CDZ Riddle me this

[Fair&Balanced]

IF the only emails Hillary and company deleted off her private server were of a private nature, how would it POSSIBLY be treason or espionage or any related federal crime for Trump to ask the Russians to find them?

Started in the CDZ on purpose because I'm hoping we can stay away from whether Hillary broke any laws or whatever, we've had those discussions. My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

 

[irosie91]

IF the only emails Hillary and company deleted off her private server were of a private nature, how would it POSSIBLY be treason or espionage or any related federal crime for Trump to ask the Russians to find them?

Started in the CDZ on purpose because I'm hoping we can stay away from whether Hillary broke any laws or whatever, we've had those discussions. My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

what makes you use the word "PERSONAL"? because it was a personal account? The issue is whether or not the content of the e-mails included information of a SECRET nature-------it would not matter if they started out as "DEAR DARLING" and ended up "LOVE, HILLIARY"

 

[Auld Phart]

the question is moot, the FBI already determined not all of the deleted emails were personal, I'm interested in whether anyone acquired 'work' related information

 

[Meathead]

An observation which obviously begs the question whether Hillary's yoga lessons and Chelsea's wedding preparations were a matter of national security.

LOL

 

[Fair&Balanced]

IF the only emails Hillary and company deleted off her private server were of a private nature, how would it POSSIBLY be treason or espionage or any related federal crime for Trump to ask the Russians to find them?

Started in the CDZ on purpose because I'm hoping we can stay away from whether Hillary broke any laws or whatever, we've had those discussions. My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

what makes you use the word "PERSONAL"? because it was a personal account? The issue is whether or not the content of the e-mails included information of a SECRET nature-------it would not matter if they started out as "DEAR DARLING" and ended up "LOVE, HILLIARY"

What? No, Sheesh

Hillary claims that ONLY personal emails were deleted, no work related emails. So, if that is true, then what harm to national security would come from the Russians having those emails?

THAT is the point, the Dems are wanting have their cake "oh no we only deleted personal emails" and eat it too "Trump is calling for the Russians to expose state secrets"

 

[Divine Wind]

....My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

If the deleted emails were entirely personal, no laws were broken. Ergo, there could be no treason or illegal activity.

However, as Comey has testified, that's not the case here.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

the question is moot, the FBI already determined not all of the deleted emails were personal, I'm interested in whether anyone acquired 'work' related information

No they did not determine that, how would they do so , what the FBI said was that they have no way to know if all the emails were personal in nature.

 

[Divine Wind]

What? No, Sheesh

Hillary claims that ONLY personal emails were deleted, no work related emails. So, if that is true, then what harm to national security would come from the Russians having those emails?...

Yes, that is what she claimed, but as

Statement by FBI Director James B. Comey on the Investigation of Secretary Hillary Clinton’s Use of a Personal E-Mail System — FBI
The FBI also discovered several thousand work-related e-mails that were not in the group of 30,000 that were returned by Secretary Clinton to State in 2014. We found those additional e-mails in a variety of ways. Some had been deleted over the years and we found traces of them on devices that supported or were connected to the private e-mail domain. Others we found by reviewing the archived government e-mail accounts of people who had been government employees at the same time as Secretary Clinton, including high-ranking officials at other agencies, people with whom a Secretary of State might naturally correspond.

This helped us recover work-related e-mails that were not among the 30,000 produced to State. Still others we recovered from the laborious review of the millions of e-mail fragments dumped into the slack space of the server decommissioned in 2013.

With respect to the thousands of e-mails we found that were not among those produced to State, agencies have concluded that three of those were classified at the time they were sent or received, one at the Secret level and two at the Confidential level. There were no additional Top Secret e-mails found. Finally, none of those we found have since been “up-classified.”

I should add here that we found no evidence that any of the additional work-related e-mails were intentionally deleted in an effort to conceal them. Our assessment is that, like many e-mail users, Secretary Clinton periodically deleted e-mails or e-mails were purged from the system when devices were changed. Because she was not using a government account—or even a commercial account like Gmail—there was no archiving at all of her e-mails, so it is not surprising that we discovered e-mails that were not on Secretary Clinton’s system in 2014, when she produced the 30,000 e-mails to the State Department.

It could also be that some of the additional work-related e-mails we recovered were among those deleted as “personal” by Secretary Clinton’s lawyers when they reviewed and sorted her e-mails for production in 2014.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

....My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

If the deleted emails were entirely personal, no laws were broken. Ergo, there could be no treason or illegal activity.

However, as Comey has testified, that's not the case here.

That is NOT what Comey said. How would Comey know if DELETED emails were work related? What he in fact said was that the FBI had no way of knowing if all the emails were personal.

Here is the FULL press conference

FBI Director James Comey’s full remarks on Clinton email probe | New York Post

and of course , just common sense would tell you that the FBI couldn't say definitively that there were work related emails deleted when they in fact have not seen the emails.

It's pure speculation to guess that there were work related emails deleted. That's not to say there probably weren't , because probably there were, but the FBI doesn't deal in probabilities, they deal in facts.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

What? No, Sheesh

Hillary claims that ONLY personal emails were deleted, no work related emails. So, if that is true, then what harm to national security would come from the Russians having those emails?...

Yes, that is what she claimed, but as

Statement by FBI Director James B. Comey on the Investigation of Secretary Hillary Clinton’s Use of a Personal E-Mail System — FBI
The FBI also discovered several thousand work-related e-mails that were not in the group of 30,000 that were returned by Secretary Clinton to State in 2014. We found those additional e-mails in a variety of ways. Some had been deleted over the years and we found traces of them on devices that supported or were connected to the private e-mail domain. Others we found by reviewing the archived government e-mail accounts of people who had been government employees at the same time as Secretary Clinton, including high-ranking officials at other agencies, people with whom a Secretary of State might naturally correspond.

This helped us recover work-related e-mails that were not among the 30,000 produced to State. Still others we recovered from the laborious review of the millions of e-mail fragments dumped into the slack space of the server decommissioned in 2013.

With respect to the thousands of e-mails we found that were not among those produced to State, agencies have concluded that three of those were classified at the time they were sent or received, one at the Secret level and two at the Confidential level. There were no additional Top Secret e-mails found. Finally, none of those we found have since been “up-classified.”

I should add here that we found no evidence that any of the additional work-related e-mails were intentionally deleted in an effort to conceal them. Our assessment is that, like many e-mail users, Secretary Clinton periodically deleted e-mails or e-mails were purged from the system when devices were changed. Because she was not using a government account—or even a commercial account like Gmail—there was no archiving at all of her e-mails, so it is not surprising that we discovered e-mails that were not on Secretary Clinton’s system in 2014, when she produced the 30,000 e-mails to the State Department.

It could also be that some of the additional work-related e-mails we recovered were among those deleted as “personal” by Secretary Clinton’s lawyers when they reviewed and sorted her e-mails for production in 2014.

Yes, but that includes ones that the FBI found , on other devices or what have you, so those aren't gone. The allegations about Trump's comments are about the ones that have NOT been found , through ANY means, and were not addressed by Comey's comments.

 

[OldLady]

I thought the "treason" was in the effort to retrieve emails not belonging to them--that THAT is the "espionage"

Which is a totally ridiculous bunch of malarkey. The Repubs are getting a taste of their own medicine, blowing up the e-mail scandal into such a monstrosity of allegations and suspicions that served them well politically for going on two years. And amounted to basically nothing. She was careless. We all realize she probably deleted e-mails she's damned glad no one got to see. But it amounted to a tempest in a teapot and now the Dems are trying to do it back. Malarkey all the way around.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

I thought the "treason" was in the effort to retrieve emails not belonging to them--that THAT is the "espionage"

Which is a totally ridiculous bunch of malarkey. The Repubs are getting a taste of their own medicine, blowing up the e-mail scandal into such a monstrosity of allegations and suspicions that served them well politically for going on two years. And amounted to basically nothing. She was careless. We all realize she probably deleted e-mails she's damned glad no one got to see. But it amounted to a tempest in a teapot and now the Dems are trying to do it back. Malarkey all the way around.

It certainly does NOT amount to a tempest in a teapot. She got away with crimes. That however is not what this thread is about.

 

[IcebergSlim]

....My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

If the deleted emails were entirely personal, no laws were broken. Ergo, there could be no treason or illegal activity.

However, as Comey has testified, that's not the case here.

Wrong.......It is inviting hacking......If you don't think hacking is illegal, give Guccifer a call....he's in cell block #9....

 

[Fair&Balanced]

....My question here is simple. IF the emails in question were personal, why do SOME liberals believe espionage type laws would apply at all?

If the deleted emails were entirely personal, no laws were broken. Ergo, there could be no treason or illegal activity.

However, as Comey has testified, that's not the case here.

Wrong.......It is inviting hacking......If you don't think hacking is illegal, give Guccifer a call....he's in cell block #9....

Fine, assume that is true. i ask again, how is hacking Hillary's PRIVATE emails a matter of national security? See, liberals want to have their cake and eat it too

 

[Divine Wind]

Fine, assume that is true. i ask again, how is hacking Hillary's PRIVATE emails a matter of national security? See, liberals want to have their cake and eat it too

If there's nothing in there, it isn't. OTOH, asking someone to hack into a person's email is asking them to commit a serious federal crime.

Criminal Penalties for Email Hacking
Crimes Related to Email Hacking

In the United States federal justice system, an email hacker may face the following criminal charges:

Computer fraud
Identity theft
Wire fraud
Obstruction of justice



Law Dictionary: Criminal Penalties for Email Hacking

 

[Divine Wind]

Wrong.......It is inviting hacking......If you don't think hacking is illegal, give Guccifer a call....he's in cell block #9....

Wrong? Where am I wrong? Your straw man argument accusing me of "you don't think hacking is illegal"? Try reading the posts before responding. It will work out better for everyone if you do.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

Fine, assume that is true. i ask again, how is hacking Hillary's PRIVATE emails a matter of national security? See, liberals want to have their cake and eat it too

If there's nothing in there, it isn't. OTOH, asking someone to hack into a person's email is asking them to commit a serious federal crime.

Criminal Penalties for Email Hacking
Crimes Related to Email Hacking

In the United States federal justice system, an email hacker may face the following criminal charges:

Computer fraud
Identity theft
Wire fraud
Obstruction of justice



Law Dictionary: Criminal Penalties for Email Hacking

True, but he didn't ask someone to hack into anyone's email. AT MOST he said "hey if you already have the emails., make them public."

Now, I personally didn't think it was a funny joke, and it cost him my vote. BUT that doesn't' change the fact about liberals who claim that it was treason or espionage are full of shit.

 

[Divine Wind]

Yes, but that includes ones that the FBI found , on other devices or what have you, so those aren't gone. The allegations about Trump's comments are about the ones that have NOT been found , through ANY means, and were not addressed by Comey's comments.

My understanding is that some of the emails Hillary deleted were recovered on the recipient's computer, not her's. Ergo, Comey did comment about deleted emails.

 

[Divine Wind]

True, but he didn't ask someone to hack into anyone's email. AT MOST he said "hey if you already have the emails., make them public."

Now, I personally didn't think it was a funny joke, and it cost him my vote. BUT that doesn't' change the fact about liberals who claim that it was treason or espionage are full of shit.

Seems to me like he did:
“Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing. I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press.”

Other than hacking, how else do you think the Russians would find deleted emails?

 

[Fair&Balanced]

Yes, but that includes ones that the FBI found , on other devices or what have you, so those aren't gone. The allegations about Trump's comments are about the ones that have NOT been found , through ANY means, and were not addressed by Comey's comments.

My understanding is that some of the emails Hillary deleted were recovered on the recipient's computer, not her's. Ergo, Comey did comment about deleted emails.

Right, but those have been found, there are still MANY that are completely lost, even to the FBI, I took Trump's comments as being directed towards those. Maybe I'm wrong.