Teacher Compensation

DGS49

Diamond Member
Apr 12, 2012
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Pittsburgh
When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.
 
I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.
 
It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth
 
States like West Virginia, Oklahoma and Arizona are notorious for poor teacher pay
Take it or leave it results in the best candidates seeking better professions

Educational results suffer
 
It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

There is only so much money to go around. Raising education spending may require cuts to police or fire departments or highways or whatever. States cannot print their own money so if teachers need to be paid more, then you should tell us what you think should be cut to pay for it. Whenever teacher pay makes the front page of the paper (or police pay or sanitation workers pay) I know for certain I can expect 1) to see the real estate assessor's car setting in front of my house reassessing my property and 2) Enhanced enforcement of zoning/local code is about to start up. They just raised rates over 11% this year so they know they will not be able to raise those again anytime soon so they will inflate assessments.
 
States like West Virginia, Oklahoma and Arizona are notorious for poor teacher pay
Take it or leave it results in the best candidates seeking better professions

Educational results suffer

West Virginia is a poor state. In a lot of these places there isn't a better profession. Some of the counties only have part-time judges & prosecutors and might only have 1 of each.
 
When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.

People think teaching is something, and then they do it, they realize it's not what they thought it was, it's harder.

Yeah, people who have never taught get all arrogant about how easy it is. But they don't actually know what it entails.

How much is a teacher worth? Those who don't value education don't value teachers and don't understand what goes on.
 
It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

There is only so much money to go around. Raising education spending may require cuts to police or fire departments or highways or whatever. States cannot print their own money so if teachers need to be paid more, then you should tell us what you think should be cut to pay for it. Whenever teacher pay makes the front page of the paper (or police pay or sanitation workers pay) I know for certain I can expect 1) to see the real estate assessor's car setting in front of my house reassessing my property and 2) Enhanced enforcement of zoning/local code is about to start up. They just raised rates over 11% this year so they know they will not be able to raise those again anytime soon so they will inflate assessments.
Again, you get what you pay for

If education is not a priority, teachers are always at the back of the line
A college educated teacher who is not even making $40,000 after ten years on the job will find better options
 
When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.

Becoming a teacher costs money and tuition has risen to the level that paying your bills and student loans back exceed what a teacher makes. So you end up with teachers making the following decision. Do I work at something I love and live in poverty or take what I know and go into the private sector. I know because I have two daughter that chose teaching as a profession. One stayed and one left. The State of Colorado lost one heck of a calculus teacher who also coached a team to the state track meet and had great success there.

I seems you think teachers should simply accept their fate and not attempt to change it. That ship sailed a few weeks ago.
 
It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

There is only so much money to go around. Raising education spending may require cuts to police or fire departments or highways or whatever. States cannot print their own money so if teachers need to be paid more, then you should tell us what you think should be cut to pay for it. Whenever teacher pay makes the front page of the paper (or police pay or sanitation workers pay) I know for certain I can expect 1) to see the real estate assessor's car setting in front of my house reassessing my property and 2) Enhanced enforcement of zoning/local code is about to start up. They just raised rates over 11% this year so they know they will not be able to raise those again anytime soon so they will inflate assessments.

Ever hear of volunteer fire departments?
 
When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.

Some good points, but further proof (in red text) that when it comes to education, most Americans get more correct information from a cereal box.
 
I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.

If we all did that, what would the schools do? They will close, like the schools did in KY when the state legislature stabbed us in the back last week!
 
It is a case of priorities of your state and you get what you pay for

These states look at education as nonessential and are willing to hire those who may not be the best available. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to educate their youth

There is only so much money to go around. Raising education spending may require cuts to police or fire departments or highways or whatever. States cannot print their own money so if teachers need to be paid more, then you should tell us what you think should be cut to pay for it. Whenever teacher pay makes the front page of the paper (or police pay or sanitation workers pay) I know for certain I can expect 1) to see the real estate assessor's car setting in front of my house reassessing my property and 2) Enhanced enforcement of zoning/local code is about to start up. They just raised rates over 11% this year so they know they will not be able to raise those again anytime soon so they will inflate assessments.

Ever hear of volunteer fire departments?


I have. My whole family was on one, and we are lifetime members.

But except in Rural areas they do not exist any more.

You have no idea how much you enjoy giving to your Community. But you have to be dedicated.
 
When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.

Becoming a teacher costs money and tuition has risen to the level that paying your bills and student loans back exceed what a teacher makes. So you end up with teachers making the following decision. Do I work at something I love and live in poverty or take what I know and go into the private sector. I know because I have two daughter that chose teaching as a profession. One stayed and one left. The State of Colorado lost one heck of a calculus teacher who also coached a team to the state track meet and had great success there.

I seems you think teachers should simply accept their fate and not attempt to change it. That ship sailed a few weeks ago.

The sheer anger here on this board is down right stupid.

Envy and greed seem to rule.
 
The OP thinks that because he can offer take it or leave it salaries for women who stock his shelves....we should do the same with those who educate our children
 
When I was in retailing many years ago (with Hill's Department Stores), we had a job that needed to be done. Empty boxes of incoming stuff and stock the shelves. We were an absolutely-self-serve discount department store, so the most convenient time to do this was the middle of the day. We employed a small army of WOMEN under the following employment paradigm: You work from 10:00am to 2:00pm, with one 15-minute break, at slightly over minimum wage. No benefits, no vacation, no raises, no nothing. We were absolutely clear with applicants that this was the deal.

Who would take such a job? Happy housewives wanting a little extra money, moms who wanted to work a schedule that allowed them to continue being full-time moms, "retired" women. We had no trouble finding and keeping women to take these positions, and turnover was negligible. They required minimal supervision, and got the job done.

At around the same time, a friend of mine was an elected State Representative in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. His salary was about $6,000/yr, with minimal benefits. It wasn't a full-time job, but the commitment was pretty-much full time, due to constituent needs.

Who would take such a job? Mostly lawyers, but also business owners who had flexible schedules, farmers, people with other sources of income (a working spouse?), people who had retired from their careers. The occasional crook.

In both of these cases, you have a "job" that DOES NOT PAY A LIVING WAGE. People considering that "job" have to assess, in advance, whether it satisfies their personal needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. There is nothing unreasonable about this, on the part of the employer. The employer, in structuring the job in this way, recognizes that MOST PEOPLE will not be willing to take the job under these constraints, so they are passing on possibly the "best people for the job," but it's a tradeoff.

Not surprisingly, the legislators in Pennsylvania gradually over many years declared that Representative was a FULL-TIME job, and they have paid themselves accordingly, including splendid benefits, and a pension to die for, if you will excuse the totally inappropriate metaphor.

And now we come to TEACHERS.

In many states, the State has decided, wisely or not, to compensate their teachers at a wage that is significantly less than what an exemplary college graduate might make at a full-time job in the private sector (or even in Government). Why would they do such a thing? Well, there's June, July, and August, and the fact that it's arguably not a "full-time job" in the other months of the year (after the first couple years).

But it doesn't really matter WHY they pay their teachers what they do. Maybe they have made a decision, based on the best information they have available, that they can staff their schools adequately at this wage. Maybe they know that at that wage, they will not get the most economically ambitious grads, they will not get many STEM graduates, and High Schools Chemistry in, say, West Virginia, will be taught by History majors who have taken a couple of college Chem classes, rather than a grad with a degree in Organic Chemistry.

But there is no deception here. Applicants for teaching positions in those states know exactly what they will be making, and there is no promise of riches down the road. They have to decide whether that wage and those benefits will meet their needs, and if it doesn't, they need to look elsewhere. The State knows that many would-be teachers will go into another field or leave the state. But they have made that decision, and so be it. (One might point out that the teachers in states where teachers are WELL paid are rarely Phi Beta Kappa material either).

So massive strikes against such State Education Systems are bullshit. As with collective bargaining, they are a Leftist-led assault on the hapless taxpayers, in the name of "fairness."

Since when is it unfair to keep one's promises, as the respective States have done? If you don't like it, if you can't live on those wages, then go somewhere else. Most people in the Real World do this periodically throughout their working lives, with little trauma or gnashing of teeth. The state schools will have NO TROUBLE replacing each and every teacher who departs.
/----/ And why my property taxes are near $10,000 a year (Schools are funded via property tax) MAny districts are Union Free but not all.
2016-2017 teacher and administrator pay
2016-2017 teacher and administrator pay
Nearly 250,000 teachers and administrators statewide, excluding New York City, were paid $15,852,056,522.93 during the 2016-2017 school year.

Nearly 250,000 teachers and administrators statewide, excluding in New York City, were paid $15,852,056,522.93 during the 2016-2017 school year, according to data reported to the New York State Teachers Retirement System obtained under the state's Freedom of Information Act. That amounts to an average of $64,512.95 per member of the retirement system, an increase of 3.7 percent from the year before.

Here are the unaudited details available to the state as of Sept. 1, 2017; those records may be updated as employers report additional data or amend prior reporting records. Here are links to comparable data for teachers and administrators for 2015-2016 and 2014-2015. This database was posted on Sept. 8, 2017.
Name Start Date Last Known Employer Amount
Abulafia, Ovadia 11/17/1997 SUNY Health Science Center at Brooklyn $563,870.51
Lucchesi, Michael P 5/2/1994 SUNY Health Science Center at Brooklyn $529,440.01
Lazzaro, Douglas R 7/11/2001 SUNY Health Science Center at Brooklyn $477,340.43
Brown, Joyce F 9/1/1968 Fashion Institute of Technology $420,576.28
Fallon, Kelly A 9/1/1984 Half Hollow Hills Central Schools $397,933.03
Takeuchi, Esther S 9/1/2007 SUNY at Stony Brook $394,032.02
Tuttle, Stephen P 10/17/2011 Fashion Institute of Technology $378,294.52
Hunderfund, Anna F 9/3/1974 Locust Valley Central Schools $373,664.90
Wool, Louis N 9/1/1981 Harrison Central Schools $371,060.85
Grishman, Henry L 9/1/1967 Jericho Union Free Schools $365,354.02
Kersich, Peter J 9/1/1986 William Floyd Union Free Schools $351,627.40
Goodman, Amy J 12/14/1981 Greenburgh-Graham Union Free Schools $345,132.65
 
Oklahoma teachers never got a raise since 2007. Shame on oklahoma. Not even a 1 percent raise? I support them in whatever they decide to do. What a backward place. Even the teacher of the year gotu p and left that time warp state. A good teacher is thought of as trash in america. People wanr the best education without paying for it. A poor philosophy. Immoral.
 
I think Hills only retired old people, and teachers thinking they would be making what the top graduate at an Ivy League school would be getting is their own naive nature. Every time I hear a teacher complain about their pay, I tell them, "Well quit and go into the private sector." I have yet to see someone do it.

So...your plan is to dumb down children even more with poorly trained teachers, did you think this through?
 

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