The Miracle of Freedom.....

[regent]

Y

The whole idea of "God-given" freedom is goofy. According to the standard biblical theology, "freedom" from the dictatorial Paradise is the result of Adam and Eve's original sin. Or if one is inclined to extra-biblical Christian beliefs, due to the rebellion of Satan among the Angels.

Unless of course one is a Deist...

Here is your abbreviated lesson on the Bible:

There are dolts who follow dictums of the French Revolution, replacing religion and morality with science and reason.
Such has proven to be far more than an unmitigated failure: it resulted in the millions upon millions slaughtered by communists, fascists, Nazis.....

Reason supports a lot of things, as for example, a very liberal position on abortion. If there is no God, "Love your neighbor as yourself" is just a good idea. That's why it is written, incidentally, in Leviticus, "Love your neighbor as yourself, I am God." I, God, tell you to be decent to other people.
Prager

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Y

The whole idea of "God-given" freedom is goofy. According to the standard biblical theology, "freedom" from the dictatorial Paradise is the result of Adam and Eve's original sin. Or if one is inclined to extra-biblical Christian beliefs, due to the rebellion of Satan among the Angels.

Unless of course one is a Deist...

Here is your abbreviated lesson on the Bible:

There are dolts who follow dictums of the French Revolution, replacing religion and morality with science and reason.
Such has proven to be far more than an unmitigated failure: it resulted in the millions upon millions slaughtered by communists, fascists, Nazis.....

Reason supports a lot of things, as for example, a very liberal position on abortion. If there is no God, "Love your neighbor as yourself" is just a good idea. That's why it is written, incidentally, in Leviticus, "Love your neighbor as yourself, I am God." I, God, tell you to be decent to other people.
Prager

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

What are you doing here?

Shouldn't you be filling up on how your "historians" tell you how to ....repeat ( I almost said 'think').

 

[regent]

Y

The whole idea of "God-given" freedom is goofy. According to the standard biblical theology, "freedom" from the dictatorial Paradise is the result of Adam and Eve's original sin. Or if one is inclined to extra-biblical Christian beliefs, due to the rebellion of Satan among the Angels.

Unless of course one is a Deist...

Here is your abbreviated lesson on the Bible:
It's a simple question
There are dolts who follow dictums of the French Revolution, replacing religion and morality with science and reason.
Such has proven to be far more than an unmitigated failure: it resulted in the millions upon millions slaughtered by communists, fascists, Nazis.....

Reason supports a lot of things, as for example, a very liberal position on abortion. If there is no God, "Love your neighbor as yourself" is just a good idea. That's why it is written, incidentally, in Leviticus, "Love your neighbor as yourself, I am God." I, God, tell you to be decent to other people.
Prager

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

What are you doing here?

Shouldn't you be filling up on how your "historians" tell you how to ....repeat ( I almost said 'think').

Well I do read a lot of history. Good historians are important to me, but I generally read their books. Back to the question: when has the United States had free markets?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Y

Here is your abbreviated lesson on the Bible:
It's a simple question
There are dolts who follow dictums of the French Revolution, replacing religion and morality with science and reason.
Such has proven to be far more than an unmitigated failure: it resulted in the millions upon millions slaughtered by communists, fascists, Nazis.....

Reason supports a lot of things, as for example, a very liberal position on abortion. If there is no God, "Love your neighbor as yourself" is just a good idea. That's why it is written, incidentally, in Leviticus, "Love your neighbor as yourself, I am God." I, God, tell you to be decent to other people.
Prager

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

What are you doing here?

Shouldn't you be filling up on how your "historians" tell you how to ....repeat ( I almost said 'think').

Well I do read a lot of history. Good historians are important to me, but I generally read their books. Back to the question: when has the United States had free markets?

As we both know, not amount of education from any but your Liberal/Leftist "historians" will alter your indoctrination.

That's true, isn't it.

 

[regent]

Y

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

What are you doing here?

Shouldn't you be filling up on how your "historians" tell you how to ....repeat ( I almost said 'think').

Well I do read a lot of history. Good historians are important to me, but I generally read their books. Back to the question: when has the United States had free markets?

As we both know, not amount of education from any but your Liberal/Leftist "historians" will alter your indoctrination.

That's true, isn't it.

Well, like so many people at one time I used the "I 1think history" but the historians seemed so much more capable relating history than even the I Think method. P,S. you didn't include FDR's Four Freedoms in your post.
I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Y

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

What are you doing here?

Shouldn't you be filling up on how your "historians" tell you how to ....repeat ( I almost said 'think').

Well I do read a lot of history. Good historians are important to me, but I generally read their books. Back to the question: when has the United States had free markets?

As we both know, not amount of education from any but your Liberal/Leftist "historians" will alter your indoctrination.

That's true, isn't it.

Well, like so many people at one time I used the "I 1think history" but the historians seemed so much more capable relating history than even the I Think method. P,S. you didn't include FDR's Four Freedoms in your post.
I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?

"Well, like so many people at one time I used the "I 1think history" but the historians seemed so much more capable relating history than even the I Think method. P,S. you didn't include FDR's Four Freedoms in your post.
I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?"





Well, well, well.....another day, another opportunity to put you in your place: that well-worn last seat in the dumb row.



How about I break your lessons into several posts, based on your parviscient post?

Now...be sure to take notes!


Blinded as you are by the indoctrination, and your motto of allowing 'historians,' rather than the facts, to determine your worldview, you actually suggested that Franklin Roosevelt favored freedom, liberty, and the rights of others.....

...you actually wrote the risible " you didn't include FDR's Four Freedoms in your post."




1. The rule of life is this: reality is defined by actions, not by words.

Roosevelt drooled words redolent of freedom, liberty, and American values....but he sure didn't invest them with his actions!


Roosevelt, well documented to be a congenital liar, [e.g., he claimed to have written the constitution of Haiti] loved to drop the word 'freedom'.....but hardly believed in it.


a. He hated Jews, Asian, and African Americans.
I need not give all of the examples available....need I?


b. He actually put American citizens into concentration camps....the Japanese, to assauge California farmers.
Get it? Politics, not freedom or liberty or American values.


c. He offered the lives of all of inhabitants of Eastern Europe to his lord and master, Joseph Stalin. Evidence of his intentions can be seen in a document which FDR's closest adviser, Soviet Spy Harry Hopkins, took with him to the Quebec conference in August, 1943, entitled "Russia's Position," quoted as follows in Sherwood's book ["Roosevelt and Hopkins: An Intimate History,"byRobert E. Sherwood]: "Russia's post-war position in Europe will be a dominant one. With Germany crushed, there is no power in Europe to oppose her tremendous military forces."

And, of course, he made certain that Normandy was the target of D Day, not the Adriatic....so Stalin's Red Army could occupy half of Europe.



d. He demanded authority over the very Constitution he swore to protect and defend. In July 5, 1935, in a letter to Representative Samuel B. Hill of Washington, the President manifested his contempt for the Constitution. Hill was chairman of the subcommittee studying the Guffey-Vinson bill to regulate the coal industry: the purpose of the legislation was to re-establish, for the coal industry, the NRA code system which the Supreme Court had unanimously declared unconstitutional. Roosevelt wrote: "I hope your committee will not permit doubts as to constitutionality, however reasonable, to block the legislation.

This was the same Roosevelt who had sworn an oath on his 300 year old family Bible, to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."



You can't deny anything in this post....can you.



So....any palaver about "four freedoms" was simply garbage to persuade suckers like you.


In short....the only historian that you should give credence to is......lil' ol' moi.



Coming up.....I'll shred your ignorance of the Founders' creating a nation based on free markets.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Y

Please don't expect me to educate you on religion on a daily basis.
Perhaps more on Sunday.

More appropriate in this thread......



There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.[/QUOTE
When has the United States ever had free markets?

What are you doing here?

Shouldn't you be filling up on how your "historians" tell you how to ....repeat ( I almost said 'think').

Well I do read a lot of history. Good historians are important to me, but I generally read their books. Back to the question: when has the United States had free markets?

As we both know, not amount of education from any but your Liberal/Leftist "historians" will alter your indoctrination.

That's true, isn't it.

Well, like so many people at one time I used the "I 1think history" but the historians seemed so much more capable relating history than even the I Think method. P,S. you didn't include FDR's Four Freedoms in your post.
I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?

"Well, like so many people at one time I used the "I 1think history" but the historians seemed so much more capable relating history than even the I Think method. P,S. you didn't include FDR's Four Freedoms in your post.
I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?"



Well, well, well.....another day, another opportunity to put you in your place: that well-worn last seat in the dumb row.



Blinded as you are by the indoctrination, and your motto of allowing 'historians,' rather than the facts, to determine your worldview, you actually suggested that Franklin Roosevelt favored freedom, liberty, and the rights of others.....


...you actually wrote the risible "I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?"



1. Let's review....I offered you the opportunity to pick the better path for America....


a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'




Fearful as you Leftists are of exposing your true desires, you tried to avoid the choice...and, instead, claimed that America was not based on individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.
With that aim, you hid behind the suggestion that America was never based on free markets:

"Back to the question: when has the United States had free markets?"

Without lies and obfuscations, you Leftists would be mute.



2. Let's define the parameters of the discussion. Rather than every permutation and combination of each system, the choice for the purpose of this is binary.

Hence....the debate is whether the Founders intended

a. Free markets

or

b. The command and control economy endorsed, and demanded by Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.
In short....the modern Democrat Party.


To win the debate, I can simply demand that you show that our memorializing documents support any of those shameful six political views.



Next post....the Founders and the Free Market.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. ...you actually wrote the risible "I guess by now you have dropped the free market bit?"


Hence....the debate is whether the Founders intended

a. Free markets

or

b. The command and control economy endorsed, and demanded by Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


To win the debate, I can simply demand that you show that our memorializing documents support any of those shameful six political views.



2. Even before the Founders settled on 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, the political philosopher, John Locke served as the Founders's guide.
Americans were committed to John Locke's proposition that mankind has a God-given right to life, liberty, and property, and that legitimate governments are required to protect those rights. In the Constitutional Convention of 1787 James Madison, Gouverneur Morris, and others listed the protection of property rights as the primary reason for instituting government.




3. If the Founders were communists...or, modern Liberals, how would they restrict the rights of free men to own and do what they wished with their property?

Taxation and regulation. This is not to claim that neither were part of the Founders' views....but simply the degree of same: as the price of bread was regulated....and the taking of private property was clearly allowed under certain circumstance, with just and due compensation.



But... ' the Constitution created the largest contiguous area of free trade in the world. Neither the states nor the Congress could levy taxes on the interstate movement of goods which the states had been theoretically able to do prior to the adoption of the Constitution. For yet another, the contract clause of Article I, section 10 - "No State shall. . . pass any. . . Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts" - was a commitment to unfettered capitalism insofar as it prohibited state legislative interference into market transactions.' Forrest McDonald, “The Founding Fathers and the Economic Order” - Online Library of Liberty



a. James Madison relied on Sir William Blackstone's 4 volume Commentaries on the Laws of England, wherein we find the definition of property as ‘that sole and despotic dominion which one man claims and exercises over the external things of the world, in total exclusion of the right of any other individual in the universe.’ Property and Ownership > Notes (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)


Now....how would that fit under a communist, or Liberal/environmentalist view of government control of property?

Are you ready to admit to being a mind-numbed drone of Leftist propaganda???

No?

Welll then.....
More to come!

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. Now....your suggestion that the Founders were aligned with The command and control economy endorsed, and demanded by Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


This: collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



....rather than the free market.





2. Let's see if they endorsed communism, Liberalism, socialism, Nazism, Progressivism, or Fascism....

#1 “A wise and frugal government… shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.” — Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801

#2 “A people… who are possessed of the spirit of commerce, who see and who will pursue their advantages may achieve almost anything.” – George Washington

#3 “Government is instituted to protect property of every sort; as well that which lies in the various rights of individuals, as that which the term particularly expresses. This being the end of government, that alone is a just government which impartially secures to every man whatever is his own.” – James Madison, Essay on Property, 1792

#4 “To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, the guarantee to everyone the free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it.” — Thomas Jefferson, letter to Joseph Milligan, April 6, 1816

#5 “The moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence. If ‘Thou shalt not covet’ and ‘Thou shalt not steal’ were not commandments of Heaven, they must be made inviolable precepts in every society before it can be civilized or made free.” — John Adams, A Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America, 1787

#6 “Beware the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry.” – Thomas Paine


See any claim that America should have a command and control economy in the above?

Any?




Kind of smashes that custard pie in your kisser, huh?

 

[regent]

1. Now....your suggestion that the Founders were aligned with The command and control economy endorsed, and demanded by Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


This: collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



....rather than the free market.





2. Let's see if they endorsed communism, Liberalism, socialism, Nazism, Progressivism, or Fascism....

#1 “A wise and frugal government… shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.” — Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801

#2 “A people… who are possessed of the spirit of commerce, who see and who will pursue their advantages may achieve almost anything.” – George Washington

#3 “Government is instituted to protect property of every sort; as well that which lies in the various rights of individuals, as that which the term particularly expresses. This being the end of government, that alone is a just government which impartially secures to every man whatever is his own.” – James Madison, Essay on Property, 1792

#4 “To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, the guarantee to everyone the free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it.” — Thomas Jefferson, letter to Joseph Milligan, April 6, 1816

#5 “The moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence. If ‘Thou shalt not covet’ and ‘Thou shalt not steal’ were not commandments of Heaven, they must be made inviolable precepts in every society before it can be civilized or made free.” — John Adams, A Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America, 1787

#6 “Beware the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry.” – Thomas Paine


See any claim that America should have a command and control economy in the above?

Any?




Kind of smashes that custard pie in your kisser, huh?

It is not claims, but actions that count, and were the states given any control over the economy within their state?

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. Now....your suggestion that the Founders were aligned with The command and control economy endorsed, and demanded by Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


This: collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



....rather than the free market.





2. Let's see if they endorsed communism, Liberalism, socialism, Nazism, Progressivism, or Fascism....

#1 “A wise and frugal government… shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.” — Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801

#2 “A people… who are possessed of the spirit of commerce, who see and who will pursue their advantages may achieve almost anything.” – George Washington

#3 “Government is instituted to protect property of every sort; as well that which lies in the various rights of individuals, as that which the term particularly expresses. This being the end of government, that alone is a just government which impartially secures to every man whatever is his own.” – James Madison, Essay on Property, 1792

#4 “To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, the guarantee to everyone the free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it.” — Thomas Jefferson, letter to Joseph Milligan, April 6, 1816

#5 “The moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence. If ‘Thou shalt not covet’ and ‘Thou shalt not steal’ were not commandments of Heaven, they must be made inviolable precepts in every society before it can be civilized or made free.” — John Adams, A Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America, 1787

#6 “Beware the greedy hand of government thrusting itself into every corner and crevice of industry.” – Thomas Paine


See any claim that America should have a command and control economy in the above?

Any?




Kind of smashes that custard pie in your kisser, huh?

It is not claims, but actions that count, and were the states given any control over the economy within their state?

I guess by now you have dropped the 'Roosevelt was about freedom' bit?


I guess by now you have dropped the 'America wasn't designed around free market' bit?


I guess by now you have learned to never doubt me,huh?

 

[regent]

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

 

[PoliticalChic]

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

More beatings?

Sure.

Let's first take a look at your attempt to slither away...
You actually wrote this:
"The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market.....

.....and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom."



Pretty much an admission that you were wrong in trying to both deny this....
That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


....and your attempt to support the opposite.....this:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'


Wow....was that easy.
But.....ripping you anti-Americans is usually both fun and easy.



Be sure to let me know if you need some more slapping around.

 

[regent]

Perhaps that's just the difference between written history

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

More beatings?

Sure.

Let's first take a look at your attempt to slither away...
You actually wrote this:
"The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market.....

.....and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom."



Pretty much an admission that you were wrong in trying to both deny this....
That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


....and your attempt to support the opposite.....this:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'


Wow....was that easy.
But.....ripping you anti-Americans is usually both fun and easy.



Be sure to let me know if you need some more slapping around.

I'm not sure that you even know what I'm talking about, and as for that slapping around stuff, I'm not into that, even if it might be historic.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Perhaps that's just the difference between written history

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

More beatings?

Sure.

Let's first take a look at your attempt to slither away...
You actually wrote this:
"The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market.....

.....and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom."



Pretty much an admission that you were wrong in trying to both deny this....
That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


....and your attempt to support the opposite.....this:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'


Wow....was that easy.
But.....ripping you anti-Americans is usually both fun and easy.



Be sure to let me know if you need some more slapping around.

I'm not sure that you even know what I'm talking about, and as for that slapping around stuff, I'm not into that, even if it might be historic.

If you're back....you're here for a beating.

Let's review.....
I gave you this choice, as it represents the binary between liberty....the Founders.....and totalitarian governance, any of these six:
Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


You're too much of a wimp to admit the truth.....but claimed that there was no free market aspect to the America of the Founders.

Of course I proved you wrong....with quotes of those folks.


Now to inflict more damage....as you so richly deserve.


What...you might say that the Founders lived far too long ago?

Well....my personal favorite was more contemporary....let's see what he has to say.


Milton Friedman on free markets and the Founders....

" It’s true that there have been free men who have made free markets. The founders of this country, the fathers of our Constitution, were free men who believed in individual and personal freedom, and they set up a Constitution that was designed to preserve free markets.


The founders of the American Constitution did establish free markets, but what really preserved free markets in this country were not the philosophical ideas of the founders. It was a fortunate accident that in the 1830’s, over a century ago, when state after state, including Illinois, went in for government control and government activity, the government projects were failures. How many of you know that at one time Illinois had state-owned and operated banks? They failed and so they went out of business. There was an enormous movement at that time for states to construct canals and railroads, toward what today we would call socialism or national enterprise or central planning on a state-by-state level. But the crisis of 1837 wiped them all out. It was that accident, more I believe than the philosophical ideas of the founders of this country, that preserved free markets in this country.


....free markets make free men and that controlled markets destroy free men..."
https://www.chicagobooth.edu/~/media/917BA065D1914F8F8DF7536680FD7EE7.pdf




Don't forget.....c'mon back whenever you feel the need for a spanking.

 

[regent]

Perhaps that's just the difference between written history

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

More beatings?

Sure.

Let's first take a look at your attempt to slither away...
You actually wrote this:
"The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market.....

.....and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom."



Pretty much an admission that you were wrong in trying to both deny this....
That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


....and your attempt to support the opposite.....this:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'


Wow....was that easy.
But.....ripping you anti-Americans is usually both fun and easy.



Be sure to let me know if you need some more slapping around.

I'm not sure that you even know what I'm talking about, and as for that slapping around stuff, I'm not into that, even if it might be historic.

If you're back....you're here for a beating.

Let's review.....
I gave you this choice, as it represents the binary between liberty....the Founders.....and totalitarian governance, any of these six:
Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


You're too much of a wimp to admit the truth.....but claimed that there was no free market aspect to the America of the Founders.

Of course I proved you wrong....with quotes of those folks.


Now to inflict more damage....as you so richly deserve.


What...you might say that the Founders lived far too long ago?

Well....my personal favorite was more contemporary....let's see what he has to say.


Milton Friedman on free markets and the Founders....

" It’s true that there have been free men who have made free markets. The founders of this country, the fathers of our Constitution, were free men who believed in individual and personal freedom, and they set up a Constitution that was designed to preserve free markets.


The founders of the American Constitution did establish free markets, but what really preserved free markets in this country were not the philosophical ideas of the founders. It was a fortunate accident that in the 1830’s, over a century ago, when state after state, including Illinois, went in for government control and government activity, the government projects were failures. How many of you know that at one time Illinois had state-owned and operated banks? They failed and so they went out of business. There was an enormous movement at that time for states to construct canals and railroads, toward what today we would call socialism or national enterprise or central planning on a state-by-state level. But the crisis of 1837 wiped them all out. It was that accident, more I believe than the philosophical ideas of the founders of this country, that preserved free markets in this country.


....free markets make free men and that controlled markets destroy free men..."
https://www.chicagobooth.edu/~/media/917BA065D1914F8F8DF7536680FD7EE7.pdf




Don't forget.....c'mon back whenever you feel the need for a spanking.

Do you have idea what went on in 1837 to cause the market collapse?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Perhaps that's just the difference between written history

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

More beatings?

Sure.

Let's first take a look at your attempt to slither away...
You actually wrote this:
"The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market.....

.....and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom."



Pretty much an admission that you were wrong in trying to both deny this....
That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


....and your attempt to support the opposite.....this:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'


Wow....was that easy.
But.....ripping you anti-Americans is usually both fun and easy.



Be sure to let me know if you need some more slapping around.

I'm not sure that you even know what I'm talking about, and as for that slapping around stuff, I'm not into that, even if it might be historic.

If you're back....you're here for a beating.

Let's review.....
I gave you this choice, as it represents the binary between liberty....the Founders.....and totalitarian governance, any of these six:
Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


You're too much of a wimp to admit the truth.....but claimed that there was no free market aspect to the America of the Founders.

Of course I proved you wrong....with quotes of those folks.


Now to inflict more damage....as you so richly deserve.


What...you might say that the Founders lived far too long ago?

Well....my personal favorite was more contemporary....let's see what he has to say.


Milton Friedman on free markets and the Founders....

" It’s true that there have been free men who have made free markets. The founders of this country, the fathers of our Constitution, were free men who believed in individual and personal freedom, and they set up a Constitution that was designed to preserve free markets.


The founders of the American Constitution did establish free markets, but what really preserved free markets in this country were not the philosophical ideas of the founders. It was a fortunate accident that in the 1830’s, over a century ago, when state after state, including Illinois, went in for government control and government activity, the government projects were failures. How many of you know that at one time Illinois had state-owned and operated banks? They failed and so they went out of business. There was an enormous movement at that time for states to construct canals and railroads, toward what today we would call socialism or national enterprise or central planning on a state-by-state level. But the crisis of 1837 wiped them all out. It was that accident, more I believe than the philosophical ideas of the founders of this country, that preserved free markets in this country.


....free markets make free men and that controlled markets destroy free men..."
https://www.chicagobooth.edu/~/media/917BA065D1914F8F8DF7536680FD7EE7.pdf




Don't forget.....c'mon back whenever you feel the need for a spanking.

Do you have idea what went on in 1837 to cause the market collapse?

Now...why are you running from the issue?
See how neatly I've boiled the choices down for you?

It's simple, and binary.

Sooooo.....why the deep fear or answering?

There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.


Then, defend your pick.


If you can.


You pick.

 

[PoliticalChic]

The whole idea of "God-given" freedom is goofy. According to the standard biblical theology, "freedom" from the dictatorial Paradise is the result of Adam and Eve's original sin. Or if one is inclined to extra-biblical Christian beliefs, due to the rebellion of Satan among the Angels.

Unless of course one is a Deist...

Here is your abbreviated lesson on the Bible:

There are dolts who follow dictums of the French Revolution, replacing religion and morality with science and reason.
Such has proven to be far more than an unmitigated failure: it resulted in the millions upon millions slaughtered by communists, fascists, Nazis.....

Reason supports a lot of things, as for example, a very liberal position on abortion. If there is no God, "Love your neighbor as yourself" is just a good idea. That's why it is written, incidentally, in Leviticus, "Love your neighbor as yourself, I am God." I, God, tell you to be decent to other people.
Prager

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Religion.... As An Excuse For Socialism?

 

[Agit8r]

The whole idea of "God-given" freedom is goofy. According to the standard biblical theology, "freedom" from the dictatorial Paradise is the result of Adam and Eve's original sin. Or if one is inclined to extra-biblical Christian beliefs, due to the rebellion of Satan among the Angels.

Unless of course one is a Deist...

Here is your abbreviated lesson on the Bible:

There are dolts who follow dictums of the French Revolution, replacing religion and morality with science and reason.
Such has proven to be far more than an unmitigated failure: it resulted in the millions upon millions slaughtered by communists, fascists, Nazis.....

Reason supports a lot of things, as for example, a very liberal position on abortion. If there is no God, "Love your neighbor as yourself" is just a good idea. That's why it is written, incidentally, in Leviticus, "Love your neighbor as yourself, I am God." I, God, tell you to be decent to other people.
Prager

I bet you haven't even read the Bible

Religion.... As An Excuse For Socialism?

It was all the excuse that the Jesuits needed in Paraguay...

 

[regent]

Perhaps that's just the difference between written history

As I said the market was not free, it had both state and federal laws and supervision. The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom.

More beatings?

Sure.

Let's first take a look at your attempt to slither away...
You actually wrote this:
"The framers had discovered they had given too much freedom to the market.....

.....and so the new Constitution took away some of that freedom."



Pretty much an admission that you were wrong in trying to both deny this....
That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


....and your attempt to support the opposite.....this:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'


Wow....was that easy.
But.....ripping you anti-Americans is usually both fun and easy.



Be sure to let me know if you need some more slapping around.

I'm not sure that you even know what I'm talking about, and as for that slapping around stuff, I'm not into that, even if it might be historic.

If you're back....you're here for a beating.

Let's review.....
I gave you this choice, as it represents the binary between liberty....the Founders.....and totalitarian governance, any of these six:
Communists, Liberals, Progressives, Nazis, Fascists, and Socialists.

In short....the modern Democrat Party.


You're too much of a wimp to admit the truth.....but claimed that there was no free market aspect to the America of the Founders.

Of course I proved you wrong....with quotes of those folks.


Now to inflict more damage....as you so richly deserve.


What...you might say that the Founders lived far too long ago?

Well....my personal favorite was more contemporary....let's see what he has to say.


Milton Friedman on free markets and the Founders....

" It’s true that there have been free men who have made free markets. The founders of this country, the fathers of our Constitution, were free men who believed in individual and personal freedom, and they set up a Constitution that was designed to preserve free markets.


The founders of the American Constitution did establish free markets, but what really preserved free markets in this country were not the philosophical ideas of the founders. It was a fortunate accident that in the 1830’s, over a century ago, when state after state, including Illinois, went in for government control and government activity, the government projects were failures. How many of you know that at one time Illinois had state-owned and operated banks? They failed and so they went out of business. There was an enormous movement at that time for states to construct canals and railroads, toward what today we would call socialism or national enterprise or central planning on a state-by-state level. But the crisis of 1837 wiped them all out. It was that accident, more I believe than the philosophical ideas of the founders of this country, that preserved free markets in this country.


....free markets make free men and that controlled markets destroy free men..."
https://www.chicagobooth.edu/~/media/917BA065D1914F8F8DF7536680FD7EE7.pdf




Don't forget.....c'mon back whenever you feel the need for a spanking.

Do you have idea what went on in 1837 to cause the market collapse?

Now...why are you running from the issue?
See how neatly I've boiled the choices down for you?

It's simple, and binary.

Sooooo.....why the deep fear or answering?

There are two choices:

a. That of the Founders, individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government, via the Constitution.


b. Leftists.....communists, Liberals,Progressives, whatever, offer the following:
collectivization, unquestioning lock-step adherence to government policies, over-regulation, and unlimited central command and control governance.....'



You pick.


Then, defend your pick.


If you can.


You pick.

The framers of the Constitution created a document that increased the powers of national government. The economy was very much a part of that document as we had a national debt that would not be paid off, for the first and only time in our history until a Democrat, did the deed in 1837,