The Post-Welfare State Family and a return to traditional values

[koshergrl]

"British author Ferdinand Mount argued in a 1992 book that the family “is a subversive organization. .  .  . Only the family has continued throughout history and still continues to undermine the ‘State.’ ” Tocqueville, Mount pointed out, also grasped this fundamental antagonism between family and state; witness the great Frenchman’s observation that “as long as family feeling is kept alive, the opponent of oppression is never alone.”

"Looking away from theory and toward the public square, it’s also plainly true that the welfare state has interrupted the organic bonds of family in ways too numerous to count. As Milton Friedman once observed of Social Security, “The voluntary transfers [from young to old] strengthened the bonds of the family; the compulsory transfers weaken those bonds.” And certainly it’s the welfare state that has effectively bankrolled via many programs the expensive pan-Western fallout of the sexual revolution: the unprecedented levels of divorce, family breakup, out-of-wedlock births, and other trends that have turned the modern state into an inefficient but all-encompassing substitute for a man of the house.
In sum, statism has been an engine of family destruction—and vice versa. All of which leads to a contrarian thought: Might the dark ages of the welfare state end in a family renaissance?"

"If the welfare states of the West finally do implode, it’s hard to think of any institution but the family that could step into that vacuum."

Shocking, I know.

The idea that ... pffft.....FAMILY might take care of their own, and base decisions on how to best accomplish that.

Shocking and totally alien concept to the againsheilas and nycs of the world.

The Post-Welfare State Family | The Weekly Standard

 

[Agit8r]

All one has to do is look at country by country divorce rates, to learn that the above premise is utter bullshit

 

[koshergrl]

Er, no, but whatever.

 

[Agit8r]

Er, no, but whatever.

I presume that you are capable of logic, right? And we all know that Greece has an extravagant welfare state, yes?

Obviously then if Greece has a tiny fraction of the divorce rate that the US has, the OP is completely false.

 

[OKTexas]

All one has to do is look at country by country divorce rates, to learn that the above premise is utter bullshit

Divorce is only one indicator of the destruction of the nuclear family, unwed birth rates are another. The US has 32% out of wedlock births of all births. Iceland has a 65% out of wedlock birth rate.

AASP - Unwed Births Internationally

 

[koshergrl]

What the hell is going on in Iceland?

Are they populated by Polynesians?

 

[Agit8r]

All one has to do is look at country by country divorce rates, to learn that the above premise is utter bullshit

Divorce is only one indicator of the destruction of the nuclear family, unwed birth rates are another. The US has 32% out of wedlock births of all births. Iceland has a 65% out of wedlock birth rate.

AASP - Unwed Births Internationally

Again, Greece has 3%. Italy has 8%. Those countries have more welfarism than we do.

 

[koshergrl]

Actually, their welfare states are crumbling and the people are starving.

Which is why they are less likely to divorce, and more likely to get married in the first place. They need each other.

In other words, you're proving the premise of the article. Which does mention Greece, incidentally.

 

[koshergrl]

"In the New York Times, a harrowing front page story entitled “More Children in Greece Start To Go Hungry” showed what can happen when an economy in free-fall meets the highest unemployment rates in Europe (27 percent): More Greek youngsters underfed and malnourished; garbage-picking outside elementary schools; and an overall level of “food insecurity” that, according to one expert, rivals that in parts of Africa. And though “experts” can be expected to overstate, Greece, it helps to remember, is a country in the EU."

 

[Agit8r]

Actually, their welfare states are crumbling and the people are starving.

Which is why they are less likely to divorce, and more likely to get married in the first place. They need each other.

In other words, you're proving the premise of the article. Which does mention Greece, incidentally.

the data I provided was from 2004. The data that OKTexas posted is from 1999

in other words, the data is from before the financial crisis.

 

[Crackerjaxon]

It's a speculative premise, but not ridiculous by any means. Families do pull together when things get tough. It's what they do. If families and individuals do not move toward self-reliance, it's going to get a lot tougher.

Printing and borrowing money doesn't create wealth, it just dilutes what money we have.

Smart people are moving to the country.

 

[Agit8r]

It's a speculative premise, but not ridiculous by any means. Families do pull together when things get tough. It's what they do. If families and individuals do not move toward self-reliance, it's going to get a lot tougher.

Printing and borrowing money doesn't create wealth, it just dilutes what money we have.

Smart people are moving to the country.

The premise of the article has been debunked outright already. All you have to do is read the comments above