So much for buy american! walmart to outsource even more!

[WillowTree]

yea dude! the comparative impact of a yearly 9 dollar salary versus a 24 dollar salary SURE IS ARBITRARY!

Arbitrary No, many of those who were making $24.00 an hour are out of work or soon to be out of work, those working in factories making $9.00 an hour still have jobs and will have jobs in the future, there's a simple explaination to that conundrum, those that were making $24.00 an hour in UAW factories weren't worth that much. The union geniuses priced much of their own membership right out of the labor market.

Hogwash, you want to blame the workers? You my man are as full shit as they come. Place the blame on over paid executives, the politicians, the insurance companies, the over inflated value of property, inflated taxes and the union bosses but don't you dare blame a working man/woman for the desire to make enough to feed his/her family and live in a decent home. You shot any credibility you had right out the window. "stand4liberty" my aching ass.

that's not what he was doing.

 

[STAND4LIBERTY]

Hogwash, you want to blame the workers?
You my man are as full shit as they come. Place the blame on over paid executives, the politicians, the insurance companies, the over inflated value of property, inflated taxes and the union bosses but don't you dare blame a working man/woman for the desire to make enough to feed his/her family and live in a decent home. You shot any credibility you had right out the window. "stand4liberty" my aching ass.

Actually you should learn to read .... let me repeat it for you pal

The union geniuses priced much of their own membership right out of the labor market.

Ring any bells?

 

[Agnapostate]

"Immorality" as defined by you.

I have a little time for collectivist left moralizing as I do for collectivist right moralizing.

Then if you wish to assert otherwise, provide an argument. I'll line up the utilitarian argument presented for you in basic form so that you can get to work.

Premise 1: It is immoral to permit a child to die in order to save your shoes, since those shoes are not of comparable moral significance to the life of a child.

Premise 2: The aforementioned analogy is similar to the very real situation of world poverty, which could also be alleviated through sacrifice of articles not of comparable moral significance to human life.

Conclusion: It is immoral to permit the world's economically disadvantaged to die by not providing finances to aid them, since this could be done without sacrifice of anything of comparable moral significance to human life.

Feel free to attack where you feel you best can.

Forcing people to give their business to someone whose product costs too much leaves less money in the pockets of the charitable to give.

Clearly, you're not familiar with so basic an economic concept as the diminishing rate of marginal utility.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

yea dude! the comparative impact of a yearly 9 dollar salary versus a 24 dollar salary SURE IS ARBITRARY!

Arbitrary No, many of those who were making $24.00 an hour are out of work or soon to be out of work, those working in factories making $9.00 an hour still have jobs and will have jobs in the future, there's a simple explaination to that conundrum, those that were making $24.00 an hour in UAW factories weren't worth that much. The union geniuses priced much of their own membership right out of the labor market.

Hogwash, you want to blame the workers? You my man are as full shit as they come. Place the blame on over paid executives, the politicians, the insurance companies, the over inflated value of property, inflated taxes and the union bosses but don't you dare blame a working man/woman for the desire to make enough to feed his/her family and live in a decent home. You shot any credibility you had right out the window. "stand4liberty" my aching ass.

Rodishi, you're right to the point where the individual is entitled to make the best he or she can make... but where the government comes in and forces employers to bargain collectively; where that collective workforce, uses coercive means to force employers to pay beyond the means of the market margins, THAT Collective workforce is directly responsible for the inevitable demise of that business.

Such was the case in the US Textile industry, the US Steel Industry and now the US Auto industry...

Such will soon be the case with the US financial services industry and the Health industry.

 

[RodISHI]

Hogwash, you want to blame the workers?
You my man are as full shit as they come. Place the blame on over paid executives, the politicians, the insurance companies, the over inflated value of property, inflated taxes and the union bosses but don't you dare blame a working man/woman for the desire to make enough to feed his/her family and live in a decent home. You shot any credibility you had right out the window. "stand4liberty" my aching ass.

Actually you should learn to read .... let me repeat it for you pal

The union geniuses priced much of their own membership right out of the labor market.

Ring any bells?

I did read it. twenty-four dollars and hour ain't shit. Now the medical insurance and benefits are. Where does that fall? Those twenty-four dollar an hour employees can't determine what the cost of their benefits are. Blame the insurance companies....

 

[RodISHI]

Arbitrary No, many of those who were making $24.00 an hour are out of work or soon to be out of work, those working in factories making $9.00 an hour still have jobs and will have jobs in the future, there's a simple explaination to that conundrum, those that were making $24.00 an hour in UAW factories weren't worth that much. The union geniuses priced much of their own membership right out of the labor market.

Hogwash, you want to blame the workers? You my man are as full shit as they come. Place the blame on over paid executives, the politicians, the insurance companies, the over inflated value of property, inflated taxes and the union bosses but don't you dare blame a working man/woman for the desire to make enough to feed his/her family and live in a decent home. You shot any credibility you had right out the window. "stand4liberty" my aching ass.

Rodishi, you're right to the point where the individual is entitled to make the best he or she can make... but where the government comes in and forces employers to bargain collectively; where that collective workforce, uses coercive means to force employers to pay beyond the means of the market margins, THAT Collective workforce is directly responsible for the inevitable demise of that business.

Such was the case in the US Textile industry, the US Steel Industry and now the US Auto industry...

Such will soon be the case with the US financial services industry and the Health industry.

Tell me this if those CEO's did not receive billions while jacking up the cost of everything and taking out any competition along the way where would these companies be?

 

[Oddball]

Blame the insurance companies....

Why not blame those who treated first-dollar coverage for a boil on their butt as a right??

 

[RodISHI]

Blame the insurance companies....

Why not blame those who treated first-dollar coverage for a boil on their butt as a right??

Go ahead add them to the mix.

 

[Oddball]

Then if you wish to assert otherwise, provide an argument. I'll line up the utilitarian argument presented for you in basic form so that you can get to work.

Premise 1: It is immoral to permit a child to die in order to save your shoes, since those shoes are not of comparable moral significance to the life of a child.

Premise 2: The aforementioned analogy is similar to the very real situation of world poverty, which could also be alleviated through sacrifice of articles not of comparable moral significance to human life.

Conclusion: It is immoral to permit the world's economically disadvantaged to die by not providing finances to aid them, since this could be done without sacrifice of anything of comparable moral significance to human life.

Feel free to attack where you feel you best can.

Your're attempting to attach objective meanings to relative and unquantifiable terms, like "wealth", "poverty" and "morality"....Not to mention invoking what Rand correctly identified as "lifeboat ethics".

Every utilitarian argument I've seen is founded upon such arbitrarily defined terms, and subsequently fall apart like a sand castle in the incoming tide because of them.

Premises: Rejected.

 

[Shogun]

yea dude! the comparative impact of a yearly 9 dollar salary versus a 24 dollar salary SURE IS ARBITRARY!

Arbitrary No, many of those who were making $24.00 an hour are out of work or soon to be out of work, those working in factories making $9.00 an hour still have jobs and will have jobs in the future, there's a simple explaination to that conundrum, those that were making $24.00 an hour in UAW factories weren't worth that much. The union geniuses priced much of their own membership right out of the labor market.

yea dude! our economy, and it's total meltdown of consuming ability, sure does agree with you!



Buy a fucking house lately? How many 9/hr factory workers do you think are out getting new homes built? Or, I daresay, buying homes period? 24/hr are out of work because assholes like you don't have a problem shipping those opportunities to Mexico. Don't deflect the blame, dude. It's entirely the fault of people like you that we are wading through the river of shit that seems to have stunk up our domestic economic climate.

 

[Shogun]

Is that your way of crying uncle?




I take it you didn't want to go ahead and push the idea that your 7k altitude is reflective of the rest of the nation, eh? Whatsa matter, lil guy? Wasn't prepared for my Snow Machine joke?






for real.. you diminish the very avatar you've chosen, strangely, to use.

 

[STAND4LIBERTY]

I did read it. twenty-four dollars and hour ain't shit. Now the medical insurance and benefits are. Where does that fall? Those twenty-four dollar an hour employees can't determine what the cost of their benefits are. Blame the insurance companies....

It is if your competitors are paying $9.00 an hour for the same labor and building superior products too boot, you can't stay in business doing that for very long and the UAW instead of reading the hand writing on the wall (and it's been there for YEARS) kept demanding more and more all along. They essentially wouldn't give in until the last shoe dropped and when that happened it was too little too late.

There's plenty of blame to go around for the failure of GM & Chrysler, but the post I was responding to was specifically bitching about the loss of $24.00 an hour factory jobs in favor of $9.00 an hour factory jobs, perhaps you should consider the context before going off on a friggin tangent next time.... just a thought.

 

[Shogun]

Blame the insurance companies....

Why not blame those who treated first-dollar coverage for a boil on their butt as a right??

indeed! We need an America that is as unhealthy as a fucking Chinese sweat shop TOO! Hell, if some dirty mexicans who work in a mexican auto plant don't expect clean water and daily baths then why the fuck should an AMERICAN expect as much??



you, sir, are one silly piece of shit.

 

[Derek_Plumber]

So it makes MORE business sense to screw americans out of jobs that they are capable of doing! Oh yeah I forgot it would cut into profit margins to pay american workers 7-9 bucks on hour when you can save that profit and keep more in their already fat wallet, overpaid asses by outsourcing at half or better of the cost! viva la capitalism!

Definitely a man after my own heart! Walmart is UnAmerican with its globel encouragement of slave wages. Here is some proof. This is just the FIRST PAGE of Anti-WalMart groups from the Internet. anti-walmart movement - Google Search You don't suppose Life_Long_Dem's criticism comes from WalMart itself? They are a sleazy bunch.

 

[STAND4LIBERTY]

yea dude! our economy, and it's total meltdown of consuming ability, sure does agree with you!



Buy a fucking house lately? How many 9/hr factory workers do you think are out getting new homes built? Or, I daresay, buying homes period? 24/hr are out of work because assholes like you don't have a problem shipping those opportunities to Mexico. Don't deflect the blame, dude. It's entirely the fault of people like you that we are wading through the river of shit that seems to have stunk up our domestic economic climate.

Just out of curiosity exactly how DRUNK are you ?

 

[Agnapostate]

Tell me this if those CEO's did not receive billions while jacking up the cost of everything and taking out any competition along the way where would these companies be?

Executive overpayment can typically be found at the root of the problem, with particularly extreme forms of wage dispersion causing greater problems. For example, consider Wade et al.'s Overpaid CEOs and Underpaid Managers: Fairness and Executive Compensation.

Much previous research on executive compensation has been predicated on previous research on executive compensation has been predicated on economic theories with their assumptions of the motivational benefits of individual competitiveness among employees. Using a sample of over 120 large public companies over a five year period, results of this study show the negative consequences of inequity in the CEO’s pay on employees at lower levels of the organization. First, the effects of CEO over- and underpayment are shown to cascade down to lower organizational levels. Second, inequity between the CEO’s compensation and that of lower level managers is associated with higher rates of turnover for these employees. Overall, the findings are consistent with the positive effects of wage compression in salaries. Theoretical implications for the design of executive compensation are discussed.

 

[Oddball]

indeed! We need an America that is as unhealthy as a fucking Chinese sweat shop TOO! Hell, if some dirty mexicans who work in a mexican auto plant don't expect clean water and daily baths then why the fuck should an AMERICAN expect as much??

Did I hear someone say non sequitur?!?!?!?!?!?

 

[Shogun]

yea dude! our economy, and it's total meltdown of consuming ability, sure does agree with you!



Buy a fucking house lately? How many 9/hr factory workers do you think are out getting new homes built? Or, I daresay, buying homes period? 24/hr are out of work because assholes like you don't have a problem shipping those opportunities to Mexico. Don't deflect the blame, dude. It's entirely the fault of people like you that we are wading through the river of shit that seems to have stunk up our domestic economic climate.

Just out of curiosity exactly how DRUNK are you ?

Not drunk at all.. I take it this is your method of avoiding to give an answer about how many 9/hr employees are out buying homes or having new houses built LIKE THOSE MAKING 24/hr CAN...

Cant say that I'm shocked that you'd avoid that issue kind of like you do the Trade Deficit.

 

[STAND4LIBERTY]

Not drunk at all..

That's too bad, at least if you were drunk you'd have an excuse... oh well...pray continue.

 

[Shogun]

indeed! We need an America that is as unhealthy as a fucking Chinese sweat shop TOO! Hell, if some dirty mexicans who work in a mexican auto plant don't expect clean water and daily baths then why the fuck should an AMERICAN expect as much??

Did I hear someone say non sequitur?!?!?!?!?!?

tell me more about non seuiter, mr picture man..