Separation of Church and State?

[nibor]

your tinfoil hat's too tight.

Your anchor rope slipped.................

 

[Shogun]

No he wasn't, your point being?

my point being that HE is the one we believe to be the first to establish a unified legal code, NOT THE JEWS, and was given them by.......



....... his god.

 

[Shogun]

Jillian where in any of that exquist world history does it proclaim that we have to submit and surrender ourselves BY LAW to Jewish version of God's vision????

dude.. what is your fucking problem? I give israel no quarter myself but im pretty fucking glad we criminalize murder despite the same being found in the jewish ten commandments. Is there somethign specific you are going for here?

 

[Glimmer Twins]

You can say that all you want but there is 200 years of Supreme Court case law to show you're wrong.

I thought we were discussing "original intent."

 

[Glimmer Twins]

... our founding fathers were Christian...

Most of them were liberal Protestants who believed "the civil magistrate hath no authority over purely sacred things." That's why they gave the U. S. Government no jurisdiction whatsoever over religion when they made the Constitution, thus building a wall of separation between religion and civil authority, in compliance with the divine civil government directive not to render unto Caesar what rightly belongs to God.

 

[jillian]

Most of them were liberal Protestants who believed "the civil magistrate hath no authority over purely sacred things." That's why they gave the U. S. Government no jurisdiction whatsoever over religion when they made the Constitution, thus building a wall of separation between religion and civil authority, in compliance with the divine civil government directive not to render unto Caesar what rightly belongs to God.

Well, they were mostly deists. But they certainly didn't require government to pretend religion didn't exist. It just couldn't be part of government or government part of religion.

Such a view of American history is completely contrary to known facts. The primary leaders of the so-called founding fathers of our nation were not Bible-believing Christians; they were deists. Deism was a philosophical belief that was widely accepted by the colonial intelligentsia at the time of the American Revolution. Its major tenets included belief in human reason as a reliable means of solving social and political problems and belief in a supreme deity who created the universe to operate solely by natural laws. The supreme God of the Deists removed himself entirely from the universe after creating it. They believed that he assumed no control over it, exerted no influence on natural phenomena, and gave no supernatural revelation to man. A necessary consequence of these beliefs was a rejection of many doctrines central to the Christian religion. Deists did not believe in the virgin birth, divinity, or resurrection of Jesus, the efficacy of prayer, the miracles of the Bible, or even the divine inspiration of the Bible.

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/farrell_till/myth.html

 

[Glimmer Twins]

Well, they were mostly deists. But they certainly didn't require government to pretend religion didn't exist. It just couldn't be part of government or government part of religion.

All I know is that the lawmakers granted the government no jurisdiction whatsoever over religion, and Madison said it meant the government didn't have "a shadow of a right" to get involved in religion.

 

[Glimmer Twins]

The Constitution grants Congress no authority to:

1) ask the President to issue religious recommendations to the people

2) make a law imposing the duty to financially support Congressional Chaplains

3) make a law declaring the people's trust in God on the nation's coins​

 

[Steerpike]

I thought we were discussing "original intent."

Ah. Well that could be the source of our disagree - I'm talking about the current state of the law, not the original intent.

 

[Steerpike]

Well, they were mostly deists. But they certainly didn't require government to pretend religion didn't exist. It just couldn't be part of government or government part of religion.

At least at the federal level. The Bill of Rights didn't bind the States initially.