Right-Wing Extremism: The Real Referendum of 2012

[bigrebnc1775]

It was a typo, obviously. It should have read "every single." Meaning every one. Meaning all of them.

They have absolutely done good. Or would you prefer they die and decrease the surplus population?

Are you employed by Soros?

He's a blogger for soros.

 

[JamesSchlarmann]

My pointing out that the very programs that progressives thought would help people may have actually harmed them does not mean that I prefer they "die". Your making that accusation is rather amusing actually. It's the kind of hyperbole that desperate people fall back on when they can't make a compelling argument.

By all means, tell me what your solution to people living below the poverty line is. I'd love to hear it, actually.

I'm curious as to why you think a system that encourages generation after generation to stay on government assistance "helps". You talk about a lack of opportunity for advancement?

What really encourages the lack of progress in a group of people? A system that's built to help them in times of need, or a system of education that prices many out of the market. Your group is supposed to be all about incentive, right? So what exactly is the incentive to get off welfare and assistance programs?

Can I tell you something? I have two full time jobs, and I still cannot afford health care for my entire family on my own. The state of California has a program for families to get health coverage that the state helps pay for. I still pay about $50 a month, but I'm able to provide health care to my two sons.

Guess who gets the shit end of the stick? My wife. Because we simply can't afford to pay our mortgage, car payment, and every other bill we have in the house and still have enough to get her health care. I'd gladly take government assistance to make sure my wife doesn't die of ovarian cancer. So instead once a year she goes to Planned Parenthood for her yearly pap screening.

Not all entitlement programs do the same thing, and not all are necessary. But I'm thankful that my state has a program that will help me keep my kids from dying or not being able to go to the ER with a broken bone if needs be.

And I'm not the only hard working middle class American who has to take government help for a thing or two. Am I part of the dependency class, in your opinion?

If you REALLY want to put yourself in a position where you have little chance of advancing yourself then go welfare and stay there. That's what your New Deal progressive programs have ultimately meant to a large percentage of the population...a systematic incentive to not work and not better ones self.

And yet by and large, most of the people ON welfare live in the South, which is supposedly the Mecca of self-reliance and good, Conservative, "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps" mentality, right? So figure that one out. Also, figure out why a lot of poor folks on welfare vote for Republicans every election cycle.

 

[The T]

It was a typo, obviously. It should have read "every single." Meaning every one. Meaning all of them.

They have absolutely done good. Or would you prefer they die and decrease the surplus population?

Are you employed by Soros?

He's a blogger for soros.

Doesn't surprise me one bit.

 

[Stephanie]

It was a typo, obviously. It should have read "every single." Meaning every one. Meaning all of them.

They have absolutely done good. Or would you prefer they die and decrease the surplus population?

Are you employed by Soros?

He's a blogger for soros.

I'd say that could be a good bet.
sounds just like what you hear from moveon, thinkprogress, dailykos, etc

 

[initforme]

We are at the crossroads of a battle much bigger than the right wing. This all comes down to the ultra wealthy and corporations now seeing blood in the water and grabbing even more wealth. They care not for the country but for their pocketbooks. The GOP politicians protect the wealthy at any cost. Its about power. The income gap is going to widen. Less safety restrictions is what they want. Workers with less vacation, less benefits, lower wages. Its a national trend. What is hilarious is some poor slobs out there working their tails off for $12 arent smart enough to see it. Somehow the right wing has been able to take your average kindergarten teacher and villanize them. As a business owner it disgusts me. But it will all come back to the chicken and egg thing. As the middle class wages dwindle and they have less money to buy, big money with all the control wont make their profits as nobody will have any money to spend. Even Henry ford figured that out. Pay em so they can buy the product. Instead, today its gimmee gimmee gimmee.

 

[Oldstyle]

My pointing out that the very programs that progressives thought would help people may have actually harmed them does not mean that I prefer they "die". Your making that accusation is rather amusing actually. It's the kind of hyperbole that desperate people fall back on when they can't make a compelling argument.

By all means, tell me what your solution to people living below the poverty line is. I'd love to hear it, actually.

I'm curious as to why you think a system that encourages generation after generation to stay on government assistance "helps". You talk about a lack of opportunity for advancement?

What really encourages the lack of progress in a group of people? A system that's built to help them in times of need, or a system of education that prices many out of the market. Your group is supposed to be all about incentive, right? So what exactly is the incentive to get off welfare and assistance programs?

Can I tell you something? I have two full time jobs, and I still cannot afford health care for my entire family on my own. The state of California has a program for families to get health coverage that the state helps pay for. I still pay about $50 a month, but I'm able to provide health care to my two sons.

Guess who gets the shit end of the stick? My wife. Because we simply can't afford to pay our mortgage, car payment, and every other bill we have in the house and still have enough to get her health care. I'd gladly take government assistance to make sure my wife doesn't die of ovarian cancer. So instead once a year she goes to Planned Parenthood for her yearly pap screening.

Not all entitlement programs do the same thing, and not all are necessary. But I'm thankful that my state has a program that will help me keep my kids from dying or not being able to go to the ER with a broken bone if needs be.

And I'm not the only hard working middle class American who has to take government help for a thing or two. Am I part of the dependency class, in your opinion?

If you REALLY want to put yourself in a position where you have little chance of advancing yourself then go welfare and stay there. That's what your New Deal progressive programs have ultimately meant to a large percentage of the population...a systematic incentive to not work and not better ones self.

And yet by and large, most of the people ON welfare live in the South, which is supposedly the Mecca of self-reliance and good, Conservative, "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps" mentality, right? So figure that one out. Also, figure out why a lot of poor folks on welfare vote for Republicans every election cycle.

If you contribute more than you take out then you are not part of the dependency class. If you take out more than you put in then you are.

I'm sorry, James but I was raised by a father who worked as a firefighter, ran the family dairy farm AND worked part time as a carpenter to pay the bills for 8 kids. He retired from the FD as Chief with degrees in fire science and managed to do all that without taking a single dime from a government "program". If he were listening to this conversation I suspect that his reply to your little rant would be to tell you to get off your ass and get a third job or get better at the ones you have so they give you a raise.

As for your comments about where most of the people on welfare live? You once again prove that you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. Many of the people on welfare are in northern welfare states that provide substantially more money to those on welfare than most southern States. They moved TO those States because of the generous welfare provisions. Trust me...you don't move to Alabama because you want to take advantage of their welfare system.

 

[The T]

Are you employed by Soros?

He's a blogger for soros.

I'd say that could be a good bet.
sounds just like what you hear from moveon, thinkprogress, dailykos, etc

I note he ignores it.

Typical of the paid shills on these boards.

 

[JamesSchlarmann]

If you contribute more than you take out then you are not part of the dependency class. If you take out more than you put in then you are.

Well, I'm certainly glad to have you here to pass that judgment on me, and anyone else who needs government assistance.

I'm sorry, James but I was raised by a father who worked as a firefighter, ran the family dairy farm AND worked part time as a carpenter to pay the bills for 8 kids. He retired from the FD as Chief with degrees in fire science and managed to do all that without taking a single dime from a government "program". If he were listening to this conversation I suspect that his reply to your little rant would be to tell you to get off you ass and get a third job or get better at the ones you have so they give you a raise.

And I wold respectfully tell your father to go **** himself. It'd kinda of not be his place to tell me how to live my life, nor is it yours. I know, I **** me and all my Liberal friends for actually wanting to create a society where someone doesn't have to work three jobs to make ends meet. It's called progress for a reason.

You should be proud of your father. But quality of life means something. No man or woman should have to work three jobs unless they WANT to. If they want to, that's all well and good. But I think one job should be enough to make sure you have bread on the table.

As for you comments about where most of the people on welfare live? You once again prove that you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. Many of the people on welfare are in northern welfare states that provide substantially more money to those on welfare than most southern States. They moved TO those States because of the generous welfare provisions. Trust me...you don't move to Alabama because you want to take advantage of their welfare system.

I'm looking into the stats now actually, and you could be right. I'm trying to get census data. I thought I read somewhere that in the South per capita you see more welfare assistance, but I could've been mistaken, definitely. I'll link anything I find, whether it proves or disproves my case.

 

[clevergirl]

If you contribute more than you take out then you are not part of the dependency class. If you take out more than you put in then you are.

Well, I'm certainly glad to have you here to pass that judgment on me, and anyone else who needs government assistance.

I'm sorry, James but I was raised by a father who worked as a firefighter, ran the family dairy farm AND worked part time as a carpenter to pay the bills for 8 kids. He retired from the FD as Chief with degrees in fire science and managed to do all that without taking a single dime from a government "program". If he were listening to this conversation I suspect that his reply to your little rant would be to tell you to get off you ass and get a third job or get better at the ones you have so they give you a raise.

And I wold respectfully tell your father to go **** himself. It'd kinda of not be his place to tell me how to live my life, nor is it yours. I know, I **** me and all my Liberal friends for actually wanting to create a society where someone doesn't have to work three jobs to make ends meet. It's called progress for a reason.

You should be proud of your father. But quality of life means something. No man or woman should have to work three jobs unless they WANT to. If they want to, that's all well and good. But I think one job should be enough to make sure you have bread on the table.

As for you comments about where most of the people on welfare live? You once again prove that you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. Many of the people on welfare are in northern welfare states that provide substantially more money to those on welfare than most southern States. They moved TO those States because of the generous welfare provisions. Trust me...you don't move to Alabama because you want to take advantage of their welfare system.

I'm looking into the stats now actually, and you could be right. I'm trying to get census data. I thought I read somewhere that in the South per capita you see more welfare assistance, but I could've been mistaken, definitely. I'll link anything I find, whether it proves or disproves my case.

People who pay taxes used to support others always have a right to say "get a third job". Society is not good because it supports those who can help themselves. Society is good because it creates a sphere where people can help themselves.

 

[Oldstyle]

If you contribute more than you take out then you are not part of the dependency class. If you take out more than you put in then you are.

Well, I'm certainly glad to have you here to pass that judgment on me, and anyone else who needs government assistance.

I'm sorry, James but I was raised by a father who worked as a firefighter, ran the family dairy farm AND worked part time as a carpenter to pay the bills for 8 kids. He retired from the FD as Chief with degrees in fire science and managed to do all that without taking a single dime from a government "program". If he were listening to this conversation I suspect that his reply to your little rant would be to tell you to get off you ass and get a third job or get better at the ones you have so they give you a raise.

And I wold respectfully tell your father to go **** himself. It'd kinda of not be his place to tell me how to live my life, nor is it yours. I know, I **** me and all my Liberal friends for actually wanting to create a society where someone doesn't have to work three jobs to make ends meet. It's called progress for a reason.

You should be proud of your father. But quality of life means something. No man or woman should have to work three jobs unless they WANT to. If they want to, that's all well and good. But I think one job should be enough to make sure you have bread on the table.

As for you comments about where most of the people on welfare live? You once again prove that you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. Many of the people on welfare are in northern welfare states that provide substantially more money to those on welfare than most southern States. They moved TO those States because of the generous welfare provisions. Trust me...you don't move to Alabama because you want to take advantage of their welfare system.

I'm looking into the stats now actually, and you could be right. I'm trying to get census data. I thought I read somewhere that in the South per capita you see more welfare assistance, but I could've been mistaken, definitely. I'll link anything I find, whether it proves or disproves my case.

So let me see if I've got this straight...you'd tell my father who worked the three jobs to pay for HIS family...that you think that HIS taxes should go to pay for YOUR family's needs because you're more worried about your "quality of life" then you are about providing for your family? And if he didn't like that, he should go **** himself? Gotta love you progressives, James!

 

[Stephanie]

me and all my Liberal friends for actually wanting to create a society

You friggen mushy brained Progressives want to "create" a society, go find your own damn country or an Island to CREATE your UTOPIA, leave THE REST of us alone..

 

[Buford]

If you contribute more than you take out then you are not part of the dependency class. If you take out more than you put in then you are.

Well, I'm certainly glad to have you here to pass that judgment on me, and anyone else who needs government assistance.

I'm sorry, James but I was raised by a father who worked as a firefighter, ran the family dairy farm AND worked part time as a carpenter to pay the bills for 8 kids. He retired from the FD as Chief with degrees in fire science and managed to do all that without taking a single dime from a government "program". If he were listening to this conversation I suspect that his reply to your little rant would be to tell you to get off you ass and get a third job or get better at the ones you have so they give you a raise.

And I wold respectfully tell your father to go **** himself. It'd kinda of not be his place to tell me how to live my life, nor is it yours. I know, I **** me and all my Liberal friends for actually wanting to create a society where someone doesn't have to work three jobs to make ends meet. It's called progress for a reason.

You should be proud of your father. But quality of life means something. No man or woman should have to work three jobs unless they WANT to. If they want to, that's all well and good. But I think one job should be enough to make sure you have bread on the table.

As for you comments about where most of the people on welfare live? You once again prove that you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. Many of the people on welfare are in northern welfare states that provide substantially more money to those on welfare than most southern States. They moved TO those States because of the generous welfare provisions. Trust me...you don't move to Alabama because you want to take advantage of their welfare system.

I'm looking into the stats now actually, and you could be right. I'm trying to get census data. I thought I read somewhere that in the South per capita you see more welfare assistance, but I could've been mistaken, definitely. I'll link anything I find, whether it proves or disproves my case.

Why should I pay a govt union worker more for doing the same job as a non-govt worker?

 

[Mustang]

By James Schlarmann

Over the last couple of weeks, the Right Wing has trotted out the idea that this 2012 Presidential Election is going to be a referendum on Barack Obama. They claim that the American people have been let down by the President’s economic performance, and that it’s time get the good ol’ tricke down started again. They claim that so many people are out of work and hurting financially, and they know it’s because Obama has failed to pull us out of the Depression (seriously, it’s a Depression that we’re in), and thus this election will be all about Americans saying “no” to the Obama Administration.

The thing is, they’re right about this election being a referendum. And maybe they could be right about it being a referendum on Obama, but only for their own electorate. Instead, I think there’s a much larger picture being painted with this election, and it’s for the moral compass of this country’s economy and social policy. For the first time in many, many years, Americans are being asked to dictate the direction of the country not just in terms of its economy’s heart and soul, but of the heart and soul of the nation’s stated beliefs when it comes to human rights. The Mitt Romney/Tea Party/George W. Bush/Grover Norquist/Wall Street is King/Greed is Good message of fiscal and social extremism is really what’s on trial here. As much as the GOP would have you believe this election is about the other guy, is much more about them, and their apparent decision to let the lunatic fringe of their party drive the ship.

The War on Women, the Fight Against Marriage Equality and the Let the Rich Get Richer forces of the Republican party are going to be put under intense scrutiny by the Obama campaign, and they may be shocked when their messages of intolerance, devolution and Plutocracy are left to die on the vine.

All over the nation, people are being given a choice. Conservatives now more than ever are trying to rush us into a massive nuclear-powered Delorean and take us as far backward as they can, be it a social issue or a fiscal policy. People like Paul Ryan are proposing budgets that kill social programs but pump still even more money into the Defense budget. Over a thousand bills restricting women’s health care and access to abortions and contraceptives have been introduced since the rise of the Tea Party. The storm is gathering, and showdown is coming.

More: Right-Wing Extremism: The Real Referendum of 2012 | The Political Garbage Chute

Talk radio has created a conspiratorial monster. Unfortunately, as far as the Republican Party establishment is concerned, that's not the worst of it. You see, they (GOP leaders) thought they could manipulate (or at least steer) the talk radio crowd in the direction they wanted them to go. In other words, the GOP leadership felt like they could more or less pull the strings of the RW crowd's views on issues. Unfortunately, you can't manipulate what you can't control. Now the RW crowd has the leadership on the run. At this point it's an even bet what will happen next. Will the leadership be able to run fast enough to be able to get out in front of the RW crowd so they can again look like they're leading the charge? Or will the leadership just get run over?

 

[The T]

If you contribute more than you take out then you are not part of the dependency class. If you take out more than you put in then you are.

Well, I'm certainly glad to have you here to pass that judgment on me, and anyone else who needs government assistance.



And I wold respectfully tell your father to go **** himself. It'd kinda of not be his place to tell me how to live my life, nor is it yours. I know, I **** me and all my Liberal friends for actually wanting to create a society where someone doesn't have to work three jobs to make ends meet. It's called progress for a reason.

You should be proud of your father. But quality of life means something. No man or woman should have to work three jobs unless they WANT to. If they want to, that's all well and good. But I think one job should be enough to make sure you have bread on the table.

As for you comments about where most of the people on welfare live? You once again prove that you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. Many of the people on welfare are in northern welfare states that provide substantially more money to those on welfare than most southern States. They moved TO those States because of the generous welfare provisions. Trust me...you don't move to Alabama because you want to take advantage of their welfare system.

I'm looking into the stats now actually, and you could be right. I'm trying to get census data. I thought I read somewhere that in the South per capita you see more welfare assistance, but I could've been mistaken, definitely. I'll link anything I find, whether it proves or disproves my case.

Why should I pay a govt union worker more for doing the same job as a non-govt worker?

And that's just it? Some government folks think they're government and that makes them special...shit not stinking and all of that.

Call it arrogance.

 

[JamesSchlarmann]

So let me see if I've got this straight...you'd tell my father who worked the three jobs to pay for HIS family...that you think that HIS taxes should go to pay for YOUR family's needs because you're more worried about your "quality of life" then you are about providing for your family? And if he didn't like that, he should go **** himself? Gotta love you progressives, James!

What exactly would give your father the right to tell me that two jobs isn't enough, and I should go work a third job, exactly? What gives you that right for that matter? Or anyone? That's just being a nosy, uppity, high-horse riding asshole. I have a feeling if someone told you how to live your life, you'd say the same thing.

If your father was enough of an asshole to tell me how to live my life, you bet I'd tell him to **** himself. First you complain about people not having any job, then you tell someone working two that's not enough? That's why Conservatives look like monsters to a lot of people. How much is enough? Everyone should do nothing but work with their lives so that their kids can eat and get medicine when they need it? **** that. That's Draconian. That's wrong. It's morally reprehensible to suggest to someone that all their life is good for is work. Work to kick their money up the chain and pray to whatever science-fiction character they believe in will trickle down love and manna from heaven?

Nah. That's ******* stupid.

 

[Oddball]

Talk radio has created a conspiratorial monster. Unfortunately, as far as the Republican Party establishment is concerned, that's not the worst of it. You see, they (GOP leaders) thought they could manipulate (or at least steer) the talk radio crowd in the direction they wanted them to go. In other words, the GOP leadership felt like they could more or less pull the strings of the RW crowd's views on issues. Unfortunately, you can't manipulate what you can't control. Now the RW crowd has the leadership on the run. At this point it's an even bet what will happen next. Will the leadership be able to run fast enough to be able to get out in front of the RW crowd so they can again look like they're leading the charge? Or will the leadership just get run over?

Awwww....All that "free speech" thingy we hear so much about turned around and bit all the establishment socialists' asses.

Looks like the waaaaaambulance is working overtime this week.

 

[The T]

So let me see if I've got this straight...you'd tell my father who worked the three jobs to pay for HIS family...that you think that HIS taxes should go to pay for YOUR family's needs because you're more worried about your "quality of life" then you are about providing for your family? And if he didn't like that, he should go **** himself? Gotta love you progressives, James!

What exactly would give your father the right to tell me that two jobs isn't enough, and I should go work a third job, exactly? What gives you that right for that matter? Or anyone? That's just being a nosy, uppity, high-horse riding asshole. I have a feeling if someone told you how to live your life, you'd say the same thing.

If your father was enough of an asshole to tell me how to live my life, you bet I'd tell him to **** himself. First you complain about people not having any job, then you tell someone working two that's not enough? That's why Conservatives look like monsters to a lot of people. How much is enough? Everyone should do nothing but work with their lives so that their kids can eat and get medicine when they need it? **** that. That's Draconian. That's wrong. It's morally reprehensible to suggest to someone that all their life is good for is work. Work to kick their money up the chain and pray to whatever science-fiction character they believe in will trickle down love and manna from heaven?

Nah. That's ******* stupid.

And so are you. Now? how much is Soros pay you to be here? Obama?

 

[JamesSchlarmann]

People who pay taxes used to support others always have a right to say "get a third job". Society is not good because it supports those who can help themselves. Society is good because it creates a sphere where people can help themselves.

I pay taxes.

So what do you tell people like me then, who think we should be able to have OUR taxes pay for education, health care and welfare for those who need it? Don't we have just as much a say in where our tax dollars go?

I want to be to tell oil companies who are getting BILLIONS every year in subsidies that ultimately come out of my tax dollars that they can get a third job. Or just better yet, they can stop taking THEIR free ride.

No one, and I mean NO ONE, has the right to tell someone else they need to work three jobs to live. That's slave labor, essentially. But seeing this line or reasoning, it's easy to see why you guys hate unions. Apparently quality of life doesn't mean shit to you, because God forbid you determine your life has many more important aspects to it other than work.

 

[The T]

People who pay taxes used to support others always have a right to say "get a third job". Society is not good because it supports those who can help themselves. Society is good because it creates a sphere where people can help themselves.

I pay taxes.

So what do you tell people like me then, who think we should be able to have OUR taxes pay for education, health care and welfare for those who need it? Don't we have just as much a say in where our tax dollars go?

I want to be to tell oil companies who are getting BILLIONS every year in subsidies that ultimately come out of my tax dollars that they can get a third job. Or just better yet, they can stop taking THEIR free ride.

No one, and I mean NO ONE, has the right to tell someone else they need to work three jobs to live. That's slave labor, essentially. But seeing this line or reasoning, it's easy to see why you guys hate unions. Apparently quality of life doesn't mean shit to you, because God forbid you determine your life has many more important aspects to it other than work.

Uhmm? Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution spells it out moron.

 

[JamesSchlarmann]

So let me see if I've got this straight...you'd tell my father who worked the three jobs to pay for HIS family...that you think that HIS taxes should go to pay for YOUR family's needs because you're more worried about your "quality of life" then you are about providing for your family? And if he didn't like that, he should go **** himself? Gotta love you progressives, James!

What exactly would give your father the right to tell me that two jobs isn't enough, and I should go work a third job, exactly? What gives you that right for that matter? Or anyone? That's just being a nosy, uppity, high-horse riding asshole. I have a feeling if someone told you how to live your life, you'd say the same thing.

If your father was enough of an asshole to tell me how to live my life, you bet I'd tell him to **** himself. First you complain about people not having any job, then you tell someone working two that's not enough? That's why Conservatives look like monsters to a lot of people. How much is enough? Everyone should do nothing but work with their lives so that their kids can eat and get medicine when they need it? **** that. That's Draconian. That's wrong. It's morally reprehensible to suggest to someone that all their life is good for is work. Work to kick their money up the chain and pray to whatever science-fiction character they believe in will trickle down love and manna from heaven?

Nah. That's ******* stupid.

And so are you. Now? how much is Soros pay you to be here? Obama?

Yeah, I'm not going to respond beyond this, telling you I'm not responding, okay? And I just want to let you know why you're not worth me responding to:

You added nothing to the debate, nothing to the discourse. You didn't talk about any of my points. You called me stupid.

Well, if I'm stupid, than I'm not worth YOUR time, am I? So move along, Troll.