Pagan Christianity!

[Mickiel]

In Mark 7:7-8 Jesus said of his followers that they worship him in vain , holding on to traditions,Matt. 15:3-6. Col. 2:8 is similar to this unique unusual deception of believers in Christ. They think they can mix their vain traditions with their worship , and that be accepted.

Jesus obviously rejects such worship from his followers. But remember , a deceived person does not realize they are deceived.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

The only holiday mentioned in the New Testament is the Lord's Day aka Sunday. Every Christian holiday that we celebrate is borrowed.

Another pagan ritual YOU accept. Sunday was instituted by the Catholic Church (whom the Bible refers to as the Whore), and passed down to the Protestants (whom the Bible refers to as the Daughters of the Whore).

God's True Church follows the example of Christ, the apostles and the prophets. God's Church is a SABBATH KEEPING CHURCH. The rest are counterfeit.

 

[presonorek]

The only holiday mentioned in the New Testament is the Lord's Day aka Sunday. Every Christian holiday that we celebrate is borrowed.

Another pagan ritual YOU accept. Sunday was instituted by the Catholic Church (whom the Bible refers to as the Whore), and passed down to the Protestants (whom the Bible refers to as the Daughters of the Whore).

God's True Church follows the example of Christ, the apostles and the prophets. God's Church is a SABBATH KEEPING CHURCH. The rest are counterfeit.

I disagree unless you claim the King James Bible has been altered. Early Christians gathered on the first day of the week. The first day of the week was the day Jesus was resurrected.

 

[Meriweather]

I think playtime is right. Our calendar starts with Jesus's birth. That makes his birthday January 1, 0000. Why do we celebrate it on December 25? Why do we decorate eggs handed out by a bunny? That sounds like someone is worshiping fertility rather than a resurrection. The Old Testament is very detailed when describing holidays.

The only holiday mentioned in the New Testament is the Lord's Day aka Sunday. Every Christian holiday that we celebrate is borrowed.

The early holidays of the Church were Jesus baptism, the Epiphany (coming of the three wise men), the Last Supper, crucifixion, and the Lord's day. Birthdays weren't celebrated back then. Back then there was the tradition that Jesus died on the day he was conceived--and that was calculated as March 25 in the Western church--a week or so later in the Eastern Church. Once the celebration of birthdays became more the norm, nine months from Jesus's conception/death was...December 25.

Now there were celebrations around that time, but the interesting part is once Christians began celebrating on December 25, one of the pagan religions fixed their holiday on December 25 as well.

The point is, Christianity never lived in a vacuum, and almost from the beginning it was decided Gentile Christians did not need to convert to Judaism to become Christian. Some other early feasts were those commemorating Saint John the Baptist. His birth was set six months before Jesus, or June 24. I'll bet the book claims that the feast was set up to counter Mid-Summer celebrations? On the contrary. Two sets of beliefs celebrating two different events--both probably using the seasonal decorations and edibles at hand.

 

[presonorek]

I think playtime is right. Our calendar starts with Jesus's birth. That makes his birthday January 1, 0000. Why do we celebrate it on December 25? Why do we decorate eggs handed out by a bunny? That sounds like someone is worshiping fertility rather than a resurrection. The Old Testament is very detailed when describing holidays.

The only holiday mentioned in the New Testament is the Lord's Day aka Sunday. Every Christian holiday that we celebrate is borrowed.

The early holidays of the Church were Jesus baptism, the Epiphany (coming of the three wise men), the Last Supper, crucifixion, and the Lord's day. Birthdays weren't celebrated back then. Back then there was the tradition that Jesus died on the day he was conceived--and that was calculated as March 25 in the Western church--a week or so later in the Eastern Church. Once the celebration of birthdays became more the norm, nine months from Jesus's conception/death was...December 25.

Now there were celebrations around that time, but the interesting part is once Christians began celebrating on December 25, one of the pagan religions fixed their holiday on December 25 as well.

The point is, Christianity never lived in a vacuum, and almost from the beginning it was decided Gentile Christians did not need to convert to Judaism to become Christian. Some other early feasts were those commemorating Saint John the Baptist. His birth was set six months before Jesus, or June 24. I'll bet the book claims that the feast was set up to counter Mid-Summer celebrations? On the contrary. Two sets of beliefs celebrating two different events--both probably using the seasonal decorations and edibles at hand.

What event prompted the beginning of our calendar?

 

[Mickiel]

The earliest church buildings were patterned after the Roman basilicas.
The pastors chair was taken from the Roman's seat of the judge.
Stained glass windows and gothic cathedrals came from the philosophy of Plato.
The church steeple came from Babylonian architecture.
The pulpit came from the Greeks. As did the contemporary sermon.
Hierarchical leadership came from paganism. As did the clergy attire.
The boys choir came from paganism.
Funeral processions came from Paganism. As did infant baptism.

 

[Mickiel]

Weddings , wedding rings , statues and crosses worn as symbols or constructed as decorations , all came from paganism. As did having meals in honor of the dead.

 

[Meriweather]

The earliest church buildings were patterned after the Roman basilicas.
The pastors chair was taken from the Roman's seat of the judge.
Stained glass windows and gothic cathedrals came from the philosophy of Plato.
The church steeple came from Babylonian architecture.
The pulpit came from the Greeks. As did the contemporary sermon.
Hierarchical leadership came from paganism. As did the clergy attire.
The boys choir came from paganism.
Funeral processions came from Paganism. As did infant baptism.

Ancient Mesopotamians had dolls, as did the ancient Chinese. Doesn't mean one culture stole from the other. It means some things just naturally rise independently in almost every culture. It was probably the Egyptians, not the Greeks that first stained glass...

 

[Mickiel]

You can

The earliest church buildings were patterned after the Roman basilicas.
The pastors chair was taken from the Roman's seat of the judge.
Stained glass windows and gothic cathedrals came from the philosophy of Plato.
The church steeple came from Babylonian architecture.
The pulpit came from the Greeks. As did the contemporary sermon.
Hierarchical leadership came from paganism. As did the clergy attire.
The boys choir came from paganism.
Funeral processions came from Paganism. As did infant baptism.

Ancient Mesopotamians had dolls, as did the ancient Chinese. Doesn't mean one culture stole from the other. It means some things just naturally rise independently in almost every culture. It was probably the Egyptians, not the Greeks that first stained glass...

Its possible it could have been Egyptian , but still pagan. Even the Christian " Order of worship" came from paganism. You can scour the bible from end to end and never find anything that remotely resembles the Christian order of worship. ( Pagan Christianity pg.50.) It came from the Catholic mass ,a unique blending of pagan and Judaistic ritual.

 

[Meriweather]

Its possible it could have been Egyptian , but still pagan. Even the Christian " Order of worship" came from paganism. You can scour the bible from end to end and never find anything that remotely resembles the Christian order of worship. ( Pagan Christianity pg.50.) It came from the Catholic mass ,a unique blending of pagan and Judaistic ritual.

My point is that many things pagans began using came from Christianity. What does this mean? Nothing. Just because I eat corn, it doesn't mean I have stolen from Native American culture, or that I am following Native American practices. i.e., sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

 

[Mickiel]

Its possible it could have been Egyptian , but still pagan. Even the Christian " Order of worship" came from paganism. You can scour the bible from end to end and never find anything that remotely resembles the Christian order of worship. ( Pagan Christianity pg.50.) It came from the Catholic mass ,a unique blending of pagan and Judaistic ritual.

My point is that many things pagans began using came from Christianity. What does this mean? Nothing. Just because I eat corn, it doesn't mean I have stolen from Native American culture, or that I am following Native American practices. i.e., sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

Your point is mute because paganism was here far before Christianity. This is true history , its not which came first the chicken or the egg. Jesus spoke against "Vain traditions of men" , he meant paganism on the head. Jesus was addressing HIS followers when he said in vain do you worship me ; I mean come on , these people were worshippers of Christ and God, but they were doing something wrong, they were into mixing paganism with the worship of God. You may think this means nothing , but to Christ it was blasphemy.

 

[Meriweather]

Your point is mute because paganism was here far before Christianity. This is true history , its not which came first the chicken or the egg. Jesus spoke against "Vain traditions of men" , he meant paganism on the head. Jesus was addressing HIS followers when he said in vain do you worship me ; I mean come on , these people were worshippers of Christ and God, but they were doing something wrong, they were into mixing paganism with the worship of God. You may think this means nothing , but to Christ it was blasphemy.

Doubtful. Stone came before people but blasphemy doesn't follow because a pagan used a stone before a Christian did. Christians did not worship Pagan gods, and Pagans didn't worship One God. That is the difference between Pagan worship and Christian worship. The two lived close together for centuries, and actually there are some pagans who are still active today.

Christ looked forward to the day when people would worship the Father in spirit and in truth. I would argue that this mattered more to him than what kind of building or accessories people use. Christs comments on the vain traditions of men were spoken to those who criticized Christ's disciples for not washing their hands.

How do you think Christ would respond today if someone said to him, "Look! Your disciples are worshiping in a building that has a steeple that was originally designed by a pagan!" Do you think Jesus would march in and start over turning tables, or do you think he would say, "You are thinking as men do. Hear me and understand! Nothing on the outside can defile a person, but the things that come out from within are what defile..."

If what comes from the inside is worship of the Father in spirit and in truth, then today's Christians are doing just fine whether their worship is in a school cafeteria with a flat roof, or under a dome--or a steeple.

 

[Mickiel]

Your point is mute because paganism was here far before Christianity. This is true history , its not which came first the chicken or the egg. Jesus spoke against "Vain traditions of men" , he meant paganism on the head. Jesus was addressing HIS followers when he said in vain do you worship me ; I mean come on , these people were worshippers of Christ and God, but they were doing something wrong, they were into mixing paganism with the worship of God. You may think this means nothing , but to Christ it was blasphemy.

Doubtful. Stone came before people but blasphemy doesn't follow because a pagan used a stone before a Christian did. Christians did not worship Pagan gods, and Pagans didn't worship One God. That is the difference between Pagan worship and Christian worship. The two lived close together for centuries, and actually there are some pagans who are still active today.

Christ looked forward to the day when people would worship the Father in spirit and in truth. I would argue that this mattered more to him than what kind of building or accessories people use. Christs comments on the vain traditions of men were spoken to those who criticized Christ's disciples for not washing their hands.

How do you think Christ would respond today if someone said to him, "Look! Your disciples are worshiping in a building that has a steeple that was originally designed by a pagan!" Do you think Jesus would march in and start over turning tables, or do you think he would say, "You are thinking as men do. Hear me and understand! Nothing on the outside can defile a person, but the things that come out from within are what defile..."

If what comes from the inside is worship of the Father in spirit and in truth, then today's Christians are doing just fine whether their worship is in a school cafeteria with a flat roof, or under a dome--or a steeple.

Christians did not worship false gods , but they entertained pagan filled philosophy. The doctrine of eternal hell punishing is paganism. And false apostles in Christianity taught it, as did the Pharisees. The church had deceitful workers infusing paganism into the church. Notice Paul in 2Corinth. 11:13 " For such are false apostles ,deceitful workers , transforming themselves into apostles of Christ." And Christians believed and followed these men. Why would Paul warn of it if Christians were not following them? The church was brought into bondage through these kind of men, verse 20.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Hilarious how the moonbats only target Judiasm and Christianity. The demons know who the one true God is.

 

[Mickiel]

Notice again Paul in Gal.1:6 ,"I Marvel that you are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ into ANOTHER gospel." Even while Paul was alive the church was being invaded and its true gospel infected. Christians were being infected just that soon with paganism. The gospel itself was beginning to change and morph.

 

[Meriweather]

Christians did not worship false gods , but they entertained pagan filled philosophy. The doctrine of eternal hell punishing is paganism. And false apostles in Christianity taught it, as did the Pharisees. The church had deceitful workers infusing paganism into the church. Notice Paul in 2Corinth. 11:13 " For such are false apostles ,deceitful workers , transforming themselves into apostles of Christ." And Christians believed and followed these men. Why would Paul warn of it if Christians were not following them? The church was brought into bondage through these kind of men, verse 20.

Jesus spoke of hell. But yes, false teachers did begin appearing with their version of Christianity. The Gnostics seem to be a particular concern.

One of the reasons Paul warned of them is because of the hospitality Christians were extending to people who posed as Christians. Some were angling for handouts on top of the free hospitality. People had to be on the watch for con artists in that day and age as well.

 

[Meriweather]

Notice again Paul in Gal.1:6 ,"I Marvel that you are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ into ANOTHER gospel." Even while Paul was alive the church was being invaded and its true gospel infected. Christians were being infected just that soon with paganism. The gospel itself was beginning to change and morph.

Whose Gospel? Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John?

 

[Mickiel]

Notice again Paul in Gal.1:6 ,"I Marvel that you are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ into ANOTHER gospel." Even while Paul was alive the church was being invaded and its true gospel infected. Christians were being infected just that soon with paganism. The gospel itself was beginning to change and morph.

Whose Gospel? Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John?

In my view , the first true gospel was universalism, that is what the original church taught. That was their first love , the salvation of God to all. In Rev. 2:4 that first love was lost. That church at Ephesus was the church at the end of the apostolic age. The church had problems right after Jesus left ,even Paul and Peter had it out, Gal. 2:11. God could have kept his church from these intense problems , but as with Adam and Eve he did not. God had other plans. Plans beyond our reasoning. 5 of the seven church eras in Revelation were messed up believers.

These are things Christians have no ear for, this truth hurts them.

 

[playtime]

i·dol·a·try

īˈdälətrē/
noun
noun: idolatry; plural noun: idolatries

1. 
   
   
   • worship of idols.
     synonyms: idolization, fetishization, fetishism, idol worship, adulation, adoration, reverence, veneration, glorification, lionization, hero-worshiping
     "the prophets railed against idolatry"
     • extreme admiration, love, or reverence for something or someone.
       "we must not allow our idolatry of art to obscure issues of political significance"
       synonyms: idolization, fetishization, fetishism, idol worship, adulation, adoration, reverence, veneration, glorification, lionization, hero-worshiping
       "the prophets railed against idolatry"

Exodus 20:4-5 "You shall not make for yourself a graven image or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: you shall not bow down to them or serve them"

1 John 5:21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

catholic idols - Google Search

 

[Mickiel]

Christians idolize their pastors.