The Founders on Religion

[USNavyVet]

Given that state supported persecution by the Catholic Church was the reason the Pilgrims left Europe, it is easy to see why the Founders wanted church doctrine kept out of government.

The Pilgrims fled England and the Anglican church, not the Catholic church.

 

[P@triot]

I'm sorry, when you say "church in government" I have no idea what you're saying. What does "church in government" mean to you? How much religion do you want to see in our government?

It means that those in office govern based on biblical principles while still respecting and upholding the U.S. Constitution. That we allow prayer in school and a religious symbol in a government building.

Whose religion?

Protestant. That's what we were founded on. Those of different faiths are still free to practice their religion of course. But they aren't free to dictate that we can't have a cross on a public square or that we can't say Jesus in schools.

 

[P@triot]

Given that state supported persecution by the Catholic Church was the reason the Pilgrims left Europe, it is easy to see why the Founders wanted church doctrine kept out of government.

The Pilgrims fled England and the Anglican church, not the Catholic church.

Well that's not entirely true. They fled England and the Catholic Church. Enter the "Protestant Reformation". And that's exactly what America was built on.

 

[Political Junky]

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. ... But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding....~ Thomas Jefferson

Are you sure you want to discuss Thomas Jefferson with me?!?

“The varieties in the structure and action of the human mind, as in those of the body, are the work of our Creator, against which it cannot be a religious duty to erect the standard of uniformity. The practice of morality being necessary for the well-being of society, He has taken care to impress its precepts so indelibly on our hearts that they shall not be effaced by the subtleties of our brain. We all agree in the obligation of the moral precepts of Jesus". – Thomas Jefferson in a letter to James Fishback (September 27, 1809.)

Founders Online: Thomas Jefferson to James Fishback (Draft), 27 September 1809

Check out this book on the iBooks Store: The Real Thomas Jefferson

Jefferson edited a Bible in which he omitted all miracles.

 

[P@triot]

Jefferson edited a Bible in which he omitted all miracles.

Bwahahahahaha! Another hatriot completely sold on left-wing propaganda. Thomas Jefferson did no such thing. What he did do was create what is now known as "The Jefferson Bible". He was so enthralled with Jesus and his teachings that he considered it to be (and I quote) “His system of morality was the most benevolent and sublime probably that has been ever taught, and consequently more perfect than those of any of the ancient philosophers.… [He was] the most innocent, the most benevolent, the most eloquent and sublime character that ever has been exhibited to man" [1].

In addition to his fawning over Jesus, he felt that simplifying the Bible to just those teaching would be the best way to connect with and convert Native Americans. For these two reasons, he started cutting out only the lessons of Jesus and formed what would become known as "The Jefferson Bible". Once again I quote, “The Philosophy of Jesus of Nazareth, being Extracted from the Account of His Life and Doctrines Given by Matthew, Mark, Luke and John; Being an Abridgement of the New Testament for the Use of the Indians, Unembarrassed [Uncomplicated] with Matters of Fact or Faith beyond the Level of their Comprehensions” [2].

Why is it so hard for the left to fact-check the propaganda fed to them? There is no excuse in this day and age of smartphones and the internet.

[1] Thomas Jefferson in a letter to Dr. Joseph Priestley (April 9, 1803)
To Joseph Priestley | The Papers of Thomas Jefferson

[2] Excerpt From: Barton, David. “The Jefferson Lies.” Wallbuilders, 2012-09-17. This material may be protected by copyright.
Check out this book on the iBooks Store: The Jefferson Lies

Excerpt From: Andrew M. Allison. “The Real Thomas Jefferson: The True Story of America's Philosopher of Freedom". This material may be protected by copyright.
Check out this book on the iBooks Store: The Real Thomas Jefferson

 

[NYcarbineer]

I don't think the intent of the founders on the subject of religion was that we should forever treat the founders as gods.

Of course not - because if we do then we respect the U.S. Constitution which limits power. And we can't have that, right? You facists can't accept a limitation on power.

Yes, the Constitution limits the power of religions to have power.

Interesting. You support it limiting power on religion but nothing else. Gee....I wonder why that is.

I can count on one hand now the number of RWnuts on this forum who DON"T lie about my views.

 

[Doc1]

Given that state supported persecution by the Catholic Church was the reason the Pilgrims left Europe, it is easy to see why the Founders wanted church doctrine kept out of government.

Nope, they left because of the Anglican Church was the official state church and they were being forced into it.

 

[Rustic]

I don't think the intent of the founders on the subject of religion was that we should forever treat the founders as gods.

Of course not - because if we do then we respect the U.S. Constitution which limits power. And we can't have that, right? You facists can't accept a limitation on power.

Yes, the Constitution limits the power of religions to have power.

Interesting. You support it limiting power on religion but nothing else. Gee....I wonder why that is.

I can count on one hand now the number of RWnuts on this forum who DON"T lie about my views.

You are a politically correct Kool-Aid drinker… Just admit it

 

[Political Junky]

Jefferson edited a Bible in which he omitted all miracles.

Bwahahahahaha! Another hatriot completely sold on left-wing propaganda. Thomas Jefferson did no such thing. What he did do was create what is now known as "The Jefferson Bible". He was so enthralled with Jesus and his teachings that he considered it to be (and I quote) “His system of morality was the most benevolent and sublime probably that has been ever taught, and consequently more perfect than those of any of the ancient philosophers.… [He was] the most innocent, the most benevolent, the most eloquent and sublime character that ever has been exhibited to man" [1].

In addition to his fawning over Jesus, he felt that simplifying the Bible to just those teaching would be the best way to connect with and convert Native Americans. For these two reasons, he started cutting out only the lessons of Jesus and formed what would become known as "The Jefferson Bible". Once again I quote, “The Philosophy of Jesus of Nazareth, being Extracted from the Account of His Life and Doctrines Given by Matthew, Mark, Luke and John; Being an Abridgement of the New Testament for the Use of the Indians, Unembarrassed [Uncomplicated] with Matters of Fact or Faith beyond the Level of their Comprehensions” [2].

Why is it so hard for the left to fact-check the propaganda fed to them? There is no excuse in this day and age of smartphones and the internet.

[1] Thomas Jefferson in a letter to Dr. Joseph Priestley (April 9, 1803)
To Joseph Priestley | The Papers of Thomas Jefferson

[2] Excerpt From: Barton, David. “The Jefferson Lies.” Wallbuilders, 2012-09-17. This material may be protected by copyright.
Check out this book on the iBooks Store: The Jefferson Lies

Excerpt From: Andrew M. Allison. “The Real Thomas Jefferson: The True Story of America's Philosopher of Freedom". This material may be protected by copyright.
Check out this book on the iBooks Store: The Real Thomas Jefferson

Link to that?

 

[thanatos144]

Poor republicans. If only the founders had written that congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, unless it's Christianity.

So sad how you ignorantly dont comprehend simple plain English... But what can I say you are liberal.

 

[Rustic]

Given that state supported persecution by the Catholic Church was the reason the Pilgrims left Europe, it is easy to see why the Founders wanted church doctrine kept out of government.

You could not be more wrong, the Catholic Church and government had an incestuous relationship... The pilgrims wanted nothing to do with

 

[Political Junky]

Jefferson Bible

The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth, commonly referred to as the Jefferson Bible, was a book constructed by Thomas Jefferson in the later years of his life by cutting and pasting with a razor and glue numerous sections from the New Testament as extractions of the doctrine of Jesus. Jefferson's condensed composition is especially notable for its exclusion of all miracles by Jesus and most mentions of the supernatural, including sections of the four gospels that contain the Resurrection and most other miracles, and passages that portray Jesus as divine.[1][2][3][4]

Jefferson Bible - Wikipedia

 

[Doc1]

On the subject of revering the beliefs, opinions, and intents of the Founders...

Should white Americans give them full reverence, but maybe 3/5ths reverence would be sufficient for black Americans?

LOL, your ignorance is very unbecoming.

 

[NYcarbineer]

I don't think the intent of the founders on the subject of religion was that we should forever treat the founders as gods.

Of course not - because if we do then we respect the U.S. Constitution which limits power. And we can't have that, right? You facists can't accept a limitation on power.

Yes, the Constitution limits the power of religions to have power.

Interesting. You support it limiting power on religion but nothing else. Gee....I wonder why that is.

I can count on one hand now the number of RWnuts on this forum who DON"T lie about my views.

You are a politically correct Kool-Aid drinker… Just admit it

You are incapable of intelligent debate, as indicated perfectly by your post.

 

[NYcarbineer]

On the subject of revering the beliefs, opinions, and intents of the Founders...

Should white Americans give them full reverence, but maybe 3/5ths reverence would be sufficient for black Americans?

LOL, your ignorance is very unbecoming.

Was the 3/5ths compromise not in the Constitution? Are you denying that?

Goddam that is funny.

 

[Rustic]

On the subject of revering the beliefs, opinions, and intents of the Founders...

Should white Americans give them full reverence, but maybe 3/5ths reverence would be sufficient for black Americans?

LOL, your ignorance is very unbecoming.

Was the 3/5ths compromise not in the Constitution? Are you denying that?

Goddam that is funny.

Where in the Constitution does it say separation of church and state?

 

[Doc1]

“Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by a difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought to be deprecated. I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age, would at least have reconciled Christians of every denomination so far that we should never again see the religious disputes carried to such a pitch as to endanger the peace of society.”
~Founding Father George Washington, letter to Edward Newenham, October 20, 1792
~Founding Father Thomas Jefferson, letter to the Baptists of Danbury, Connecticut, 1802

None of your quotes even remotely imply that the founders wanted an atheist government. Take the one I left here in the reply. All Washington is saying is how religion creates disputes in society. He doesn't even mention the word government.

The people don't need to be athiests, just the government.

Seriously, what is it that you people want, your own version of Sharia Law?

Make up your mind, are we Nazi's or Radical Muslim's?

 

[Doc1]

On the subject of revering the beliefs, opinions, and intents of the Founders...

Should white Americans give them full reverence, but maybe 3/5ths reverence would be sufficient for black Americans?

LOL, your ignorance is very unbecoming.

Was the 3/5ths compromise not in the Constitution? Are you denying that?

Goddam that is funny.

Of course it is, you just do have any knowledge of what it was, or did.

 

[NYcarbineer]

On the subject of revering the beliefs, opinions, and intents of the Founders...

Should white Americans give them full reverence, but maybe 3/5ths reverence would be sufficient for black Americans?

LOL, your ignorance is very unbecoming.

Was the 3/5ths compromise not in the Constitution? Are you denying that?

Goddam that is funny.

Where in the Constitution does it say separation of church and state?

Where the Constitution establishes a Supreme Court that has the authority to interpret what the Constitution says. That's where.

 

[Doc1]

On the subject of revering the beliefs, opinions, and intents of the Founders...

Should white Americans give them full reverence, but maybe 3/5ths reverence would be sufficient for black Americans?

LOL, your ignorance is very unbecoming.

Was the 3/5ths compromise not in the Constitution? Are you denying that?

Goddam that is funny.

Where in the Constitution does it say separation of church and state?

Where the Constitution establishes a Supreme Court that has the authority to interpret what the Constitution says. That's where.

Priceless ignorance. You know nothing about the Constitution OR the Supreme Court.