R.I.P. McCain/Palin 2008

[Isolde]

Dive, you seem like an intelligent guy. Tell me what you see happening between now and then that's going to get McCain elected. Whether or not you agree or disagree with McCain's economic policies, the American economy isn't going to get better in the next 30 days, and Americans have known about the Ayres story for a long, long time since one of the first Democratic debates. I highly doubt the Ayres thing is going to work at all. So barring a terrorist attack on this country, wherein Bush suspends elections until next year, what do you see happening that is going to change the minds of all of these people?

People will realize that Obama's economic plan (tax businesses and capital gains) is a dead ender and will be a death blow to a faltering economy? Just a guess.

 

[DavidS]

Yup, there it is, the great right wing conspiracy and spin machine. Remind us about how the major press was all for Gore in 2000 and Kerry in 2004 and yet the right wing spin machine stole it away? How in 2002 the Republicans WON more seats all cause of that great right wing spin machine.

By the way we will find out who is President on Wednesday Nov 5 and not before. Though I am sure the Press as usual will try early on Tuesday the 4th to sway votes by declaring winners before there is one.

Watching at 230 in the morning that 2000 election the joy drain from all the Major Press reporters as they had to admit Gore did not win was worth staying up indeed. Some of them were on the verge of tears in their unbiased reporting that night.

If you ae truly a retired military person, I thank you for your service.

Now then, this isn't 2000, 2002 or 2004 anymore. In 2006 we had a looming recession and what happened? The Democrats won Congress. Now we have a full blown economic crisis. In the entire history of the United States, no member of the same party that's in the White House with a developing econimic crisis or recession has ever won the election. Unless John McCain has $700 billion stacked up that he's going to spend himself to bail out the economy, there is no way he is getting elected.

Think back to 1929. The Republicans (Hoover) were in charge and the stock market crashed. In comes the Democrats. The Recession of the early 1950s, the Democrats were in charge. BOOM. Ike, a Republican is elected. Recession of the 1970s with the oil crisis the Republicans were in charge BOOM Jimmy Carter is elected. Carter can't do anything about the recession BOOM Reagan is in charge. Early 1990s Bush Sr is in office, recession BOOM Clinton is elected. Dotcom bubble had just burst in 2000 and Bush promised tax cuts BOOM Gore is elected. If history is any indicator of how people vote, then Obama will win.

 

[DavidS]

Who taught you election law? Florida was a win for Bush, INCLUDING in every recount done AFTER the fact. The only Court that got it wrong was the Democratically controlled Florida Supreme Court.

Incorrect.

The media reported the results of the study during the week after November 12, 2001. The recount showed that had there been a full statewide recount of all counties, Al Gore would have received more votes than Bush. However, neither campaign requested such a total statewide recount, and it was never formally carried out.

The media recount study found that under the system of limited recounts in selected counties as was requested by the Gore campaign, the only way that Gore would have won was by using counting methods that were never requested by any party, including "overvotes" — ballots containing more than one vote for an office. While some of these ballots recorded votes for two separate candidates, a significant number (20% in Lake County, for example) were cases of a voter voting for a candidate and then also writing in that same candidate's name on the write-in line. A judge supervising the recount told the Orlando Sentinel that he had been open to the idea of examining the overvotes, and had been planning to discuss the matter at a hearing when the US Supreme Court stopped the recount. According to Mickey Kaus of Slate.com (emphasis in original), "If the recount had gone forward Judge Lewis might well have counted the overvotes in which case Gore might well have won."

According to the New York Times, the butterfly ballot in heavily Democratic Palm Beach County may have cost Gore a net 6286 votes, and the two page ballot in similarly Democratic Duval County may have cost him a net 1999 votes, each of which would have made the difference by itself.

There should have been a re-vote in Florida since so many votes were half-way chads or hanging chads, etc.

In the official vote of the 2000 general election, Al Gore won 50,999,897 and George Bush won 50,456,002. Al Gore won the general election by 543,895 and should have been elected the president.

 

[del]

Incorrect.

The media reported the results of the study during the week after November 12, 2001. The recount showed that had there been a full statewide recount of all counties, Al Gore would have received more votes than Bush. However, neither campaign requested such a total statewide recount, and it was never formally carried out.

The media recount study found that under the system of limited recounts in selected counties as was requested by the Gore campaign, the only way that Gore would have won was by using counting methods that were never requested by any party, including "overvotes" — ballots containing more than one vote for an office. While some of these ballots recorded votes for two separate candidates, a significant number (20% in Lake County, for example) were cases of a voter voting for a candidate and then also writing in that same candidate's name on the write-in line. A judge supervising the recount told the Orlando Sentinel that he had been open to the idea of examining the overvotes, and had been planning to discuss the matter at a hearing when the US Supreme Court stopped the recount. According to Mickey Kaus of Slate.com (emphasis in original), "If the recount had gone forward Judge Lewis might well have counted the overvotes in which case Gore might well have won."

According to the New York Times, the butterfly ballot in heavily Democratic Palm Beach County may have cost Gore a net 6286 votes, and the two page ballot in similarly Democratic Duval County may have cost him a net 1999 votes, each of which would have made the difference by itself.

There should have been a re-vote in Florida since so many votes were half-way chads or hanging chads, etc.

In the official vote of the 2000 general election, Al Gore won 50,999,897 and George Bush won 50,456,002. Al Gore won the general election by 543,895 and should have been elected the president.

psssst. it's 2008, try to keep up, otay?
read up on the electoral college if you have a free minute to spare from shilling for O.

 

[strollingbones]

Lee Atwater, Karl Rove: Spin that Retired.

Palin: Obama pals around with terrorists. Not what the article said, but fuck truth. Let's see. To the average American today a terrorists isn't a Weatherman, it is those dark skinned Muslims Al Quaeda types. Isn't Obama a Muslim? It said so on Fox.

Your little Alaskan lap dog has already started the spin.

If someone now comes out and posts the multiple websites by POWs who call McCain a traitor, is that about the same level of Palin's honesty?

ted stampley is that who you are talking about? ted and his vietnam vets against mccain? well is it...dont make implied comments. I would like to see the mutiple websites by POW's who call McCain a traitor? I am willing to bet ted stampley is behind them.

I draw the line at calling any pow, a traitor. I did find the swift boat ads on kerry disgusting. These are no more than that. I am sick of these mentality that reaches back into a person's past and tries to come up with things outside the context of the social norms at that time without understanding the social norms.

 

[DavidS]

People will realize that Obama's economic plan (tax businesses and capital gains) is a dead ender and will be a death blow to a faltering economy? Just a guess.

Obama is going to raise taxes on people making $250,000 a year to the levels they were under Clinton. Do you remember what the economy was like in the mid-late 1990s? Were the rich not able to create jobs? Were small bussinsses dying left and right?

Under Obama's plan, the middle class are going to get more money back to them than under McCain's plan.

Not only that, but McCain is going to give a $5000 tax credit to help people buy insurance. If I'm already getting a tax return because I paid too much in taxes last year, that doesn't help me. That also doesn't help people who are unemployed. Lastly, you cannot get any health insurance policy for a family of 3 or 4 for $5000 a year. Even a stripped down policy would cost about $15,000 a year. John McCain doesn't offer solutions to 95% of tax payers, only Obama does.

 

[DavidS]

psssst. it's 2008, try to keep up, otay?
read up on the electoral college if you have a free minute to spare from shilling for O.

Del, the discussion was about the 2000 election. Try to keep up, ok?

Gore won the Florida vote, therefore; Florida should have gone to him, which would've given him the election via popular vote AND electoral college.

 

[del]

Del, the discussion was about the 2000 election. Try to keep up, ok?

Gore won the Florida vote, therefore; Florida should have gone to him, which would've given him the election via popular vote AND electoral college.

or he could have just carried his home state and Florida would have been moot.

go figure, huh? the people who arguably knew him best decided not to vote for him, but it's all the fault of the evil Florida Republicans that Al lost, right?

keep whining; it amuses me.

 

[DavidS]

or he could have just carried his home state and Florida would have been moot.

go figure, huh? the people who arguably knew him best decided not to vote for him, but it's all the fault of the evil Florida Republicans that Al lost, right?

keep whining; it amuses me.

If you can't win one argument, you ignore the facts of that argument and start a new argument. Hilarious.

 

[del]

If you can't win one argument, you ignore the facts of that argument and start a new argument. Hilarious.

you can't argue fact. hilarious. keep swinging.

 

[Red Dawn]

or he could have just carried his home state and Florida would have been moot.

go figure, huh? the people who arguably knew him best decided not to vote for him, but it's all the fault of the evil Florida Republicans that Al lost, right?

keep whining; it amuses me.

So your contention is that Mr. 22% approval rating, who will be remembered as the worst president in modern american history, was better than either Gore or Kerry.

Way to put your party, above your country. Obviously, bush voters and republicans hate america so much they'd rather see america crash and burn than see a Democrat is the white house.

 

[del]

So your contention is that Mr. 22% approval rating, who will be remembered as the worst president in modern american history, was better than either Gore or Kerry.

Way to put your party, above your country. Obviously, bush voters and republicans hate america so much they'd rather see america crash and burn than see a Democrat is the white house.

no, my contention is that he won the elections.


would you like me to go slower?

 

[DavidS]

you can't argue fact. hilarious. keep swinging.

I did argue fact. I will re-quote it for your pleasure.

Gore won the Florida vote, therefore; Florida should have gone to him, which would've given him the election via popular vote AND electoral college.

 

[del]

I did argue fact. I will re-quote it for your pleasure.

*yawn*

gore lost. get over it, already.

buy some carbon credits.

it'll make you feel better, and be every bit as effective as rehashing an election from 8 years ago...

 

[DavidS]

*yawn*

gore lost. get over it, already.

buy some carbon credits.

it'll make you feel better, and be every bit as effective as rehashing an election from 8 years ago...

Gore only lost because Katherine Harris refused to allow a state-wide recount. If that recount would've happened, it would've allowed Gore to win.

Global warming is the biggest farce since snake oil.

 

[xsited1]

President Obama ...

Get used to it.

I agree, but it's nothing to cheer about.

 

[NOBama]

Obviously, bush voters and republicans hate america so much they'd rather see america crash and burn than see a Democrat is the white house.

All I can say is thank God that Obama wasn’t in the WH when the shit hit the fan.

 

[del]

Gore only lost because Katherine Harris refused to allow a state-wide recount. If that recount would've happened, it would've allowed Gore to win.

Global warming is the biggest farce since snake oil.

if my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.

 

[Jon]

John McCain doesn't offer solutions to 95% of tax payers, only Obama does.

What you mean to say is that John McCain doesn't offer free handouts to 95% of tax payers, only Obama does.

A $5,000 tax credit for health insurance is a big help in paying for insurance. Why should I have to pay for an entire family's of five health insurance?

 

[DiveCon]

Obama is going to raise taxes on people making $250,000 a year to the levels they were under Clinton. Do you remember what the economy was like in the mid-late 1990s? Were the rich not able to create jobs? Were small bussinsses dying left and right?

Under Obama's plan, the middle class are going to get more money back to them than under McCain's plan.

Not only that, but McCain is going to give a $5000 tax credit to help people buy insurance. If I'm already getting a tax return because I paid too much in taxes last year, that doesn't help me. That also doesn't help people who are unemployed. Lastly, you cannot get any health insurance policy for a family of 3 or 4 for $5000 a year. Even a stripped down policy would cost about $15,000 a year. John McCain doesn't offer solutions to 95% of tax payers, only Obama does.

no, actually he didnt
on ever reasonable recount conducted by several news orgs, Bush won the state of FL
it was only when using the most liberal meaning of "voter intent"(one NO ONE would agree with) that Gore came out on top