Sexless marriages thrust Japan to brink of demographic disaster

[-Cp]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/japan/story/0,7369,1451704,00.html#obvious

The sexless marriage is one of several reasons why experts fear Japan is on the verge of a demographic disaster.

 

[Annie]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/japan/story/0,7369,1451704,00.html#obvious

The sexless marriage is one of several reasons why experts fear Japan is on the verge of a demographic disaster.

Wow, that suks. Bad enough to be married, but no sex?

 

[-Cp]

Wow, that suks. Bad enough to be married, but no sex?

"..The problem is that their husbands lose interest in sex or don't want sex from the start. Many men think of their wives as substitute mothers, not as women with emotional and sexual needs...."

The 200 women a year who seek help at a clinic in the Tokyo suburbs have not had sex with their husbands in up to 20 years, and some never, according to Kim Myong-gan, who runs the clinic.

 

[Annie]

"..The problem is that their husbands lose interest in sex or don't want sex from the start. Many men think of their wives as substitute mothers, not as women with emotional and sexual needs...."

The 200 women a year who seek help at a clinic in the Tokyo suburbs have not had sex with their husbands in up to 20 years, and some never, according to Kim Myong-gan, who runs the clinic.

Forgive me for my bluntness. 20 years? Well at that point,

 

[freeandfun1]

I deal with Koreans a lot because of my business and Koreans are much like the Japanese. Korean men will tell you that they have two wives. The mother of their children and then their real wife. The one they have sex with.

Many marriages are still arranged. Not in the sense they were even just 20 years ago, but if the family does not approve of a girl, you cannot marry her. Therefore, men end up marrying women they feel would make good children, but other than that, they want no part of the relationship. I have seen this up close and personal as I have met many of my clients' mistresses while having never met their married wives in over 10 years of knowing them. In only very few cases have I actually met the women the men are married to. Also, I hate to admit it, but my own brother-in-law is much the same. The last time I was in Korea he told me hadn't had sex with his wife in over 15 years (his wife is my wife's sister). He told me, "don't worry though, I have a nice mistress I will introduce you to one day....". I have known him for nearly 20 years now and this was the first time he ever confirmed to me that he had a mistress although I have suspected it for many years.

 

[freeandfun1]

Kim Myong-gan

lol - that is a Korean name. She must be a Korean-Japanese. There are many of them.

 

[freeandfun1]

demographic disaster.

This is NOTHING new as this has been in practice for centuries. Why now is it a problem? (not mentally for the women mind you, but in terms of creating a "demographic disaster"?)

 

[Said1]

This is NOTHING new as this has been in practice for centuries. Why now is it a problem? (not mentally for the women mind you, but in terms of creating a "demographic disaster"?)

LOL. Even if Japan has a declining birth rate, the natural rate of increase propably does not equate anything close to disaster.

 

[Avatar4321]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/japan/story/0,7369,1451704,00.html#obvious

The sexless marriage is one of several reasons why experts fear Japan is on the verge of a demographic disaster.

wow sexless marriage. that would kind of destroy everything i believed in. I cant imagine.

 

[Nienna]

Many men think of their wives as substitute mothers, not as women with emotional and sexual needs."

I've seen a lot of this here in America!

What a strange way to deal with things. Have kids and a family with one woman, but no other sex, but lots of sex with another woman and no family. Seems like this would be a huge detriment to father-child bonding. Sex is a bonding experience. If you don't bond with the mother, doesn't it follow that you wouldn't bond with the children of her body? And wouldn't a man want to have children with the woman he is in a sexual/love relationship with? Of course, my not being a man, maybe they feel differently about this?

 

[Joz]

One of my children's teachers was from China. She married an Asian gentleman but was not her specific nationality & is forbidden to return to her home.

Her father was in government & a businessman. She remembers, as a child, sitting in the livingroom of her father's girlfriend's, while girlfriend & dad were in the bedroom.
The girlfriend worked in the business that dad owned & the mother had trained her. Mother raised the children and entertained or went with Dad when the dignitaries needed to be met.

 

[Nienna]

This seems like it is something like what you hear about in Saudi Arabia, minus the abuse. I don't know how I could deal if I knew I was nothing to my husband but a home manager/ baby factory (although sometimes I feel like that is what I am! : )

 

[Joz]

Many men think of their wives as substitute mothers, not as women with emotional and sexual needs."
I've seen a lot of this here in America!

This is always my argument in all these relationship threads. IF men treated women like they are suppose to, women would respond to men like they want.

 

[dmp]

This is always my argument in all these relationship threads. IF men treated women like they are suppose to, women would respond to men like they want.

it's a viscious circle...

If women treated men like they are supposed to, Men would respond to women like they want.

 

[Joz]

it's a viscious circle...

If women treated men like they are supposed to, Men would respond to women like they want.

I can't argue there. But someone has to be the one to "give in". What do you think a man would do, if he required sex, say 4 times a week, and he got it, 4 times a week? Think he wouldn't do whatever he could to please her?

 

[Nienna]

it's a viscious circle...

If women treated men like they are supposed to, Men would respond to women like they want.

I think it is both women and men. I have seen women emotionally neuter men, or just get all passive aggressive and "fine," and expect men to understand them when the man has no clue. It's not fair. Women are, generally speaking, more tuned in to relationships, so they (IMO) have more of a responsibility to be patient, explain things, etc.

However, women are much more likely to want to work on a relationship; whereas, men want to bury their heads and pretend like nothing is wrong, or that it is all the woman's problem.

It's both genders.

 

[dmp]

I can't argue there. But someone has to be the one to "give in". What do you think a man would do, if he required sex, say 4 times a week, and he got it, 4 times a week? Think he wouldn't do whatever he could to please her?

So...you may not know it but you are describing me ...and I do whatever I can (and she lets me) do to please her...thing is...that usually isn't in the bedroom....it's more like 'Dishes..vacuuming...getting down boxes from up high...taking her shopping for saws and sanders and stuff, etc.

(sigh)

 

[Nienna]

So...you may not know it but you are describing me ...and I do whatever I can (and she lets me) do to please her...thing is...that usually isn't in the bedroom....it's more like 'Dishes..vacuuming...getting down boxes from up high...taking her shopping for saws and sanders and stuff, etc.

(sigh)

sex begins in the kitchen... or, er-- the woodshop!

 

[dilloduck]

Many men think of their wives as substitute mothers, not as women with emotional and sexual needs."

I've seen a lot of this here in America!

What a strange way to deal with things. Have kids and a family with one woman, but no other sex, but lots of sex with another woman and no family. Seems like this would be a huge detriment to father-child bonding. Sex is a bonding experience. If you don't bond with the mother, doesn't it follow that you wouldn't bond with the children of her body? And wouldn't a man want to have children with the woman he is in a sexual/love relationship with? Of course, my not being a man, maybe they feel differently about this?

VERY generally speaking, it appears that there are two types of men. One that has his main goal as "settling down" and having a family and another that is primarily interested in continuing to seek sexual gratification where ever he can. Anthropology 101 told me that it was mens' natural urge to sow as many wild oats wherever he could with the hopes that his efforts would ensure the survival of the species. Women on the other hand were to attract the strongest and best provider for their children so that she could ensure the safety and culturization of the offspring.
Marriage, however, does not fit this apparently natural tendency and with differing sexual appetites conflicts arise. If both spouses feel that the ultimate purpose of marriage is too have sex anytime you want it, one will ultimately "have" to have sex when they don't really want to for this fantasy to play out.
Of all the ways there are to break ones marriage vows, infidelity appears to be seen as most grievous. Both sexes excuses usually fall into the general category of " but my needs were not being met ". This to me would point to either an inabilty to take care of ones own needs when the spouse was not willing/able OR some undocumented wedding vows or expectations that have never been agreed upon or even discussed that include " When I need something, it's YOUR responsibilty to provide it".
Some may even see everything as ones' own responsiblty to provide for their own needs but attempt to do that vicariously by manipulating the spouse to do it for them. If this fails, it becomes apparent that some one is to blame here !
I think it would serve relationships better if they were seen as opportunities to share in care taking duties and realizing that marriage DOES NOT guarantee eternal satisfaction. Some times ya just do without.

 

[Nienna]

But what about the father-child bond? Does being in a non-sexual relationship with the child's mother, while being in a sexual relationship with another woman affect the feelings a father has toward his child? From a man's point of view?