Scientific evidence for a creator.

[Fort Fun Indiana]

There are over 6,000 genetic disorders, many of which are fatal or severely debilitating. How does evolution account for this?

It doesn't have to do so. We discover new genetic disorders because we are getting better at discovering genetic disorders.

 

[rightwinger]

Still looking for scientific evidence if a creator

 

[rightwinger]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

 

[emilynghiem]

Each cell in our bodies contains thousands of gene regulatory networks. These networks are responsible the regulation of gene expression, among other things, required for life to exist. They are all part of a meta network in which they pass information to where it is needed. They use logical operators, as well as databases to perform their functions. This network is so complex that scientists have barely scratched the surface in understanding them. If any part of this vast Network was missing or damaged, the cell would not operate as it should, causing disease or even death. There is no scientific explanation as to how or why this network exists. It is impossible for evolution to be the answer since every component must be in place at the same instant in order to function. You cannot have a partial network. The only way it could possibly exist is if it was created all at the same time. Prove me wrong.

Dear Magnificat
This doesn't rule out the model that the Universe was always self-existent, and has always been in place. And changes developed within the structure and laws already existing.

God can either be interpreted to be a SOURCE or a CREATOR of all things.

Or God can be equated with the entire UNIVERSE or CREATION including the laws within it, where it is impersonal and all encompassing, self-existent and self-defining.

Either way, the concept of God's laws/truth or
UNIVERSAL laws/truth collective remain the same under
BOTH constructs or models of looking at the world.

This does NOT require believing in a PERSONIFIED being,
entity or source like an "author or creator of life".

God can be LIFE itself, or NATURE, if taken to be self-existent
and eternal, with no beginning or no end, just BEING.

 

[rightwinger]

Each cell in our bodies contains thousands of gene regulatory networks. These networks are responsible the regulation of gene expression, among other things, required for life to exist. They are all part of a meta network in which they pass information to where it is needed. They use logical operators, as well as databases to perform their functions. This network is so complex that scientists have barely scratched the surface in understanding them. If any part of this vast Network was missing or damaged, the cell would not operate as it should, causing disease or even death. There is no scientific explanation as to how or why this network exists. It is impossible for evolution to be the answer since every component must be in place at the same instant in order to function. You cannot have a partial network. The only way it could possibly exist is if it was created all at the same time. Prove me wrong.

Dear Magnificat
This doesn't rule out the model that the Universe was always self-existent, and has always been in place. And changes developed within the structure and laws already existing.

God can either be interpreted to be a SOURCE or a CREATOR of all things.

Or God can be equated with the entire UNIVERSE or CREATION including the laws within it, where it is impersonal and all encompassing, self-existent and self-defining.

Either way, the concept of God's laws/truth or
UNIVERSAL laws/truth collective remain the same under
BOTH constructs or models of looking at the world.

This does NOT require believing in a PERSONIFIED being,
entity or source like an "author or creator of life".

God can be LIFE itself, or NATURE, if taken to be self-existent
and eternal, with no beginning or no end, just BEING.

God makes people feel good

He has all the answers whether they are true or not

 

[emilynghiem]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

rightwinger
"God" is a term used like a VARIABLE
for certain VALUES or meanings.

Because this meaning can change with context,
it causes conflicts when we don't agree on the
MEANING or CONTEXT we are assigning to the
term "God"

example:
God meaning Universal Truth or Wisdom or Collective knowledge
God meaning Love
God's will meaning Good will or Greater Good for Humanity
God's laws meaning Universal Laws, or forces of Life or Nature
God as life, nature, creation, universe or SOURCE of these
Kingdom of God meaning spiritual peace, peace on earth,
humanity living in peace and harmony

Jesus also had different meanings in different contexts
Yeshua as Salvation
Ishua as Joy
Jesus as Divine Justice
Christ Jesus as Restorative Justice
Christian as Conscionable (unchristian as unconscionable or unjust)
Christianity as Charity for all
Jesus as Lord meaning Equal Justice Under Law for All
Jesus and Mary meaning Justice with Mercy
Jesus and the Holy spirit meaning Justice and Peace

rightwinger calling God a theory
is like recognizing universal laws and collective knowledge are a theory,
because we don't know all the laws in the universe, but imagine
they are out there and exist even if we haven't defined them yet.

Proving God exists is like proving Love exists,
it depends what we agree TRUE Love is
vs what is imagined or idolatry or false and not real love.

Faith in JESUS as mythical is like
saying faith in JUSTICE is unsubstantiated and never proven to exist.
Yet we all have some innate sense or belief
there is, should be, or will be Justice in the world.
This remains faith based, and not seen, never yet established
where all people AGREE, yet we either believe or want to believe,
and we ask and petition for this Justice to be recognized
and enforced through laws. So that is like asking and praying
for the sake of Justice for wrongs to be corrected and made right.
Same as praying for Jesus to come and be received by all humanity
to bring all people together in peace and restore good will
and good faith relations, based on Universal Truth Justice and Peace for all. this is what it means in Christianity to bring the message of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit to all people of all nations. It means establishing Universal Justice (by forgiving and correcting all wrongs
and injustices in the spirit of Restorative Justice or "Christ Jesus")
in order to achieve lasting peace for all humanity and society globally.

If we have faith in this, that is what it means to have faith
in Christ Jesus saving all humanity from the cycle of suffering
death and destruction by "retributive justice" (or antichrist)
by replacing that with "Restorative Justice" to transform ourselves,
our relations, institutions and nations, and make all things new,
perfect and whole again, as humanity was designed from the start.

 

[emilynghiem]

Each cell in our bodies contains thousands of gene regulatory networks. These networks are responsible the regulation of gene expression, among other things, required for life to exist. They are all part of a meta network in which they pass information to where it is needed. They use logical operators, as well as databases to perform their functions. This network is so complex that scientists have barely scratched the surface in understanding them. If any part of this vast Network was missing or damaged, the cell would not operate as it should, causing disease or even death. There is no scientific explanation as to how or why this network exists. It is impossible for evolution to be the answer since every component must be in place at the same instant in order to function. You cannot have a partial network. The only way it could possibly exist is if it was created all at the same time. Prove me wrong.

Dear Magnificat
This doesn't rule out the model that the Universe was always self-existent, and has always been in place. And changes developed within the structure and laws already existing.

God can either be interpreted to be a SOURCE or a CREATOR of all things.

Or God can be equated with the entire UNIVERSE or CREATION including the laws within it, where it is impersonal and all encompassing, self-existent and self-defining.

Either way, the concept of God's laws/truth or
UNIVERSAL laws/truth collective remain the same under
BOTH constructs or models of looking at the world.

This does NOT require believing in a PERSONIFIED being,
entity or source like an "author or creator of life".

God can be LIFE itself, or NATURE, if taken to be self-existent
and eternal, with no beginning or no end, just BEING.

God makes people feel good

He has all the answers whether they are true or not

Dear rightwinger
that doesn't last unless the answers are truly
consistent with eternal universal truth.

See previous post about the DIFFERENCE between
TRUE eternal love and man's love that is conditional and like idolatry.

Same with Universal Truth and Justice that
compels ALL PEOPLE to unite and live by
vs. local or relative justice that is only for some.
That isn't going to last or unite ALL PEOPLE.
Not unless it is truly UNIVERSAL.

God's will by definition is the ultimate greatest good for
all humanity collectively. So everyone will want and agree on that.
Anything less is local interest biased toward one group more than another,
so again, that won't last and won't unite people across ALL groups, tribes and nations.

Only UNIVERSAL TRUTH and laws have that authority
over ALL people of ALL beliefs (religious or political) and nations.

Anything less is a LOCAL or relative religion or law
and won't serve as compelling authority to all people.

 

[rightwinger]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

rightwinger
"God" is a term used like a VARIABLE
for certain VALUES or meanings.

Because this meaning can change with context,
it causes conflicts when we don't agree on the
MEANING or CONTEXT we are assigning to the
term "God"

example:
God meaning Universal Truth or Wisdom or Collective knowledge
God meaning Love
God's will meaning Good will or Greater Good for Humanity
God's laws meaning Universal Laws, or forces of Life or Nature
God as life, nature, creation, universe or SOURCE of these
Kingdom of God meaning spiritual peace, peace on earth,
humanity living in peace and harmony

Jesus also had different meanings in different contexts
Yeshua as Salvation
Ishua as Joy
Jesus as Divine Justice
Christ Jesus as Restorative Justice
Christian as Conscionable (unchristian as unconscionable or unjust)
Christianity as Charity for all
Jesus as Lord meaning Equal Justice Under Law for All
Jesus and Mary meaning Justice with Mercy
Jesus and the Holy spirit meaning Justice and Peace

rightwinger calling God a theory
is like recognizing universal laws and collective knowledge are a theory,
because we don't know all the laws in the universe, but imagine
they are out there and exist even if we haven't defined them yet.

Proving God exists is like proving Love exists,
it depends what we agree TRUE Love is
vs what is imagined or idolatry or false and not real love.

Faith in JESUS as mythical is like
saying faith in JUSTICE is unsubstantiated and never proven to exist.
Yet we all have some innate sense or belief
there is, should be, or will be Justice in the world.
This remains faith based, and not seen, never yet established
where all people AGREE, yet we either believe or want to believe,
and we ask and petition for this Justice to be recognized
and enforced through laws. So that is like asking and praying
for the sake of Justice for wrongs to be corrected and made right.
Same as praying for Jesus to come and be received by all humanity
to bring all people together in peace and restore good will
and good faith relations, based on Universal Truth Justice and Peace for all. this is what it means in Christianity to bring the message of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit to all people of all nations. It means establishing Universal Justice (by forgiving and correcting all wrongs
and injustices in the spirit of Restorative Justice or "Christ Jesus")
in order to achieve lasting peace for all humanity and society globally.

If we have faith in this, that is what it means to have faith
in Christ Jesus saving all humanity from the cycle of suffering
death and destruction by "retributive justice" (or antichrist)
by replacing that with "Restorative Justice" to transform ourselves,
our relations, institutions and nations, and make all things new,
perfect and whole again, as humanity was designed from the start.

God is a simple concept to explain things we fear

 

[emilynghiem]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

rightwinger
"God" is a term used like a VARIABLE
for certain VALUES or meanings.

Because this meaning can change with context,
it causes conflicts when we don't agree on the
MEANING or CONTEXT we are assigning to the
term "God"

example:
God meaning Universal Truth or Wisdom or Collective knowledge
God meaning Love
God's will meaning Good will or Greater Good for Humanity
God's laws meaning Universal Laws, or forces of Life or Nature
God as life, nature, creation, universe or SOURCE of these
Kingdom of God meaning spiritual peace, peace on earth,
humanity living in peace and harmony

Jesus also had different meanings in different contexts
Yeshua as Salvation
Ishua as Joy
Jesus as Divine Justice
Christ Jesus as Restorative Justice
Christian as Conscionable (unchristian as unconscionable or unjust)
Christianity as Charity for all
Jesus as Lord meaning Equal Justice Under Law for All
Jesus and Mary meaning Justice with Mercy
Jesus and the Holy spirit meaning Justice and Peace

rightwinger calling God a theory
is like recognizing universal laws and collective knowledge are a theory,
because we don't know all the laws in the universe, but imagine
they are out there and exist even if we haven't defined them yet.

Proving God exists is like proving Love exists,
it depends what we agree TRUE Love is
vs what is imagined or idolatry or false and not real love.

Faith in JESUS as mythical is like
saying faith in JUSTICE is unsubstantiated and never proven to exist.
Yet we all have some innate sense or belief
there is, should be, or will be Justice in the world.
This remains faith based, and not seen, never yet established
where all people AGREE, yet we either believe or want to believe,
and we ask and petition for this Justice to be recognized
and enforced through laws. So that is like asking and praying
for the sake of Justice for wrongs to be corrected and made right.
Same as praying for Jesus to come and be received by all humanity
to bring all people together in peace and restore good will
and good faith relations, based on Universal Truth Justice and Peace for all. this is what it means in Christianity to bring the message of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit to all people of all nations. It means establishing Universal Justice (by forgiving and correcting all wrongs
and injustices in the spirit of Restorative Justice or "Christ Jesus")
in order to achieve lasting peace for all humanity and society globally.

If we have faith in this, that is what it means to have faith
in Christ Jesus saving all humanity from the cycle of suffering
death and destruction by "retributive justice" (or antichrist)
by replacing that with "Restorative Justice" to transform ourselves,
our relations, institutions and nations, and make all things new,
perfect and whole again, as humanity was designed from the start.

God is a simple concept to explain things we fear

Dear rightwinger
why are you insisting on defining God to be something so limited?

For people who equate God with LOVE
is "LOVE" a concept made up to explain something FEARED.
Isn't it a term for UNIVERSAL LOVE that is so powerful
it moves and changes things in greater positive ways than
we can imagine or control ourselves.

That's not about "fear" but about "something GREATER
than ourselves, our knowledge or our control.

Why would you insist on equating "God" with something negative
while other people use it mean something Positive.

Why not clarify the difference by calling it a
a FALSE God if is based on ignorance or fear.
Christians use the term SATAN to mean
destroying or corrupting something by ill will,
fear or other competing NEGATIVE influence
that is OPPOSED to what God means as something POSITIVE.

If we are going to communicate effectively rightwinger
shouldn't we agree on terminology and what is
MEANT by "God."

How can we use the same variable to mean
two opposite values? No wonder we reject
and confuse each other.

Wouldn't the first step to be agree on terms?

So if you don't agree what God means, let's
stick to just the VALUES and SPECIFY what is meant.

I listed the positive meanings attributed to the term "God."

What do you call the NEGATIVE definition.
Do you call it "fear based superstition"

What terms do you use to describe this
ATTRIBUTE or concept?

I suggest assigning a different name so it is
not confused with the positive meanings of "God."
That's just confusing and would be
impossible to communicate effectively
by using terms to mean "two totally separate opposing things."

If you did that in math or science, you'd never establish
or prove anything because all your calculations would
be inconsistent using variables different ways within the same equations.

No wonder we can't communicate!

 

[ding]

Still waiting for someone to prove me wrong. Perhaps you could begin by providing one of the many gene regulatory networks we could live without. If you could do this, you might be on the right track to proving me wrong.

Creation theory can’t explain

But Genesis does. If you don’t read it literally. It was never intended to be read literally and the original meaning has been lost through times.

Then Genesis = Evolution

Pretty much. According to chapter 1 & 2 God created existence and man is a product of that creation.

 

[ding]

Still looking for scientific evidence if a creator

It’s all around you and in you.

There are only two possibilities; Spirit created the material world or the material world arose through natural processes.

I doubt you have ever seriously considered both possibilities.

 

[ding]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

That’s not entirely true.

There is indirect evidence for God. But the best evidence is found by entering into a relationship with the creator.

 

[rightwinger]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

rightwinger
"God" is a term used like a VARIABLE
for certain VALUES or meanings.

Because this meaning can change with context,
it causes conflicts when we don't agree on the
MEANING or CONTEXT we are assigning to the
term "God"

example:
God meaning Universal Truth or Wisdom or Collective knowledge
God meaning Love
God's will meaning Good will or Greater Good for Humanity
God's laws meaning Universal Laws, or forces of Life or Nature
God as life, nature, creation, universe or SOURCE of these
Kingdom of God meaning spiritual peace, peace on earth,
humanity living in peace and harmony

Jesus also had different meanings in different contexts
Yeshua as Salvation
Ishua as Joy
Jesus as Divine Justice
Christ Jesus as Restorative Justice
Christian as Conscionable (unchristian as unconscionable or unjust)
Christianity as Charity for all
Jesus as Lord meaning Equal Justice Under Law for All
Jesus and Mary meaning Justice with Mercy
Jesus and the Holy spirit meaning Justice and Peace

rightwinger calling God a theory
is like recognizing universal laws and collective knowledge are a theory,
because we don't know all the laws in the universe, but imagine
they are out there and exist even if we haven't defined them yet.

Proving God exists is like proving Love exists,
it depends what we agree TRUE Love is
vs what is imagined or idolatry or false and not real love.

Faith in JESUS as mythical is like
saying faith in JUSTICE is unsubstantiated and never proven to exist.
Yet we all have some innate sense or belief
there is, should be, or will be Justice in the world.
This remains faith based, and not seen, never yet established
where all people AGREE, yet we either believe or want to believe,
and we ask and petition for this Justice to be recognized
and enforced through laws. So that is like asking and praying
for the sake of Justice for wrongs to be corrected and made right.
Same as praying for Jesus to come and be received by all humanity
to bring all people together in peace and restore good will
and good faith relations, based on Universal Truth Justice and Peace for all. this is what it means in Christianity to bring the message of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit to all people of all nations. It means establishing Universal Justice (by forgiving and correcting all wrongs
and injustices in the spirit of Restorative Justice or "Christ Jesus")
in order to achieve lasting peace for all humanity and society globally.

If we have faith in this, that is what it means to have faith
in Christ Jesus saving all humanity from the cycle of suffering
death and destruction by "retributive justice" (or antichrist)
by replacing that with "Restorative Justice" to transform ourselves,
our relations, institutions and nations, and make all things new,
perfect and whole again, as humanity was designed from the start.

God is a simple concept to explain things we fear

Dear rightwinger
why are you insisting on defining God to be something so limited?

For people who equate God with LOVE
is "LOVE" a concept made up to explain something FEARED.
Isn't it a term for UNIVERSAL LOVE that is so powerful
it moves and changes things in greater positive ways than
we can imagine or control ourselves.

That's not about "fear" but about "something GREATER
than ourselves, our knowledge or our control.

Why would you insist on equating "God" with something negative
while other people use it mean something Positive.

Why not clarify the difference by calling it a
a FALSE God if is based on ignorance or fear.
Christians use the term SATAN to mean
destroying or corrupting something by ill will,
fear or other competing NEGATIVE influence
that is OPPOSED to what God means as something POSITIVE.

If we are going to communicate effectively rightwinger
shouldn't we agree on terminology and what is
MEANT by "God."

How can we use the same variable to mean
two opposite values? No wonder we reject
and confuse each other.

Wouldn't the first step to be agree on terms?

So if you don't agree what God means, let's
stick to just the VALUES and SPECIFY what is meant.

I listed the positive meanings attributed to the term "God."

What do you call the NEGATIVE definition.
Do you call it "fear based superstition"

What terms do you use to describe this
ATTRIBUTE or concept?

I suggest assigning a different name so it is
not confused with the positive meanings of "God."
That's just confusing and would be
impossible to communicate effectively
by using terms to mean "two totally separate opposing things."

If you did that in math or science, you'd never establish
or prove anything because all your calculations would
be inconsistent using variables different ways within the same equations.

No wonder we can't communicate!

It is you who is pushing the concept of love as coming from God

Those who do not believe in God still love

 

[rightwinger]

God is a theory

A theory with no scientific proof

That’s not entirely true.

There is indirect evidence for God. But the best evidence is found by entering into a relationship with the creator.

Fails as scientific proof
Opinion is not proof

 

[rightwinger]

Still waiting for the OP to provide Scientific Proof of a creator

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Each cell in our bodies contains thousands of gene regulatory networks. These networks are responsible the regulation of gene expression, among other things, required for life to exist. They are all part of a meta network in which they pass information to where it is needed. They use logical operators, as well as databases to perform their functions. This network is so complex that scientists have barely scratched the surface in understanding them. If any part of this vast Network was missing or damaged, the cell would not operate as it should, causing disease or even death. There is no scientific explanation as to how or why this network exists. It is impossible for evolution to be the answer since every component must be in place at the same instant in order to function. You cannot have a partial network. The only way it could possibly exist is if it was created all at the same time. Prove me wrong.

This fails as an appeal to ignorance fallacy.

That a question has yet to be resolved through science and research doesn’t mean ‘god’ is the answer.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Still waiting for someone to prove me wrong. Perhaps you could begin by providing one of the many gene regulatory networks we could live without. If you could do this, you might be on the right track to proving me wrong.

Your premise is proven wrong the consequence of its sophistry.

 

[Magnificat]

Each cell in our bodies contains thousands of gene regulatory networks. These networks are responsible the regulation of gene expression, among other things, required for life to exist. They are all part of a meta network in which they pass information to where it is needed. They use logical operators, as well as databases to perform their functions. This network is so complex that scientists have barely scratched the surface in understanding them. If any part of this vast Network was missing or damaged, the cell would not operate as it should, causing disease or even death. There is no scientific explanation as to how or why this network exists. It is impossible for evolution to be the answer since every component must be in place at the same instant in order to function. You cannot have a partial network. The only way it could possibly exist is if it was created all at the same time. Prove me wrong.

This is just a reiteration of the old canard, the specious, worthless argument to "irreducible complexity".

Lol! Specious? Can a car run without an engine? Nice try. I'll give a participation award for that one. Lolololol

 

[WinterBorn]

Still waiting for someone to prove me wrong. Perhaps you could begin by providing one of the many gene regulatory networks we could live without. If you could do this, you might be on the right track to proving me wrong.

There are organisms with very simple systems. Ours are much more complex, but that does not mean all life forms are so complex.

 

[Magnificat]

In order to prove me wrong, you would have to explain how such a network could evolve.

Or just look up the explanation yourself.

There isn't one.