Should Iran Be Allowed To Have Nuclear Weapons?

[SaxonJackson]

Seems like some here are OK with Iran having nuclear weapons. So, I thought it would be interesting to see how many with a poll and how many are against. Pretty much every single country in the world (191 out of 195) has signed the nuclear weapons non proliferation treaty, including Iran.

If bad players like China, North Korea, Israel, Pakistan, India, and the USA (the only nation to have ever dropped them on innocent bystanders) can have them ... then Iran should be able to use them as leverage over people who use them as leverage against Iran.

 

[BS Filter]

So why do you expect any country to honor treaties when it's public knowledge that powerful self-interested states consider themselves unrestrained by international law?

Its like you coming to my house and telling to me abide by your understainding of the law else you'll attack me with impunity, irrespective of any law.

Some countries don't care about treaties or law. Right?

 

[Churchill]

The UN has no power over anyone.

That's very silly, for example it was because of a UN resolution that Iraq was attacked by a coalition in 1990.

 

[BS Filter]

If bad players like China, North Korea, Israel, Pakistan, India, and the USA (the only nation to have ever dropped them on innocent bystanders) can have them ... then Iran should be able to use them as leverage over people who use them as leverage against Iran.

Why is the USA a "bad player"?

 

[toomuchtime_]

So why do you expect any country to honor treaties when it's public knowledge that powerful self-interested states consider themselves unrestrained by international law?

Its like you coming to my house and telling to me abide by your understainding of the law else you'll attack me irrespective of any law.

Countries abide by treaties when the treaties serve their interests and withdraw or violate treaties that don't serve their interests.

 

[Churchill]

Countries abide by treaties when the treaties serve their interests and withdraw or violate treaties that don't serve their interests.

Breathtaking.

 

[BS Filter]

That's very silly, for example it was because of a UN resolution that Iraq was attacked in 1990.

The UN didn't attack Iraq, and the USA didn't get permission from the UN to attack Iraq.

 

[braalian]

You tell me, that's what I'masking - what is the process for deciding whether some country to be allowed to have nuclear weapons?

Is there any process even?

What sort of "process" are you looking for?

The nuclear powers that had existing nuclear arsenals are permitted to keep them. Those that did not are not permitted to develop them. That’s the "process".

The stated goal of the treaty is to prevent non-state actors or additional nations from obtaining weapons.

It’s pretty unambiguous

 

[Churchill]

The UN didn't attack Iraq, and the USA didn't get permission from the UN to attack Iraq.

Yes it did, it convened a secuirty concil meeting to vote on a resolution authorizing all nececsaery means be used to evict Iraq from Kuwait, see UNSC 678.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Breathtaking.

That is how it has always been. The UN is a treaty organization and because of rivalries between its most powerful members is nearly always ineffectual in conflicts.

 

[BS Filter]

Yes it did, it convened a secuirty concil meeting to vote on a resolution authorizing all nececsaery means be used to evict Iraq from Kuwait, see UNSC 678.

I understand that, but the US was going to attack Iraq regardless of what the UN said. The US doesn't need permission from the UN for anything.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

Seems like some here are OK with Iran having nuclear weapons. So, I thought it would be interesting to see how many with a poll and how many are against. Pretty much every single country in the world (191 out of 195) has signed the nuclear weapons non proliferation treaty, including Iran.

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I don't believe anyone should have nuclear weapons.

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[braalian]

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I don't believe anyone should have nuclear weapons.

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Ended the war with Japan pretty quick

 

[Churchill]

What sort of "process" are you looking for?

Well some orderly defined steps that we can take to decide the matter.

The nuclear powers that had existing nuclear arsenals are permitted to keep them. Those that did not are not permitted to develop them. That’s the "process".

Yes well look into the "not permitted" part of that. The NPT itself defines no penalties. The way it has previously worked is for the UNSC to decide on actions and that's why sanctions were imposed on Iran in 2015 for example. The UNSC sifted through evidence and reports and made a decision (UNSC 2231).

That's the process that's been established by precedent, so why does Israel get to decide to now try a different process and simply start bombing Iran? That is itself a violation of international law.

The stated goal of the treaty is to prevent non-state actors or additional nations from obtaining weapons.

Yes and the stated goal of UN membership is to uphold the charter and abide by it.

It’s pretty unambiguous

As is the UN charter.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

Ended the war with Japan pretty quick

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And if the world has ever had a conscience, that should have ended the question entirely, in perpetuity.

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[Churchill]

I understand that, but the US was going to attack Iraq regardless of what the UN said.

That's speculation, it needed support from the "cowards" like the UK.

The US doesn't need permission from the UN for anything.

Then why be a member of the UN?

 

[BS Filter]

That's speculation, it needed support from the "cowards" like the UK.

Then why be a member of the UN?

Exactly what most Americans say.

 

[Churchill]

Exactly what most Americans say.

Me too, don't join a club with rules if you don't like the rules, when is trump pulling the plug? I think trump is scared to leave the UN.

You do know (I doubt) that the US hasn't paid it's UN dues for years it is the worst payer of debts.

 

[toomuchtime_]

That's speculation, it needed support from the "cowards" like the UK.

Then why be a member of the UN?

Because when the US withdrew from world affairs after WW1 the Europeans started WW2.

 

[BS Filter]

Me too, don't join a club with rules if you don't like the rules, when is trump pulling the plug? I think trump is scared to leave the UN.

You do know (I doubt) that the US hasn't paid it's UN dues for years it is the worst payer of debts.

Do some research on dues. The US pays more to run the UN than anyone.