Paul Fussell — “Thank God for the Atom Bomb”

[AZrailwhale]

Fault of the US-government. You transported illegally weapons with passenger ships to England. A double crime. Because of a mistake by an inspection of the RMS (Royal Mail Ship) Lusitania your weapons exploded and the Lusitania sank. I do not think the dependants of this people got a compensation from your government.

First, WE didn't transport anything. Lusitania was a British flagged ship transporting largely British passengers. Second, she wasn't carrying weapons, she was carrying percussion fuzes and small arms ammo. Third, she DIDN'T blow up, the torpedo causes a small secondary explosion that possibly hastened her sinking. Merchant ships, even large passenger liners didn't survive torpedo or mine hits in WWI. RMS Britannic a improved sister ship of Titanic sank in little more than a hour after a single explosion from either a torpedo or most likely a mine. That was a year and a half after the Lusitania sank.

Now, what exactly are the crimes you are accusing the USA of?

 

[elektra]

Read what I said and not what you think. You are not able to take criticism.















I'm by the way convinced never any German did do anything bad to you nor to anyone else in your family in all history of mankind - nevertheless you hate Germans with your whole person. So you learned this hate. But who did teach you? And you are for sure not a Jew but you try to speak the same time in the name of Jews - also in the name of my own murdered family members - and I guess you love it also to play with the Holocaust traumata of Jews. You should do something against your wronSa

gness.

You are a criminal racist who thinks in the same structures like the Nazis did do. You use only other placeholders. By the way: Are you Czech, Polish, Russian or a Trumpican?

You really should learn German history. Why go through life with such crazy assumptions on your head. It is not healthy.

Call me all the names you wish, that just shows you have no facts on your side but still wish to be right.

What am I? I am thee greatest, most prolific European race.

 

[Mac-7]

The article makes ridiculous militaristic arguments that have been utterly debunked for decades now. I thought you were a liberal? Ah, I guess since Truman ordered the atomic bombings, you're defending them. You're aware that the vast majority of scholars who specialize in Hiroshima and Nagasaki reject the myth that nuking Japan was necessary and saved lives, right?

The following article by historian Ward Wilson debunks every argument made in Fussell's silly propaganda piece:

https://www.belfercenter.org/sites/default/files/files/publication/is3104_pp162-179_wilson.pdf

Wilson “debunks” nothing

he merely disagrees

there were of course dissenters at the time who were honest men

but so were the many, many others who supported using the bomb

for myself I’m happy it went down the way it did

because a necessary member of my linage would have been in the invasion and may not have returned to propagate the successors to the family tree, including me

 

[zaangalewa]

First, WE didn't transport anything.

"You" delivered weapons in passenger ships like the Lusitania to England - what means the USA was allied with England.

Lusitania was a British flagged ship transporting largely British passengers.

Always thought it been an US-American ship. Whatever.

Second, she wasn't carrying weapons, she was carrying percussion fuzes and small arms ammo.

Whatever had been on board - it sank the Lusitiania. A warn shot with a torpedo had not been able to sank it.

Third, she DIDN'T blow up, the torpedo causes a small secondary explosion

Exactly. But what you call "small" sank the Lusinaian very fast. About 2 years after this accident the USA declared war on Germany.

that possibly hastened her nking. Merchant ships, even large passenger liners didn't survive torpedo or mine hits in WWI.

What's nonsense as far as I know. The torpedos had been primitve. If a big ship sank at all then it sank very slow and the passengers had a very good chance to be saved with their own rescue boats.

RMS Britannic a improved sister ship of Titanic sank in little more than a hour after a single explosion from either a torpedo or most likely a mine.

It sank because your weapons exploded which you delivered with this passenger ship to England. Another explanation why this ship sank so fast makes not a big sense.

That was a year and a half after the Lusitania sank.

Now, what exactly are the crimes you are accusing the USA of?

You should have an own list about the war crimes of the USA because you are your own best source and your archives never had been destroyed from anyone else. Let me give you here now only this answer: The "original sin" of the empire USA had been that you took part in World War 1 (what made this big European war to a real world war). Otherwise I guess you could be a more happy nation now. You created and/or strengthened on your own many of the problems which you endlessly fight.

 

[zaangalewa]

You really should learn German history. Why go through life with such crazy assumptions on your head. It is not healthy.

Call me all the names you wish, that just shows you have no facts on your side but still wish to be right.

What am I? I am thee greatest, most prolific European race.

Why do you speak with me? What did you not understand from this all what I said to you? And why do you never give any anwer to any question, structural Nazi? Why do you not even give yourselve the answers to this questions? Your "patriotism" is an empty bubble. ... and by the way: no one needs nukes nor lies to love the own country.



The Ukrainian people beg the world: "Smash down all Russian aeroplanes and rockets from the sky over the Ukraine - then we will have a chance to win!"
And I have to answer: If this will cause a nuclear war then you will win less than nothing. This god damned nukes force us to be only able to watch the cruel war crimes of the honorless Russian army. But this is still not the end of this story - nor the end of the history of justice.

 

[elektra]

Why do you speak with me? What did you not understand from this all what I said to you? And why do you never give any anwer to any question, structural Nazi? Why do you not even give yourselve the answers to this questions? Your "patriotism" is an empty bubble. ... and by the way: no one needs nukes nor lies to love the own country.



The Ukrainian people beg the world: "Smash down all Russian aeroplanes and rockets from the sky over the Ukraine - then we will have a chance to win!"
And I have to answer: If this will cause a nuclear war then you will win less than nothing. This god damned nukes force us to be only able to watch the cruel war crimes of the honorless Russian army. But this is still not the end of this story - nor the end of the history of justice.

Go help them

You blame nukes for your weakness

 

[zaangalewa]

Go help them

No.

You blame nukes for your weakness

No. The USA is the main reason for the weakness of Germany and Europe. By the way: What's your real nationality, moriturus? Russian?

 

[elektra]

No.



No. The USA is the main reason for the weakness of Germany and Europe. By the way: What's your real nationality, moriturus? Russian?

Germany is weak because that is simply how the history of your tiny country progressed.

Germany is weak because of it energy policy, leaving Germany dependent on other countries.

Germany is weaked because so many Germans believe their marxist history of the world.

 

[elektra]

By the way: What's your real nationality, moriturus?

What does race or nationality have to do with anything and why such a strong German interest in race?

You identify yourself by race as if that gave you knowledge and perspective, it does not.

 

[zaangalewa]

Germany is weak because that is simply how the history of your tiny country progressed.

Germany is weak because of it energy policy, leaving Germany dependent on other countries.

Germany is weaked because so many Germans believe their marxist history of the world.

Elektra - do you not have anything to do what makes any sense - like to do suicide for example?

 

[elektra]

Elektra - do you not have anything to do what makes any sense - like to do suicide for example?

Suicide? I see you are still stuck on your personal feelings.

It is pathetic that you reaction to facts about German history are so hateful. It says a lot about you.

 

[AZrailwhale]

"You" delivered weapons in passenger ships like the Lusitania to England - what means the USA was allied with England.



Always thought it been an US-American ship. Whatever.



Whatever had been on board - it sank the Lusitiania. A warn shot with a torpedo had not been able to sank it.



Exactly. But what you call "small" sank the Lusinaian very fast. About 2 years after this accident the USA declared war on Germany.



What's nonsense as far as I know. The torpedos had been primitve. If a big ship sank at all then it sank very slow and the passengers had a very good chance to be saved with their own rescue boats.



It sank because your weapons exploded which you delivered with this passenger ship to England. Another explanation why this ship sank so fast makes not a big sense.



You should have an own list about the war crimes of the USA because you are your own best source and your archives never had been destroyed from anyone else. Let me give you here now only this answer: The "original sin" of the empire USA had been that you took part in World War 1 (what made this big European war to a real world war). Otherwise I guess you could be a more happy nation now. You created and/or strengthened on your own many of the problems which you endlessly fight.

Lusitania was a British ship flying the British ensign. Her cargo was British property, bought and paid for. The US was truly neutral at the time. We sold to anyone. The Germans even built merchant cargo submarines to bypass the British blockade and we were happy to sell to them. The torpedo wasn’t a warning shot, it was a deliberate attack on a merchant ship without warning. Under the rules of war at the time, warships, including submarines, were required to allow merchant ships time to evacuate their crews and passengers before sinking them. That’s why Americans were so outraged by the U-20 sinking a passenger liner without warning.
There was no explosion on Lusitania other than the torpedo. It hit under the bridge, the small arms ammo and fuses were in the cargo holds in the bow. Small arms ammo is not particularly explosive and is almost immune to shock.
Large ships in WWI often sank from a single torpedo or mine hit. The British lost three large armored cruisers Abukir, Cressy and Hogue all at the same time to single torpedo hits and armored cruisers had better compartmentation that merchant ships.

 

[zaangalewa]

Lusitania was a British ship flying the British ensign. Her cargo was British property, bought and paid for. The US was truly neutral at the time.

What a nonsense. It brought US-American war weapons to Geat Britain.

We sold to anyone.

Specially the whole USA to the god "war".

The Germans

¿We?

even built merchant cargo submarines to bypass the British blockade and we were happy to sell to them.

"You" did not even sell helium to Zeppelin - what forced them to use hydrogen instead - and the peaceful part of air traffic died in Lake Hurst.

The torpedo wasn’t a warning shot, it was a deliberate attack on a merchant ship without warning.

You was on the bridge of which one of this ships? Í heard they liked to an inspection - the captain of the Lusitania refused to let them do so - they shot a warn shot to stop them - something went wrong and whatever it was exploded in the Lusitania. Anyway it is totally unimportnat what really had happened because in case "you" are right you had to accuse the captain of the ship.

Under the rules of war at the time, warships, including submarines, were required to allow merchant ships time to evacuate their crews and passengers before sinking them.

And who made this law? Where had the crew of the submarine to appear before which court?

That’s why Americans were so outraged by the U-20 sinking a passenger liner without warning.

US-Americans seem always to be totally "outraged" when they like to go in war. I remember in this context the total artifical stupidity of all US-Americans when you was on war path against the Iraq under Saddam Husein. You all had been war hungry and all of you had been totally mad.

There was no explosion on Lusitania other than the torpedo.

Or not.

It hit under the bridge, the small arms ammo and fuses were in the cargo holds in the bow. Small arms ammo is not particularly explosive and is almost immune to shock.
Large ships in WWI often sank from a single torpedo or mine hit. The British lost three large armored cruisers Abukir, Cressy and Hogue all at the same time to single torpedo hits and armored cruisers had better compartmentation that merchant ships.

By the way. Knows still anyone why England and Germany had been in war because some Serbs murdered Sofie, the duchess von Hohenberg and archduke Ferdinand from Austria? Who gave by the way this Serbs the order to murder the archduke and his wife? A secret service of the USA? We still don't know who this had been - although millons and millions and much more millions had to die because of this murder. Not to forget also 128 US-Americans who travelled to England on board of the Lusitania.

 

[AZrailwhale]

What a nonsense. It brought US-American war weapons to Geat Britain.



Specially the whole USA to the god "war".



¿We?



"You" did not even sell helium to Zeppelin - what forced them to use hydrogen instead - and the peaceful part of air traffic died in Lake Hurst.



You was on the bridge of which one of this ships? Í heard they liked to an inspection - the captain of the Lusitania refused to let them do so - they shot a warn shot to stop them - something went wrong and whatever it was exploded in the Lusitania. Anyway it is totally unimportnat what really had happened because in case "you" are right you had to accuse the captain of the ship.



And who made this law? Where had the crew of the submarine to appear before which court?



US-Americans seem always to be totally "outraged" when they like to go in war. I remember in this context the total artifical stupidity of all US-Americans when you was on war path against the Iraq under Saddam Husein. You all had been war hungry and all of you had been totally mad.



Or not.



By the way. Knows still anyone why England and Germany had been in war because some Serbs murdered Sofie, the duchess von Hohenberg and archduke Ferdinand from Austria? Who gave by the way this Serbs the order to murder the archduke and his wife? A secret service of the USA? We still don't know who this had been - although millons and millions and much more millions had to die because of this murder. Not to forget also 128 US-Americans who travelled to England on board of the Lusitania.

Lusitania was owned and operated by the White Star Line, her title was RMS, meaning Royal Mail Ship, meaning she was licensed by the British Royal Post Office to carry mail. White Star also had owned Titanic and did own Britannic, Titanics improver near sister ship.

I posted what her cargo was, shell casings (inert), five million rounds of small arms ammo (.303 caliber rifle rounds) and several thousand artillery primers. None of those things are particularly sensitive to shock.

“we” means Americans, I am an American.

Helium was a critical war material, the US was the only supplier in the world and the government wasn’t willing to sell it to the Nazis since it had other military uses than filling the cells of a civilian derigible (a derigible is a rigid framed lighter than air airship unlike the non-rigid blimps that the USN used for anti submarine warfare during WWII.
It’s public record from both the RN investigation and German Navy records that the sub commander never attempted to communicate with Lusitania. In fact the U Boat commander is on record testifying that he didn’t even surface because he was afraid that Lusitania would ram or shoot deck guns (she was unarmed) at him.

you really should do at least a little research before posting things that make it clear that you are a biased, ignorant liar.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The USA had absolutelly nothing to do with World War 1

You're into that old-school German empire mythology. That much is clear.

Just as Putin subscribes to the old school Russiian mythology.

It seems to me both are obstacles to the progression of our species.

You should rethink. Maybe consider a milder, more limited Nationalism. Self determination and then full stop, as opposed to determining also for others.

 

[AZrailwhale]

What a nonsense. It brought US-American war weapons to Geat Britain.



Specially the whole USA to the god "war".



¿We?



"You" did not even sell helium to Zeppelin - what forced them to use hydrogen instead - and the peaceful part of air traffic died in Lake Hurst.



You was on the bridge of which one of this ships? Í heard they liked to an inspection - the captain of the Lusitania refused to let them do so - they shot a warn shot to stop them - something went wrong and whatever it was exploded in the Lusitania. Anyway it is totally unimportnat what really had happened because in case "you" are right you had to accuse the captain of the ship.



And who made this law? Where had the crew of the submarine to appear before which court?



US-Americans seem always to be totally "outraged" when they like to go in war. I remember in this context the total artifical stupidity of all US-Americans when you was on war path against the Iraq under Saddam Husein. You all had been war hungry and all of you had been totally mad.



Or not.



By the way. Knows still anyone why England and Germany had been in war because some Serbs murdered Sofie, the duchess von Hohenberg and archduke Ferdinand from Austria? Who gave by the way this Serbs the order to murder the archduke and his wife? A secret service of the USA? We still don't know who this had been - although millons and millions and much more millions had to die because of this murder. Not to forget also 128 US-Americans who travelled to England on board of the Lusitania.

There were centuries old maritime warfare laws that required certain behaviors of warships when stopping and searchIng merchant ships. If the ship belonged to a enemy, or it was a neutral carrying war material, the warship had the option of placing a prize crew on the ship and sending it into a friendly or neutral port, or allowing the crew and passengers time to evacuate in their lifeboats before sinking the ship. If the U Boat captain had survived the war he would have been tried in a British Court for murder since he violated the cruiser rules as they were called. In WWII even German warships in the early part of the war followed the cruiser rules. Look up the attack on the German tanker Altmark for an example. She was boarded in Norwegian waters By a British destroyer because she was carrying the crews of destroyed British merchant ships sunk by surface raiders. The Norwegians were allowing her to violate their neutrality by steaming inside Norwegian waters to avoid British warships.

 

[zaangalewa]

You're into that old-school German empire mythology. That much is clear.

I donT have any idea what you call "old-school German empire mythology". The only "German" (=united) empire which ever had existed had been the Holy Roman Empire from 800-1806.

Just as Putin subscribes to the old school Russiian mythology.

What says Putin in this context?

It seems to me both are obstacles to the progression of our species.

So it seems to me now you are a murdern Darwinist like the Nazis had been murderous Darwinists.

You should rethink.

You should think at all if you like to speak with me.

Maybe consider a milder, more limited Nationalism.

?

Self determination and then full stop, as opposed to determining also for others.

?

 

[zaangalewa]

There were centuries old maritime warfare laws that required certain behaviors of warships when stopping and searchIng merchant ships.

Source for this laws please. And institutions which take care for this laws.

If the ship belonged to a enemy, or it was a neutral carrying war material, the warship had the option of placing a prize crew on the ship and sending it into a friendly or neutral port, or allowing the crew and passengers time to evacuate in their lifeboats before sinking the ship.

Never thought about the behavior of sailors.

If the U Boat captain

German: "U-Boot" for "Unterseeboot" English: submarine

had survived the war he would have been tried in a British Court for murder since he violated the cruiser rules as they were called.

And why did the Brits not do so in a German Court while he was alive?

In WWII even German warships in the early part of the war followed the cruiser rules. Look up the attack on the German tanker Altmark for an example. She was boarded in Norwegian waters By a British destroyer because she was carrying the crews of destroyed British merchant ships sunk by surface raiders. The Norwegians were allowing her to violate their neutrality by steaming inside Norwegian waters to avoid British warships.

Aha. And what does this story tell you?

 

[AZrailwhale]

Source for this laws please. And institutions which take care for this laws.



Never thought about the behavior of sailors.



German: "U-Boot" for "Unterseeboot" English: submarine



And why did the Brits not do so in a German Court while he was alive?



Aha. And what does this story tell you?

The U BOAT captain was killed in action before the war ended, and I have never heard of any nation allowing one of its military members to be tried by the enemy in its courts. Since Germany wasn't shy about committing atrocities in WWI, why would they allow British lawyers into a German court to accuse a naval captain of an atrocity?

 

[zaangalewa]

The U BOAT

Hmm ... What means the "U" in U BOAT? Why do you not use the word "submarine"?

captain was killed in action before the war ended,

So what? Why did "you" not accuse him in front of a German court before he died on whatever reason?

and I have never heard of any nation allowing one of its military members to be tried by the enemy in its courts.

Officially the USA had not been in war with Germany at this moment of history and why the Brits did not do so I'm also astonished. They are seen normally like Germans in the eyes of Germans.

Since Germany wasn't shy about committing atrocities in WWI,

What for heavens sake do you speak about here?

why would they allow British lawyers into a German court to accuse a naval captain of an atrocity?

Perhaps because this would had been a totally normal thing and perhaps also because the Prussian emperor over Germany had been also a Brit who grew up in England under his grandma Queen Victoria and all his stupid ideas about the way of Germany (including colonialism and a big fleet) had been stupid British ideas?

The following song had been by the way a protest song against this German Brit William II in memoriam of his father Wilhelm. William II had been an unbelievable bad educated idiot. Once he said for example to his soldiers when he will give this order they should kill without to grumble their own parents if they protest as socialists against him because he owns them and they are his soldiers.