POLL--31% voting for Obama BELIEVE they are going to get a TAX CUT!

[Navy1960]

The top tax rate is what everyone seems to have an issue with, this is where the socialism card is being thrown. When I read posts its not about all the other tax categories you posted, its about the fact that he is going to tax the rich at a higher rate, that was my point when relating the 2 tax plans.

I think I have made myself pretty clear that the argument that socialism will envelop us all should the Barack Obama plan be implemented is a non-starter. As his plan is socialistic , in that it trends towards socialism it is not anything new to this country as a policy. IMHO the socialism call has for the most part taken away from what I believe is the core argument against the Obama plan and that is it's failure to address spending and deficits as well as increasing spending while doing so. While I understand your point I will in this case have to respectfully disagree with Barack Obama's plan as comming anywhere near anything that would help the US economy.

 

[Navy1960]

good morning navy!!
were there tax increases on the middle tax rate brackets or not? i don't think their were, but i could be wrong on that...your post was not clear on this for me...?

Care

good morning Care, there were several tax increases on the Middle Class actually, an increase in the Social Security payroll tax, medicare, and elimination of deductions for many tax brackets. So while the top rate was raised the middle rate was not cut, further you add to that a reduction of the deficit and a reduction in spending, then you have Bill Clintons tax plan. Contrast that to Barack Obama's which intends to raise the top rate, cut rates below 250,000 according to the .pdf on his web page or 200,000 according to his infomercial. He has no plan to reduce the deficit other than to say we need to reduce the deficit or spending. He does however intend to increase spending. Both Barack Obama and John McCain will in fact add an additional Trillion dollars to the deficit when all is said and done with their programs. This will do nothing to help our economy and will in fact IMO further take our economy into an ever deeper hole.

 

[editec]

I think I have made myself pretty clear that the argument that socialism will envelop us all should the Barack Obama plan be implemented is a non-starter. As his plan is socialistic , in that it trends towards socialism it is not anything new to this country as a policy. IMHO the socialism call has for the most part taken away from what I believe is the core argument against the Obama plan and that is it's failure to address spending and deficits as well as increasing spending while doing so. While I understand your point I will in this case have to respectfully disagree with Barack Obama's plan as comming anywhere near anything that would help the US economy.

Not an entirely unreasonable complaint. )The "socialism will envelop us all is a bit much, of course)

What is McCain's plan to reduce the deficit?

To continue the tax breaks that the superwealthy enjoy right now and to cut social spending to pay for them.

Does his math work out?

Of course not.

No candidate running who actually had a plan to end the deficit would announce it, because to do so he'd have to say:

I'm going to cut the pork out of the military, farm sudsidies to mega-agricorporations, and on all social spending. I'm also going to raise taxes on everyone across the board. I'm going to stop giving away our oil to the oil corpoations and make them pay a fair market price for it. I'm going to impose tariffs on all goods coming into this nation until our working class goes back to work, too.

And that candidate wouldn't have ANY consituency to vote for him at all. Not the superrich, not wall street, not the military industrial complex parasites, not even the poor would vote for that guy.

The right wing would freak out that their sacred pork projects would be cut, the left wing that social services are cut, and everyone would complaint if their taxes are raised.

Neither of the current conspiracies masquading as political parties has a realistic plan because there is NO REALISTIC PLAN that doesn't call for real sacrifices.

Empires are expensive, folks. Corrupted empires like ours even more so.

Don't expect this empire-of-the-sum to get real about budgets until we can stop pissing away enormous amounts of money throwing our weight around in the rest of the world, and we change the anything but free trade policies which have made the majority of us poorer than our father's generation was.

We got into this mess one corrupt and foolish policy at a time, and we're going to have to get out of it by changing those misguided policies.

 

[GigiBowman]

Oh my God--this claim by Obama is probably the biggest farce I have seen in my 55 years. Coming from Obama's campaign rhetoric that he is only going to tax 5% of the population making over 250K & give 95%--or the rest of us a tax cut!

Frankly, I cannot believe that anyone would believe this huge farce. Let alone 31% of Americans--according to this poll--that are voting for Obama simply because they think they're going to get a tax cut with Obama as POTUS. Maybe this 31% represent the 40% in this country that pay no income taxes anyway, & they are looking for their welfare checks?

Now in the final days--we see that this 250K figure has come down to 150K according to Joe Biden, & then to 120K according to Democrat govenor Bill Richardson. This bar is going to come down much lower than this.

Obama states that we are "selfish" if we don't want to give the government more of our hard earned dollars. Yet, Americans are the most generous people on this earth. We still donate more money to people in need in this country & all over the world.

LET'S FACE IT FOLKS! There is no possible--accountable way that 5% of the population or those making over 250K per year, can give us all a tax break, pay for Obama's additional 1 TRILLION in new spending proposals, & give us all national health care insurance at the same time. It simply cannot be done. The only other place Obama can go for all this new spending & tax cuts is the middle class of this country. He will then re-distribute it to people who pay no income taxes.

If you're one of middle class tax payers in this country, voting for Obama simply because you believe you're going to get a tax cut, you are going to be extremely disappointed.

I heard the other 69% believe they are going to get a free tank of gas and a mortgage payment lol

 

[Stoner]

POLL--31% voting for Obama BELIEVE they are going to get a TAX CUT!

I believe it. Have you seen the losers voting for Comrade Hussein? Holy Shit! They are definitly as smart as a car tire. Hell, they don't even know the issues he stands for. Christ, they don't even know his running mate. There's people who think the Messiah is for the death penalty and has Sarah Palin as his VP.

Morons.

 

[Navy1960]

Not an entirely unreasonable complaint. )The "socialism will envelop us all is a bit much, of course)

What is McCain's plan to reduce the deficit?

To continue the tax breaks that the superwealthy enjoy right now and to cut social spending to pay for them.

Does his math work out?

Of course not.

No candidate running who actually had a plan to end the deficit would announce it, because to do so he'd have to say:

I'm going to cut the pork out of the military, farm sudsidies to mega-agricorporations, and on all social spending. I'm also going to raise taxes on everyone across the board. I'm going to stop giving away our oil to the oil corpoations and make them pay a fair market price for it. I'm going to impose tariffs on all goods coming into this nation until our working class goes back to work, too.

And that candidate wouldn't have ANY consituency to vote for him at all. Not the superrich, not wall street, not the military industrial complex parasites, not even the poor would vote for that guy.

The right wing would freak out that their sacred pork projects would be cut, the left wing that social services are cut, and everyone would complaint if their taxes are raised.

Neither of the current conspiracies masquading as political parties has a realistic plan because there is NO REALISTIC PLAN that doesn't call for real sacrifices.

Empires are expensive, folks. Corrupted empires like ours even more so.

Don't expect this empire-of-the-sum to get real about budgets until we can stop pissing away enormous amounts of money throwing our weight around in the rest of the world, and we change the anything but free trade policies which have made the majority of us poorer than our father's generation was.

We got into this mess one corrupt and foolish policy at a time, and we're going to have to get out of it by changing those misguided policies.

I don't think pork is an exclusive property of any party. IMO it would do our government some good to cease it's spending habits as they are now. I do not feel that adding to that spending without a concise way to address the the debt that piles up from it is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Care4all]

Oh my God--this claim by Obama is probably the biggest farce I have seen in my 55 years. Coming from Obama's campaign rhetoric that he is only going to tax 5% of the population making over 250K & give 95%--or the rest of us a tax cut!

Frankly, I cannot believe that anyone would believe this huge farce. Let alone 31% of Americans--according to this poll--that are voting for Obama simply because they think they're going to get a tax cut with Obama as POTUS. Maybe this 31% represent the 40% in this country that pay no income taxes anyway, & they are looking for their welfare checks?

Now in the final days--we see that this 250K figure has come down to 150K according to Joe Biden, & then to 120K according to Democrat govenor Bill Richardson. This bar is going to come down much lower than this.

Obama states that we are "selfish" if we don't want to give the government more of our hard earned dollars. Yet, Americans are the most generous people on this earth. We still donate more money to people in need in this country & all over the world.

LET'S FACE IT FOLKS! There is no possible--accountable way that 5% of the population or those making over 250K per year, can give us all a tax break, pay for Obama's additional 1 TRILLION in new spending proposals, & give us all national health care insurance at the same time. It simply cannot be done. The only other place Obama can go for all this new spending & tax cuts is the middle class of this country. He will then re-distribute it to people who pay no income taxes.

If you're one of middle class tax payers in this country, voting for Obama simply because you believe you're going to get a tax cut, you are going to be extremely disappointed.

Who is paying for mccain's tax breaks?

Mccain's programs and policies add 7 trillion to the national debt in 10 years, Obama's will add 5.2 trillion in 10 years...

mccain's hurts us most.

regardless, it is ridiculous that both of these guys are just continuing to add to the out of control national debt when they KNOW we will have to start paying back the money borrowed of the SS surplusses they devoured without blinking an eye....within the next few years.

The other thing that is very bad for our country is that this debt is borrowed from foreigners now, not from americans thru war bonds and stuff, so this is extremely unsafe and puts our country at risk of having to develop foreign policy that favors those we are borrowing it all from like China and Saudi Arabia....this is very risky and bad news for us americans that want to keep our country as a sovereign country looking out for America FIRST.

We will be spending more on the interest payment on that debt, than we do on the military/Defense for our entire country if we keep this up...right now it is nearly 300 BILLION A YEAR just for the interest payment, not even paying a dime of it down.....when that 11 trillion all sets in, it will be more like 500 billion a year just on the interest payment.

WE ARE IN BIG, BIG, BIG Financial TROUBLE GUYS and GALS.

Care

 

[dilloduck]

Who is paying for mccain's tax breaks?

Mccain's programs and policies add 7 trillion to the national debt in 10 years, Obama's will add 5.2 trillion in 5 years...

mccain's hurts us most.

regardless, it is ridiculous that both of these guys are just continuing to add to the out of control national debt when they KNOW we will have to start paying back the money borrowed of the SS surplusses they devoured without blinking an eye....within the next few years.

The other thing that is very bad for our country is that this debt is borrowed from foreigners now, not from americans thru war bonds and stuff, so this is extremely unsafe and puts our country at risk of having to develop foreign policy that favors those we are borrowing it all from like China and Saudi Arabia....this is very risky and bad news for us americans that want to keep our country as a sovereign country looking out for America FIRST.

We will be spending more on the interest payment on that debt, than we do on the military/Defense for our entire country if we keep this up...right now it is nearly 300 BILLION A YEAR just for the interest payment, not even paying a dime of it down.....when that 11 trillion all sets in, it will be more like 500 billion a year just on the interest payment.

WE ARE IN BIG, BIG, BIG Financial TROUBLE GUYS and GALS.

Care

We are---we cant' afford either of these idiots but here we are--trying to decide if one of their "tax plan" will give me a nickle more than the other one.

 

[Care4all]

We are---we cant' afford either of these idiots but here we are--trying to decide if one of their "tax plan" will give me a nickle more than the other one.

obama's in 10 years. i made a typo on saqying obama's in 5 years, just an fyi

 

[dilloduck]

obama's in 10 years. i made a typo on saqying obama's in 5 years, just an fyi

You do realize that all these numbers may as well be pulled out of a hat ?
There are a million variables that can turn these numbers on their head.

 

[Care4all]

You do realize that all these numbers may as well be pulled out of a hat ?
There are a million variables that can turn these numbers on their head.

yes, and inevitably, they will be turned on their head and even be worse than what the nonpartisan tax analysis groups have figured....

 

[elvis]

I will laugh my ass off when everyone's taxes go up.

 

[Annie]

I will laugh my ass off when everyone's taxes go up.

I'm guess mine won't, but none of you would want to be me.