Only religion has ever reined in Government attempts to control your entire life

[Crepitus]

Shitlibs worship The State....Can't serve two masters, and all that.

You really are just an ignorant, hate-filled, old man aren't you.

 

[Votto]

you got this backwards Libby....~S~

Yes and no.

Jesus said that his kingdom was not of this world nor can be. He said this to Pontius Pilate who questioned him. Jesus replied that if his kingdom were of this world, his followers would take up arms to free him, but alas, they did not because he is not of this world.

Jesus never sought political power, and even turned down a chance to be appointed king by a mob whom he gave food to with the miracle involving fish and bread. His apostles were perplexed because they thought the mission was to make him an earthy king. He then just left all of them hanging.

The history of Christian theocracy is very dark to say the least. It all began with Constantine who was a Roman pagan who decided to adopt the Christian faith as his own, presumably because he saw how it flourished despite the persecution. Even though he adopted the religion, he still worshiped the pagan gods. Granted, it was rumored he converted to Christianity on his death bed, but he was not Christian. And because Constantine was not Christian, he did not follow Christ. He created an earthly kingdom called the Vatican, with land and even an army, as the Pope acted more like an emperor of Europe, dictating the actions of kings across the land, than a man of God like Peter or Paul. It was a time of Inquisitions, Jewish persecution, Crusades, etc. In fact, any critique you hear of Christianity involves the apostate era that Constantine created to give Christianity a black eye. Before that, Christians flourished in secret in houses all across the Roman empire for hundreds of years.

But then an amazing event happened, the Guttenberg press as Bibles began to be given to people to read for themselves, in addition to the break of Martin Luther. But I suspect that the only reason Martin Luther was so successful, was because of the Guttenberg Press. People literally began to read for themselves and understand the apostacy of the Catholic church that abused and oppressed people for political gain. It was the beginning of the end for Christian theocracies.

England, however, continued this as the state continued to preach from the pulpit. This is why Christians fled to America, for religious freedom and why the Founding Fathers refused to adopt a state church like England had. They saw the abuses that occurred because of it.

However, the Founding Fathers also recognized the importance of faith, and without it, the morals of the people would deteriorate until despotism took over. As Ben Franklin famously said.

“I agree to this Constitution with all its faults, if they are such: because I think a General Government necessary for us, and there is no Form of Government but what may be a Blessing to the People if well-administred; and I believe farther that this is likely to be well administred for a Course of Years and can only end in Despotism as other Forms have done before it, when the People shall become so corrupted as to need Despotic Government, being incapable of any other.”​

Ben knew that only a moral people can be free, otherwise, if society had the morality of a prison cell, all you can do at that point is build a wall around them and hire a warden. And as we see the Left divorce God from society in any way they can, we begin to see the unraveling of our freedoms as a result. But this is just human nature. Ben knew that it was only a matter of time. The only possible outcome of such continued war against God and the Bible is despotism as Ben pointed out, and that is what the Left is all about. They want all powerful centralized control to do things like "save the planet from carbon emissions", and to hell with human freedom and dignity.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Speaking of Arnold J. Toynbee

Observing the pious women of his day, historian Arnold Toynbee remarked, "Religion and its practices have consistently been one of women's fiercest enemies . . . . The fact that many women do not realize this shows how thorough the brainwashing and intimidation have been."

[^That simply mentioned in a very informative, long, historical speech on women and religion.]

Arnold's granddaughter, Poly, says

What are 26 bishops doing in our legislature, making us the only democracy with a theocratic element? True, the men in frocks don’t look out of place in the whole creaking edifice of the House of Lords. But the high number of religious members of both houses is wildly out of kilter with the wider population. Polly Toynbee, in her column, “Faith in religion is dwindling, but when will British politics reflect that?” The Guardian, 7-11-19

 

[Libby von H]

View attachment 924519
~S~

Everything you say is from somewhere else. Keep it up I want everyone to know that all your thoughts are derivative

 

[ReinyDays]

And their deity is The State.

"Money is the root of all evil" ... not sure why y'all are trying to cast Democrat pedophilia into some kind of spiritual thing ... it's not ... "deities" and "religion" have nothing to do with stealing money ... or raping little girls ...

Is it in high school where students learn both parties do this? ... see how MAGA Mike Johnson completely sold out to spendspendspend Democrats? ... you know Republicans are getting a healthy cut of that pie ...

Nikki Haley isn't an old white man ... and I hate her politics ... that makes her the best qualified of the bunch IMEIO ...

 

[Libby von H]

Speaking of Arnold J. Toynbee

[^That simply mentioned in a very informative, long, historical speech on women and religion.]

Arnold's granddaughter, Poly, says

But logically if you disparage the many more statements I quote you are simply saying that your quote is meaningless. If that is your plan it's like killing yourself to prove the gun is loaded

 

[1srelluc]

View attachment 924519
~S~

 

[Independentthinker]

I just want some of the dropouts here to learn a little history. Toynbee devoted his life to the study of religion and civillization.

“Religion holds the solution to all problems of human relationship, whether they are between parents and children or nation and nation. Sooner or later, man has always had to decide whether he worships his own power or the power of God.”

“Material power that is not counterbalanced by adequate spiritual power, that is, by love and wisdom, is a curse.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

“Man’s true end is to glorify God and to enjoy Him for ever.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

“The course of human history consists of a series of encounters between individual human beings and God in which each man and woman or child, in turn, is challenged by God to make his free choice between doing God’s will and refusing to do it.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

SCAREY for liberals
“The last stage but one of every civilisation, is characterised by the forced political unification of its constituent parts, into a single greater whole.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

Democrats are the ones who want to control everyone's lives.

 

[Smokin' OP]

I just want some of the dropouts here to learn a little history. Toynbee devoted his life to the study of religion and civillization.

“Religion holds the solution to all problems of human relationship, whether they are between parents and children or nation and nation. Sooner or later, man has always had to decide whether he worships his own power or the power of God.”

“Material power that is not counterbalanced by adequate spiritual power, that is, by love and wisdom, is a curse.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

“Man’s true end is to glorify God and to enjoy Him for ever.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

“The course of human history consists of a series of encounters between individual human beings and God in which each man and woman or child, in turn, is challenged by God to make his free choice between doing God’s will and refusing to do it.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

SCAREY for liberals
“The last stage but one of every civilisation, is characterised by the forced political unification of its constituent parts, into a single greater whole.”

— Arnold J. Toynbee

Which "God"?

Arnold's god?

 

[sparky]

Yes and no.

Jesus said that his kingdom was not of this world nor can be. He said this to Pontius Pilate who questioned him. Jesus replied that if his kingdom were of this world, his followers would take up arms to free him, but alas, they did not because he is not of this world.

Jesus never sought political power, and even turned down a chance to be appointed king by a mob whom he gave food to with the miracle involving fish and bread. His apostles were perplexed because they thought the mission was to make him an earthy king. He then just left all of them hanging.

The history of Christian theocracy is very dark to say the least. It all began with Constantine who was a Roman pagan who decided to adopt the Christian faith as his own, presumably because he saw how it flourished despite the persecution. Even though he adopted the religion, he still worshiped the pagan gods. Granted, it was rumored he converted to Christianity on his death bed, but he was not Christian. And because Constantine was not Christian, he did not follow Christ. He created an earthly kingdom called the Vatican, with land and even an army, as the Pope acted more like an emperor of Europe, dictating the actions of kings across the land, than a man of God like Peter or Paul. It was a time of Inquisitions, Jewish persecution, Crusades, etc. In fact, any critique you hear of Christianity involves the apostate era that Constantine created to give Christianity a black eye. Before that, Christians flourished in secret in houses all across the Roman empire for hundreds of years.

But then an amazing event happened, the Guttenberg press as Bibles began to be given to people to read for themselves, in addition to the break of Martin Luther. But I suspect that the only reason Martin Luther was so successful, was because of the Guttenberg Press. People literally began to read for themselves and understand the apostacy of the Catholic church that abused and oppressed people for political gain. It was the beginning of the end for Christian theocracies.

England, however, continued this as the state continued to preach from the pulpit. This is why Christians fled to America, for religious freedom and why the Founding Fathers refused to adopt a state church like England had. They saw the abuses that occurred because of it.

However, the Founding Fathers also recognized the importance of faith, and without it, the morals of the people would deteriorate until despotism took over. As Ben Franklin famously said.

“I agree to this Constitution with all its faults, if they are such: because I think a General Government necessary for us, and there is no Form of Government but what may be a Blessing to the People if well-administred; and I believe farther that this is likely to be well administred for a Course of Years and can only end in Despotism as other Forms have done before it, when the People shall become so corrupted as to need Despotic Government, being incapable of any other.”​

Ben knew that only a moral people can be free, otherwise, if society had the morality of a prison cell, all you can do at that point is build a wall around them and hire a warden. And as we see the Left divorce God from society in any way they can, we begin to see the unraveling of our freedoms as a result. But this is just human nature. Ben knew that it was only a matter of time. The only possible outcome of such continued war against God and the Bible is despotism as Ben pointed out, and that is what the Left is all about. They want all powerful centralized control to do things like "save the planet from carbon emissions", and to hell with human freedom and dignity.

Good one Votto

and so it (yet again) comes down to humanities morality being something handed down by God almighty , or that which we as humans can assume on our own.

the devil (as you've presented) obviously being in the details , because that comes down to who CONTROLS our destiny.

~S~

 

[Grumblenuts]

But logically if you disparage

Huh?
I mainly wished to share--> this link <--invited by your "learn a little history" quip. Oh well.

Our mothers and grandmothers may have been strong or spiritual women, powerful in their individual hearts and minds. But from the advent of patriarchal religions, roughly five thousand years ago, the images of female divinity and power have declined to the point where our mothers and grandmothers had no such images to pass on to us. Yet it has been only a very small fraction--one six-hundredth--of our three million years on this earth that father gods have been postulated in any form at all. The Judeo-Christian god is such a Johnny-come-lately that his adherents have had to turn much of their attention to discrediting his greatest and oldest rival, the Great Mother.

 

[buckeye45_73]

If only there was a god you might have something there.

There is, but who cares what you think. You think some atom randomly exploded and here we are. I know I see atoms randomly explode all the time....

I love how you guys criticize God, but then don't' examine your own beliefs which are far more rediculous.

 

[OldFlame]

Yes and no.

Jesus said that his kingdom was not of this world nor can be. He said this to Pontius Pilate who questioned him. Jesus replied that if his kingdom were of this world, his followers would take up arms to free him, but alas, they did not because he is not of this world.

Jesus never sought political power, and even turned down a chance to be appointed king by a mob whom he gave food to with the miracle involving fish and bread. His apostles were perplexed because they thought the mission was to make him an earthy king. He then just left all of them hanging.

The history of Christian theocracy is very dark to say the least. It all began with Constantine who was a Roman pagan who decided to adopt the Christian faith as his own, presumably because he saw how it flourished despite the persecution. Even though he adopted the religion, he still worshiped the pagan gods. Granted, it was rumored he converted to Christianity on his death bed, but he was not Christian. And because Constantine was not Christian, he did not follow Christ. He created an earthly kingdom called the Vatican, with land and even an army, as the Pope acted more like an emperor of Europe, dictating the actions of kings across the land, than a man of God like Peter or Paul. It was a time of Inquisitions, Jewish persecution, Crusades, etc. In fact, any critique you hear of Christianity involves the apostate era that Constantine created to give Christianity a black eye. Before that, Christians flourished in secret in houses all across the Roman empire for hundreds of years.

But then an amazing event happened, the Guttenberg press as Bibles began to be given to people to read for themselves, in addition to the break of Martin Luther. But I suspect that the only reason Martin Luther was so successful, was because of the Guttenberg Press. People literally began to read for themselves and understand the apostacy of the Catholic church that abused and oppressed people for political gain. It was the beginning of the end for Christian theocracies.

England, however, continued this as the state continued to preach from the pulpit. This is why Christians fled to America, for religious freedom and why the Founding Fathers refused to adopt a state church like England had. They saw the abuses that occurred because of it.

However, the Founding Fathers also recognized the importance of faith, and without it, the morals of the people would deteriorate until despotism took over. As Ben Franklin famously said.

“I agree to this Constitution with all its faults, if they are such: because I think a General Government necessary for us, and there is no Form of Government but what may be a Blessing to the People if well-administred; and I believe farther that this is likely to be well administred for a Course of Years and can only end in Despotism as other Forms have done before it, when the People shall become so corrupted as to need Despotic Government, being incapable of any other.”​

Ben knew that only a moral people can be free, otherwise, if society had the morality of a prison cell, all you can do at that point is build a wall around them and hire a warden. And as we see the Left divorce God from society in any way they can, we begin to see the unraveling of our freedoms as a result. But this is just human nature. Ben knew that it was only a matter of time. The only possible outcome of such continued war against God and the Bible is despotism as Ben pointed out, and that is what the Left is all about. They want all powerful centralized control to do things like "save the planet from carbon emissions", and to hell with human freedom and dignity.

Well said.

 

[BrokeLoser]

government, via the first amendment, is the only force available (outside the natural skepticism that saves a few of us.) to protect us from total control by religion.;

True dat. The feds are most often the defenders of freedom, while state and local governments are the destroyers of freedom.

God's Law is perfect ... it is Man who fails ...

We're given death for adultery ... is that what you want? ... killing children for disobedience? ... cutting off women's heads for the sin of driving a car? ... maybe you should read the Bible before you advocate his contents ...

Q: Who among us is perfect and can cast these judgements? ...
A: Charles III of England ... by divine right ... Jesus gives us a monarchy ...

If only there was a god you might have something there.

Only government has ever reined in religious people's attempts to control your entire lives.

YOu do remember that escaping the church of england was part of why the US was founded, right?

Which "God"?

Arnold's god?

Libs-
“Please Father Government, please make everyone pretend abortion is cool, please force chicks with dicks and faggotry down the throats of all, please stop people from following that moral order that made us great and exceptional, please make indecency, immorality, abnormalities and all weird shit normal and excepted.
Please stop those normal, decent, moral, law-abiding, principled, responsible, accountable Christian folks from setting standards and expectations.”

 

[Crepitus]

Libs-
“Please Father Government, please make everyone pretend abortion is cool, please force chicks with dicks and faggotry down the throats of all, please stop people from following that moral order that made us great and exceptional, please make indecency, immorality, abnormalities and all weird shit normal and excepted.
Please stop those normal, decent, moral, law-abiding, principled, responsible, accountable Christian folks from setting standards and expectations.”

Wow, that's a pretty epic whine there, buddy.

 

[JGalt]

The image of god?

This is a god of billions:

View attachment 924536

That's not God. They're worshiping false prophets which are the manifestation of Satan.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Only religion has ever reined in Government attempts to control your entire life​

By them wanting to control you instead.

 

[Crepitus]

That's not God. They're worshiping false prophets which are the manifestation of Satan.

And that is your opinion.

They have their own.

 

[Smokin' OP]

Libs-
“Please Father Government, please make everyone pretend abortion is cool, please force chicks with dicks and faggotry down the throats of all, please stop people from following that moral order that made us great and exceptional, please make indecency, immorality, abnormalities and all weird shit normal and excepted.
Please stop those normal, decent, moral, law-abiding, principled, responsible, accountable Christian folks from setting standards and expectations.”

Sure...........Like Trump.

Donald Trump, Lee Greenwood selling Bibles​

USA Today
https://www.usatoday.com › news › politics › 2024/03/27
3 days ago — Former President Donald Trump is partnering with Lee Greenwood to sell "God Bless the USA" bibles for $59.99.

 

[OldFlame]

By them wanting to control you instead.

Who has more power over your life, religion or government?