Prison: A Waste of Human Life

[Avatar4321]

Of course, but what about the people he killed? she should be writing to their families, not the guy who killed them.

we asked her about that....its in the thread.

she doesn't care about them.....

Thats sad, those are the people who really need the help.

Some do. Some don't. Some are resilient.

 

[syrenn]

we asked her about that....its in the thread.

she doesn't care about them.....

Thats sad, those are the people who really need the help.

Some do. Some don't. Some are resilient.

and some would prefer to watch the criminals die for the crimes they commented and were sentenced for.

 

[Avatar4321]

Thats sad, those are the people who really need the help.

Some do. Some don't. Some are resilient.

and some would prefer to watch the criminals die for the crimes they commented and were sentenced for.

I have no doubt some would. but it doesn't really change anything.

 

[High_Gravity]

I write to prisoners and I am friends with a few. What I'm struck by is that the sentences don't always match the crime and that the innocent also wind up in prison.

I would like to discuss the transformation that sometimes occurs to remarkable prisoners as a result of their incarceration.

Some truly self-heal, and IMO, it is a waste of resources to keep them locked or to execute them.

Jarvis Masters is the author of Finding Freedom. He is one such remarkable man, living on Death Row in San Quentin Prison.

Prison work has been part of my spiritual path for ten years.

Your thoughts?

My experience with prisoners is that MOST of them are innocent. Or so they claim.

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Sometimes you have no choice, if it looks like you will be found guilty and the DA offers you a 5 year sentence opposed to the 20 years you are facing, you have to take it. Alot of people who end up pleading are not guilty my friend, they just had to take the deal so they could see the light of day again.

 

[Hollie]

My experience with prisoners is that MOST of them are innocent. Or so they claim.

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Sometimes you have no choice, if it looks like you will be found guilty and the DA offers you a 5 year sentence opposed to the 20 years you are facing, you have to take it. Alot of people who end up pleading are not guilty my friend, they just had to take the deal so they could see the light of day again.

I can see that. If the only defense attorney you can "afford" is a flunky public defender, 5 years behind bars begins to look a lot better than 20.

 

[Gadawg73]

My first job at a law firm was in 1979 in downtown Atlanta, Ga. Having been arrested a few times in the mid 70s in Fulton county which is Atlanta I was familiar with the county jail. Over the last 33 years I have been in every prison and half of the 170 county jails in Georgia interviewing witnesses and clients. For many years most of my work was criminal defense and it is half now.
Caging non violent offenders, more than half the prison population in America, is not only absurd but it costs 10 times more than extensive probation and/or decriminalizing most of the offenses they are doing time on.
Cost of sending a man to prison: $40,000 a year in incarceration, $15,000 for the arrest and conviction, $15,000 a year in hidden costs such as additional or new costs of all of the public entitlement programs his family will receive as a result of his incarceration and inability to work.
Add in the additional costs of about 2K a year in probation supervision over and above the fines and probation fees they are required to pay.
Unfortunately the Justice system is now a for profit business in the private sector with the taxpayers paying the freight. Costs have quadrupled in the last 12 years as the incarceration rate has skyrocketed.
As most of these offenders are not even criminals. They have drug and alcohol health problems that many times have escalated to petty crimes involving no violence or minor accusations of domestic violence. I had a recent case where a man was washing dishes in his house and his daughter who he had custody of was on the internet. The man received a call from his ex wife and argued and hung up. He was mad and yelled to himself "I am going to shoot that *****" The 13 year old daughter did a OMG on the chat with her friend on the internet and said "My Dad just said out loud that he was going to shoot my Mom. OMG, she is not even here" And the other 13 year old girl had her mother monitoring her internet chats. The Mom called police, they sent the SWAT team out there, arrested him ans charged him with child endangerment and a dozen other charges. Best deal he could get was 10 to do 2. This is the norm these days and we wonder why prison reform is not Priority One.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I write to prisoners and I am friends with a few. What I'm struck by is that the sentences don't always match the crime and that the innocent also wind up in prison.

I would like to discuss the transformation that sometimes occurs to remarkable prisoners as a result of their incarceration.

Some truly self-heal, and IMO, it is a waste of resources to keep them locked or to execute them.

Jarvis Masters is the author of Finding Freedom. He is one such remarkable man, living on Death Row in San Quentin Prison.

Prison work has been part of my spiritual path for ten years.

Your thoughts?

My experience with prisoners is that MOST of them are innocent. Or so they claim.

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Suppose you are poor, working a subsistence level job, and have a family and a mortgage.. You get arrested, and they set bail at $50,000, and your lawyer tells you that you will be sitting in jail for about 18 months before you get to trial. He then tells you that, if you plead guilty, you will be out in 4 days. go back to work, and not force your family onto the street.

What would you do?

 

[High_Gravity]

My experience with prisoners is that MOST of them are innocent. Or so they claim.

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Suppose you are poor, working a subsistence level job, and have a family and a mortgage.. You get arrested, and they set bail at $50,000, and your lawyer tells you that you will be sitting in jail for about 18 months before you get to trial. He then tells you that, if you plead guilty, you will be out in 4 days. go back to work, and not force your family onto the street.

What would you do?

Exactly.

 

[High_Gravity]

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Sometimes you have no choice, if it looks like you will be found guilty and the DA offers you a 5 year sentence opposed to the 20 years you are facing, you have to take it. Alot of people who end up pleading are not guilty my friend, they just had to take the deal so they could see the light of day again.

I can see that. If the only defense attorney you can "afford" is a flunky public defender, 5 years behind bars begins to look a lot better than 20.

Hell yeah it does, at least after 5 years you might have some semblance of a life again. If you go in for 20 theres no telling if you will even make it out.

 

[MikeK]

My first job at a law firm was in 1979 in downtown Atlanta, Ga. Having been arrested a few times in the mid 70s in Fulton county which is Atlanta I was familiar with the county jail. Over the last 33 years I have been in every prison and half of the 170 county jails in Georgia interviewing witnesses and clients. For many years most of my work was criminal defense and it is half now.
Caging non violent offenders, more than half the prison population in America, is not only absurd but it costs 10 times more than extensive probation and/or decriminalizing most of the offenses they are doing time on.
Cost of sending a man to prison: $40,000 a year in incarceration, $15,000 for the arrest and conviction, $15,000 a year in hidden costs such as additional or new costs of all of the public entitlement programs his family will receive as a result of his incarceration and inability to work.
Add in the additional costs of about 2K a year in probation supervision over and above the fines and probation fees they are required to pay.
Unfortunately the Justice system is now a for profit business in the private sector with the taxpayers paying the freight. Costs have quadrupled in the last 12 years as the incarceration rate has skyrocketed.
As most of these offenders are not even criminals. They have drug and alcohol health problems that many times have escalated to petty crimes involving no violence or minor accusations of domestic violence. I had a recent case where a man was washing dishes in his house and his daughter who he had custody of was on the internet. The man received a call from his ex wife and argued and hung up. He was mad and yelled to himself "I am going to shoot that *****" The 13 year old daughter did a OMG on the chat with her friend on the internet and said "My Dad just said out loud that he was going to shoot my Mom. OMG, she is not even here" And the other 13 year old girl had her mother monitoring her internet chats. The Mom called police, they sent the SWAT team out there, arrested him ans charged him with child endangerment and a dozen other charges. Best deal he could get was 10 to do 2. This is the norm these days and we wonder why prison reform is not Priority One.

What has happened and is happening to the criminal justice system in the U.S. is one frightening example of the ultimate effects of laissez-faire capitalism, which has enabled the practice of punishment to become privatized. One manifestation of this glaring example of socio-economic perversion are judges who are taking kickbacks from the "correction" industry for sentencing otherwise probation-eligible offenders to costly prison terms.

Penn. Judges Get Kickbacks for Placing Youths in Privately Owned Jails

This is a perfect manifestation of the belief that an unregulated capitalist system will eventually begin to devour itself.

 

[MikeK]

Sometimes you have no choice, if it looks like you will be found guilty and the DA offers you a 5 year sentence opposed to the 20 years you are facing, you have to take it. Alot of people who end up pleading are not guilty my friend, they just had to take the deal so they could see the light of day again.

I can see that. If the only defense attorney you can "afford" is a flunky public defender, 5 years behind bars begins to look a lot better than 20.

Hell yeah it does, at least after 5 years you might have some semblance of a life again. If you go in for 20 theres no telling if you will even make it out.

Because criminal "justice" has become a profitable business gone are the days when minor, non-violent, first-time offenders were usually fined and/or placed on probation. Today putting people in prison puts money in a lot of pockets, which means the average person needs to be extra-careful to avoid being charged with a crime, however benign.

 

[Avatar4321]

My experience with prisoners is that MOST of them are innocent. Or so they claim.

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Suppose you are poor, working a subsistence level job, and have a family and a mortgage.. You get arrested, and they set bail at $50,000, and your lawyer tells you that you will be sitting in jail for about 18 months before you get to trial. He then tells you that, if you plead guilty, you will be out in 4 days. go back to work, and not force your family onto the street.

What would you do?

Fire them and argue myself. Course, it helps that I have a law degree.

But I can guarantee you that most defendents aren't in any sort of situation like that.

 

[koshergrl]

Few of them have mortgages...not many of them have jobs.

 

[tjvh]

I write to prisoners and I am friends with a few. What I'm struck by is that the sentences don't always match the crime and that the innocent also wind up in prison.

I would like to discuss the transformation that sometimes occurs to remarkable prisoners as a result of their incarceration.

Some truly self-heal, and IMO, it is a waste of resources to keep them locked or to execute them.

Jarvis Masters is the author of Finding Freedom. He is one such remarkable man, living on Death Row in San Quentin Prison.

Prison work has been part of my spiritual path for ten years.

Your thoughts?

My thoughts are simple... If you don't want to spend time in prison, respect our Laws, and don't be a degenerate uncivil asshole.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

That's my experience as well. My favorite is when they tell me they are innocent but want to plead to the crimes.. Im just like, if you didn't do it why would you plead?

Suppose you are poor, working a subsistence level job, and have a family and a mortgage.. You get arrested, and they set bail at $50,000, and your lawyer tells you that you will be sitting in jail for about 18 months before you get to trial. He then tells you that, if you plead guilty, you will be out in 4 days. go back to work, and not force your family onto the street.

What would you do?

Fire them and argue myself. Course, it helps that I have a law degree.

But I can guarantee you that most defendents aren't in any sort of situation like that.

You don't think most defendants in jail are poor and unable to make bail? Have you ever visited a jail and talked to the people awaiting trial? I can assure you that most of them are not that well off.

As for arguing your own case, remember the adage about fools and lawyers.

 

[Gadawg73]

Few of them have mortgages...not many of them have jobs.

Hard to keep a job when you are in jail or prison on bull shit charges.
News flash: when you are in prison you can not work. Can not work means can not pay the mortgage. Not being able to pay the mortgage soon means no mortgage.

 

[Gadawg73]

Suppose you are poor, working a subsistence level job, and have a family and a mortgage.. You get arrested, and they set bail at $50,000, and your lawyer tells you that you will be sitting in jail for about 18 months before you get to trial. He then tells you that, if you plead guilty, you will be out in 4 days. go back to work, and not force your family onto the street.

What would you do?

Fire them and argue myself. Course, it helps that I have a law degree.

But I can guarantee you that most defendents aren't in any sort of situation like that.

You don't think most defendants in jail are poor and unable to make bail? Have you ever visited a jail and talked to the people awaiting trial? I can assure you that most of them are not that well off.

As for arguing your own case, remember the adage about fools and lawyers.

You are right and a lot more are there for probation violations, petty stuff and the majority they can not pay the fines and probation fees. They are in prison for 2 years, get out on probation and immediately have $300 in fines and probation fees a month. The fees are $4 for the fire department, $6 for the courthouse law library, $8 for the assistant to the girl that sucks the Judge's dick. And guess what the #1 probation violation is? Can not pay the probation fees and fines so they go back to jail. No bail on probation violations. However, in misdemeanor cases they lower the bail every few weeks to next to nothing.

 

[Gadawg73]

I write to prisoners and I am friends with a few. What I'm struck by is that the sentences don't always match the crime and that the innocent also wind up in prison.

I would like to discuss the transformation that sometimes occurs to remarkable prisoners as a result of their incarceration.

Some truly self-heal, and IMO, it is a waste of resources to keep them locked or to execute them.

Jarvis Masters is the author of Finding Freedom. He is one such remarkable man, living on Death Row in San Quentin Prison.

Prison work has been part of my spiritual path for ten years.

Your thoughts?

My thoughts are simple... If you don't want to spend time in prison, respect our Laws, and don't be a degenerate uncivil asshole.

Simple answers are for simple minded people.

 

[Big Black Dog]

I write to prisoners and I am friends with a few. What I'm struck by is that the sentences don't always match the crime and that the innocent also wind up in prison.

I would like to discuss the transformation that sometimes occurs to remarkable prisoners as a result of their incarceration.

Some truly self-heal, and IMO, it is a waste of resources to keep them locked or to execute them.

Jarvis Masters is the author of Finding Freedom. He is one such remarkable man, living on Death Row in San Quentin Prison.

Prison work has been part of my spiritual path for ten years.

Your thoughts?

Prison should be a place that nobody wants to go. There should be nothing to make life comfortable and it should be hard work all day long busting big rocks into little rocks. If you are sentenced to 10 years, you should be made to do 10 years day for day. If you are sentenced to death that should happen within 6 months. Then, and only then, will being sent to prison mean anything. Most criminals look at prison as the joke it has become.

 

[Gadawg73]

I write to prisoners and I am friends with a few. What I'm struck by is that the sentences don't always match the crime and that the innocent also wind up in prison.

I would like to discuss the transformation that sometimes occurs to remarkable prisoners as a result of their incarceration.

Some truly self-heal, and IMO, it is a waste of resources to keep them locked or to execute them.

Jarvis Masters is the author of Finding Freedom. He is one such remarkable man, living on Death Row in San Quentin Prison.

Prison work has been part of my spiritual path for ten years.

Your thoughts?

Prison should be a place that nobody wants to go. There should be nothing to make life comfortable and it should be hard work all day long busting big rocks into little rocks. If you are sentenced to 10 years, you should be made to do 10 years day for day. If you are sentenced to death that should happen within 6 months. Then, and only then, will being sent to prison mean anything. Most criminals look at prison as the joke it has become.

That is the myth. You do not work in a prison and have to go there everyday. Listen to what they want as they are the ones charged with keeping the prisoners daily.
The warden on down to the prison staff and jailers all want a peaceful and quiet prison.
Last thing you want in a prison is an angry inmate. That causes more problems for everyone involved that has to work there including the prisoner that wants to do his time and get out.
Prison is no joke. Do not know where you get your information but it is way off.