Since when does the Catholic Church have the right to force their religious values...

[Cecilie1200]

denying women benefits that are available to the majority, just because of the type of sign over the door, is medieval. Revel in it.

What does this even MEAN? The "majority" of WHAT? Not the majority of employees of the Catholic Church, since they don't provide coverage for birth control and sterilization for ANY of their employees.

 

[Intense]

denying women benefits that are available to the majority, just because of the type of sign over the door, is medieval. Revel in it.

What does this even MEAN? The "majority" of WHAT? Not the majority of employees of the Catholic Church, since they don't provide coverage for birth control and sterilization for ANY of their employees.

It's like Dot Com is blind folded and mute, could not find a condom without help, even in a multiple choice question with illustrations. Wouldn't know what to do with it anyway.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Curious...

I assume you supported the bailouts of Chrysler and GM.....and I assume you supported the stiumulus plan..

Now....using those assumptions...

What right does the government have to pick and choose what companies should get stimulus money or bailout money....

and if they have the right to pick and choose...

Why cant they pick and choose who should be exempt from a law that would infringe on the religious convictions of an employer?

This is not about what the government can or can't do by changing the law, or passing a law.

It's about what is right. Allowing one set of businesses to avoid providing their employees a benefit that is the law for every other business in the country is discrimination.

Which is why the government needs to get out of this "business".

Religion by it's very nature is discriminatory.

Reality by its very nature is discriminatory.

 

[saveliberty]

Good thing the RCC doesn't run a motel chain. These idiots would expect whores to be provided.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

That is fact. That is irrefutable.

Actually, yes they do. We have laws against Peyote, but the religious practices of certain tribes in New Mexico that involve its use are allowed because of the First Amendment.

Your so-called "fact" is easily refutable.

I believe Santeria involves animal sacrifice and gets special dispensation from laws about animal cruelty and so forth.

 

[Cecilie1200]

The controvery isn't over whether women should have access to birth control but whether free access to birth control and abortion is a human right.

Exactly. Do women have a right to have someone else buy their birth control? If so, where is that right codified into the law?

 

[Cecilie1200]

I'd like to know since when have Evangelicals been defenders of the Catholic church??? I am Catholic, and I have been criticized for praying to statues and to the Blessed Virgin. Evangelicals have told me it's wrong.

I think the majority of people flapping their gums on this issue are only doing it because it's a good excuse to criticize the prez. The majority of Catholics do use birth control just like they ate meat on Fridays before the Pope said we could.

This whole thing is a crock. Until Evangelicals, Republicans, and othe Obama hating groups become objective, I don't trust them.

Since forever, shitstain. We don't have to agree with each other doctrinally in order to understand that defending each others' right to religious freedom is both the right thing to do and in our own best interests.

And I don't give a **** WHAT the "majority of Catholics" do. Last time I checked, we don't vote on respecting Constitutional rights.

 

[Cecilie1200]

denying women benefits that are available to the majority, just because of the type of sign over the door, is medieval. Revel in it.

What does this even MEAN? The "majority" of WHAT? Not the majority of employees of the Catholic Church, since they don't provide coverage for birth control and sterilization for ANY of their employees.

It's like Dot Com is blind folded and mute, could not find a condom without help, even in a multiple choice question with illustrations. Wouldn't know what to do with it anyway.

And wouldn't have anyone he'd need to use it with.

 

[Intense]

Curious...

I assume you supported the bailouts of Chrysler and GM.....and I assume you supported the stiumulus plan..

Now....using those assumptions...

What right does the government have to pick and choose what companies should get stimulus money or bailout money....

and if they have the right to pick and choose...

Why cant they pick and choose who should be exempt from a law that would infringe on the religious convictions of an employer?

This is not about what the government can or can't do by changing the law, or passing a law.

It's about what is right. Allowing one set of businesses to avoid providing their employees a benefit that is the law for every other business in the country is discrimination.

Which is why the government needs to get out of this "business".

Religion by it's very nature is discriminatory.

Either you are on the path or you aren't. It's your choice Sallow. Is Conscience Black and White? Are your options simple or complex, requiring steps? Lighten Up Doggie Breath. So how late did you hang out at Brooklyn Tech last Night?

 

[Intense]

What does this even MEAN? The "majority" of WHAT? Not the majority of employees of the Catholic Church, since they don't provide coverage for birth control and sterilization for ANY of their employees.

It's like Dot Com is blind folded and mute, could not find a condom without help, even in a multiple choice question with illustrations. Wouldn't know what to do with it anyway.

And wouldn't have anyone he'd need to use it with.

If he could only figure out how to inflate his Blow Up Doll.

 

[saveliberty]

Seems like more Nazi pics would bolster the church haters position right? Quick, someone blame da Jews.

 

[Againsheila]

They receive whatever their employer agrees to, and not one thing more.

Except that you're not allowed to discriminate. No one is asking the RCC to do anything, except provide insurance. The people backing their position seem to be on the wrong side of the First Amendment fight, IMO.

Where the hell did discrimination come into this? The Catholic Church is not discriminating against anyone. They do not want to provide a service that violates their beliefs. Period. The other side thinks it is all right for them to be forced into the corner.

You are an idiot. No where did they do any such thing whatsoever. They simply do not want to be a part of it. The employees still have full rights to do whatever they damn well please. You simply do not want to afford the religious institution that same right.

You have a special talent for stupid non sequiturs.

Peyote possession is against the law, unless you belong to certain Indian tribes because it's used in their religious practices. That proves your claim wrong.

End of story.

I said, you ignorant ****,

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

Using peyote in a religious ceremony is not running a ******* business.

You must be the dumbest **** on this forum.

That US law is the problem though because it is utter bullshit. It requires them to provide birth control yet sores right over other medical needs like hearing aids as already covered in this very thread (and the point went unanswered). Why in the hell is BC a mandated service when all those others are not? By what bullshit right does the government decide you MUST cover simple and cheap pills for women and then glaze over actual medical needs that are damn near unobtainable for people that actually need help. It is partisan bullshit agenda pushing and you should wake the hell up to it. The Catholic institutions WANT to provide medical coverage for their employees. They are actively trying to cover them. Then daddy government comes in and says hay, you can't make sure that your employees are healthy and have good coverage unless you buy into MY philosophy and cover what WE want covered, even if it goes against your deeply held convictions. This is a classic case of government stepping WAY over their bounds to force people into doing something they have absolutely ZERO right doing. There is no defense whatsoever that you can put up that puts BC as a required coverage and still ignores all the other procedures that are simply not required.

Good point...so what happens now if the Catholic church just decides not to provide health insurance for it's employees?

 

[bripat9643]

It's like Dot Com is blind folded and mute, could not find a condom without help, even in a multiple choice question with illustrations. Wouldn't know what to do with it anyway.

Libturds just keep mindlessly repeat talking points because they don't posess that capacity for rational thought. The repeat what has been spoonfed to them on the various propaganda websites like DailyKOS

 

[tinydancer]

Except that you're not allowed to discriminate. No one is asking the RCC to do anything, except provide insurance. The people backing their position seem to be on the wrong side of the First Amendment fight, IMO.

Where the hell did discrimination come into this? The Catholic Church is not discriminating against anyone. They do not want to provide a service that violates their beliefs. Period. The other side thinks it is all right for them to be forced into the corner.

You are an idiot. No where did they do any such thing whatsoever. They simply do not want to be a part of it. The employees still have full rights to do whatever they damn well please. You simply do not want to afford the religious institution that same right.

I said, you ignorant ****,

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

Using peyote in a religious ceremony is not running a ******* business.

You must be the dumbest **** on this forum.

That US law is the problem though because it is utter bullshit. It requires them to provide birth control yet sores right over other medical needs like hearing aids as already covered in this very thread (and the point went unanswered). Why in the hell is BC a mandated service when all those others are not? By what bullshit right does the government decide you MUST cover simple and cheap pills for women and then glaze over actual medical needs that are damn near unobtainable for people that actually need help. It is partisan bullshit agenda pushing and you should wake the hell up to it. The Catholic institutions WANT to provide medical coverage for their employees. They are actively trying to cover them. Then daddy government comes in and says hay, you can't make sure that your employees are healthy and have good coverage unless you buy into MY philosophy and cover what WE want covered, even if it goes against your deeply held convictions. This is a classic case of government stepping WAY over their bounds to force people into doing something they have absolutely ZERO right doing. There is no defense whatsoever that you can put up that puts BC as a required coverage and still ignores all the other procedures that are simply not required.

Good point...so what happens now if the Catholic church just decides not to provide health insurance for it's employees?

I've been wondering what law would kick in if the Church and related Hospitals et al screened all employees based on religion?

Would they not get a double whammy here?

Let's take another example. If this goes forward, I as a Christian could force a Muslim School financed with public funds (and yes, I know where they are) to hire Christians and Jews and then force the Muslim school to provide all of Obama's dream condoms, birth control pills, morning after pills and then penultimately abortion all under Obamacare.

whoopsies hit post instead of preview.

I guarantee you just try telling a muslim public school funded by taxpayers that they have to provide bc pills let alone the morning after pill let alone condoms let alone a book called "Mohammed had two daddies" and that boat ain't going to float.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Except that you're not allowed to discriminate. No one is asking the RCC to do anything, except provide insurance. The people backing their position seem to be on the wrong side of the First Amendment fight, IMO.

Where the hell did discrimination come into this? The Catholic Church is not discriminating against anyone. They do not want to provide a service that violates their beliefs. Period. The other side thinks it is all right for them to be forced into the corner.

You are an idiot. No where did they do any such thing whatsoever. They simply do not want to be a part of it. The employees still have full rights to do whatever they damn well please. You simply do not want to afford the religious institution that same right.

I said, you ignorant ****,

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

Using peyote in a religious ceremony is not running a ******* business.

You must be the dumbest **** on this forum.

That US law is the problem though because it is utter bullshit. It requires them to provide birth control yet sores right over other medical needs like hearing aids as already covered in this very thread (and the point went unanswered). Why in the hell is BC a mandated service when all those others are not? By what bullshit right does the government decide you MUST cover simple and cheap pills for women and then glaze over actual medical needs that are damn near unobtainable for people that actually need help. It is partisan bullshit agenda pushing and you should wake the hell up to it. The Catholic institutions WANT to provide medical coverage for their employees. They are actively trying to cover them. Then daddy government comes in and says hay, you can't make sure that your employees are healthy and have good coverage unless you buy into MY philosophy and cover what WE want covered, even if it goes against your deeply held convictions. This is a classic case of government stepping WAY over their bounds to force people into doing something they have absolutely ZERO right doing. There is no defense whatsoever that you can put up that puts BC as a required coverage and still ignores all the other procedures that are simply not required.

Good point...so what happens now if the Catholic church just decides not to provide health insurance for it's employees?

Then we'll hear the cries of foul.. how the Catholics want people to die in the streets, Christians are evil... you know the drill.

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnn.............

 

[bripat9643]

No, Chickenshit, the First Amendment gives Catholics the right to exercise their religious freedom in every aspect of their lives, including running their businesses . . . unless you can sack up and show me where the First Amendment limits this in any way.

By the way, shitforbrains, Christian Scientists probably don't offer health insurance AT ALL. They don't believe in ANY medical care, not just insulin shots. Duuuhhh.

Next they will demand that Bible stores stock prayor rugs and the Qu'ran because doing otherwise would discriminate against Muslims.

 

[bripat9643]

I said, you ignorant ****,

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

Using peyote in a religious ceremony is not running a ******* business.

You must be the dumbest **** on this forum.

U.S. law cannot conflict with the First Amendment, you ******* moron. Obama and the Dims aren't free to make any law they want trampling over the First Amendment rights of business owners. However, you and your moronic goosestepping ilk think Congress isn't required to follow the Constitution.

 

[NYcarbineer]

I said, you ignorant ****,

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

Using peyote in a religious ceremony is not running a ******* business.

You must be the dumbest **** on this forum.

U.S. law cannot conflict with the First Amendment, you ******* moron. Obama and the Dims aren't free to make any law they want trampling over the First Amendment rights of business owners. However, you and your moronic goosestepping ilk think Congress isn't required to follow the Constitution.

NYS law requires the same birth control insurance as the federal law and was upheld by the courts in 2007.

 

[Mr.Nick]

...on their non Catholic employees?

Churches are exempt from the ruling.

However, religious institutions that employ and serve people outside their faith -- hospitals, elementary schools, universities -- have to comply with the requirement to cover birth control if they offer health insurance coverage for employees. That means such Catholic institutions, which employ and serve wide swaths of non-Catholics across the country, will not be exempt, despite church teachings against use of contraception.

Obama Administration's New Contraception Rule Puts Key Catholic Vote at Risk

What gives the Catholic church (or any church, for that matter) the right to force their religious convictions on employees who aren't even catholic?

If you don't agree with the Catholic faith then why the **** would you want to work for a Catholic non-for-profit organization??

IN WHAT UNIVERSE DO NON-BELIEVERS GET TO SHOVE THEIR FUCKED UP MORALS DOWN OTHERS THROATS???

That is the better question...

It's not the churches obligation to pander to the immoral....

Go work somewhere else if you're not satisfied with your health care..

 

[NYcarbineer]

Except that you're not allowed to discriminate. No one is asking the RCC to do anything, except provide insurance. The people backing their position seem to be on the wrong side of the First Amendment fight, IMO.

Where the hell did discrimination come into this? The Catholic Church is not discriminating against anyone. They do not want to provide a service that violates their beliefs. Period. The other side thinks it is all right for them to be forced into the corner.

You are an idiot. No where did they do any such thing whatsoever. They simply do not want to be a part of it. The employees still have full rights to do whatever they damn well please. You simply do not want to afford the religious institution that same right.

I said, you ignorant ****,

Churches do not get to run businesses outside US law simply because they have a piece of dogma that conflicts with that law.

Using peyote in a religious ceremony is not running a ******* business.

You must be the dumbest **** on this forum.

That US law is the problem though because it is utter bullshit. It requires them to provide birth control yet sores right over other medical needs like hearing aids as already covered in this very thread (and the point went unanswered). Why in the hell is BC a mandated service when all those others are not? By what bullshit right does the government decide you MUST cover simple and cheap pills for women and then glaze over actual medical needs that are damn near unobtainable for people that actually need help. It is partisan bullshit agenda pushing and you should wake the hell up to it. The Catholic institutions WANT to provide medical coverage for their employees. They are actively trying to cover them. Then daddy government comes in and says hay, you can't make sure that your employees are healthy and have good coverage unless you buy into MY philosophy and cover what WE want covered, even if it goes against your deeply held convictions. This is a classic case of government stepping WAY over their bounds to force people into doing something they have absolutely ZERO right doing. There is no defense whatsoever that you can put up that puts BC as a required coverage and still ignores all the other procedures that are simply not required.

Good point...so what happens now if the Catholic church just decides not to provide health insurance for it's employees?

They can do that, but they are competing for talent in their businesses just like any other business. You're a medical professional looking for a job in a hospital, or you're an education professional looking for a job at a university...

...how high on your list do you think you'll put the ones with no healthcare plan/benefit???