Zone1 The greatest failure of Christianity.

[Woodznutz]

We are to "love others as we love ourselves". However, we don't really love ourselves, so there is not much benefit for either ourselves or others. Implicit is that we first love ourselves so that we understand what it means, and then confer that knowledge to others. In this the Christian world has failed. Perhaps it's because we are all waiting for someone to love us first, which of course is a zero-sum game spiritually. Best to discover what "love" actually is and apply it to ourselves, prove that it is beneficial, then share it with others.

 

[occupied]

The golden rule does not require that you love anything. Just treat everyone with the same basic level of respect you expect for yourself.

 

[Woodznutz]

The golden rule does not require that you love anything. Just treat everyone with the same basic level of respect you expect for yourself.

That's more 'live and let live' than love.

 

[occupied]

That's more 'live and let live' than love.

Half the golden rule is minding your own business.

 

[Woodznutz]

Half the golden rule is minding your own business.

Our business is our health and wealth. How's that working for us?

 

[MarathonMike]

We are to "love others as we love ourselves". However, we don't really love ourselves, so there is not much benefit for either ourselves or others. Implicit is that we first love ourselves so that we understand what it means, and then confer that knowledge to others. In this the Christian world has failed. Perhaps it's because we are all waiting for someone to love us first, which of course is a zero-sum game spiritually. Best to discover what "love" actually is and apply it to ourselves, prove that it is beneficial, then share it with others.

I've always thought that is one of many biblical phrases that was garbled in translation.

 

[Woodznutz]

I've always thought that is one of many biblical phrases that was garbled in translation.

It does require some thought, such as "If the blind lead the blind won't they both fall into the ditch?"

 

[occupied]

How's that working for us?

Works for me.

 

[occupied]

It does require some thought, such as "If the blind lead the blind won't they both fall into the ditch?"

The only thought involved are for those looking to disregard this unabiguous commandment of Jesus without getting on his bad side.

 

[jwoodie]

The thread title

We are to "love others as we love ourselves". However, we don't really love ourselves, so there is not much benefit for either ourselves or others. Implicit is that we first love ourselves so that we understand what it means, and then confer that knowledge to others. In this the Christian world has failed. Perhaps it's because we are all waiting for someone to love us first, which of course is a zero-sum game spiritually. Best to discover what "love" actually is and apply it to ourselves, prove that it is beneficial, then share it with others.

The Christian message is that of forgiveness of ourselves as well as others. This is beneficial to both. Unfortunately, this message is constantly undermined by the pursuit of material goods and social status.

 

[Woodznutz]

Works for me.

Me too. Oh, that it worked for those others.

 

[Woodznutz]

The only thought involved are for those looking to disregard this unabiguous commandment of Jesus without getting on his bad side.

I think that,

Assent of will,
Judgement,
Duty,
Propriety,

the four main elements of agape,
require some thought.

 

[Woodznutz]

The thread title

The Christian message is that of forgiveness of ourselves as well as others. This is beneficial to both. Unfortunately, this message is constantly undermined by the pursuit of material goods and social status.

The message, although beneficial for all, manifests mainly in the church.

 

[Foxfyre]

We are to "love others as we love ourselves". However, we don't really love ourselves, so there is not much benefit for either ourselves or others. Implicit is that we first love ourselves so that we understand what it means, and then confer that knowledge to others. In this the Christian world has failed. Perhaps it's because we are all waiting for someone to love us first, which of course is a zero-sum game spiritually. Best to discover what "love" actually is and apply it to ourselves, prove that it is beneficial, then share it with others.

Maybe you're being too hard on us Christians in this regard? Now I admit many Christians miss the mark when it comes to love. The teaching is pretty explicit that he who does not love does not know God. And it is hard for me to see the Christ in those who so obviously express hate toward others.

But remember that the New Testament was written mostly in Greek and there are six Greek words translated 'love' that have different meanings. The passage:

Mark 12:30-31 NIV: 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no commandment greater than these.”

uses the Greek word "agape" i.e. brotherly love, charity, concern for humankind or in ecclesiastical use "the love of God for man and man for God." "Man" of course interpreted 'humankind' in this context.

I've seen too many examples of agape love in Christians to believe it is not a strong component of Christianity as we know it in the 21st century.

 

[Woodznutz]

Maybe you're being too hard on us Christians in this regard? Now I admit many Christians miss the mark when it comes to love. The teaching is pretty explicit that he who does not love does not know God. And it is hard for me to see the Christ in those who so obviously express hate toward others.

But remember that the New Testament was written mostly in Greek and there are six Greek words translated 'love' that have different meanings. The passage:

Mark 12:30-31 NIV: 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no commandment greater than these.”

uses the Greek word "agape" i.e. brotherly love, charity, concern for humankind or in ecclesiastical use "the love of God for man and man for God." "Man" of course interpreted 'humankind' in this context.

I've seen too many examples of agape love in Christians to believe it is not a strong component of Christianity as we know it in the 21st century.

Agape is much deeper and more detailed than that. The best Greek translation is found in Strong's translation of phileo where a comparison between the two is made.

Strong’s Definitions [?](Strong’s Definitions Legend)
φιλέω philéō, fil-eh'-o; from G5384; to be a friend to (fond of (an individual or an object)), i.e. have affection for (denoting personal attachment, as a matter of sentiment or feeling; while G25 (agape) is wider, embracing especially the judgment and the deliberate assent of the will as a matter of principle, duty and propriety: the two thus stand related very much as G2309 and G1014, or as G2372 and G3563 respectively; the former (phileo) being chiefly of the heart and the latter (agape) of the head); specially, to kiss (as a mark of tenderness):—kiss, love.

 

[BreezeWood]

Best to discover what "love" actually is and apply it to ourselves, prove that it is beneficial, then share it with others.

spoken as a true crucifier, the outcome derived from the c-bible ...

best start from scratch and if referring to the christian bible rewrite it the way jesus meant for it to be written than how those that murdered him wrote it in the 4th century ...

Then God said, “Let us make life in our image, in our likeness, the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky the livestock and all the wild animals, and all the creatures that move along the ground.”

an example of what jesus taught - not found in the c-bible ... forgeries and fallacies on nearly every page.

 

[Foxfyre]

Agape is much deeper and more detailed than that. The best Greek translation is found in Strong's translation of phileo where a comparison between the two is made.

I prefer to keep things as simple as they can be and not make things harder than they have to be.

 

[Woodznutz]

spoken as a true crucifier, the outcome derived from the c-bible ...

best start from scratch and if referring to the christian bible rewrite it the way jesus meant for it to be written than how those that murdered him wrote it in the 4th century ...



an example of what jesus taught - not found in the c-bible ... forgeries and fallacies on nearly every page.

Send me the corrected version.

 

[Woodznutz]

I prefer to keep things as simple as they can be and not make things harder than they have to be.

Couldn't be simpler. There are two kinds of love. Most operate on one to the exclusion of the other. Not good.

I know a woman who loves her baby girl with all her heart, but is turning her into a whiny little brat because she isn't using her head.

 

[Arlette]

We are to "love others as we love ourselves". However, we don't really love ourselves, so there is not much benefit for either ourselves or others. Implicit is that we first love ourselves so that we understand what it means, and then confer that knowledge to others. In this the Christian world has failed. Perhaps it's because we are all waiting for someone to love us first, which of course is a zero-sum game spiritually. Best to discover what "love" actually is and apply it to ourselves, prove that it is beneficial, then share it with others.

The greatest failure of Christianity in America was crawling into bed with Trump.