The birth of Zionist propaganda on film

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore, et al,

What the hell are you talking about?

Don't be ridiculous. Of course politics can change borders. Its called a treaty.

Good post.

What treaty did Israel have with Palestine to change borders?

Link?

(COMMENT)

Up until 1988, there was no assemblance of any state entity known to represent the Arab Palestinian. The term "treaty" applies to an international agreement between States.
It was only in December 1988 that the UN acknowledged the proclamation of the State of Palestine by the Palestine National Council on 15 November 1988. Only "States" possess the capacity to be a party to treaties. In the acknowledgement, the UN decided to replace the name Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) with the name "Palestine" in the UN system.

On 6 January 2016, the UN reaffirmed, the State of Palestine [(resolutions 3237 (XXIX), 22 November 1974; 43/177, 15 December 1988; 52/250, 7 July 1998; and 67/19, 29 November 2012)] would be listed as a non-member and an entity having received a standing invitation to participate as an observer in the sessions and the work of the General Assembly.

The initiation of a treaty can be started by any power. But most often by the Major Powers of the World; which have often initiated treaties and armistice arrangements. In the case of the Arab Palestinians, the PLO have been the only good faith representative that has extended themselves successfully in the last two decades.

In August 1988, the Jordanians abandon the West Bank and withdrew its sovereignty leaving it in the hands of the effective control of Israel. While the Israelis did not stand in the way of the PLO Declaration of Independence; which stipulated that the "territory covered was:

• Pursuant to the resolutions of the Arab Summit Conferences and on the basis of the international legitimacy embodied in the resolutions of the United Nations since 1947, and
• Through the exercise by the Palestinian Arab people of its right to self-determination, political independence and sovereignty over its territory:
​

For which the General Assemble replied:

• Affirms the need to enable the Palestinian people to exercise their sovereignty over their territory occupied since 1967;
​

(THE LONG and the SHORT OF IT)

In the "Question of Palestine" it takes two to tango. And the Hostile Arab Palestinians, the leadership behind them, which actively work the incite, encourage, and further Jihadist, the Fedayeen, the Insurgents, the Radical Islamist, the Resistance Activist, and Asymmetric Extremist that pursue a course of action specifically targeting civilians and with the intent to harm the Occupation Force in violation of Article 68 GCIV.

Most Respectfully,
R

Palestine has been a state since 1924. A state continues to exist even when it is under occupation.

"Palestine has been a state since 1924".....because I say so!

I believe this fantastical invention of your mythical "country of Pal'istan has become an OCD-like psychosomatic disorder.

Palestine is a state. It was common knowledge until the Palestinian issue was buried in Israeli bullshit.

The U.S. State Department Digest of International Law says that the terms of the Treaty of Lausanne provided for the application of the principles of state succession to the "A" Mandates. The Treaty of Versailles (1920) provisionally recognized the former Ottoman communities as independent nations. It also required Germany to recognize the disposition of the former Ottoman territories and to recognize the new states laid down within their boundaries. The Treaty of Lausanne required the newly created states that acquired the territory to pay annuities on the Ottoman public debt, and to assume responsibility for the administration of concessions that had been granted by the Ottomans. A dispute regarding the status of the territories was settled by an Arbitrator appointed by the Council of the League of Nations. It was decided that Palestine and Transjordan were newly created states according to the terms of the applicable post-war treaties. In its Judgment No. 5, The Mavrommatis Palestine Concessions, the Permanent Court of International Justice also decided that Palestine was responsible as the successor state for concessions granted by Ottoman authorities. The Courts of Palestine and Great Britain decided that title to the properties shown on the Ottoman Civil list had been ceded to the government of Palestine as an allied successor state.[25]

State of Palestine: Difference between revisions - Wikipedia​

Even your link says it did not exist until 1988

'''Palestine'''{{ref label|naming|i|}} ({{lang-ar|فلسطين}} ''{{transl|ar|DIN|Filasṭīn/Falasṭīn/Filisṭīn}}''), officially declared as the '''State of Palestine''' ({{lang-ar|دولة فلسطين}}, ''{{transl|ar|DIN|Dawlat Filasṭin}}''),<ref name="declaration1988"/><ref name=Pagep161/><ref name=Bissiop433>{{cite book|title=The World: A Third World Guide 1995–96|editor= Bissio, Robert Remo | location = Montevideo | publisher= [[ITeM|Instituto del Tercer Mundo]]|year=1995| page = 443 | isbn=978-0-855-98291-1}}</ref> is a state that was [[Declaration of independence|proclaimed]] in exile in [[Algiers]] on 15 November 1988, when the [[Palestine Liberation Organization]]'s (PLO) [[Palestinian National Council|National Council]] (PNC) adopted the unilateral [[Palestinian Declaration of Independence]]. At the time of the 1988 declaration, the PLO did not exercise control over any territory,<ref name=Zartmanp43>Bercovitch and Zartman, 2008, [http://books.google.ca




Talk about shooting yourself in the foot,. have you and feet left after this faux pas.


By the way it was never an "A" manfate was it, and the treaty you cite deals only with who was responcible for any debts ran up by the inhabitants under the trusteeship of Britain and mandatory.

The treaty of Versailles does not mention palestine at all, and not as a state.




Your trickery failed again tinny and you have egg all over your face

 

[flacaltenn]

As can be seen, the Zionists started using film propaganda early.

The myth of "Jews making the desert bloom", was based on a clip from this film. The beach sand dunes, with invaders standing around, were filmed with productive Christian and Muslim owned orchards just behind the photographer. This was what created the myth.

Most of the Zionist supporting morons here believe this myth and actually mention in their posts.

You keep posting the same things over and over.. And over and over, we tell you that you don't fix propaganda with MORE propaganda.

You cannot "see Jaffa" from the original deeds for old Tel Aviv (Ahusel Bayut ??)). Those deeds WERE ENTIRELY sand dunes. I've stood on them and seen pictures of the 2 orig. streets in Tel Aviv.


And the NPR piece (that you posted for the 1st time about a year ago -- takes great liberties with what a photographer "would have seen" in other directions. It's all loose rhetoric compared to the FACTS of deeds and photo records.

This is your ORIGINAL thread (same topic) http://www.usmessageboard.com/posts/11749024/

So my question here Monte is when are you ever gonna acknowledge that this short clip is a highly "romanticized" version of Jews being devious with propaganda and taking existing Christian/Arab orchards????

 

[montelatici]

The NPR piece was not "romanticized", it is a more accurate depiction of what actually took place. It contrasts the highly romanticized professional Zionist propaganda that has conditioned Americans for the past 100 years. Neve Tzedek was the first colony established where Tel Aviv is today and it is about 100 meters from the outskirts of Jaffa. So, the perspective indicated by the author of the documentary is absolutely correct. You could not have stood on the sand dunes as they are no sand dunes. It is within the city of Tel Aviv.

 

[flacaltenn]

The NPR piece was not "romanticized", it is a more accurate depiction of what actually took place. It contrasts the highly romanticized professional Zionist propaganda that has conditioned Americans for the past 100 years. Neve Tzedek was the first colony established where Tel Aviv is today and it is about 100 meters from the outskirts of Jaffa. So, the perspective indicated by the author of the documentary is absolutely correct. You could not have stood on the sand dunes as they are no sand dunes. It is within the city of Tel Aviv.

Those pictures were NOT Neve Tzedek. They were in the Stanford Archives as a TRIBUTE to

Ahuzat Bayit and the Founding of Tel Aviv in 1909 SUL --- Except the link is gone since Stanford took down that display for 100th birthday of Tel Aviv.

Those images show 2 and 4 main streets built on DUNES with NOTHING around them and no direct view of Yafo or Jaffa without a hill and binoculars. .You can look at the DEEDS and see NOTHING around them but MORE dunes.

You're STILL gonna be romanicizing about a "unified Palestine" when Tel Aviv turns 200 --- aren't you chap????

 

[Phoenall]

The NPR piece was not "romanticized", it is a more accurate depiction of what actually took place. It contrasts the highly romanticized professional Zionist propaganda that has conditioned Americans for the past 100 years. Neve Tzedek was the first colony established where Tel Aviv is today and it is about 100 meters from the outskirts of Jaffa. So, the perspective indicated by the author of the documentary is absolutely correct. You could not have stood on the sand dunes as they are no sand dunes. It is within the city of Tel Aviv.

So says monte who was not even born at the time, so he could not have seen the sand dunes.

 

[Divine Wind]

So says monte who was not even born at the time, so he could not have seen the sand dunes.

Ahhh, but hate is eternal and Monte is obviously a hater looking for someone to vent himself.

 

[montelatici]

The NPR piece was not "romanticized", it is a more accurate depiction of what actually took place. It contrasts the highly romanticized professional Zionist propaganda that has conditioned Americans for the past 100 years. Neve Tzedek was the first colony established where Tel Aviv is today and it is about 100 meters from the outskirts of Jaffa. So, the perspective indicated by the author of the documentary is absolutely correct. You could not have stood on the sand dunes as they are no sand dunes. It is within the city of Tel Aviv.

Those pictures were NOT Neve Tzedek. They were in the Stanford Archives as a TRIBUTE to

Ahuzat Bayit and the Founding of Tel Aviv in 1909 SUL --- Except the link is gone since Stanford took down that display for 100th birthday of Tel Aviv.

Those images show 2 and 4 main streets built on DUNES with NOTHING around them and no direct view of Yafo or Jaffa without a hill and binoculars. .You can look at the DEEDS and see NOTHING around them but MORE dunes.

You're STILL gonna be romanicizing about a "unified Palestine" when Tel Aviv turns 200 --- aren't you chap????

Still making things up Flac. You are a better at propaganda than the original Zionists. "at the beginning of the 20th century, Ahuzat Bayit was established on the outskirts of Jaffa,"

Stand for Israel - Tel Aviv : Modern Cities : Land of Israel

 

[flacaltenn]

The NPR piece was not "romanticized", it is a more accurate depiction of what actually took place. It contrasts the highly romanticized professional Zionist propaganda that has conditioned Americans for the past 100 years. Neve Tzedek was the first colony established where Tel Aviv is today and it is about 100 meters from the outskirts of Jaffa. So, the perspective indicated by the author of the documentary is absolutely correct. You could not have stood on the sand dunes as they are no sand dunes. It is within the city of Tel Aviv.

Those pictures were NOT Neve Tzedek. They were in the Stanford Archives as a TRIBUTE to

Ahuzat Bayit and the Founding of Tel Aviv in 1909 SUL --- Except the link is gone since Stanford took down that display for 100th birthday of Tel Aviv.

Those images show 2 and 4 main streets built on DUNES with NOTHING around them and no direct view of Yafo or Jaffa without a hill and binoculars. .You can look at the DEEDS and see NOTHING around them but MORE dunes.

You're STILL gonna be romanicizing about a "unified Palestine" when Tel Aviv turns 200 --- aren't you chap????

Still making things up Flac. You are a better at propaganda than the original Zionists. "at the beginning of the 20th century, Ahuzat Bayit was established on the outskirts of Jaffa,"

Stand for Israel - Tel Aviv : Modern Cities : Land of Israel

You saw the pictures. I know the drive from old Tel Aviv to Jaffa.. I ain't lying.

Define "outskirts". In Israel the West Bank is in the "outskirts" of Tel Aviv..

 

[MJB12741]

No rational person who deals with documented facts takes Monte serious. We need him here for all the laughs he gives us.

 

[flacaltenn]

About 1930s Hertzlstrasse in Tel Aviv. Built on the sand dunes

Even earlier -- about 1910 -- built on sand dunes. NOT within sight of Jaffa harbor.

 

[montelatici]

It was a development, a suburb of Jaffa, within a mile of Jaffa. The Jaffa orchards were in plain view. The West Bank is about 30 miles away from Tel Aviv. You are such a propagandist.

 

[flacaltenn]

The 12 acre plot for Tel Aviv circa 1912

You want to see the location of the 12 acre LAND DEED Monty? I've got it around somewhere.

 

[montelatici]

About 1930s Hertzlstrasse in Tel Aviv. Built on the sand dunes

Even earlier -- about 1910 -- built on sand dunes. NOT within sight of Jaffa harbor.

The documentary says nothing of the harbor, it states that turning the lens you would see the Christian and Muslim owned orchards. Which were on the outskirts of Jaffa. Keep up the propaganda.

 

[flacaltenn]

It was a development, a suburb of Jaffa, within a mile of Jaffa. The Jaffa orchards were in plain view. The West Bank is about 30 miles away from Tel Aviv. You are such a propagandist.

For a guy who holds out for a UNITED palestine -- you don't know your map very well. Can you read a map? From Tel Aviv to the green line is more like 15 miles. The average american commute.

 

[flacaltenn]

About 1930s Hertzlstrasse in Tel Aviv. Built on the sand dunes

Even earlier -- about 1910 -- built on sand dunes. NOT within sight of Jaffa harbor.

The documentary says nothing of the harbor, it states that turning the lens you would see the Christian and Muslim owned orchards. Which were on the outskirts of Jaffa. Keep up the propaganda.

You really believe there were ORCHARDS behind the photographer in the B&W I put up there?

You're hanging on a LITERARY LICENCE to make propaganda. I'll show you the deeds. No where is there a sight line to Jaffa. It's a "little lie" that NPT did to make a dramatic "tale"..

It was ONLY a 12 acre plot when those settlers took that 1st picture. Those early photos show almost ALL of the 12 acres. .

 

[flacaltenn]

Geography time..


Tel Aviv - Wikipedia


Ahuzat Bayit

Sarona, Tel Aviv
The Second Aliyah led to further expansion. In 1906, a group of Jews, among them residents of Jaffa, followed the initiative of Akiva Aryeh Weiss and banded together to form the Ahuzat Bayit (lit. "homestead") society. The society's goal was to form a "Hebrew urban centre in a healthy environment, planned according to the rules of aesthetics and modern hygiene."[38] The urban planning for the new city was influenced by the Garden city movement.[39] The first 60 plots were purchased in Kerem Djebali near Jaffa by Jacobus Kann, a Dutch citizen, who registered them in his name to circumvent the Turkish prohibition on Jewish land acquisition.[40] Meir Dizengoff, later Tel Aviv's first mayor, also joined the Ahuzat Bayit society.[41][42] His vision for Tel Aviv involved peaceful co-existence with Arabs.[35][unreliable source]


Herzliya Hebrew Gymnasium in 1936
On 11 April 1909, 66 Jewish families gathered on a desolate sand dune to parcel out the land by lottery using seashells. This gathering is considered the official date of the establishment of Tel Aviv. The lottery was organised by Akiva Aryeh Weiss, president of the building society.[43][44] Weiss collected 120 sea shells on the beach, half of them white and half of them grey. The members' names were written on the white shells and the plot numbers on the grey shells. A boy drew names from one box of shells and a girl drew plot numbers from the second box. A photographer, Avraham Soskin, documented the event. The first water well was later dug at this site (today Rothschild Boulevard, across from Dizengoff House).[45] Within a year, Herzl, Ahad Ha'am, Yehuda Halevi, Lilienblum, and Rothschild streets were built; a water system was installed; and 66 houses (including some on six subdivided plots) were completed.[39] At the end of Herzl Street, a plot was allocated for a new building for the Herzliya Hebrew High School, founded in Jaffa in 1906.[39] On 21 May 1910, the name Tel Aviv was adopted.[39] The flag and city arms of Tel Aviv (see above) contain under the red Star of David 2 words from the biblical book of Jeremiah: "I (God) will build You up again and you will be rebuilt." (Jer 31:4) Tel Aviv was planned as an independent Hebrew city with wide streets and boulevards, running water at each house, and street lights.[46]

By 1914, Tel Aviv had grown to more than 1 square kilometre (247 acres).[39] However, growth halted in 1917 when the Ottoman authorities expelled the residents of Jaffa and Tel Aviv.[39] A report published in The New York Times by United States Consul Garrels in Alexandria, Egypt described the Jaffa deportation of early April 1917. The orders of evacuation were aimed chiefly at the Jewish population.[47] Jews were free to return to their homes in Tel Aviv at the end of the following year when, with the end of World War I and the defeat of the Ottomans, the British took control of Palestine.

Now the Homework assignment IS Monty -- go find Rothschild Boulevard in Modern Tel Aviv and tell me if you can see old Jaffa proper from there.

Here's a clue. https://binged.it/2gfagVN

 

[montelatici]

About 1930s Hertzlstrasse in Tel Aviv. Built on the sand dunes

Even earlier -- about 1910 -- built on sand dunes. NOT within sight of Jaffa harbor.

The documentary says nothing of the harbor, it states that turning the lens you would see the Christian and Muslim owned orchards. Which were on the outskirts of Jaffa. Keep up the propaganda.

You really believe there were ORCHARDS behind the photographer in the B&W I put up there?

You're hanging on a LITERARY LICENCE to make propaganda. I'll show you the deeds. No where is there a sight line to Jaffa. It's a "little lie" that NPT did to make a dramatic "tale"..

It was ONLY a 12 acre plot when those settlers took that 1st picture. Those early photos show almost ALL of the 12 acres. .

They look in one direction, Mr. propaganda.

 

[Phoenall]

The NPR piece was not "romanticized", it is a more accurate depiction of what actually took place. It contrasts the highly romanticized professional Zionist propaganda that has conditioned Americans for the past 100 years. Neve Tzedek was the first colony established where Tel Aviv is today and it is about 100 meters from the outskirts of Jaffa. So, the perspective indicated by the author of the documentary is absolutely correct. You could not have stood on the sand dunes as they are no sand dunes. It is within the city of Tel Aviv.

Those pictures were NOT Neve Tzedek. They were in the Stanford Archives as a TRIBUTE to

Ahuzat Bayit and the Founding of Tel Aviv in 1909 SUL --- Except the link is gone since Stanford took down that display for 100th birthday of Tel Aviv.

Those images show 2 and 4 main streets built on DUNES with NOTHING around them and no direct view of Yafo or Jaffa without a hill and binoculars. .You can look at the DEEDS and see NOTHING around them but MORE dunes.

You're STILL gonna be romanicizing about a "unified Palestine" when Tel Aviv turns 200 --- aren't you chap????

Still making things up Flac. You are a better at propaganda than the original Zionists. "at the beginning of the 20th century, Ahuzat Bayit was established on the outskirts of Jaffa,"

Stand for Israel - Tel Aviv : Modern Cities : Land of Israel

Your own link just destroys your POV and claims and you are too stupid to realise this

 

[Phoenall]

About 1930s Hertzlstrasse in Tel Aviv. Built on the sand dunes

Even earlier -- about 1910 -- built on sand dunes. NOT within sight of Jaffa harbor.

The documentary says nothing of the harbor, it states that turning the lens you would see the Christian and Muslim owned orchards. Which were on the outskirts of Jaffa. Keep up the propaganda.

You really believe there were ORCHARDS behind the photographer in the B&W I put up there?

You're hanging on a LITERARY LICENCE to make propaganda. I'll show you the deeds. No where is there a sight line to Jaffa. It's a "little lie" that NPT did to make a dramatic "tale"..

It was ONLY a 12 acre plot when those settlers took that 1st picture. Those early photos show almost ALL of the 12 acres. .

They look in one direction, Mr. propaganda.

Yes towards were any port would be, the sea. So were is the port ?

 

[Phoenall]

It was a development, a suburb of Jaffa, within a mile of Jaffa. The Jaffa orchards were in plain view. The West Bank is about 30 miles away from Tel Aviv. You are such a propagandist.

And here we have monte with his " tell them I am right and they have to let me play mummy"

I think you need to learn how to use a map and look at the tell tale manipulations of the ones you use