Zone1 OK "Experts" How Do We Solve Racial Inequality Without Considering Race?

[Woodznutz]

I know how blacks are progressing better than you. Systemic Racism is tied to wealth and income disparity. Preference to ones own race does not include preference to not pay the same for the same work, or to deny entrepreneurs chances to start businsses, deny home loans, etc. Again, I am black so you can't tell me ---- about some phase you think blacks are in. Your assessment is wrong. Whites spend. Blacks have saved and invested. Whites have been the recipient of gigantic amounts of government help, that's the difference.

The wage gap closes substantially between blacks and whites in the higher paying jobs and professions, occupations that require advanced education. It is the lower skilled jobs where the disparity is greatest. Of course, the takeaway is that education is the key to reducing earnings disparity.

I have almost always fallen below the average (and median) income, but I've never complained as I value things other than money. The quest for financial 'equity' is a fool's errand. There's more to life than money. That said, later in life I have accumulated wealth through investments and hard work. I had to shoot my way out of high school, and other than working as a meat cutter I have never held a highly skilled job.

 

[IM2]

The wage gap closes substantially between blacks and whites in the higher paying jobs and professions, occupations that require advanced education. It is the lower skilled jobs where the disparity is greatest. Of course, the takeaway is that education is the key to reducing earnings disparity.

I have almost always fallen below the average (and median) income, but I've never complained as I value things other than money. The quest for financial 'equity' is a fool's errand. There's more to life than money. That said, later in life I have accumulated wealth through investments and hard work. I had to shoot my way out of high school, and other than working as a meat cutter I have never held a highly skilled job.

Again, there should be no wage gap. There is no reason a black and white exec doing the same job don't get the same pay. I have studied this, your opinion isn't going to cut it.

 

[Woodznutz]

Again, there should be no wage gap. There is no reason a black and white exec doing the same job don't get the same pay. I have studied this, your opinion isn't going to cut it.

What did you discover about the wage gap?

 

[IM2]

What did you discover about the wage gap?

Payscale did a two-year study from 2017 to 2019, and this is their conclusion: "we find equal pay for equal work is still not a reality." They studied the earnings of white men and men of color using data from 1.8 million employees. They found that no matter how far they advanced, black men made less than white men with the same qualifications. According to the study, “black men were the only racial/ethnic group not achieving pay parity with white men at some level." The study showed that black men had the most significant pay gap relative to white men and that on average, black men earned 87 cents for every dollar a white man earned. The Payscale study showed that black men are paid less compared to all other men. Even when black and white men had the same job, experience, education, and worked at the same geographic location, the study shows that black men earned less. Executive-level black men still earn less than white men at that same level. At that level, black men are paid 97 cents for every dollar a white man is paid but face the same executive responsibilities and are expected to produce the same or superior results.

The National Women’s Law Center also showed that black women are paid less than other women. Black women are paid 63 cents for every dollar paid to white men based on calculations used in the study. Where this impacts black single mothers is this study shows a pay difference of over 20,000 dollars per year. "Black women have to work more than 19 months—until the very last day of July—to make as much as white, non-Hispanic men did in the previous 12-month calendar year." Black women in high-wage occupations earn 64 cents for every dollar a white man earns. On average, that is 40,000 dollars per year less than white men in those same occupations. This is not about lack of education. Nor is it about the field of study.

"Even after completing undergraduate and graduate degrees, black and Hispanic workers earned less than non-Hispanic white workers with the same, or often less, education."
- Roy Eduardo Kokoyachuk, ThinkNow Research

Kokoyachuck found that blacks and Hispanics with college degrees were paid less than whites and Asians with comparable education. His study showed that blacks and Hispanics who graduated in S.T.E.M majors earned less than whites and Asians with degrees in those same majors. "Even when Blacks and Hispanics go the extra mile and earn professional degrees, their incomes still don’t break six figures. Whites and Asians, however, double their incomes by earning professional degrees, allowing them to make well over $100,000 a year."

 

[Lisa558]

What did you discover about the wage gap?

It’s interesting. While IM2 would like to blame racism for the difference in pay between black and white execs, if one dives into it, most of the difference is attributable to differences in intelligence - and when one controls for the same level of intelligence, most of the gap disappears.

For example, take two Ivy-educated exes, one black and one white. The white earns more. It would seem at first blush that it’s racism. But remember - the odds are 2:1 (I worked in admissions) that the black got in with lower scores and grades.

When you control for academic metrics - comparing black and white execs who had about the same scores and grades - the majority of the gap disappears. Some of the remaining gap is explained in a number of ways, only one of which is racism.

So while racism accounts for a small amount of the gap, most of it is attributed elsewhere.

The linked article explains it more, although you have to dive deep to find it all.

Racial, gender wage gaps persist in U.S. despite some progress

Looking at gender, race and ethnicity combined, all groups, with the exception of Asian men, lag behind white men in terms of median hourly earnings.

www.pewresearch.org

 

[Woodznutz]

Again, there should be no wage gap. There is no reason a black and white exec doing the same job don't get the same pay. I have studied this, your opinion isn't going to cut it.

A closer look.

"African-Americans make up only a small percentage of some of the highest-paying of majors, including those in STEM and business. They’re only 8 percent of engineering, 7 percent of mathematics and 5 percent of computer science majors. Worse, Carnevale said even those who do major in high-paying fields, typically choose the lowest paying major within them. For example, the majority of black women in STEM typically study biology, the lowest-paying of the science discipline. Among engineers, most black men study civil engineering, the lowest-paying in that sector."

African-Americans over-represented among low-paying college majors

More African-Americans are earning college degrees than ever before. But a new study shows they're over-represented in majors that lead to low-paying jobs.

www.pbs.org

 

[Lisa558]

The average earnings, from high to low, goes: Asian, White, Black, Hispanic. They don’t separate Jews in the study, but I’m sure it’s higher than whites. Just saying.

 

[Lisa558]

Does this fit into your studies?

African-Americans over-represented among low-paying college majors

More African-Americans are earning college degrees than ever before. But a new study shows they're over-represented in majors that lead to low-paying jobs.

www.pbs.org

Interesting. IM2 has revealed he was a sociology major, and that is one of the lowest-paying fields.

 

[Woodznutz]

Interesting. IM2 has revealed he was a sociology major, and that is one of the lowest-paying fields.

However, he has suggested that he's doing ok financially.

 

[Lisa558]

As I’ve related here I’ve been stopped without breaking laws because either my car or I resembled a criminal the cops were looking for. Unlike you I shrug it off as the cops doing their job. You embrace it as “proof” of racism.

Remember how Michelle Obama accused someone of racism because she asked her to help her get something off the top shelf at Target?

(Michelle is tall.)

 

[Lisa558]

However, he has suggested that he's doing ok financially.

Maybe he is as an individual. But sociology as a whole pays poorly.

 

[AZrailwhale]

However, he has suggested that he's doing ok financially.

He also claims to have started and run two corprorations. It would be interesting to research how many non-blacks he employed. But since he will never give us particulars about anything he has allegedly done, I have a better chance of flying to the moon by flapping my arms than us ever learning anything.

 

[ninja007]

im2 lives in a white neighborhood.

 

[LibertyKid]

I know how blacks are progressing better than you. Systemic Racism is tied to wealth and income disparity.

Disparity is true. But what is always left out is the "why". You, like a broken record always point to the past. There is nothing today, that you can't do that a white person can do. Period. But you won't admit to that because your entire racist premise crumbles.

Preference to ones own race does not include preference to not pay the same for the same work, or to deny entrepreneurs chances to start businsses, deny home loans, etc.

Every opportunity exists today, and more so for blacks. How many gov't funded programs are out there that give aid because you are black? If you are denied a home loan today, it is because the banks see you as a credit risk. Not because of skin color. It is now illegal to deny loans based on race. Correct?

Again, I am black so you can't tell me ---- about some phase you think blacks are in. Your assessment is wrong. Whites spend. Blacks have saved and invested. Whites have been the recipient of gigantic amounts of government help, that's the difference.

And blacks aren't receiving any gov't funded help or have had regulations set in place to help them?

Why don't you do a study on David Steward and Robert Smith and see what those two black men did to become Billionaires. Great case studies I would think, and let's hear your feedback and summary.

 

[MizMolly]

I know how blacks are progressing better than you. Systemic Racism is tied to wealth and income disparity. Preference to ones own race does not include preference to not pay the same for the same work, or to deny entrepreneurs chances to start businsses, deny home loans, etc. Again, I am black so you can't tell me ---- about some phase you think blacks are in. Your assessment is wrong. Whites spend. Blacks have saved and invested. Whites have been the recipient of gigantic amounts of government help, that's the difference.

Same negative things happen to whites. You don’t take into account that perhaps people aren’t paid the same for the same job is: different employers, educational background, tenure on the job, more experience in the same field, efficiency and better skills used to perform job duties. Too many variances. If you don’t have the capital to start a business, it’s not because of your race. Same with loans, etc. without good credit scores, job stability, income, whites are denied for the same reasons.