Supreme Court Rules 7-2 on Obamacare

[Hutch Starskey]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

Exactly!
Republicans showed up again empty handed and without merit.

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

It’s exactly what you said. You just don’t understand what you meant by “cop out”.
SCOTUS literally decided that the argument was so dumb that they couldn’t rule on it.

No, the literally did not. That is not what dismissed for lack of standing means. The closest you can get to what you are saying is dismissed with prejudice but that does not even make the jump you are here - courts do not make a ruling on the level of intelligence an argument brings. Considering it was not even a 9-0 decision, it is clear the court did not state it was so dumb they could not rule on it.

No, the literally did not. That is not what dismissed for lack of standing means. The closest you can get to what you are saying is dismissed with prejudice but that does not even make the jump you are here - courts do not make a ruling on the level of intelligence an argument brings. Considering it was not even a 9-0 decision, it is clear the court did not state it was so dumb they could not rule on it.

You’ve literally no sense of humor.
It is pretty dumb though to appeal such a weak case all the way to the SCOTUS. Lack of standing in this case meant that the states were not damaged sufficiently enough to even make the case against the ACA in the first place.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

Exactly!
Republicans showed up again empty handed and without merit.

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

It’s exactly what you said. You just don’t understand what you meant by “cop out”.
SCOTUS literally decided that the argument was so dumb that they couldn’t rule on it.

You're a total fucking retard.

The only double standard is your Democrat one that your rules don't apply to you

You're a total fucking retard.

The only double standard is your Democrat one that your rules don't apply to you

You’re clearly confused per usual.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

But we do wonder why Americans refuse single payer universal health care that's half the cost per capita and proven to be better in other countries?

It’s something called self-reliance and personal responsibility. I wouldn’t expect foreigners to understand but some of us believe we can do a better job of looking after ourselves than the Government can.

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

How will you pay for services without health insurance? Who’s paying that $250k bill for the 10 surgeries to rebuild your pelvis after a car accident or your $60k a month chemotherapy treatments?
There’s a reason health insurance exists. The healthy pay for the sick. Not many individuals could afford to pay for open heart surgery out of pocket.

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

WTF? Risk is cost to insurers.
Insurance, like any business, is about controlling cost in order to maximize profits. The risks and costs of untreated chronic disease are well known and understood. It is proven that people actually go to their doctors and manage their chronic illnesses when they have coverage. It is by far cheaper to manage disease then treat the inevitable and avoidable emergencies that require hospital interventions and stays. This is the concept of wellness. It’s better for you and cheaper for your insurers to have your doctors to help you stay well rather than treat you emergently.

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

I’ve done no such thing. I said nothing of welfare or suggested it be free or without profit. It’s obvious to anyone reading this that it is you who struggles.

You clearly did, liar. You said insurance is where healthy people pay for unhealthy people. Actually insurance is about risk pooling. Insurance is based on ex ante risks, not ex post money redistribution. That is socialism, not insurance

You clearly did, liar. You said insurance is where healthy people pay for unhealthy people. Actually insurance is about risk pooling. Insurance is based on ex ante risks, not ex post money redistribution. That is socialism, not insurance

Still confused I see.
I said nothing about welfare, dope.

Yes. Risk pooling. Now explain why they are arranged as such.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Libertarianism doesn't work.

Then maybe it’s time to blow this whole place up and start over from scratch.

Then maybe it’s time to blow this whole place up and start over from scratch.

Or maybe just yourself

 

[dblack]

You've managed to put politicians in charge of our health care. Congrats.

As one who has battled the Insurance Companies before. And will again. It is honestly not a concern of mine. Frankly the longer I spend trying to get the insurance companies to care for my wife as they are supposed to, the better Single Payer sounds.

As long as you don't mind every single election being a referendum on whether grandma lives or dies.

That referendum is being fought out monthly now. You mean I can make it a fight I have to deal with every couple years instead? My God. That sounds like paradise.

No, I'm talking about something radically different. I'm talking about majority rules decisions, where we take a vote and we're stuck with whatever the majority wants. That's not necessary.

Nonsense. The Republicans want to cut funding. But don’t want to actually be blamed for it. After all it was Bush who pushed through the Medicare Prescription Drug plan. Which wasn’t much of a help. But it was some help.

The idea that care for my loved ones will come down to a vote is insane.

The battles will be fought over procedures and coverage. Republicans will scream and shout about not covering Abortion. Democrats will scream and shout over the issue.

Republicans will demand that services be cut. Democrats will campaign on raising taxes on the rich to pay for more services.

In other words. Exactly where we are now.

I agree. Except for the "nonsense" party. How does your post conflict with mine?

 

[dblack]

f you want nothing from the government then only drive on your roads, go to your schools, have your own military, have your own fire fighters, have your own police, if you cannot pay for health care, die

I want nothing from the Government except what they’re specifically given power over in founding documents, and which I pay taxes for:

From the Feds thst would be interstate roads and defense of the nation (not other nations). From the state that would be state roads. From the local Government that would be fire, police, local roads. Schools should be a private affair.

The Government should not have its nose or fingers in most of people’s affairs. Definitely not our health care.

Libertarianism doesn't work.

Try to keep up.

It works brilliantly. It's the default mode of society.

Try to pay attention.

 

[dblack]

I think it's a very good thing that we still have Obamacare.

In fact, I think we should do away with insurance companies for health care.

Most people in America can't stand insurance companies controlling what health care they can have and denying to pay medical bills.

We have some people who can have health care without being bankrupted or have insurance premiums that aren't astronomical. It's not fair that some people have proper insurance that is affordable and others don't here in the United States.

Our health care system is a total mess.

I've spent way too much time discussing the merits, or lack thereof, of ACA. It's corporatist shitshow throughout.

But, outside it's corruption and the blatant violation of Constitutional limits on government, the ACA does not have broad consensus. It was passed on strict partisan lines and will be a political football going forward, constantly torn and twisted as successive administrations get their hands on it.

You've managed to put politicians in charge of our health care. Congrats.

You will never convince a Statist that anything is wrong with a government program.

Black or white.....white or black.

Say, just where is libertarianism practiced on this planet?

Everywhere. Most of the time.

Where exactly?

Here. Wherever you are. Anywhere, and in any situation, when there aren't laws dictating our behavior. Is that "exact" enough for you?

I know what you're trying to do. You're trying to build a strawman equating libertarianism with anarchy. The usual. That lets you dismiss any argument criticizing the expansion of government power as "impractical". Basically you're saying, "anarchy doesn't work so you have accept whatever government power grab I propose". Whatever.

I don't care whether you call me a libertarian, or what (the Trumpsters here call me a leftist, go figure). And I'm not - in this thread - talking about any other issues. I just don't want my family's health care to be democratically determined. Voters are far too stupid to trust with something so important.

 

[Flopper]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

It should be pretty clear that Obamacare is not going to be overturn by the Supreme Court. Conservatives have 3 times tried and struck out. The only way it is going to be overturned is if republican in congress do it. Republicans had a chance when they controlled Congress during the Trump administration. Instead of making it a priority, they punted and left it to the courts. The fact is conservatives want Obamacare gone but they don't want to have to offer a replacement because of the problems it will cause them at the ballot box. 28 million people have health insurance due to Obamacare. 38 states have adopted Medicaid Expansion, a part of Obamacare. Without Obamacare, those states would be faced with either a huge cut to Medicaid or replacing federal funds with state funds.

 

[Ben Thomson]

They ruled Texas does not have standing in that it was not injured in anyway by the ACA. Texas tried to claim it did suffer..due to the higher cost of more Texans being insured. Texans..(rolls eyes)

 

[Colin norris]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

That's truly a shame. The Court is a joke. I just hope Manchin keeps his finger in the dam. Otherwise, we're all fucked.

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

That's truly a shame. The Court is a joke. I just hope Manchin keeps his finger in the dam. Otherwise, we're all fucked.

Is it really a joke? Are you still crying about them refusing to her trumps challenges?
How sad. My heart bleeds for you.

 

[Colin norris]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

It should be pretty clear that Obamacare is not going to be overturn by the Supreme Court. Conservatives have 3 times tried and struck out. The only way it is going to be overturned is if republican in congress do it. Republicans had a chance when they controlled Congress during the Trump administration. Instead of making it a priority, they punted and left it to the courts. The fact is conservatives want Obamacare gone but they don't want to have to offer a replacement because of the problems it will cause them at the ballot box. 28 million people have health insurance due to Obamacare. 38 states have adopted Medicaid Expansion, a part of Obamacare. Without Obamacare, those states would be faced with either a huge cut to Medicaid or replacing federal funds with state funds.

They will pay with election defeat if they attempt to remove it.
28 million will swing any election.

 

[Wyatt earp]

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue

Do you undercut? I don’t think you do. I don’t think that you truly understand how many of us do not want anything from the Government; whether we’ve paid for it or not.

It’s not that we somehow believe the insure companies have our best interests at heart. We know they don’t. We’d just rather take the chance of getting care for our bodies there than doing harm to our Souls by dealing with the Government.

If you want nothing from the government then only drive on your roads, go to your schools, have your own military, have your own fire fighters, have your own police, if you cannot pay for health care, die.

You don't die if you have health care..


Who knew?

Well Bear, you do die with insurance and/or a lot of money, but most likely not as fast as if you were only given healthcare if you could pay for it or had insurance.
I know this is a very complex idea. Have your mother explain it to you.

Talk about drinking the Kool aid

That is not Kool Aid, that is the real world; no sugar added. How old are you. You sound like a person who has not experienced much in life or are very stupid or both.

Old enough to know I don't need health insurance and am not paying for your fat ass

 

[debbiedowner]

A huge hit to Trump by his 'loaded' Scotus.

Complete 'crazy' won't go the distance for Trump. Between this and the positive spin for Biden with Putin, this is Trump's worst day since the voters took him down.

Trump's supporters on this board are now isolated background noise.

His loaded SCOTUS I don't believe has given the right a big win. I always said if a justice was following the law it doesn't matter what President nominated them.

 

[debbiedowner]

Republicans and Conservatives lose again.

No. Working Americans loose again. The only people who like Obamacare are those the rest of us are paying for.

If Renquist had still been alive and Chief Justice of the SC, Obamacare would have been kicked to the curb. Right where it belongs.

So, please thrill us with your idea of "something better."

HC should be kicked back to the private sector where it belongs. Check the Constitution. You won't find health care anywhere in the Constitution.

You won't find lots of things in the Constitution.......but that is an extremely childish justification for not wanting more people to have health care....

But anyhoo....The first federal public healthcare law was signed in 1798....by one of those "Founders" you love to worship.....was he a socialist marxist??

You want health care then you buy it like everyone else does. You want to pay for someone else's health care then be my guest.

Damn, you amaze me and I always thought you were a Walmart employee but you in earlier posts prove you are a constitutional scholar who probably has health insurance and pays for other's.

 

[debbiedowner]

Republicans and Conservatives lose again.

No. Working Americans loose again. The only people who like Obamacare are those the rest of us are paying for.

If Renquist had still been alive and Chief Justice of the SC, Obamacare would have been kicked to the curb. Right where it belongs.

So, please thrill us with your idea of "something better."

HC should be kicked back to the private sector where it belongs. Check the Constitution. You won't find health care anywhere in the Constitution.

You won't find lots of things in the Constitution.......but that is an extremely childish justification for not wanting more people to have health care....

But anyhoo....The first federal public healthcare law was signed in 1798....by one of those "Founders" you love to worship.....was he a socialist marxist??

You want health care then you buy it like everyone else does. You want to pay for someone else's health care then be my guest.

You are subsidizing someone's healthcare regardless...or do you not know how insurance companies work??

Fact is.....you are subsidizing someone else's healthcare in a more ineffective way in the private market than you would be in the public market....


But aside from that point...do you not care that Republicans lie to you over and over again about their healthcare plans?? Did you already know Trump was being full of shit about promising everyone affordable healthcare with his non-existent plan?? Was that one of those lies you didn't mind because your cult leader said it?

Well since I'm not a Rep I really don't care what they say.

As for me. I'm on Medicare. Which I've paid for my whole working life. If you want to pay for someone else's health care then be my guest.

That is how Medicare works...that is how taxes work.....

Do you think that you alone paid for the Medicare benefits you receive now??

Adorable

She's clueless.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

That's truly a shame. The Court is a joke. I just hope Manchin keeps his finger in the dam. Otherwise, we're all fucked.

I think it's a very good thing that we still have Obamacare.

In fact, I think we should do away with insurance companies for health care.

Most people in America can't stand insurance companies controlling what health care they can have and denying to pay medical bills.

We have some people who can have health care without being bankrupted or have insurance premiums that aren't astronomical. It's not fair that some people have proper insurance that is affordable and others don't here in the United States.

Our health care system is a total mess.

Most people in America can't stand insurance companies controlling what health care they can have and denying to pay medical bills.

and you think Medicare is any different?...

Anybody holding up signs like this demanding any healthcare plan Republicans proposed??View attachment 502413

For Medicare to be just like private insurance companies -- there sure seems to be a lot of historically popular bipartisan support for it over the last 60 or so years....

they dont cover everything.....so they also tell you what health care you can have....

Does Medicare tell you what care you can have in order to increase profit share like private insurance companies do??

Do they find all kinds of ways to deny covering pre-existing conditions so they can run at 20% overhead in order to pay out those executive bonuses??

Again...there is a reason why after 50 years -- those with Medicare still love it in comparison to any alternative Republicans/private insurance has offered....


Do we need to pretend to not know the history of how Medicare even became a thing??

 

[kaz]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

Exactly!
Republicans showed up again empty handed and without merit.

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

It’s exactly what you said. You just don’t understand what you meant by “cop out”.
SCOTUS literally decided that the argument was so dumb that they couldn’t rule on it.

You're a total fucking retard.

The only double standard is your Democrat one that your rules don't apply to you

You're a total fucking retard.

The only double standard is your Democrat one that your rules don't apply to you

You’re clearly confused per usual.

You looked at a post and said that is clearly not the same, you clearly aren't going to hold Democrats to the same standard you hold Republicans to. It's lame, you're a total hypocrite

 

[kaz]

But we do wonder why Americans refuse single payer universal health care that's half the cost per capita and proven to be better in other countries?

It’s something called self-reliance and personal responsibility. I wouldn’t expect foreigners to understand but some of us believe we can do a better job of looking after ourselves than the Government can.

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

How will you pay for services without health insurance? Who’s paying that $250k bill for the 10 surgeries to rebuild your pelvis after a car accident or your $60k a month chemotherapy treatments?
There’s a reason health insurance exists. The healthy pay for the sick. Not many individuals could afford to pay for open heart surgery out of pocket.

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

WTF? Risk is cost to insurers.
Insurance, like any business, is about controlling cost in order to maximize profits. The risks and costs of untreated chronic disease are well known and understood. It is proven that people actually go to their doctors and manage their chronic illnesses when they have coverage. It is by far cheaper to manage disease then treat the inevitable and avoidable emergencies that require hospital interventions and stays. This is the concept of wellness. It’s better for you and cheaper for your insurers to have your doctors to help you stay well rather than treat you emergently.

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

I’ve done no such thing. I said nothing of welfare or suggested it be free or without profit. It’s obvious to anyone reading this that it is you who struggles.

You clearly did, liar. You said insurance is where healthy people pay for unhealthy people. Actually insurance is about risk pooling. Insurance is based on ex ante risks, not ex post money redistribution. That is socialism, not insurance

You clearly did, liar. You said insurance is where healthy people pay for unhealthy people. Actually insurance is about risk pooling. Insurance is based on ex ante risks, not ex post money redistribution. That is socialism, not insurance

Still confused I see.
I said nothing about welfare, dope.

Yes. Risk pooling. Now explain why they are arranged as such.

God you're stupid. You don't even understand the discussion.

When you say you are using medicine to redistribute wealth (healthy to unhealthy), that is clearly welfare. Clearly meaning to someone who's not an idiot. You know, you ...

 

[colfax_m]

I know "standing" seems like a cop out, but when you actually look at what they mean by "standing", it becomes obvious that the lawsuit is just bullshit.

The complaint is that the plaintiff's were injured by the fact that they had to buy insurance even though they're not forced to buy it and the penalty for not doing so is zero. It's gibberish.

 

[kaz]

I know "standing" seems like a cop out, but when you actually look at what they mean by "standing", it becomes obvious that the lawsuit is just bullshit.

The complaint is that the plaintiff's were injured by the fact that they had to buy insurance even though they're not forced to buy it and the penalty for not doing so is zero. It's gibberish.

Since the Federal government was created by the States, how can the States not have standing to sue the Federal government? If they don't have standing, who does?

You were right the first time, it was a cop out.

If I could go back in time and tell the founding fathers one thing, it would be that three branches of government keeping each other in check is a stupid idea. They are not keeping each other in check, they have the same incentive. Bigger government = more power for them.

The founders should have preempted the stupid Judicial review and made the federal government get ALL LAWS ratified by the State legislatures before they took effect. That is a check and balance, not branches of the same government