Tesla is now most valuable auto maker in US

[Wyatt earp]

Despite the idiotic obsession with oversized vehicles in America, with the recently announced advances in battery performance, electric cars will take over very shortly. Now, we need to enhance the photovoltaic capacity in order to charge them 'greenly'.

Not in your lifetime

 

[WinterBorn]

I wish them the best of luck, but I consider their stock to be WAY too speculative for me. I would feel better about it if I ever drive downtown and actually see a Tesla dealer. Maybe they could buy up some of those empty Saturn dealership buildings. They are still pretty new, since Saturn was only introduced in 1992. And, then, there are those empty Hummer buildings....

There are a couple of Tesla stores in Atlanta. I see 2 or 3 Teslas most days that I am driving around the city. And probably 10 to 15 charging centers in the greater Atlanta area.

 

[WinterBorn]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

Huh. Never heard of them. Up here everyone is driving a Subaru or a Ford truck.

You've never heard of Tesla? Turn the rabbit ear antennae 90 degrees to the west. By the way I have an old tv in the garage that uses those old style rabbit ears after everything went digital in 2009. It looks just like the whole tv experience looked when I was a kid visiting my grandfather. He actually had a rabbit ears that would rotate with the push of a button to get best reception on whatever channel you wanted to watch.

This car company was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM. Note.

Never seen them advertised up here either. What do they look like?
OH! Electric cars? That's what they call them? Someone at work had one of those. She liked it. Is anyone else making them (I think it was a half and half). I don't remember "Tesla."

LOL You're right I have my mom's old behemouth of a Zenith but no rabbit ears out here in the country--satellite is the only way to get a signal.

In some areas the car dealers and their lobbyists have fought tooth & nail to keep Tesla out. Tesla does not use dealerships. They sell directly from their own stores.

The other electrics are the Leaf and the Volt (made by Nissan and Chevy respectively). Those cars have a range of 40 or 50 miles, where the Tesla has a range of 250 to 300+ miles on a charge. Teslas, especially the Model S, are high end luxury cars.

 

[WinterBorn]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

Huh. Never heard of them. Up here everyone is driving a Subaru or a Ford truck.

I had the opportunity to test drive a Tesla a couple of years ago. The Insane Mode (now the Ludicrous Mode) feels more like a launch than anything. The accelerator response is instantaneous and feels like a ride at Six Flags. The technology is nothing short of amazing. The car I drove would go from 0-60 in 3.1 seconds. The new P100D will do it in 2.5 seconds.

 

[martybegan]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

The fine print from your article.

esla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."

So the valuation is not held to the same standards as the major manufacturers. Where is the direct comparison?

As I stated in another post, most of that valuation is probably due to speculation investments in the company, which doesn't give an indication of the companies current fiscal strength.

The Major auto companies valuation is a hard one, based on assets and short term sales numbers. Tesla's is based on maybe electric cars becoming the norm sometime in the next 2-3 decades.

Hard numbers : Tesla's sales were above 7b in 2016. It seems peanuts compared to GM 166b... until you notice Tesla's sales are doubling every two years. That still means the time in which Tesla's revenues match GM's are ten years in the future.

Only assuming a doubling every 2 years for 10 years, which is usually a very hard rate to maintain. Their biggest issue is how large of a market they have for their higher end vehicles, and if they can get costs down to enter the middle market before they exhaust the higher one.

Another big question is how many people now have a Tesla AND an ICE car vs. how many people have only a Tesla. It's easy to deal with the charge times of an electric when you can fall back to an ICE vehicle when you need to. For people in more middle incomes, they may only have 1 car.

I don't see electrics taking over the 1 car family market until you can charge one as fast as you fill up a tank of gas.

 

[WinterBorn]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

The fine print from your article.

esla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."

So the valuation is not held to the same standards as the major manufacturers. Where is the direct comparison?

As I stated in another post, most of that valuation is probably due to speculation investments in the company, which doesn't give an indication of the companies current fiscal strength.

The Major auto companies valuation is a hard one, based on assets and short term sales numbers. Tesla's is based on maybe electric cars becoming the norm sometime in the next 2-3 decades.

Hard numbers : Tesla's sales were above 7b in 2016. It seems peanuts compared to GM 166b... until you notice Tesla's sales are doubling every two years. That still means the time in which Tesla's revenues match GM's are ten years in the future.

Only assuming a doubling every 2 years for 10 years, which is usually a very hard rate to maintain. Their biggest issue is how large of a market they have for their higher end vehicles, and if they can get costs down to enter the middle market before they exhaust the higher one.

Another big question is how many people now have a Tesla AND an ICE car vs. how many people have only a Tesla. It's easy to deal with the charge times of an electric when you can fall back to an ICE vehicle when you need to. For people in more middle incomes, they may only have 1 car.

I don't see electrics taking over the 1 car family market until you can charge one as fast as you fill up a tank of gas.

The quick refuleing is one area where ICE come out ahead. Tesla created an automated battery swap system that could replace the entire battery load in less time than it takes to refuel a gasoline engine Audi A8. But they have focused on the Supercharger stations instead of the battery swap stations. One of the big pluses to the Supercharger stations is that they are free for all Model S and Model X owners. You can get half a charge in about 30 mins. So on long trips you take a 30 min break every 150 to 170 miles. So long trips take a bit longer but cost a bit less.

Most people don't go over 250 miles in a day unless they are taking a trip. So this is not as big an issue as it seems.

 

[martybegan]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

The fine print from your article.

esla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."

So the valuation is not held to the same standards as the major manufacturers. Where is the direct comparison?

As I stated in another post, most of that valuation is probably due to speculation investments in the company, which doesn't give an indication of the companies current fiscal strength.

The Major auto companies valuation is a hard one, based on assets and short term sales numbers. Tesla's is based on maybe electric cars becoming the norm sometime in the next 2-3 decades.

Hard numbers : Tesla's sales were above 7b in 2016. It seems peanuts compared to GM 166b... until you notice Tesla's sales are doubling every two years. That still means the time in which Tesla's revenues match GM's are ten years in the future.

Only assuming a doubling every 2 years for 10 years, which is usually a very hard rate to maintain. Their biggest issue is how large of a market they have for their higher end vehicles, and if they can get costs down to enter the middle market before they exhaust the higher one.

Another big question is how many people now have a Tesla AND an ICE car vs. how many people have only a Tesla. It's easy to deal with the charge times of an electric when you can fall back to an ICE vehicle when you need to. For people in more middle incomes, they may only have 1 car.

I don't see electrics taking over the 1 car family market until you can charge one as fast as you fill up a tank of gas.

The quick refuleing is one area where ICE come out ahead. Tesla created an automated battery swap system that could replace the entire battery load in less time than it takes to refuel a gasoline engine Audi A8. But they have focused on the Supercharger stations instead of the battery swap stations. One of the big pluses to the Supercharger stations is that they are free for all Model S and Model X owners. You can get half a charge in about 30 mins. So on long trips you take a 30 min break every 150 to 170 miles. So long trips take a bit longer but cost a bit less.

Most people don't go over 250 miles in a day unless they are taking a trip. So this is not as big an issue as it seems.

1/2 a charge in 30 minutes isn't going to cut it for most people, but I assume they will figure out a way to drive that down.

 

[WinterBorn]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

The fine print from your article.

esla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."

So the valuation is not held to the same standards as the major manufacturers. Where is the direct comparison?

As I stated in another post, most of that valuation is probably due to speculation investments in the company, which doesn't give an indication of the companies current fiscal strength.

The Major auto companies valuation is a hard one, based on assets and short term sales numbers. Tesla's is based on maybe electric cars becoming the norm sometime in the next 2-3 decades.

Hard numbers : Tesla's sales were above 7b in 2016. It seems peanuts compared to GM 166b... until you notice Tesla's sales are doubling every two years. That still means the time in which Tesla's revenues match GM's are ten years in the future.

Only assuming a doubling every 2 years for 10 years, which is usually a very hard rate to maintain. Their biggest issue is how large of a market they have for their higher end vehicles, and if they can get costs down to enter the middle market before they exhaust the higher one.

Another big question is how many people now have a Tesla AND an ICE car vs. how many people have only a Tesla. It's easy to deal with the charge times of an electric when you can fall back to an ICE vehicle when you need to. For people in more middle incomes, they may only have 1 car.

I don't see electrics taking over the 1 car family market until you can charge one as fast as you fill up a tank of gas.

The quick refuleing is one area where ICE come out ahead. Tesla created an automated battery swap system that could replace the entire battery load in less time than it takes to refuel a gasoline engine Audi A8. But they have focused on the Supercharger stations instead of the battery swap stations. One of the big pluses to the Supercharger stations is that they are free for all Model S and Model X owners. You can get half a charge in about 30 mins. So on long trips you take a 30 min break every 150 to 170 miles. So long trips take a bit longer but cost a bit less.

Most people don't go over 250 miles in a day unless they are taking a trip. So this is not as big an issue as it seems.

1/2 a charge in 30 minutes isn't going to cut it for most people, but I assume they will figure out a way to drive that down.

I think most people don't drive more than 250 miles in a day, unless on vacation.

 

[rightwinger]

I dont see how thats possible when I might see a Tesla once a week if that.
They sold 76k cars in 2016 vs say GM who sold 3.1 million.

I agree. I heard it on the radio and it makes no sense

What makes Tesla "valuable"? I haven't passed a Tesla on the road in months. They have two models and limited sales outlets. GM sells cars, trucks, buses, commercial vehicles as well as the Chevy Volt which I see more of than Tesla's...How can Tesla be more valuable

 

[Correll]

I dont see how thats possible when I might see a Tesla once a week if that.
They sold 76k cars in 2016 vs say GM who sold 3.1 million.

Media created bubble. It will crash and crash big.

 

[martybegan]

The fine print from your article.

So the valuation is not held to the same standards as the major manufacturers. Where is the direct comparison?

As I stated in another post, most of that valuation is probably due to speculation investments in the company, which doesn't give an indication of the companies current fiscal strength.

The Major auto companies valuation is a hard one, based on assets and short term sales numbers. Tesla's is based on maybe electric cars becoming the norm sometime in the next 2-3 decades.

Hard numbers : Tesla's sales were above 7b in 2016. It seems peanuts compared to GM 166b... until you notice Tesla's sales are doubling every two years. That still means the time in which Tesla's revenues match GM's are ten years in the future.

Only assuming a doubling every 2 years for 10 years, which is usually a very hard rate to maintain. Their biggest issue is how large of a market they have for their higher end vehicles, and if they can get costs down to enter the middle market before they exhaust the higher one.

Another big question is how many people now have a Tesla AND an ICE car vs. how many people have only a Tesla. It's easy to deal with the charge times of an electric when you can fall back to an ICE vehicle when you need to. For people in more middle incomes, they may only have 1 car.

I don't see electrics taking over the 1 car family market until you can charge one as fast as you fill up a tank of gas.

The quick refuleing is one area where ICE come out ahead. Tesla created an automated battery swap system that could replace the entire battery load in less time than it takes to refuel a gasoline engine Audi A8. But they have focused on the Supercharger stations instead of the battery swap stations. One of the big pluses to the Supercharger stations is that they are free for all Model S and Model X owners. You can get half a charge in about 30 mins. So on long trips you take a 30 min break every 150 to 170 miles. So long trips take a bit longer but cost a bit less.

Most people don't go over 250 miles in a day unless they are taking a trip. So this is not as big an issue as it seems.

1/2 a charge in 30 minutes isn't going to cut it for most people, but I assume they will figure out a way to drive that down.

I think most people don't drive more than 250 miles in a day, unless on vacation.

The problem is range is less than 250 miles if ancillary systems need to be used. Someone in Florida doesn't have to worry about the battery being drained due to the use of a heater, but someone in Wisconsin in February sure as hell has to. Without an ICE you lose that free heat, and have to rely on electric heat, which can dig into the battery life considerably.

 

[jon_berzerk]

I dont see how thats possible when I might see a Tesla once a week if that.
They sold 76k cars in 2016 vs say GM who sold 3.1 million.

yeah

must be very expensive cars

really really expensive cars

if that is the case

--LOL

 

[rightwinger]

The electric-car maker hit a market value of $50.84 billion on Monday, edging past GM (GM) at $50.79 billion.

Tesla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford in the United States alone.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."


Idiot investors

 

[martybegan]

The electric-car maker hit a market value of $50.84 billion on Monday, edging past GM (GM) at $50.79 billion.

Tesla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford in the United States alone.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."


Idiot investors

it's speculators hoping for a bit hit 20 years or so from now, when the technology matures and the cars 1) enter the cost range of middle income people and 2) they get battery charging down to the 5-10 minute range.

 

[GHook93]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

Don't get me wrong I am a huge fan of the Tesla, but the valuation is strange to say the least. I thought Wall Street was above liberal bullying but I guess not. Tesla is still not profitable and they sell 25k cars to 690k cars for GM and Ford in the US alone. If you compare worldwide sales then the valuation is even more ridiculous.

Right from your article:
"Tesla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford in the United States alone."

The inflated valuation could be due to the Model 3 car that is supposed to be $35k and available to the middle class, but they said the same thing before the Model X came out. My guess is the model 3 will run around $60-$70k when it is all said and done. Not quite middle class.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Wyatt earp]

I dont see how thats possible when I might see a Tesla once a week if that.
They sold 76k cars in 2016 vs say GM who sold 3.1 million.

I agree. I heard it on the radio and it makes no sense

What makes Tesla "valuable"? I haven't passed a Tesla on the road in months. They have two models and limited sales outlets. GM sells cars, trucks, buses, commercial vehicles as well as the Chevy Volt which I see more of than Tesla's...How can Tesla be more valuable

You have to read the OPs link RW they are using different metrics then GM, Ford and Toyota ...


Like I said before for a fourth car I wouldn't mind having one, the acceleration on a electric motor with a telsa can compete with a Ferrari or lambo..

 

[GHook93]

I dont see how thats possible when I might see a Tesla once a week if that.
They sold 76k cars in 2016 vs say GM who sold 3.1 million.

It makes zero sense. I could see some optimism with the Model 3, but not even close to making Tesla valued over GM and Ford


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[WinterBorn]

Hard numbers : Tesla's sales were above 7b in 2016. It seems peanuts compared to GM 166b... until you notice Tesla's sales are doubling every two years. That still means the time in which Tesla's revenues match GM's are ten years in the future.

Only assuming a doubling every 2 years for 10 years, which is usually a very hard rate to maintain. Their biggest issue is how large of a market they have for their higher end vehicles, and if they can get costs down to enter the middle market before they exhaust the higher one.

Another big question is how many people now have a Tesla AND an ICE car vs. how many people have only a Tesla. It's easy to deal with the charge times of an electric when you can fall back to an ICE vehicle when you need to. For people in more middle incomes, they may only have 1 car.

I don't see electrics taking over the 1 car family market until you can charge one as fast as you fill up a tank of gas.

The quick refuleing is one area where ICE come out ahead. Tesla created an automated battery swap system that could replace the entire battery load in less time than it takes to refuel a gasoline engine Audi A8. But they have focused on the Supercharger stations instead of the battery swap stations. One of the big pluses to the Supercharger stations is that they are free for all Model S and Model X owners. You can get half a charge in about 30 mins. So on long trips you take a 30 min break every 150 to 170 miles. So long trips take a bit longer but cost a bit less.

Most people don't go over 250 miles in a day unless they are taking a trip. So this is not as big an issue as it seems.

1/2 a charge in 30 minutes isn't going to cut it for most people, but I assume they will figure out a way to drive that down.

I think most people don't drive more than 250 miles in a day, unless on vacation.

The problem is range is less than 250 miles if ancillary systems need to be used. Someone in Florida doesn't have to worry about the battery being drained due to the use of a heater, but someone in Wisconsin in February sure as hell has to. Without an ICE you lose that free heat, and have to rely on electric heat, which can dig into the battery life considerably.

The current Model S gets an estimated 337 to 350 miles on a charge. Yes, the cold weather and use of heat will cut that back a bit, but you should still be able to get 250 miles on a charge.

And as far as longer trips, it is still not a huge deal. We go to St Augustine (from Atlanta) every year for a long weekend. It is about 400 miles away and takes around 6 hours to get there in our Honda CRV. Getting 25 mpg, and with gas costing $2.38 a gal, we are spending $38.08 for the gas to get there. With a Tesla we would take 7 hrs to get there and spend nothing on fuel. When we got, we always stop at least once for gas and food. So the difference in travel time is less than you think, and the cost savings are more.

On the same trip in a vehicle that gets 20MPG, you spend $47.60 on fuel.

When gas costs $3.25 a gal, the trip (one way) will cost $52 for the 25mpg car and $65 for the 20mpg car.

 

[rightwinger]

The electric-car maker hit a market value of $50.84 billion on Monday, edging past GM (GM) at $50.79 billion.

Tesla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford in the United States alone.

Rebecca Lindland, executive analyst at Kelley Blue Book, says Tesla is being treated differently than other carmakers. "They're classified as a tech company," she told CNNMoney, "so they're not really held to the same standards."

She adds that while Wall Street focuses on more traditional criteria -- like profitability -- for established companies like Ford and GM, "Tesla kind of gets a free pass."


Idiot investors

it's speculators hoping for a bit hit 20 years or so from now, when the technology matures and the cars 1) enter the cost range of middle income people and 2) they get battery charging down to the 5-10 minute range.

What says Tesla will be the only company in the electric car market twenty years from now?
Ford, GM. Toyota, Honda and many others are in a better position to undercut Tesla in the future.

Current problems with electric cars

1. Range
2. Time to recharge
3. Cost of replacing batteries and disposing of old ones
4. Heavy duty market...Trucks, construction vehicles, tractors

 

[Wyatt earp]

Tesla just became the most valuable carmaker in America


Some people are dragged into the future and some people drag all of humanity forward. Elon Musk has a gigantic rope and is pulling the world into the 22nd century.

Tesla was founded in 2003 and has already overtaken GM in the US and is close to overtaking Honda in the world. Next on to Toyota.

Don't get me wrong I am a huge fan of the Tesla, but the valuation is strange to say the least. I thought Wall Street was above liberal bullying but I guess not. Tesla is still not profitable and they sell 25k cars to 690k cars for GM and Ford in the US alone. If you compare worldwide sales then the valuation is even more ridiculous.

Right from your article:
"Tesla loses money, and it sells a small fraction of the cars of its much older competitors. Tesla sold about 25,000 of its Model S and Model X cars in the first three months of the year, compared with 690,000 cars and trucks for GM and 617,000 for Ford in the United States alone."

The inflated valuation could be due to the Model 3 car that is supposed to be $35k and available to the middle class, but they said the same thing before the Model X came out. My guess is the model 3 will run around $60-$70k when it is all said and done. Not quite middle class.


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Enjoy the free charging stations while they last. Because it will be soon a thing of the past


Tesla Just Killed Free Supercharging—And That’s a Good Sign


Also lawmakers are already looking to tax by the mile, with more electrics on the road they need the revenue for infrastructure..



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