Patriot Act

[eots]

I know this is not a current news event but I am still upset about this. I really believe we lost freedoms with this. I don’t have money but the fact that transactions can be monitored and one must use federal forms to move more than 10,000.00, well it isn’t right. Also the government can listen to phone conversations and view emails without a warrant – wow

This still pisses me off – does anyone else feel this way or am I just ‘big talking’

Oh…ahhh… just one more thing:
There is nothing patriotic about the patriot act!

The fact that they had to sell it as "Patriot Act" should have tipped you off

And yet the democrats have approved it every time under their watch it came up, GO FIGURE.

thats because they have the same handlers and it aint we the people

 

[eots]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

Gunny, as a former law enforcement officer, I too see the value the Patriot Act can have. Especially with terrorism, the cops would sometimes not have time to obtain a warrant to do a wiretap or search. I remember in my old days working the road, it could take up to 24-48 hours just to get a proper search warrant for a simple drug dealer's house. And that was on a weekday. If it's midnight, and you gotta wake up a judge, or God-forbid on a holiday (like we saw in Portland yesterday) then getting a warrant could be very time consuming.

And with terrorism, time could be short. So if the FBI or locals got a tip of an imminent threat, they may not have time to get a warrant. So I can see why this act was needed to outline the situations where they could do it without one. The Patriot Act is basically an extension or footnote on the 4th amendment, done without having a Constitutional Convention necessary to amend that document.

But, on the other hand, I have little trust for the Federal Government at the legislative branch. The FBI, CIA, DEA, ATF and military, they have a lot more honor than politicians and I trust them a lot more. Nearly 100% of FBI, CIA, etc, are former cops anyway. BUT.....I can't wrap my mind around how and why the Patriot Act was written in 1995, 7 years before 9-11. In Feb of 1995, 2 and 1/2 months before Oklahoma City also.

ya...ya we all no getting rid of those pesky constitutional rights would make lazy cops jobs" easier"

 

[eots]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

how would you know if people can be arrested or spied on without warrant ?

 

[eots]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

the rights have been suspended under the patriot act so how can they be denied ?

 

[Missourian]

I keep asking this, what rights have we lost? I can't think of any.

Problem thinking huh?

Just read a little bit and try to comprehend.

Non-answer.

What rights do YOU believe have been lost?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlLL03lTxUc&feature=related

obama 2008 3:00 What he will do with a stroke of a pen if elected
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Se0GrfvaKGk[/ame]

obamna 2009 he did what

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NSL4CAePWQ[/ame]

My my my how the worm does turn.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

the rights have been suspended under the patriot act so how can they be denied ?

Provide EVIDENCE. Name some names of people that have had their rights "suspended or removed" by the Patriot act with out due process. Must be easy for you since you insist it has and is happening.

 

[Flopper]

I know this is not a current news event but I am still upset about this. I really believe we lost freedoms with this. I don’t have money but the fact that transactions can be monitored and one must use federal forms to move more than 10,000.00, well it isn’t right. Also the government can listen to phone conversations and view emails without a warrant – wow

This still pisses me off – does anyone else feel this way or am I just ‘big talking’

Oh…ahhh… just one more thing:
There is nothing patriotic about the patriot act!

If you took the 911 terrorist attack and scaled it down to the population of the US in 1776, the attack would killed 25 people. I seriously doubt that our forefathers would have passed any new laws or made any change in how those laws were enforced due to such an attack. Today we seem to be willing to trade off more and more of our personal freedoms for more security. Look at what we have done to airline travel. We have made it safer, but in so doing we have taken away the fun of flying.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The Patriot Act is one of the worst ideas in the history of the United States. Future historians will look back on this and point to it as the beginning of the end.

 

[Annie]

I know this is not a current news event but I am still upset about this. I really believe we lost freedoms with this. I don’t have money but the fact that transactions can be monitored and one must use federal forms to move more than 10,000.00, well it isn’t right. Also the government can listen to phone conversations and view emails without a warrant – wow

This still pisses me off – does anyone else feel this way or am I just ‘big talking’

Oh…ahhh… just one more thing:
There is nothing patriotic about the patriot act!

many agreed with the premise, when it was proposed and voted on. There were concerns, especially regarding time going on. With some of the things now being done by TSA and ICE, regarding far flung powers, seems the concerns were more than a bit justified.

 

[uscitizen]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

They do not have to be Americans to be denied their due process. If they are on US controlled soil they get due process.
Does the constitution limit due process to citizens?

 

[uscitizen]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

Gunny, as a former law enforcement officer, I too see the value the Patriot Act can have. Especially with terrorism, the cops would sometimes not have time to obtain a warrant to do a wiretap or search. I remember in my old days working the road, it could take up to 24-48 hours just to get a proper search warrant for a simple drug dealer's house. And that was on a weekday. If it's midnight, and you gotta wake up a judge, or God-forbid on a holiday (like we saw in Portland yesterday) then getting a warrant could be very time consuming.

And with terrorism, time could be short. So if the FBI or locals got a tip of an imminent threat, they may not have time to get a warrant. So I can see why this act was needed to outline the situations where they could do it without one. The Patriot Act is basically an extension or footnote on the 4th amendment, done without having a Constitutional Convention necessary to amend that document.

But, on the other hand, I have little trust for the Federal Government at the legislative branch. The FBI, CIA, DEA, ATF and military, they have a lot more honor than politicians and I trust them a lot more. Nearly 100% of FBI, CIA, etc, are former cops anyway. BUT.....I can't wrap my mind around how and why the Patriot Act was written in 1995, 7 years before 9-11. In Feb of 1995, 2 and 1/2 months before Oklahoma City also.

ya...ya we all no getting rid of those pesky constitutional rights would make lazy cops jobs" easier"

Reagan did away with a lot of rights under the guise of the war on drugs.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Gunny, as a former law enforcement officer, I too see the value the Patriot Act can have. Especially with terrorism, the cops would sometimes not have time to obtain a warrant to do a wiretap or search. I remember in my old days working the road, it could take up to 24-48 hours just to get a proper search warrant for a simple drug dealer's house. And that was on a weekday. If it's midnight, and you gotta wake up a judge, or God-forbid on a holiday (like we saw in Portland yesterday) then getting a warrant could be very time consuming.

And with terrorism, time could be short. So if the FBI or locals got a tip of an imminent threat, they may not have time to get a warrant. So I can see why this act was needed to outline the situations where they could do it without one. The Patriot Act is basically an extension or footnote on the 4th amendment, done without having a Constitutional Convention necessary to amend that document.

But, on the other hand, I have little trust for the Federal Government at the legislative branch. The FBI, CIA, DEA, ATF and military, they have a lot more honor than politicians and I trust them a lot more. Nearly 100% of FBI, CIA, etc, are former cops anyway. BUT.....I can't wrap my mind around how and why the Patriot Act was written in 1995, 7 years before 9-11. In Feb of 1995, 2 and 1/2 months before Oklahoma City also.

ya...ya we all no getting rid of those pesky constitutional rights would make lazy cops jobs" easier"

Reagan did away with a lot of rights under the guise of the war on drugs.

Another false claim PROVIDE evidence. Lying dumb ass.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

They do not have to be Americans to be denied their due process. If they are on US controlled soil they get due process.
Does the constitution limit due process to citizens?

Armed combatants legal or illegal do not get due process while waging war against America they are covered else where and in fact if captured can simple be held prisoner until the conflict is over.

Now I repeat NAME someone that had their rights denied on US SOIL without due process. You can not cause it hasn't happened. That makes you ignorant or a liar. Since you keep claiming it happened I suggest that qualifies you as a liar unless you can provide some evidence.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

They do not have to be Americans to be denied their due process. If they are on US controlled soil they get due process.
Does the constitution limit due process to citizens?

Your answer that you seek cannot be found in the U.S. Constitution

International humanitarian law
International humanitarian law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[DaGoose]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

the rights have been suspended under the patriot act so how can they be denied ?

Provide EVIDENCE. Name some names of people that have had their rights "suspended or removed" by the Patriot act with out due process. Must be easy for you since you insist it has and is happening.

HEY RetiredGySgt.........

How about a home schooled American teenager?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFVQ0HZz2mc[/ame]

Here are a couple more stories you should read.........

washingtonpost.com: Court: U.S. Can Hold Citizens as Enemy Combatants

Pre 911 Warning Results In Arrest Under Patriot Act For Susan Lindauer - Mad Mad World

Patriot Act Author Has Concerns

HELLOOOOOO.....Are that naive and trusting of the federal government that you don't believe that they would DARE violate someone's Constitutional Rights???

 

[Immanuel]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

They do not have to be Americans to be denied their due process. If they are on US controlled soil they get due process.
Does the constitution limit due process to citizens?

Not only that, but actions need not have been taken thus far against American citizens to constitute a loss of freedoms.

Immie

 

[DaGoose]

Not asingle right was effected. Proven by the fact when I ask for evidence that any where none of you can provide any.

Go ahead name a single American that was denied their rights without due process under the Patriot act.

They do not have to be Americans to be denied their due process. If they are on US controlled soil they get due process.
Does the constitution limit due process to citizens?

Not only that, but actions need not have been taken thus far against American citizens to constitute a loss of freedoms.

Immie

True, but actions HAVE been taken against American citizens. (See my post above)

 

[RetiredGySgt]

They do not have to be Americans to be denied their due process. If they are on US controlled soil they get due process.
Does the constitution limit due process to citizens?

Not only that, but actions need not have been taken thus far against American citizens to constitute a loss of freedoms.

Immie

True, but actions HAVE been taken against American citizens. (See my post above)

And all your supposed violations involved court action which either approved the action or found it unconstitutional and refused the action. In other words DUE PROCESS. I am past tired of you retards not understanding simple concepts.

 

[Two Thumbs]

It was a knee jerk reaction of the moment.

When I heard about it, I was torn, I had friends in NYC, and didn't want anyone to have to go through that or far worse again.

But as time passed, I knew this had to go, or it would become very long term or permanent.

Getting rid of it was the one thing I was hoping obama would do. not only did he not get rid of it, he made it stronger.

Now you understand why many of us want Constitutional conservatives in office.