The glaring evidence that Obamacare is a catastrophic FAILURE continues to mount

[Unkotare]

human capital is the the most invaluable asset we have.

That's exactly why we shouldn't leave it to the least efficient entity in the nation - the government.

This is a late breaking Fox opinion.

 

[dblack]

I'll bet that you count the number of adequately self insured families in the country on one hand. Yet you want to design our whole health insurance system around them.

Don't strawman it. I'm not talking about wholly self-insuring. I'm talking about something a reasonably prudent middle class family could do - put 10 - 20k away in an HSA and get dirt cheap catastrophic insurance with a huge deductible. That was the trend before ACA, and it's what the insurance lobby is trying to head off at the pass. They don't want us paying for own health care because it cuts them out of the picture as middlemen. It injects real responsibility into the equation.

Just like the bankers trying to keep us all addicted to credit, they want to keep themselves in the middle of every single health care transaction. That's why they finally stopped fighting health 'care' reform, and twisted the effort into a scheme to protect their turf. And fools like you are selling it for them.

Ok, now you've got your population up to two handfuls.

What is your plan for the millions who either chose or have no option to buy health care insurance?

My 'plan' for them is to let them decide for themselves how to manage their own health care expenses. Treat them like actual adults; hold them accountable for their own health care costs and stop pretending that there's such a thing as a 'right to be taken care of'.

 

[PMZ]

Don't strawman it. I'm not talking about wholly self-insuring. I'm talking about something a reasonably prudent middle class family could do - put 10 - 20k away in an HSA and get dirt cheap catastrophic insurance with a huge deductible. That was the trend before ACA, and it's what the insurance lobby is trying to head off at the pass. They don't want us paying for own health care because it cuts them out of the picture as middlemen. It injects real responsibility into the equation.

Just like the bankers trying to keep us all addicted to credit, they want to keep themselves in the middle of every single health care transaction. That's why they finally stopped fighting health 'care' reform, and twisted the effort into a scheme to protect their turf. And fools like you are selling it for them.

Ok, now you've got your population up to two handfuls.

What is your plan for the millions who either chose or have no option to buy health care insurance?

My 'plan' for them is to let them decide for themselves. Hold them accountable for their own health care costs and stop pretending that there's such a thing as a 'right to be taken care of'.

I'm not as generous as you about paying the health care costs of anyone who just doesn't want to pay their own.

 

[dblack]

Ok, now you've got your population up to two handfuls.

What is your plan for the millions who either chose or have no option to buy health care insurance?

My 'plan' for them is to let them decide for themselves. Hold them accountable for their own health care costs and stop pretending that there's such a thing as a 'right to be taken care of'.

I'm not as generous as you about paying the health care costs of anyone who just doesn't want to pay their own.

I hear you. You've done nothing but whine about it for the entire thread. That's what get's me about the 'bleeding hearts'. They're not the slightest bit altruistic, and they don't really want to help out the under privileged - certainly not if it costs them anything. They prefer to use the power of the vote to force some other sucker into doing it instead.

 

[PMZ]

My 'plan' for them is to let them decide for themselves. Hold them accountable for their own health care costs and stop pretending that there's such a thing as a 'right to be taken care of'.

I'm not as generous as you about paying the health care costs of anyone who just doesn't want to pay their own.

I hear you. You've done nothing but whine about it for the entire thread. That's what get's me about the 'bleeding hearts'. They're not the slightest bit altruistic, and the don't want to help out the under privileged - not if it costs them anything. They prefer to use the power of the vote to force some other poor schmoe into doing it instead.

I hear you Fox Opinions.

With Obamacare everybody who business chooses to pay a living wage to is required to pay for their own health care, no exceptions.

Those that business chooses to not pay a living wage to will receive subsidies to make up for their employers irresponsibility.

 

[dblack]

Those that business chooses to not pay a living wage to will receive subsidies to make up for their employers irresponsibility.

Doesn't that just make you hopping mad? Those dastardly irresponsible employers are costing you money! Good thing Obama gave 'em a break, eh?

 

[PMZ]

Those that business chooses to not pay a living wage to will receive subsidies to make up for their employers irresponsibility.

Doesn't that just make you hopping mad? Those dastardly irresponsible employers are costing you money! Good thing Obama gave 'em a break, eh?

Those employers have you fooled into believing that them choosing to not pay a living wage makes things cheaper for you. It just moves the cost of those people from the companies payroll to the governments, and we know who pays that.

Once someone is born, they have to be paid for by somebody for the next 80 years or so. The ones that cause the economy to grow are the ones who are taught by family and friends and schools to be responsible and skilled and educated. If they are employed.

All means of welfare are the cost of failure. Failure of families, of schools, of culture, of business to provide well paying jobs. Countries don't achieve less welfare just by cutting it back. That inevitably exasperates every cause of failure.

Economies grow by replacing failure in families, schools, culture, and business with success.

That's progress. It comes from solving problems.

 

[dblack]

Those that business chooses to not pay a living wage to will receive subsidies to make up for their employers irresponsibility.

Doesn't that just make you hopping mad? Those dastardly irresponsible employers are costing you money! Good thing Obama gave 'em a break, eh?

Those employers have you fooled into believing that them choosing to not pay a living wage makes things cheaper for you.

Nah.. I didn't say anything like that. I'm not the one shilling for insurance companies.

You just seem awfully selective in which 'irresponsible' people you're willing to subsidize. You don't seem to have a problem with picking up the slack for employers who aren't paying their employees a 'living wage', yet you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down. I'm beginning to think you might have a lot of stock in Wellpoint or something. Is your name Liz Fowler?

 

[BlackSand]

All means of welfare are the cost of failure. Failure of families, of schools, of culture, of business to provide well paying jobs. Countries don't achieve less welfare just by cutting it back. That inevitably exasperates every cause of failure.

You were doing okay right up to the part in bold above.
Here is a link to a website that lists 1000 current openings for positions that pay more than 100k a year ... And it is just one website.

100k Jobs, Employment | Indeed.com

Edit:
Businesses do offer well paying jobs ... And for the most part, the other three reasons are why they cannot find employees to fill them.

.

 

[Unkotare]

Those that business chooses to not pay a living wage to will receive subsidies to make up for their employers irresponsibility.

Doesn't that just make you hopping mad? Those dastardly irresponsible employers are costing you money! Good thing Obama gave 'em a break, eh?

Those employers have you fooled into believing that them choosing to not pay a living wage makes things cheaper for you.

at the lefty talking points. Chapter and verse.

 

[P@triot]

Those that business chooses to not pay a living wage to will receive subsidies to make up for their employers irresponsibility.

Doesn't that just make you hopping mad? Those dastardly irresponsible employers are costing you money! Good thing Obama gave 'em a break, eh?

Those employers have you fooled into believing that them choosing to not pay a living wage makes things cheaper for you. It just moves the cost of those people from the companies payroll to the governments, and we know who pays that.

Once someone is born, they have to be paid for by somebody for the next 80 years or so. The ones that cause the economy to grow are the ones who are taught by family and friends and schools to be responsible and skilled and educated. If they are employed.

All means of welfare are the cost of failure. Failure of families, of schools, of culture, of business to provide well paying jobs. Countries don't achieve less welfare just by cutting it back. That inevitably exasperates every cause of failure.

Economies grow by replacing failure in families, schools, culture, and business with success.

That's progress. It comes from solving problems.

And unfortunately [MENTION=43872]PMZ[/MENTION], Dumbocrats replace families, schools, culture, and business with FAILURE. Always have, always will.

And yes, that is the Dumbocrats idea of "progress". Sitting on their lazy ass and asking government to do everything for them in exchange for their freedom. "Progress". Ain't it grand!

 

[P@triot]

With Obamacare everybody who business chooses to pay a living wage to is required to pay for their own health care, no exceptions.

In the history of this nation [MENTION=43872]PMZ[/MENTION], there has never been a single business that didn't pay a "living wage". Never. It has never happened.

The problem comes in the parasite (such as you) definition of "living wage". You believe you are entitled to a $700 iPhone, a $700 iPad, and $3,000 plasma tv, a $65,000 BMW, and a $400,000 home, among other things because you've seen other people with them. What you haven't seen is the work they had to put in to achieve those things.

If you weren't so greedy and lazy, you would realize that the lowest minimum wage job at McDonald's provides more than enough "living wage" in America. And it comes with tremendous perks such as college tuition to better yourself and become whatever you want to become. But a McDonald's minimum wage requires that you forgo the iPhone, the iPad, the plasma tv, the BMW, and the large home for paying your necessities such as food, health insurance, and utilities.

In summary - you want to put in the effort and hours of a minimum wage worker, live like a skilled and hard working executive, and have your fellow tax payer pick up the large gap left over.

 

[P@triot]

Uh-oh [MENTION=43872]PMZ[/MENTION]! This isn't "Fox!" and this person is an Obama supporter. Now what chief? What kind of excuse can you come up with this time? Spin it PMZ, spin it!

Will PMZ go with the "she didn't really lose her health insurance and nobody has else either" absurd claim?

Or will PMZ go with tried and true Tourette's back up of "Fox! Fox! Fox!"?

Or will PMZ go the schizophrenic route where she suddenly becomes a conservative and pretends that she supports personal responsibility while pretending like we don't and while pretending that's what Obamacare exists for? (this one is always one of my favorites)?

Obama supporter miffed at botched healthcare rollout - latimes.com

 

[PMZ]

Doesn't that just make you hopping mad? Those dastardly irresponsible employers are costing you money! Good thing Obama gave 'em a break, eh?

Those employers have you fooled into believing that them choosing to not pay a living wage makes things cheaper for you.

Nah.. I didn't say anything like that. I'm not the one shilling for insurance companies.

You just seem awfully selective in which 'irresponsible' people you're willing to subsidize. You don't seem to have a problem with picking up the slack for employers who aren't paying their employees a 'living wage', yet you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down. I'm beginning to think you might have a lot of stock in Wellpoint or something. Is your name Liz Fowler?

"you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down."

That's quite a bit different than what I said. I said that I want them to pay for their own health care. To be personally responsible.

Your reaction to personal responsibility is bizarre.

 

[dblack]

Those employers have you fooled into believing that them choosing to not pay a living wage makes things cheaper for you.

Nah.. I didn't say anything like that. I'm not the one shilling for insurance companies.

You just seem awfully selective in which 'irresponsible' people you're willing to subsidize. You don't seem to have a problem with picking up the slack for employers who aren't paying their employees a 'living wage', yet you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down. I'm beginning to think you might have a lot of stock in Wellpoint or something. Is your name Liz Fowler?

"you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down."

That's quite a bit different than what I said. I said that I want them to pay for their own health care. To be personally responsible.

No, you don't. You want to force them to buy health insurance.

 

[PMZ]

All means of welfare are the cost of failure. Failure of families, of schools, of culture, of business to provide well paying jobs. Countries don't achieve less welfare just by cutting it back. That inevitably exasperates every cause of failure.

You were doing okay right up to the part in bold above.
Here is a link to a website that lists 1000 current openings for positions that pay more than 100k a year ... And it is just one website.

100k Jobs, Employment | Indeed.com

Edit:
Businesses do offer well paying jobs ... And for the most part, the other three reasons are why they cannot find employees to fill them.

.

You make it sound like businesses here don't benefit from a healthy economy. How weird is that? They want poor workers and wealthy customers, and they're the same people! In other words they want to benefit from other employers being smarter than they.

And then they want to blame their mess on government.

And you people fall for it every time. Yikes!

 

[PMZ]

Nah.. I didn't say anything like that. I'm not the one shilling for insurance companies.

You just seem awfully selective in which 'irresponsible' people you're willing to subsidize. You don't seem to have a problem with picking up the slack for employers who aren't paying their employees a 'living wage', yet you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down. I'm beginning to think you might have a lot of stock in Wellpoint or something. Is your name Liz Fowler?

"you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down."

That's quite a bit different than what I said. I said that I want them to pay for their own health care. To be personally responsible.

No, you don't. You want to force them to buy health insurance.

Why do you keep trying to speak for me?

I said that I expect them to pay for their own health care!

 

[dblack]

"you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down."

That's quite a bit different than what I said. I said that I want them to pay for their own health care. To be personally responsible.

No, you don't. You want to force them to buy health insurance.

Why do you keep trying to speak for me?

I said that I expect them to pay for their own health care!

Are you no longer claiming that as justification for forcing them to buy health insurance? If you've changed your mind, that's great!

 

[BlackSand]

All means of welfare are the cost of failure. Failure of families, of schools, of culture, of business to provide well paying jobs. Countries don't achieve less welfare just by cutting it back. That inevitably exasperates every cause of failure.

You were doing okay right up to the part in bold above.
Here is a link to a website that lists 1000 current openings for positions that pay more than 100k a year ... And it is just one website.

100k Jobs, Employment | Indeed.com

Edit:
Businesses do offer well paying jobs ... And for the most part, the other three reasons are why they cannot find employees to fill them.

.

You make it sound like businesses here don't benefit from a healthy economy. How weird is that? They want poor workers and wealthy customers, and they're the same people! In other words they want to benefit from other employers being smarter than they.

And then they want to blame their mess on government.

And you people fall for it every time. Yikes!

I provided you with the link to real jobs ... That pay dang good salaries ... Over a thousand of them that are current and just one website.

They are all empty ... And it isn't because they cannot find cheap employees.
It is because they don't teach people how to think in school anymore ... They teach them what to think, and a social agenda ... While that kind of thinking isn't innovative, and doesn't produce acceptable results.
It is because society excuses people's failures ... Doesn't expect people to excel anymore ... Makes it easier on people who put out minimal effort.
The ACA, the minimum wage ... And all the other garbage the Progressive Liberals promote now is in lieu of the fact that Democrats can no longer get away with straight over the counter handouts.

They have to find another way to keep supporting their voter base on the backs of the successful ... And when they cannot tax businesses any further to give away money to their voters ... They will still put it in their hand with minimum wage.

If anyone is fooling themselves ... it is you.
You cannot argue with the open jobs that pay far more than minimum wage ... And the absence of warm bodies to fill them.
You and your kind are failing your fellow citizens ... And nine times out of ten it is under the guise of attempting to help them.

.

 

[PMZ]

Nah.. I didn't say anything like that. I'm not the one shilling for insurance companies.

You just seem awfully selective in which 'irresponsible' people you're willing to subsidize. You don't seem to have a problem with picking up the slack for employers who aren't paying their employees a 'living wage', yet you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down. I'm beginning to think you might have a lot of stock in Wellpoint or something. Is your name Liz Fowler?

"you want to bully middle class working folks into sucking insurance industry cock to keep your premiums down."

That's quite a bit different than what I said. I said that I want them to pay for their own health care. To be personally responsible.

No, you don't. You want to force them to buy health insurance.

Here's the deal. You talk for you. I talk for me.