Republican talking point debunked, in part, by a Republican

[Ravi]

WASHINGTON — As Congress has debated energy policy over the past several days, an unusual argument keeps surfacing in support of drilling off the U.S. coastline and in Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.
Why, ask some Republicans, should the United States be thwarted from drilling in its own territory when just 50 miles off the Florida coastline the Chinese government is drilling for oil under Cuban leases?


Yet no one can prove that the Chinese are drilling anywhere off Cuba's shoreline. The China-Cuba connection is "akin to urban legend," said Sen. Mel Martinez, a Republican from Florida who opposes drilling off the coast of his state but who backs exploration in ANWR.


"China is not drilling in Cuba's Gulf of Mexico waters, period," said Jorge Pinon, an energy fellow with the Center for Hemispheric Policy at the University of Miami and an expert in oil exploration in the Gulf of Mexico. Martinez cited Pinon's research when he took to the Senate floor Wednesday to set the record straight.
Even so, the Chinese-drilling-in-Cuba legend has gained momentum and has been swept up in Republican arguments to open up more U.S. territory to domestic production.

McClatchy Washington Bureau | 06/12/2008 | GOP claim about Chinese oil drilling off Cuba is untrue

 

[CSM]

Technically correct. In keeping with lib's version of foreign policy, we should absolutely wait for the "smoking gun".

"China's Sinopec oil company does have an agreement with the Cuban government to develop onshore resources west of Havana, Piñon said. The Chinese have done some seismic testing, he said, but no drilling. Western diplomats in Havana told McClatchy that to the best of their knowledge there is no Chinese drilling offshore."

China-Cuba rumors fuel renewed offshore drilling debate - 06/12/2008 - MiamiHerald.com

 

[Ravi]

So you think the Chinese have stealth oil rigs?

 

[CSM]

So you think the Chinese have stealth oil rigs?

Yeah, they are delivered by the same spaceship that brought you here.

The Chinese may not be drilling at this very moment (the "technically correct" part of my post). The fact that they are conducting surveys indicates that they will be.

As i said, we should absolutely and positively wait until they start drilling before we allow any US company to do the same....and even then we probably should not let US companies compete with the Chinese effort.

 

[Ravi]

Yeah, they are delivered by the same spaceship that brought you here.

The Chinese may not be drilling at this very moment (the "technically correct" part of my post). The fact that they are conducting surveys indicates that they will be.

As i said, we should absolutely and positively wait until they start drilling before we allow any US company to do the same....and even then we probably should not let US companies compete with the Chinese effort.

It could also mean that they'll discover with their surveys that it isn't worth the bother.

 

[CSM]

It could also mean that they'll discover with their surveys that it isn't worth the bother.

Possible...then again, they just might find that it is even more lucrative than they expect. Of course, the Chinese deserve that energy resource far more than the US does.

 

[Ravi]

Possible...then again, they just might find that it is even more lucrative than they expect. Of course, the Chinese deserve that energy resource far more than the US does.

How so? They can't drill in our waters, we aren't about to make a deal with the Cubans...I've not seen any compelling evidence that there is enough oil to get excited about.

 

[CSM]

How so? They can't drill in our waters, we aren't about to make a deal with the Cubans...I've not seen any compelling evidence that there is enough oil to get excited about.

Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean there is none.

Here's some compelling evidence which will probably do even less to excite you:

Assessment of Undiscovered Oil and Gas Resources of the North Cuba Basin, Cuba, 2004

World Assessment of Oil and Gas Fact SheetAssessment of Undiscovered Oil and Gas Resources ofthe North Cuba Basin, Cuba, 2004

Using a geology-basedassessment methodology, the U.S. Geological Surveyestimated a mean of 4.6 billion barrels of undiscovered oil, a mean of 9.8 trillion cubic feet of undis-covered natural gas (8.6 trillion cubic feet of associated-dissolved gas and 1.2 trillion cubic feet of non-associated gas), and a mean of 0.9 billion barrels of undiscovered naturalgas liquids in the North Cuba Basin of Cuba

 

[Ravi]

How long would that last? Is it cost effective to get it? Is it in waters that we can drill in? Who would pay for it?

 

[CSM]

How long would that last? Is it cost effective to get it? Is it in waters that we can drill in? Who would pay for it?

Apparently the Chinese and others think it would last long enough; is cost effective to get, somehow negotiated to drill in those waters and found some way to pay for it. Of course, US citizens don't have that kind of philosophy and determination. For the US EVERYTHING worth doing is just too hard to do so don't even try.

 

[AllieBaba]

How long would that last? Is it cost effective to get it? Is it in waters that we can drill in? Who would pay for it?

Is it cost effective?
Have you been watching the news or buying gas, lady?

 

[Ravi]

Apparently the Chinese and others think it would last long enough; is cost effective to get, somehow negotiated to drill in those waters and found some way to pay for it. Of course, US citizens don't have that kind of philosophy and determination. For the US EVERYTHING worth doing is just too hard to do so don't even try.

Like cutting back on pollution? I agree.

The Chinese are communists, remember. The government pays for everything.

Thanks for not even attempting to answer my questions. Exactly why no one is convinced.

 

[Ravi]

Is it cost effective?
Have you been watching the news or buying gas, lady?

Invading Iraq was going to make oil cheaper, remember? How'd that work out from a cost effective standpoint?

 

[maneal]

Invading Iraq was going to make oil cheaper, remember? How'd that work out from a cost effective standpoint?

Can you please show me where the administration said oil would be cheaper by invading Iraq?

 

[AllieBaba]

It was never supposed to make oil cheaper, how idiotic.

The economic dimwits who insisted we must depend on countries like Mexico, Canada and Iraq and not develop our own sources are the only reason oil prices are what they are.

Once again, you can't expect the price of something to go down if you refuse to decrease access to it.

 

[CSM]

Like cutting back on pollution? I agree.

The Chinese are communists, remember. The government pays for everything.

Thanks for not even attempting to answer my questions. Exactly why no one is convinced.

This from the poster who did not even bother to question some Dem Congressman who made a political statement. I had no problem finding the US geological survey showing that there were "compelling reasons" (as you put it) for drilling. Perhaps if you did the tiniest bit of searching the web, you would find the answers to your questions. You know darn well that no matter what facts I present to answer your questions, you will blithely ignore them just as you did the US Geological Survey.

It is obvious to me that you are more interested in the "gotchya" game that politicians love to play than in seriously considering the facts. It is also obvious which side you play on.

 

[Ravi]

This from the poster who did not even bother to question some Dem Congressman who made a political statement. I had no problem finding the US geological survey showing that there were "compelling reasons" (as you put it) for drilling. Perhaps if you did the tiniest bit of searching the web, you would find the answers to your questions. You know darn well that no matter what facts I present to answer your questions, you will blithely ignore them just as you did the US Geological Survey.

It is obvious to me that you are more interested in the "gotchya" game that politicians love to play than in seriously considering the facts. It is also obvious which side you play on.

Which Dem congressman do you mean?

I don't doubt the existence of oil under there. I doubt the amount available is worth the bother or the cost. And thankfully, even my own Republican senator agrees with me.

States rights only apply when you like what they do, correct?

 

[CSM]

Which Dem congressman do you mean?

I don't doubt the existence of oil under there. I doubt the amount available is worth the bother or the cost. And thankfully, even my own Republican senator agrees with me.

States rights only apply when you like what they do, correct?

What the heck does Chinese drilling for oil in Cuba have to do with state's rights?

The reason US companies cannot drill (or anything else for that matter) in Cuba is because of the Federal government's embargo that has been in place for decades.

I am sure you have a very agile mind but save the demonstration for your grade school buddies and at least try to discuss the original topic. A congressman made a statement that, while technically true, is intentionally misleading.

 

[Ravi]

What the heck does Chinese drilling for oil in Cuba have to do with state's rights?

The reason US companies cannot drill (or anything else for that matter) in Cuba is because of the Federal government's embargo that has been in place for decades.

I am sure you have a very agile mind but save the demonstration for your grade school buddies and at least try to discuss the original topic. A congressman made a statement that, while technically true, is intentionally misleading.

Drilling off the coast of the State of Florida will impact the state of Florida. Just like it now impacts the state of LA.

 

[CSM]

Drilling off the coast of the State of Florida will impact the state of Florida. Just like it now impacts the state of LA.

Gotchya.

I guess then it's ok with you if Chinese drill (a worthless endeavor no doubt but drill they will) but not US companies.

Again, the good ol Congress has managed to prevent US companies from drilling but turn a blind eye to foreign efforts at doing the same. I suppose they can only do so much to hinder economic development within the US.