The Right to Bear Arms vs Right to Vote: Registration requirement

[PaulS1950]

The constitution does NOT enumerate all our rights - it enumerates some of our rights to insure their protection by the federal government.
The constitution only enumerates the powers of the federal government. Those powers are extremely limited and completely listed. If it is not listed in the constitution then it belongs to the states and the people.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

And we have laws banning some people from owning a gun. So, wouldnt a registry ensure no one owns a gun who isn't suppose to? Wont stop fraud, obviously, just like voter reg doesnt stop voting fraud. Just asking the question.

Would it stop fraud? Only in the imaginations of people who think the government is all powerful, in the real world fraud will keep occurring despite the government's attempt to play God.

 

[PaulS1950]

The fact remains that the power to force registration of guns is not one of the powers that are granted to the federal government by the constitution.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Guns, ammo - have only one purpose - to kill.

Of course we should have the capability to trace both to the buyer.

If that is true than Obama has been killing people at Camp David all the time, I even have pictures.

Should we indict him for it, or would you prefer to retract your absurd claim?

 

[PaulS1950]

I have been using guns and ammo for decades and I have yet to kill anything other than a lot of paper targets (can you kill if its not alive?) and a few meals that grew wild.

Maybe my guns and ammo are defective?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Criminals don't legally buy guns - registration would not affect them - so what is the rationale for registering guns?
You don't have to be a citizen to buy a gun - you have to be a citizen to vote - hence you are required (in my state) to have a voter ID card to vote. I got my card when I registered at 18. It is now out of date but I registered on-line when I moved. I am still able to exercise my right to vote.

The constitution does not enumerate all our rights - see 9th amendment. The constitution only enumerates the powers the states and people gave to the federal government. The 10th amendment preserves those not mentioned to the states or the people.

Actually most guns crooks get are legally obtained through straw buyer or private sales. None require any kind of background check.

Also the only place i've heard of are a few places like chicago that require registering only handguns, but as far as I'm aware there is nowhere else that requires guns to be registered.

The funny thing about this country is that it's easier to get a gun than it is to vote.

I love how you spout stuff without any evidence to back it up.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Just asking about consistency on these two issues: Right to vote, vs Right to bear arms.

I've heard the arguments from Voter ID advocates, and of course, we must register to vote. We have a right to vote, yet, are required to register that vote.

I've heard the arguments from the Gun Control crowd that all guns should be registered (many states dont require it, the feds dont req it). You have the right to bear arms, yet, you dont have to register that arm (firearm).

Should our vote and our gun both be registered? Or, should be be free to buy guns and cast votes without the government making us register, and take our word of integrity in practicing both rights?

We should be registering gun buyers, not guns. Just like we register voters.

When you register to vote, you are put on an approved voter list. Then you can choose to vote or not vote, and who you vote for is strictly your business and not the government's.

When you register to be a gun buyer, you would get placed on an approved gun buyer list. Then you can choose to buy a gun or not buy a gun, and what you buy is strictly your business and not the government's.

Why should we register gun buyers? Do you demand that we register posters on the internet who criticize the political parties? What is the difference between the two positions?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Just asking about consistency on these two issues: Right to vote, vs Right to bear arms.

I've heard the arguments from Voter ID advocates, and of course, we must register to vote. We have a right to vote, yet, are required to register that vote.

I've heard the arguments from the Gun Control crowd that all guns should be registered (many states dont require it, the feds dont req it). You have the right to bear arms, yet, you dont have to register that arm (firearm).

Should our vote and our gun both be registered? Or, should be be free to buy guns and cast votes without the government making us register, and take our word of integrity in practicing both rights?

Actually, you’ve got an apples and oranges situation when comparing the two.

Very generally speaking, in order to limit or restrict a right the state must demonstrate a compelling interest, supported by evidence, indicating the efficacy of the measure.

Obviously the only way for the state to determine if a resident is a citizen and eligible to vote is for the prospective voter to provide documentation when registering. This would also be necessary to ensure the prospective voter meets other conditions of eligibility, such as not being a felon.

But once the initial registration is completed, however, and the voter remains active on the registration rolls, he should not be compelled to prove his identity every time he votes; this manifest an undue burden to voting and can not be justified as there is no evidence that requiring ID prevents voter ‘fraud.’ Indeed, there is no evidence ID fraud has altered the outcome of any modern election.

The same would be true with regard to registering firearms: there is no evidence registration prevents gun crime, absent this evidence requiring gun registration would manifest an undue burden to one exercising his Second Amendment rights.

Whether requiring ID every time one votes or requiring gun registration, the issue isn’t what ‘sounds good,’ or ‘seems the right thing to do,’ rather, the only issue is what can the state prove in court, and what evidence can the state provide to support and justify its desire to restrict a Constitutional right.

If I go into to vote and claim I am you, that is fine, even though when you go into vote you will be denied a vote because you already voted? Interesting that you don't have a prob,em with that.

 

[Wehrwolfen]

Just asking about consistency on these two issues: Right to vote, vs Right to bear arms.

I've heard the arguments from Voter ID advocates, and of course, we must register to vote. We have a right to vote, yet, are required to register that vote.

I've heard the arguments from the Gun Control crowd that all guns should be registered (many states dont require it, the feds dont req it). You have the right to bear arms, yet, you dont have to register that arm (firearm).

Should our vote and our gun both be registered? Or, should be be free to buy guns and cast votes without the government making us register, and take our word of integrity in practicing both rights?

Without the Right to bear arms there would be no right to vote. Will you seek to make Oblamer President for life after all guns are confiscated?

 

[bucs90]

There's no constitutionally enumerated right to vote.

/thread

Wrong. The right to vote is mentioned in the 15th, 19th, and 26th amendments.

Right wingers are Constitutional experts (since 2009). So...please, stop using the actual words in the Constitution as a reference to counter their Constitutional expertise

 

[bucs90]

Just asking about consistency on these two issues: Right to vote, vs Right to bear arms.

I've heard the arguments from Voter ID advocates, and of course, we must register to vote. We have a right to vote, yet, are required to register that vote.

I've heard the arguments from the Gun Control crowd that all guns should be registered (many states dont require it, the feds dont req it). You have the right to bear arms, yet, you dont have to register that arm (firearm).

Should our vote and our gun both be registered? Or, should be be free to buy guns and cast votes without the government making us register, and take our word of integrity in practicing both rights?

Without the Right to bear arms there would be no right to vote. Will you seek to make Oblamer President for life after all guns are confiscated?

And without the right to vote, there would no longer be a right to bear arms.

We bear arms to protect our right to vote. We vote to protect our right to bear arms.

Thats kinda how it works. Both rights should be protected and treated responsibly, meaning, some reasonable measures to protect the integrity and reasonableness of both rights. Such as only being able to vote once, and dead people not being allowed to vote. And, being able to know who owns what gun, so if that gun is lost or stolen or used in a crime, the cops know where to start the investigation, and take leads from there.

 

[Dante]

Just asking about consistency on these two issues: Right to vote, vs Right to bear arms.

I've heard the arguments from Voter ID advocates, and of course, we must register to vote. We have a right to vote, yet, are required to register that vote.

I've heard the arguments from the Gun Control crowd that all guns should be registered (many states dont require it, the feds dont req it). You have the right to bear arms, yet, you dont have to register that arm (firearm).

Should our vote and our gun both be registered? Or, should be be free to buy guns and cast votes without the government making us register, and take our word of integrity in practicing both rights?

It's understandable that somebody like you who fears other people voting would make an argument that the danger guns pose to a civil society is equal to that of people you disagree with actually voting

 

[bucs90]

Just asking about consistency on these two issues: Right to vote, vs Right to bear arms.

I've heard the arguments from Voter ID advocates, and of course, we must register to vote. We have a right to vote, yet, are required to register that vote.

I've heard the arguments from the Gun Control crowd that all guns should be registered (many states dont require it, the feds dont req it). You have the right to bear arms, yet, you dont have to register that arm (firearm).

Should our vote and our gun both be registered? Or, should be be free to buy guns and cast votes without the government making us register, and take our word of integrity in practicing both rights?

It's understandable that somebody like you who fears other people voting would make an argument that the danger guns pose to a civil society is equal to that of people you disagree with actually voting

WTF are you talking about? Every American has the right to vote. Thats quite simple.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

There's no constitutionally enumerated right to vote.

/thread

Wrong. The right to vote is mentioned in the 15th, 19th, and 26th amendments.

Right wingers are Constitutional experts (since 2009). So...please, stop using the actual words in the Constitution as a reference to counter their Constitutional expertise

Aren't you the guy that keeps insisting that "shall not be infringed" doesn't mean what it says?