Should religion be eliminated

[Crepitus]

There's quite a bit of opposition to religion here. I am just wondering how many of you people believe religion should be eliminated. It's been tried before and failed, but don't let that deter you in your quest.

Learn from their mistakes and give it another try.

Why the Soviet attempt to stamp out religion failed | Giles Fraser: Loose canon

I don't have a problem with religion. I do however have a serious case of the ass for hypocrites. Sadly the two seem to go hand in hand more often than not.

So should we just lock them up in camps then?

Nope, just be aware that they rarely practice what they preach.

That's it?

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

 

[ding]

There's quite a bit of opposition to religion here. I am just wondering how many of you people believe religion should be eliminated. It's been tried before and failed, but don't let that deter you in your quest.

Learn from their mistakes and give it another try.

Why the Soviet attempt to stamp out religion failed | Giles Fraser: Loose canon

I don't have a problem with religion. I do however have a serious case of the ass for hypocrites. Sadly the two seem to go hand in hand more often than not.

So should we just lock them up in camps then?

Nope, just be aware that they rarely practice what they preach.

That's it?

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

 

[Natural Citizen]

But if there was a particular religion that was evil, let's say Christianity, wouldn't abolishing it be the moral thing to do?

I'm sorry, ding, I'm afraid you'll have to elevate discourse to my level of understanding of the subject if we're going to continue.

Ok, let's try this. The reason they stopped hanging witches is because they no longer believed that witches had magical powers and used them for evil. If they really did believe that then hanging them would have been the moral thing to do.

So if people really do feel that religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it.

How was that?

Alright, ding. Read this, The Spiritual is Supreme this, Fear of Government-over-Man this, Unalienable Rights--From God this, Man Organizes Governments to Be His Tools this, Limited Government this, Decentralized Government this, Equal, By God's Gift, In Sight of God and Law this, Life and the Pursuit of Happiness this, Liberty--Against Government-over-Man this, Private Property--Liberty's Support this, Taxes--Limited to Safeguard Liberty and this The Majority--Limited for Liberty

 

[Crepitus]

I don't have a problem with religion. I do however have a serious case of the ass for hypocrites. Sadly the two seem to go hand in hand more often than not.

So should we just lock them up in camps then?

Nope, just be aware that they rarely practice what they preach.

That's it?

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

Naw, not really. Why? Do you think it's a good idea?

 

[ding]

But if there was a particular religion that was evil, let's say Christianity, wouldn't abolishing it be the moral thing to do?

I'm sorry, ding, I'm afraid you'll have to elevate discourse to my level of understanding of the subject if we're going to continue.

Ok, let's try this. The reason they stopped hanging witches is because they no longer believed that witches had magical powers and used them for evil. If they really did believe that then hanging them would have been the moral thing to do.

So if people really do feel that religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it.

How was that?

Alright, ding. Read this, The Spiritual is Supreme this, Fear of Government-over-Man this, Unalienable Rights--From God this, Man Organizes Governments to Be His Tools this, Limited Government this, Decentralized Government this, Equal, By God's Gift, In Sight of God and Law this, Life and the Pursuit of Happiness this, Liberty--Against Government-over-Man this, Private Property--Liberty's Support this, Taxes--Limited to Safeguard Liberty and this The Majority--Limited for Liberty

So what? If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

 

[ding]

So should we just lock them up in camps then?

Nope, just be aware that they rarely practice what they preach.

That's it?

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

Naw, not really. Why? Do you think it's a good idea?

I keep asking you guys about it and you tell me nothing good has come from it only bad. If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

 

[BreezeWood]

There's quite a bit of opposition to religion here. I am just wondering how many of you people believe religion should be eliminated. It's been tried before and failed, but don't let that deter you in your quest.

Learn from their mistakes and give it another try.

Why the Soviet attempt to stamp out religion failed | Giles Fraser: Loose canon

Each time a civilization has tried to eliminate religion, it had to slaughter masses of its average folk to get and keep the atheism ball rolling. Sound good? Then French Revolution away! Just cross your fingers you're not one among the slaughtered masses.

.

Each time a civilization has tried to eliminate religion, it had to slaughter masses of its average folk to get and keep the atheism ball rolling.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Each time a civilization has tried to eliminate religion ...

- Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion:

it is disingenuous to deny the 1st Amendment does not eliminate religion from being a core component of governance for the people of the United States, unique for the time of its adoption.

and made so without - it had to slaughter masses of its average folk to get and keep the atheism ball rolling -

nor the French Revolution:

beginning in 1789. The Revolution overthrew the monarchy, established a republic, catalyzed violent periods of political turmoil, and finally culminated in a dictatorship under Napoleon who brought many of its principles to areas he conquered in Western Europe and beyond. Inspired by liberal and radical ideas, the Revolution profoundly altered the course of modern history, triggering the global decline of absolute monarchies while replacing them with republics and liberal democracies. Through the Revolutionary Wars, it unleashed a wave of global conflicts that extended from the Caribbean to the Middle East. Historians widely regard the Revolution as one of the most important events in human history ...

Just cross your fingers you're not one among the slaughtered masses.

that was in fact the reason for the french revolution in the first place .... church by monarchy

Not exactly true. I advocate for the religion of statism is to be eliminated every day in some way or another.

- the desert religions have always been a pariah against freedom and liberty. uninterrupted throughout the centuries.

 

[ding]

I guess either they don't really feel that way about religion or they are just really shy.

 

[Crepitus]

Nope, just be aware that they rarely practice what they preach.

That's it?

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

Naw, not really. Why? Do you think it's a good idea?

I keep asking you guys about it and you tell me nothing good has come from it only bad. If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

Naw, people are the root cause of evil in the world.

 

[ding]

That's it?

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

Naw, not really. Why? Do you think it's a good idea?

I keep asking you guys about it and you tell me nothing good has come from it only bad. If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

Naw, people are the root cause of evil in the world.

You mean it isn't because of religion?

 

[ding]

Hey... we got our first yes vote.

Finally someone who is willing to stand by his convictions.

 

[LittleNipper]

But if there was a particular religion that was evil, let's say Christianity, wouldn't abolishing it be the moral thing to do?

I'm sorry, ding, I'm afraid you'll have to elevate discourse to my level of understanding of the subject if we're going to continue.

Ok, let's try this. The reason they stopped hanging witches is because they no longer believed that witches had magical powers and used them for evil. If they really did believe that then hanging them would have been the moral thing to do.

So if people really do feel that religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it.

How was that?

Alright, ding. Read this, The Spiritual is Supreme this, Fear of Government-over-Man this, Unalienable Rights--From God this, Man Organizes Governments to Be His Tools this, Limited Government this, Decentralized Government this, Equal, By God's Gift, In Sight of God and Law this, Life and the Pursuit of Happiness this, Liberty--Against Government-over-Man this, Private Property--Liberty's Support this, Taxes--Limited to Safeguard Liberty and this The Majority--Limited for Liberty

So what? If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

And which evil will accomplish this feat?

 

[ding]

But if there was a particular religion that was evil, let's say Christianity, wouldn't abolishing it be the moral thing to do?

I'm sorry, ding, I'm afraid you'll have to elevate discourse to my level of understanding of the subject if we're going to continue.

Ok, let's try this. The reason they stopped hanging witches is because they no longer believed that witches had magical powers and used them for evil. If they really did believe that then hanging them would have been the moral thing to do.

So if people really do feel that religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it.

How was that?

Alright, ding. Read this, The Spiritual is Supreme this, Fear of Government-over-Man this, Unalienable Rights--From God this, Man Organizes Governments to Be His Tools this, Limited Government this, Decentralized Government this, Equal, By God's Gift, In Sight of God and Law this, Life and the Pursuit of Happiness this, Liberty--Against Government-over-Man this, Private Property--Liberty's Support this, Taxes--Limited to Safeguard Liberty and this The Majority--Limited for Liberty

So what? If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

And which evil will accomplish this feat?

In their minds it is religion that is evil. So they would be doing good.

 

[Crepitus]

That's it. If they didn't have god to bother they might start bugging me!

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

Naw, not really. Why? Do you think it's a good idea?

I keep asking you guys about it and you tell me nothing good has come from it only bad. If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

Naw, people are the root cause of evil in the world.

You mean it isn't because of religion?

Religion can do bad things yes, but only because people are gullible enough to believe that crap.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Alright. This threads a dud. Later...

 

[ding]

I wonder if the person voting yes would be so kind to reveal who he is?


I would like to shake the hand of the patriot who isn't afraid of standing up against tyranny.

 

[ding]

Are you sure you don't want to abolish religion and lock up all the religious people?

Don't you believe that would make the world a better place?

Naw, not really. Why? Do you think it's a good idea?

I keep asking you guys about it and you tell me nothing good has come from it only bad. If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

Naw, people are the root cause of evil in the world.

You mean it isn't because of religion?

Religion can do bad things yes, but only because people are gullible enough to believe that crap.

So if you cut out religion the people cannot be led astray, right?

 

[ding]

Alright. This threads a dud. Later...

Laterz

 

[skye]

I'm not an expert in religion at all...

but

I think.....why eliminate Religion and take away that little bit of faith that people have?

why

 

[well named]

I keep asking you guys about it and you tell me nothing good has come from it only bad. If religion is the root cause of evil in this world, then the moral thing would be to abolish it. Right?

I think your (implicit) argument here is poorly reasoned: in a nutshell you're ignoring the fact that there are costs and uncertainties associated with change in the real world. Someone can consistently believe both that religious institutions are a net negative in the world but also believe that it is not possible to abolish them without causing worse problems. It's basically the same kind of flaw that underpins certain kinds of utopianism.

Politics provides plenty of useful examples of this problem. I'm fairly sure that the world would be better off if no one took heroin recreationally. But I'm also fairly sure that the negative effects of the drug war in the US and criminalization of drug use has caused worse outcomes than other possible responses. Similarly, I think the world would be morally improved if various national governments were abolished, but I also think I have good reason to suspect that direct military intervention to destroy them would create situations worse than the status quo in those countries.

So the first point is that your logic only works if you assume that we have infinite power to shape the world to be the way we want it to be, with no cost. But that's not true. The second point is maybe more subtle but I think equally important: it's also coherent to have a point of view but recognize a lot of uncertainty around potential outcomes associated with attempts to change the world. There are limits to our power but also to our knowledge of the future, and both limits suggest that a certain kind of conservatism about social change is warranted, and is even consistent with a negative view of some phenomenon. That is the logic I'm using when I say I think we'd be better off if most religious institutions were dramatically different than they are, but that I do not think some means of changing them are good.