in school. Athiests want no prayer in school. under the law, there is no prayer in school. is that an equal ruling? but that's the law and that's what is currently accepted as the fair solution.

Christians can pray in school.

I'm not sure where you are from but Christians are certainly allowed to pray in school, as a matter of fact if a school were to bar Christians from praying (when not disrupting others or interfering with school business) they place their federal funding in jeopardy from being withdrawn.

Now there are some Christians that want to require that others pray in school, but that is a different issue.



>>>>

 

[WorldWatcher]

Gays serving.

Dishonorable.

Pretty much cut and dry.

Case closed...


NEXT !!!!

Homosexuals have been allowed to serve honorably for the last 18 years under DADT.


>>>>

 

[Momanohedhunter]

I don't recall anyone or any written question asking about my sexual orientation during my 22 years of service.

But this thread has gone to shit.

I truly hope that the US Military does not experience the problems that I foresee. I hope I am wrong. But this was still really bad timing.....

Enjoy.....

The troops aren't happy SFC Ollie. You know the drill. They've been ordered to stay silent on this issue, and are not supposed to make any disparaging remarks about the CinC Obama bin Lyin. They do talk amongst themselves, and they feel betrayed. Less then 1 % of our population is serving this country to fight in two wars. They've given their all, and their bravery, and patriotism has been repaid with a kick in the face. It isn't difficult to conclude that liberals are trying to destroy America's military might.

On this board we have a bunch of pin heads who've spun stories of sexual deviance during their alleged military service. I find myself asking the same question you do. What military did they serve in? It sure wasn't the one that I served in either. I find it amazing that these people are stupid enough to actually believe that we think they are telling the truth.

Serving in The United States Military is a privilege not a right. To be accepted in service of this country you must meet high standards. Not everyone can serve. Being a sexual deviant isn't an acceptable standard. Sexual deviants do not belong in the military.

Another spotlight on your ignorance about the military and further proof you did not serve your country. General enlisted in any branch are not to make comments to the press without authorization on any matter. I knew that before I was done at meps. and on my way to boot camp. I dont know anyone else in or out of the military who does not know that .