the rich get richer........

[manu1959]

and they are democracts.......

In major flip, House Dems now represent richest regions - USATODAY.com

Democrats now represent 57% of the 4.8 million households that had incomes of $200,000 or more in 2008. In 2005, Republicans represented 55% of those affluent households.

 

[Elutherian]

The Rich will always get Richer when you've got a fascist economic system of private profit and socialized losses.

 

[Bern80]

The Rich will always get Richer when you've got a fascist economic system of private profit and socialized losses.

there is nothing fascist about it. Very competetive maybe, but not fascist. There is major human behavior component to the whole have, have not debate that most people don't realize. The real problem is that too much of our labor force is not willing to adapt. It used to be worked hard and get paid well. Now the pay goes to people that work smart. Intelligence is more valuable then how many of part a you can attach to part b. That is coupled with the fact that fewer people are willing to put in the work required to attain the skills that pay well. Fewer people are willing to risk striking out on their own and build their own business. Chances are you simply won't make it rich working for someone else.

 

[Paulie]

Outside of the trust fund babies, I bet you'll be hard pressed to find ANYONE who became rich that didn't risk a specific enough portion of money that might have made them broke had that venture potentially failed.

And then you have the ones who even though the intitial venture failed, they STILL kept trying...some even fail more than once.

To tell you the truth, it's probably the ONLY reason why I have such a tiny consideration for the idea of fractional reserve lending. It's quite minute, but it's there.

 

[manu1959]

The Rich will always get Richer when you've got a fascist economic system of private profit and socialized losses.

your paycheck is private profit....the government takes some of your profits and redistributes it to others that need it......and your losses (lack of a pay check) is funded buy the socialized welfare system.....which is the private profits of others....

do you wish to change that system.....

 

[Elutherian]

The Rich will always get Richer when you've got a fascist economic system of private profit and socialized losses.

your paycheck is private profit....the government takes some of your profits and redistributes it to others that need it......and your losses (lack of a pay check) is funded buy the socialized welfare system.....which is the private profits of others....

do you wish to change that system.....

Hell yes I want to change that system. The private profits part I like... but losses ought to be private as well. If it ain't you end up with the system of corporate billionaires taking our hard earned money because they're "too big to fail".

Private Profit + Private losses = Free Market Capitalism
Private Profit + Socialized losses = Fascism/Corporatism
Socialized Profit + Socialized losses = Socialism/Communism

 

[manu1959]

The Rich will always get Richer when you've got a fascist economic system of private profit and socialized losses.

your paycheck is private profit....the government takes some of your profits and redistributes it to others that need it......and your losses (lack of a pay check) is funded buy the socialized welfare system.....which is the private profits of others....

do you wish to change that system.....

Hell yes I want to change that system. The private profits part I like... but losses ought to be private as well. If it ain't you end up with the system of corporate billionaires taking our hard earned money because they're "too big to fail".

Private Profit + Private losses = Free Market Capitalism
Private Profit + Socialized losses = Fascism/Corporatism
Socialized Profit + Socialized losses = Socialism/Communism

don't disagree.....we should have let aig.....gm...and chrysler fail.....

 

[Bern80]

your paycheck is private profit....the government takes some of your profits and redistributes it to others that need it......and your losses (lack of a pay check) is funded buy the socialized welfare system.....which is the private profits of others....

do you wish to change that system.....

Hell yes I want to change that system. The private profits part I like... but losses ought to be private as well. If it ain't you end up with the system of corporate billionaires taking our hard earned money because they're "too big to fail".

Private Profit + Private losses = Free Market Capitalism
Private Profit + Socialized losses = Fascism/Corporatism
Socialized Profit + Socialized losses = Socialism/Communism

don't disagree.....we should have let aig.....gm...and chrysler fail.....

The complaint I don't understand is the socialized losses thing. Most every monetary transaction between parties is an agreed upon contract. So how is that private businesses socialize losses? In other words how do they take your money involuntarily to cover losses?

I can see the argument already. The gov saving GM will inflate the prices of their automobiles, labor, everything. Yes I agree we probably should have taken it on the chin and let them fail , but so what?! At the end of the day you still have to agree to support that subsidy or labor rate by purchasing their product. That's really the only way they can get your money is by you voluntarily giving it to them.

This part of what I am talking about when say I think our society is becoming more ambivalent and ignorant and is part of why this economic crisis happened. People beleive there are no choices when there are many. The simplest place to first turn to for solution to any problem is yourself, yet it is something we are less and less willing to do because it is far easier to blame someone else and get them to fix it for you.

 

[Elutherian]

Hell yes I want to change that system. The private profits part I like... but losses ought to be private as well. If it ain't you end up with the system of corporate billionaires taking our hard earned money because they're "too big to fail".

Private Profit + Private losses = Free Market Capitalism
Private Profit + Socialized losses = Fascism/Corporatism
Socialized Profit + Socialized losses = Socialism/Communism

don't disagree.....we should have let aig.....gm...and chrysler fail.....

The complaint I don't understand is the socialized losses thing. Most every monetary transaction between parties is an agreed upon contract. So how is that private businesses socialize losses? In other words how do they take your money involuntarily to cover losses?

I can see the argument already. The gov saving GM will inflate the prices of their automobiles, labor, everything. Yes I agree we probably should have taken it on the chin and let them fail , but so what?! At the end of the day you still have to agree to support that subsidy or labor rate by purchasing their product. That's really the only way they can get your money is by you voluntarily giving it to them.

This part of what I am talking about when say I think our society is becoming more ambivalent and ignorant and is part of why this economic crisis happened. People beleive there are no choices when there are many. The simplest place to first turn to for solution to any problem is yourself, yet it is something we are less and less willing to do because it is far easier to blame someone else and get them to fix it for you.

You actually answered your own question. If our tax dollars aren't taken directly to pay for the bailouts, then it's borrowed (enslaving us all to debt), and if it ain't borrowed, it's printed. That devalues everything we own. It's legal counterfietting and a form of theft.

 

[8236]

[You actually answered your own question. If our tax dollars aren't taken directly to pay for the bailouts, then it's borrowed (enslaving us all to debt), and if it ain't borrowed, it's printed. That devalues everything we own. It's legal counterfietting and a form of theft.

No, no! It's called Quantitative Easing, honest! Seriously though, it does tend to cause inflation, but if an economy is heading for deflation then it can have a stablising effect. A problem it will always cause is indeed devaluing the currency of the nation involved, but even that can have temporary positive effects on exports. It will also cause a surge in imports and a drain on foreign currency reserves. And, damn, for the stuff we all (in the world) buy in dollars (oil) it sux. Bah, hope the US doesn't go for it.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

And it continues. Example: The much maligned and demonized health insurance companies have to be licking their chops over the mandatory health coverage provisions in the health scare bills.

Think of it: A new, untapped market of 47 million who will be required by law to get health insurance! Even if they pick up only 40% of those, it's billions of new revenue!

Were I in Congress and a friend of "Big Insurance" I might do just exactly what the Dems are proposing -- feed the industry 47 MILLION potential NEW customers!

Do it now: Sink some of your investment dollars in the Big Four health insurance providers -- their stock is going to shoot way up the next few years, as they roll in extra billions thanks to their buddies, the rich fat-cat Dems in Washington!

 

[rdean]

Somehow Republicans believe that the rich paying off congress in exchange for tax breaks, shelters and loopholes is "competition". Was it a lack of oxygen at birth? Or on overdose of beer?

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Somehow Republicans believe that the rich paying off congress in exchange for tax breaks, shelters and loopholes is "competition". Was it a lack of oxygen at birth? Or on overdose of beer?

The rich have been paying off the rich in Congress forever. It's nothing new and it hasn't changed, and it's BOTH parties.

No one I have ever seen, however, calls it "competition."