Penn and Teller on the value of a college education

[martybegan]

"Conservatives" hate real education. Look at their stands on global warming and such statements as "Rapes seldom result in pregnancy". Most "Conservatives" are the very people that took the 'basket weaving' courses at college.

And there are a number of vintners in the Willimette Valley that took a couple of hundred acres of hillside previously almost unused, and made them into million dollar operations. I think that PC has absolutely no real world skills, and is deterimined to denigrate all those that do.

Yeah, all those anti-vac nutters are sooooo conservative....

This conservative took Chemical Engineering in College, so go suck it.

 

[rdean]

Must you always be a tool? Conservatives don't hate education, they value it. There are in fact, far too many kids majoring in things like 18th century french literature. My 30 year old neice is STILL in school working on her PhD in medieval literature. 30 years old and she grades papers for the professors and fills in classes shen the professor is out. Her prospect for a real job in the future is some old white haired professor dying or teaching english in a high school or college.

My 20 year old (conservative like his old man) son is studying fire protection and safety technology in the engineering college at his university. He is spending the summer in an internship with BP on the north slope in Alaska. With overtime hours, he is averaging $30 per hour. His university is only one of two in the US with an accredited program for this field and only has about 200 students total in it. The vast majority of them spend their summers following their sophomore year in internships and have high paying jobs waiting for them when they graduate.

The difference? One is in a field where there is a real need and the other is pursuing what would better be described as a hobby. I'm not saying that colleges shouldn't provide a wide field of majors, but there is only so much call for history and english majors out in the work world.

Some very few conservatives value education. When you have Rick Santorum saying Obama is a snob for wanting education to be available to all Americans. Or the constant ridicule of scientists and universities by the right wing. Chinese, Indian and Mexican students see US schools as the finest in the world. Republicans see them as riddled with liberals and liberal thinkers. And the nonsense that comes out of so called "conservative think tanks". What a disgrace. How can you have so many conservatives on one message board who believe that saying "demand drives job creation" is one of the dumbest things they ever heard?

Our engineering, economics and physics departments are respected the world over. But our humanities are a fucking joke the world over and it is the humanities that conservatives are usually going on about, though YEC do pick fights with science in various ways, they do not represent a majority of conservatives, nor of Santorum.

So, once again, you demonstrate that you do not know what the hell you are talking about, though it wont slow you down one nanosecond.

Yea, half of a university is so good and the other half so bad. That's just stupid.

 

[rdean]

"Conservatives" hate real education. Look at their stands on global warming and such statements as "Rapes seldom result in pregnancy". Most "Conservatives" are the very people that took the 'basket weaving' courses at college.

And there are a number of vintners in the Willimette Valley that took a couple of hundred acres of hillside previously almost unused, and made them into million dollar operations. I think that PC has absolutely no real world skills, and is deterimined to denigrate all those that do.

Yeah, all those anti-vac nutters are sooooo conservative....

This conservative took Chemical Engineering in College, so go suck it.

Many conservatives that go into engineering or science tend to pick areas that don't touch on the age of the world. It's the whole "evolution" thing.

 

[rdean]

Must you always be a tool? Conservatives don't hate education, they value it. There are in fact, far too many kids majoring in things like 18th century french literature. My 30 year old neice is STILL in school working on her PhD in medieval literature. 30 years old and she grades papers for the professors and fills in classes shen the professor is out. Her prospect for a real job in the future is some old white haired professor dying or teaching english in a high school or college.

My 20 year old (conservative like his old man) son is studying fire protection and safety technology in the engineering college at his university. He is spending the summer in an internship with BP on the north slope in Alaska. With overtime hours, he is averaging $30 per hour. His university is only one of two in the US with an accredited program for this field and only has about 200 students total in it. The vast majority of them spend their summers following their sophomore year in internships and have high paying jobs waiting for them when they graduate.

The difference? One is in a field where there is a real need and the other is pursuing what would better be described as a hobby. I'm not saying that colleges shouldn't provide a wide field of majors, but there is only so much call for history and english majors out in the work world.

"Conservatives don't hate education, they value it. There are in fact, far too many kids majoring in things like 18th century french literature."

You are so right....and Right!

Examples?


1. Wine Making. College isn't just about boozing after hours. Students at a host of schools can take viticulture -- learning to make wine from the grape growing to the grape stomping (or pressing these days) and beyond.
2. Golf Management. Four years on the links doesn't sound all that hard, but these students actually learn everything from how to keep a green "green" to hospitality.
3. Boilermaking. Not just the Purdue mascot, it's the study of how to make and repair steam parts.
4. Franchising. An entire line of study can help you run your own fast food chain. It's a far cry from flipping burgers.
5. Philology. A fancy name for the study of language. Take your pick from Tagalog to Urdu.
6. Meat Cutting. Thank a meat-cutting major for your steak tonight.
7. Home Ec. Yes, even in this day and age -- although they call it "family and consumer sciences" these days.
8. Home Furnishings and Equipment Installers. A roundabout way of saying "interior design," but they sound large and in charge this way.
9. Auctioneering. Classes to make you talk faster! New Yorkers need not apply.
10. Fashion and Fabric Consultation. Next stop: personal shopper.
11. Aromatherapy. You mean there's more to it than walking through Yankee Candle and taking home what smells good?
12. Human Sexuality. Let's talk about sex, baby! They do it at Widener University!
13. Canadian History. Our neighbor to the north is YOUNGER than the United States. And that's saying a lot.
14. Gunsmithing. As long as there's a right to bear arms, someone has to make them, right?
15. Mortuary Science and Embalming. Somebody's got to do it, but way to bring a pallor to your party days.
16. Logic. Can we sign everyone up for a year of this?
17. Security and Loss Prevention. They're NOT just mall cops apparently.
18. Cartooning. It's not a well-known college, but there's a school devoted entirely to comic books. Spider-Man eat your heart out.
19. Bagpiping. There's never a shortage of pipers at Scottish funerals ... or weddings ... thanks to Carnegie Mellon.
20. Sports Ministry. Get out there with your pastor and play paddleball at Belhaven. You'll be in sports heaven.
Would you pay for these?
Meatcutting and 19 More Strange College Majors Parents Are Paying For | The Stir

Every one seems like a valid major

What did you major in?

They point to a subject they know nothing about, ridicule it, then say, "See how dumb". Right wingers are a damaged people.

 

[martybegan]

"Conservatives" hate real education. Look at their stands on global warming and such statements as "Rapes seldom result in pregnancy". Most "Conservatives" are the very people that took the 'basket weaving' courses at college.

And there are a number of vintners in the Willimette Valley that took a couple of hundred acres of hillside previously almost unused, and made them into million dollar operations. I think that PC has absolutely no real world skills, and is deterimined to denigrate all those that do.

Yeah, all those anti-vac nutters are sooooo conservative....

This conservative took Chemical Engineering in College, so go suck it.

Many conservatives that go into engineering or science tend to pick areas that don't touch on the age of the world. It's the whole "evolution" thing.

99.99% of engineering doesnt care about the age of the world anyway when it comes to thier work.

And Im catholic and we are fine with evolution, so that dog does not hunt with me anyway.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I wonder how many Libs have degrees in the study of the south Bolivian lesbian newt in a mostly
heterosexual rain forest.

Most engineers and scientists are liberal

Conservatives get their degrees in "Christian Studies"

No, most engineers are conservative, most scientists apolitical and most liars, grifters and thieves are libtards like you, fraud.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Gotta love this,

The conservative dislike of education ...

when you start your post off with that kind of grossly false statement it kinda makes the rest of your opinion hard to accept.

That is the real BS of the piece, the children I know who grew up in conservative republican families cling to the same bifurcated views as most wingnuts on USMB.

Good thing you used the term "wingnuts", it adds validity to your point of view.

Yup....Conservatives love education

As long as it is abolish the Dept of Education and Homeschool for everyone

Abolishing the Dept of Education would be one of the BEST things we could do for education in this country. Our educational system started having its worst problems right after the DoE was set up and that is not mere coincidence as they have regularly interfered in harmful ways with local education, ridding the class room of discipline and order was among the first calamities these morons have inflicted to local schools.

And homeschool works far better and the results speak for themselves.

Obviously you weren't homeschooled, lying fake.

 

[Skull Pilot]

What a totally dumbass video. I am just finished three quarters at Portland State University. Of course, I was taking bullshit courses like Chemistry and Calculus. And the young people in class with me were nothing like portrayed here. Many of them were, like me, working and only going to college part time, half to three quarters load. And all seemed very serious about learning the subjects.

Right now, my company is having real problems recruiting material and mechanical engineers worldwide. The pay is good, the benefits, in all nations, above standard, but there are not enough applicants to fill the jobs. Here in the states, the same with craftsmen. Don't know about the worldwide situation there.

Higher education, in the appropriate field, whether at the technical level, or university level, is still the way for a more rewarding life and career.

Its the typical rightwing disdain for higher education

They think everyone majors in 18th century French Literature

10 Most Popular Bachelors Degrees In 2011

Notice that the top 10 bachelor degrees include Psychology, Criminal Justice, and Human services.

Now most of those folks with those degrees will have wasted their time and money getting them.

Not disdain, just fact.

 

[martybegan]

What a totally dumbass video. I am just finished three quarters at Portland State University. Of course, I was taking bullshit courses like Chemistry and Calculus. And the young people in class with me were nothing like portrayed here. Many of them were, like me, working and only going to college part time, half to three quarters load. And all seemed very serious about learning the subjects.

Right now, my company is having real problems recruiting material and mechanical engineers worldwide. The pay is good, the benefits, in all nations, above standard, but there are not enough applicants to fill the jobs. Here in the states, the same with craftsmen. Don't know about the worldwide situation there.

Higher education, in the appropriate field, whether at the technical level, or university level, is still the way for a more rewarding life and career.

Its the typical rightwing disdain for higher education

They think everyone majors in 18th century French Literature

10 Most Popular Bachelors Degrees In 2011

Notice that the top 10 bachelor degrees include Psychology, Criminal Justice, and Human services.

Now most of those folks with those degrees will have wasted their time and money getting them.

Not disdain, just fact.

I have been trying to find a source for the numbers of degrees issued by ranking, and all i can find is links similar to this. To me "popular" may not translate into # of degrees issued.

Seeing engineering on the list makes me skeptical, as by # of degrees I wouldnt expect to see engineering that high up there.

 

[JimBowie1958]

"Conservatives" hate real education. Look at their stands on global warming ...

Conservative like the NY Times or the BBC?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/11/science/earth/what-to-make-of-a-climate-change-plateau.html?_r=1&

The rise in the surface temperature of earth has been markedly slower over the last 15 years than in the 20 years before that. And that lull in warming has occurred even as greenhouse gases have accumulated in the atmosphere at a record pace.

BBC News - Climate slowdown means extreme rates of warming 'not as likely'

Since 1998, there has been an unexplained "standstill" in the heating of the Earth's atmosphere.

I guess the insistence of both papers that AGW will resume very soon saves their libtard credentials?

and such statements as "Rapes seldom result in pregnancy".

lol, you think every conservative agrees with that statement?

Most "Conservatives" are the very people that took the 'basket weaving' courses at college.

Judging from your knowledge of conservatism, it would seem you are the one who is compellingly ignorant about the subject, not conservatives.

 

[rightwinger]

What a totally dumbass video. I am just finished three quarters at Portland State University. Of course, I was taking bullshit courses like Chemistry and Calculus. And the young people in class with me were nothing like portrayed here. Many of them were, like me, working and only going to college part time, half to three quarters load. And all seemed very serious about learning the subjects.

Right now, my company is having real problems recruiting material and mechanical engineers worldwide. The pay is good, the benefits, in all nations, above standard, but there are not enough applicants to fill the jobs. Here in the states, the same with craftsmen. Don't know about the worldwide situation there.

Higher education, in the appropriate field, whether at the technical level, or university level, is still the way for a more rewarding life and career.

Its the typical rightwing disdain for higher education

They think everyone majors in 18th century French Literature

10 Most Popular Bachelors Degrees In 2011

Notice that the top 10 bachelor degrees include Psychology, Criminal Justice, and Human services.

Now most of those folks with those degrees will have wasted their time and money getting them.

Not disdain, just fact.

Many police forces now require Criminal Justice degrees. Used to take a High School diploma. The other eight on that list are pretty solid and support my contention

 

[rightwinger]

Gotta love this,

when you start your post off with that kind of grossly false statement it kinda makes the rest of your opinion hard to accept.

Good thing you used the term "wingnuts", it adds validity to your point of view.

Yup....Conservatives love education

As long as it is abolish the Dept of Education and Homeschool for everyone

Abolishing the Dept of Education would be one of the BEST things we could do for education in this country. Our educational system started having its worst problems right after the DoE was set up and that is not mere coincidence as they have regularly interfered in harmful ways with local education, ridding the class room of discipline and order was among the first calamities these morons have inflicted to local schools.

And homeschool works far better and the results speak for themselves.

Obviously you weren't homeschooled, lying fake.

The DOE provides about 10% of the funding for our schools. If you have a problem with our schools, you need to go after the local and state governments and are providing 90% of the funding and have the most control over the quality of our education
Homeschool is a niche market and not a solution to our current educational issues

 

[martybegan]

Its the typical rightwing disdain for higher education

They think everyone majors in 18th century French Literature

10 Most Popular Bachelors Degrees In 2011

Notice that the top 10 bachelor degrees include Psychology, Criminal Justice, and Human services.

Now most of those folks with those degrees will have wasted their time and money getting them.

Not disdain, just fact.

Many police forces now require Criminal Justice degrees. Used to take a High School diploma. The other eight on that list are pretty solid and support my contention

Or military service.

Also popular does not mean "most degrees issued"

 

[JimBowie1958]

Yup....Conservatives love education

As long as it is abolish the Dept of Education and Homeschool for everyone

There was Education before the Department of Education. One does not have to be old enough to remember.

Meaning squat

The US has a hodgepodge of education with communities giving varying emphasis on education. Sadly, the poorest performing schools tend to be in those Red States most intent on eliminating the Dept of Education

bullshit. The cultural bias that blue state yuppies preload into any tests only confirms that more people in red states do not share the same cultural values. If you categorize IQ or SAT scores by income and race, the cultural bias is even more apparent.

Tests that have normalized groups including race and income levels show little significant difference.

Also more students in red states get homeschooled, and there is a high disproportion of the better students being home schooled, so the better students get culled from the public schools more often in red states.

Besides all that, you are a fucking liar so who really gives a shit what you try to think, you lying bastard?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Its the typical rightwing disdain for higher education

They think everyone majors in 18th century French Literature

10 Most Popular Bachelors Degrees In 2011

Notice that the top 10 bachelor degrees include Psychology, Criminal Justice, and Human services.

Now most of those folks with those degrees will have wasted their time and money getting them.

Not disdain, just fact.

Many police forces now require Criminal Justice degrees. Used to take a High School diploma. The other eight on that list are pretty solid and support my contention

Yeah and how many people with that degree are going to actually be cops?

How many Psych majors haven't wasted their time and money?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Yup....Conservatives love education

As long as it is abolish the Dept of Education and Homeschool for everyone

Abolishing the Dept of Education would be one of the BEST things we could do for education in this country. Our educational system started having its worst problems right after the DoE was set up and that is not mere coincidence as they have regularly interfered in harmful ways with local education, ridding the class room of discipline and order was among the first calamities these morons have inflicted to local schools.

And homeschool works far better and the results speak for themselves.

Obviously you weren't homeschooled, lying fake.

The DOE provides about 10% of the funding for our schools.

Which is why we don't need it since it costs more than it contributes.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Yup....Conservatives love education

As long as it is abolish the Dept of Education and Homeschool for everyone

Abolishing the Dept of Education would be one of the BEST things we could do for education in this country. Our educational system started having its worst problems right after the DoE was set up and that is not mere coincidence as they have regularly interfered in harmful ways with local education, ridding the class room of discipline and order was among the first calamities these morons have inflicted to local schools.

And homeschool works far better and the results speak for themselves.

Obviously you weren't homeschooled, lying fake.

The DOE provides about 10% of the funding for our schools.

Yeah after taking our taxes and then giving part of it back, I guess we should all be grateful that not ALL our taxes go into Chicago political machine patronage.

If you have a problem with our schools, you need to go after the local and state governments and are providing 90% of the funding and have the most control over the quality of our education
Homeschool is a niche market and not a solution to our current educational issues

Only because libtard fascists like you stonewall all attempts to assist parents that educate their children at home. lol, you prevent much funding and support if any at all then use the low participation from that to support your claims? What a fucking lying bastard.

 

[rightwinger]

Abolishing the Dept of Education would be one of the BEST things we could do for education in this country. Our educational system started having its worst problems right after the DoE was set up and that is not mere coincidence as they have regularly interfered in harmful ways with local education, ridding the class room of discipline and order was among the first calamities these morons have inflicted to local schools.

And homeschool works far better and the results speak for themselves.

Obviously you weren't homeschooled, lying fake.

The DOE provides about 10% of the funding for our schools.

Which is why we don't need it since it costs more than it contributes.

If you look at the countries that are kicking our butts in education, a common theme is that they have more national control of the education system....not LESS

 

[editec]

Penn and teller can go suck my bachelorette.

 

[rightwinger]

Abolishing the Dept of Education would be one of the BEST things we could do for education in this country. Our educational system started having its worst problems right after the DoE was set up and that is not mere coincidence as they have regularly interfered in harmful ways with local education, ridding the class room of discipline and order was among the first calamities these morons have inflicted to local schools.

And homeschool works far better and the results speak for themselves.

Obviously you weren't homeschooled, lying fake.

The DOE provides about 10% of the funding for our schools.

Yeah after taking our taxes and then giving part of it back, I guess we should all be grateful that not ALL our taxes go into Chicago political machine patronage.

If you have a problem with our schools, you need to go after the local and state governments and are providing 90% of the funding and have the most control over the quality of our education
Homeschool is a niche market and not a solution to our current educational issues

Only because libtard fascists like you stonewall all attempts to assist parents that educate their children at home. lol, you prevent much funding and support if any at all then use the low participation from that to support your claims? What a fucking lying bastard.

Homeschooling is a gimmic, not a solution

THe majority of American families can no longer afford to keep one parent home to educate the children. There are also limitations on the educational capabilities of the parents