Scientists Discover a Self-Replicating Protein Structure, And It Could Have Built The First Life on

[ReinyDays]

I have no idea.

Do you pretend that you know the one, correct answer?

My opinion? ... I certainly know what my opinion is in the matter ... and I'm asking for your opinion ...

What is life? ...

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

My opinion? ... I certainly know what my opinion is in the matter ... and I'm asking for your opinion ...

What is life? ...

I really don't know. Depends on the context, I suppose. I'm not saying the conventional definitions don't work. We're just parsing those.

If parts of it repirate, parts of it move, parts of it replicate...is it life?

Is the universe alive?

 

[scruffy]

Maybe try using google, dummy.

Since when is Google the arbiter of truth?

 

[ding]

Since when is Google the arbiter of truth?

Logic is. Like I said in the other thread... The reason the seven characteristics of living things aren't arbitrary is that each characteristic has been observed in things that were alive whereas they have never been observed in inanimate objects.

 

[scruffy]

Logic is. Like I said in the other thread... The reason the seven characteristics of living things aren't arbitrary is that each characteristic has been observed in things that were alive whereas they have never been observed in inanimate objects.

Looks to me like you need to expand your definition of "observed".

Consider for example Schrodinger's cat. Which is bothe alive and dead. Until it's "observed". lol

The main problem here, is you insist on restricting your definition of life to things you can see. You're at the macroscopic level, whereas I'm talking about stuff that's not even as big as a photon.

Stuff that small, is hard to "observe". Because any measurement (any observation) destroys the state.

But scientists have come up with ways of observing things at this scale - not directly, but indirectly. For instance we can observe "ensembles" without changing the states of their components (or only so few of them that it makes no difference to the ensemble).

In the vernacular this form of observation is called "weak" measurement.

Weak measurement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[ding]

Looks to me like you need to expand your definition of "observed".

Consider for example Schrodinger's cat. Which is bothe alive and dead. Until it's "observed". lol

The main problem here, is you insist on restricting your definition of life to things you can see. You're at the macroscopic level, whereas I'm talking about stuff that's not even as big as a photon.

Stuff that small, is hard to "observe". Because any measurement (any observation) destroys the state.

But scientists have come up with ways of observing things at this scale - not directly, but indirectly. For instance we can observe "ensembles" without changing the states of their components (or only so few of them that it makes no difference to the ensemble).

In the vernacular this form of observation is called "weak" measurement.

Weak measurement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

No. I'm good with defining living things as things that respire, grow, excrete, reproduce, metabolize, move, and be responsive to the environment.

Eighteen distinctive characteristics of life

A practical approach in the inquiry of life is to contrast living beings with nonliving ones from different perspectives and extract the distinctive features of living beings. We can identify features and mechanisms that truthfully account for the differences ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

No. I'm good with defining living things as things that respire, grow, excrete, reproduce, metabolize, move, and be responsive to the environment.

Eighteen distinctive characteristics of life

A practical approach in the inquiry of life is to contrast living beings with nonliving ones from different perspectives and extract the distinctive features of living beings. We can identify features and mechanisms that truthfully account for the differences ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And there isn't much problem with that. That will work just fine, for a working biologist. I don't think anyone disputes that.

 

[ding]

And there isn't much problem with that. That will work just fine, for a working biologist. I don't think anyone disputes that.

You have been. But then again, you believe you can make a valid logical argument for the moon being made of cheese.

 

[abu afak]

Seems to me a critical component of living things and evolution is the ability to reproduce and pass down genetic information. So I would be very interested to understand how pre-life cell components which supposedly evolved, reproduced and passed down genetic information so that evolution could occur.

Already posted with you in it.
As I said, I covered the Pillars.

But the official THEORY and FACT of Evolution start AFTER the first Life, not before it.
\
`

 

[ding]

Already posted with you in it.
As I said, I covered the Pillars.

But the official THEORY and FACT of Evolution start AFTER the first Life, not before it.
\
`

I covered her too.

 

[ding]

But the official THEORY and FACT of Evolution start AFTER the first Life, not before it.

Tell that to alang1216

 

[scruffy]

Already posted with you in it.
As I said, I covered the Pillars.

But the official THEORY and FACT of Evolution start AFTER the first Life, not before it.
\
`

You'll never convince the hardheads of that simple concept though.

What's interesting is they think they can define life, and they can't.

 

[westwall]

Logic is. Like I said in the other thread... The reason the seven characteristics of living things aren't arbitrary is that each characteristic has been observed in things that were alive whereas they have never been observed in inanimate objects.

Computer viruses, the very best ones, imitate life. They replicate, mutate to hide from anti virus programs etc. They meet all of the requirements for the definition of life. Yet are not organic.

 

[ding]

Computer viruses, the very best ones, imitate life. They replicate, mutate to hide from anti virus programs etc. They meet all of the requirements for the definition of life. Yet are not organic.

So can't respire and excrete.

 

[westwall]

So can't respire and excrete.

Unless you consider the mutation, and loss of the bits of code no longer deemed necessary as a form of excretion.

The consumption of electricity is a form of respiration.

 

[ding]

Unless you consider the mutation, and loss of the bits of code no longer deemed necessary as a form of excretion.

The consumption of electricity is a form of respiration.

Seems like a stretch to me.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

No, we don't have all the answers, but we're still looking.
We'll never have all the answers as they just generate new questions.

Scientists Discover a Self-Replicating Protein Structure, And It Could Have Built The First Life on Earth
Mike McRae - 4 Mar 2018 - sciencealert.com
Scientists Discover a Self-Replicating Protein Structure, And It Could Have Built The First Life on Earth

Roughly 4 billion years ago an assortment of complex organic compounds went from being mere carbon soup to replicating biochemistry – the first steps to life on Earth.​

​

The order of these steps has been a source of debate for decades. Now, a recent discovery about a common protein structure could help tip the balance, bringing us closer to understanding just how we came to be here.​

​

Researchers from Eidgenössische Technische Hochschule (ETH) in Zürich have demonstrated that short strands of amyloid protein structures can direct the selection of amino acids to build even more amyloids.​

​

If the word amyloid doesn't sound familiar, they're a protein structure that's increasingly being found all over the place in nature.​

[.....]​

`

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

Here's his questions factored out (prepositioned) of the video, I'm not a chemist, perhaps someone here is:

Polypeptides



Polynucleotides



Polysacharides



Specified Information



Assembly

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Here's his questions factored out (prepositioned) of the video, I'm not a chemist, perhaps someone here is:

Polypeptides



Polynucleotides



Polysacharides



Specified Information



Assembly

What do you think you are accomplishing, by posting these intellectually deviant opinion videos?

The speaker can publish his science or stfu.

Them's the rules.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

What do you think you are accomplishing, by posting these intellectually deviant opinion videos?

The speaker can publish his science or stfu.

Them's the rules.

Hmm, seems I might have struck a nerve here, I was replying to the OP's ridiculously optimistic claims about abiogenesis, that this upsets you is of no concern to me, I'll let the late Bob Widlar present my response to your whining: