Official Thread for Denial of GreenHouse Effect and Radiative Physics.

[Grumblenuts]

Coriolis force doesn't produce torque, therefore it cannot effect rotation ... we use convective force (cross product) pressure force = torque ...

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Can the torque about the center of mass due to Coriolis force be cancelled out? Yes, the torque about the center of mass due to Coriolis force can be cancelled out if the object is in motion in a direction parallel to the Earth's axis of rotation. In this case, the Coriolis force will be perpendicular to the direction of motion and will not cause a torque about the center of mass.

Reference: Torque about center of mass due to Coriolis force, is it 0?

In other words, no, the torque about the center of mass due to Coriolis force can't be cancelled out if the object is in motion in any direction other than parallel to the Earth's axis of rotation.

 

[ReinyDays]

What amazes me is that Crick told us he is an engineer. I frankly have an enormous respect for engineers as a group.
I also respect true climate scientists. I however am no sheep.
I have presented many scientists, whose specialty is climate study. I present those who call BS to claims man is screwing the planet. I point out that Earth is not tiny. As a planet it is not massive. However it takes a full day to rotate once. It takes 365 rotations per year. In other words, this baby we live on is pretty damned huge. You can use your best telescope and yet you can see a limited distance. Because it is so huge, the earth curvature is not a hell of a long ways away from keeping you see the adjacent areas. Were you to have a gigantic ruler or level, and put it tangentially on earth, you would fast notice the huge change in what you can see in the distance. You experience some of this when you fly commercially. This to some might seem irrelevant. It is to show you climate is hugely varied. We do live on a planet with a climate. It has many climates. I talked to Professor Lindzen by email years back and hit him with some important questions. I asked him about stories he works for the oil interests. He may have given a talk or two. I don't recall that part of his explanation. But he never in his life was an employee of big oil. He is an academic. His pay came to him from MIT up to the time he retired. He lives on Earth. If anybody should tell us to be frightened, he is precisely the man who would sound the alarm.

He calls bullshit. So why don't you join him and me and call bullshit on this political nonsense?

Chick is a liar ... she's not an engineer ... I've taken a few college science classes and Chick has never ... there's a couple of things every lab section goes over, every time, that she misses, completely ...

Scientific Theory is nothing without a demonstration ... in the laboratory ... and this is completely lacking in the Hysterical Climate Change movement ... at most, 1,000,000 ppm gives a +5ºC increase ... by ratios, we should see 0.005ºC increase for 150 ppm increase ...

We don't measure temperature that accurately ...but YOU CAN HELP ...

Tell us how you use temperature to calculate density altitude ... say Aspen, Colorado (7,800 ft), on a 95ºF day ... how many extra loops should you fly to get over those 12,000 foot ridge lines all around you? ...

 

[ReinyDays]

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In other words, no, the torque about the center of mass due to Coriolis force can't be cancelled out if the object is in motion in any direction other than parallel to the Earth's axis of rotation.

Coriolis force is a pseudo-force ... it's strictly an artifact of your frame-of-reference ... shoot your cannon ball due north, so you see the Coriolis acceleration? ... now, where did the kinetic energy come from? ...

From an inertial frame-of-reference ... the Coriolis force cannot be observed ... therefore, it cannot be ascribed to have done any work ... it is you who are under acceleration, not the cannonball ...

Physics 101 ...

 

[Robert W]

Try it yourself ... any latitude ... which ever way you swirl the bathtub water, that's how the water will spin down the drain ... if you want the water to go straight down, you'll need to wait a week for all the currents to settle ...

If the tub is nearly infinitely narrow, then the rotation will be infinitely small ... and the pressure drop along the axis of rotation will be infinitely small ... which instantly condenses water vapor and releases that 2,100 J/g of energy ... all within an infinitely short time period ... if we then let time pass, then some of this latent energy will be applied to increasing the angular momentum of the rotation ... why cyclones spin ...

Coriolis force doesn't produce torque, therefore it cannot effect rotation ... we use convective force (cross product) pressure force = torque ...

Chick is a liar ... she's not an engineer ... I've taken a few college science classes and Chick has never ... there's a couple of things every lab section goes over, every time, that she misses, completely ...

Scientific Theory is nothing without a demonstration ... in the laboratory ... and this is completely lacking in the Hysterical Climate Change movement ... at most, 1,000,000 ppm gives a +5ºC increase ... by ratios, we should see 0.005ºC increase for 150 ppm increase ...

We don't measure temperature that accurately ...but YOU CAN HELP ...

Tell us how you use temperature to calculate density altitude ... say Aspen, Colorado (7,800 ft), on a 95ºF day ... how many extra loops should you fly to get over those 12,000 foot ridge lines all around you? ...

Thanks for the question about Density Altitude.
You handed me incomplete information.
Second do you have an E6B Flight Calculator?

If you have a lot of horsepower, you will outperform a Cessna 120 by a huge margin.
I have landed and taken off at such high airports and calculated Density Altitude and it is a must to do this. Say you end up calculating you will have a climb rate of 100 feet per minute, this can show you how many loops you need to get above the peaks.
Flying still is visual at most times. The exception is if you fly in lousy visibility. Then you must fly using IFR rules or instrument flight rules.
Here is a link to help you.

Technique - Calculating density altitude

www.aopa.org

However, the rule is fly the airplane. I hope you are a pilot. For non pilots, what we mean is do not let your awareness fail you because you are not paying attention to flying the airplane. It is not unknown to have two commercial pilots get focused on a problem and lose track of what they must do to correctly fly the airplane. But it is extremely rare that commercial pilots will both manage to focus on a problem to the point they are not aware of what the plane is doing.
I should not be telling you new material.
If this is for fun, try the link.

The Density altitude problem is ordinarily worried about when you get into the 90s and up in temperature. But one must also understand barometric pressure and how to set your altimeter to be your friend. The link has good detail.

 

[Robert W]

Coriolis force is a pseudo-force ... it's strictly an artifact of your frame-of-reference ... shoot your cannon ball due north, so you see the Coriolis acceleration? ... now, where did the kinetic energy come from? ...

From an inertial frame-of-reference ... the Coriolis force cannot be observed ... therefore, it cannot be ascribed to have done any work ... it is you who are under acceleration, not the cannonball ...

Physics 101 ...

What I am talking about is the fact that air is not naturally moving. It moves when a force is applied. And as you mention, the closer to the two poles you are, the more you notice the wind is not moving in the path the earth is spinning but it veers off to the observer on the ground. Birds paths change due to the effect. When they shoot missiles, they must understand this as part of the aiming process. Of course we are in the era of computers so they will program the missile to follow the desired path. Birds do not have computers so they do it the old fashioned way.

 

[jc456]

Try it yourself ... any latitude ... which ever way you swirl the bathtub water, that's how the water will spin down the drain ... if you want the water to go straight down, you'll need to wait a week for all the currents to settle ...

If the tub is nearly infinitely narrow, then the rotation will be infinitely small ... and the pressure drop along the axis of rotation will be infinitely small ... which instantly condenses water vapor and releases that 2,100 J/g of energy ... all within an infinitely short time period ... if we then let time pass, then some of this latent energy will be applied to increasing the angular momentum of the rotation ... why cyclones spin ...

Coriolis force doesn't produce torque, therefore it cannot effect rotation ... we use convective force (cross product) pressure force = torque ...

Another one

 

[Robert W]

Another one

When discussing climate, the effect shown using water is far less important since air is what spins. (climate discussion)
I can't imagine there being tornados or hurricanes except for the Coriolis effect. This effects name is that of the Frenchman who first was working with it scientifically. I have never heard of a tornado or a hurricane at the equator. Perhaps a poster has knowledge if it happened. Notice when talking about Weather and they tell you about hurricanes. Watch the path they follow. They follow a curve. This is due to the effect under discussion.

 

[jc456]

Chick is a liar ... she's not an engineer ... I've taken a few college science classes and Chick has never ... there's a couple of things every lab section goes over, every time, that she misses, completely ...

Scientific Theory is nothing without a demonstration ... in the laboratory ... and this is completely lacking in the Hysterical Climate Change movement ... at most, 1,000,000 ppm gives a +5ºC increase ... by ratios, we should see 0.005ºC increase for 150 ppm increase ...

We don't measure temperature that accurately ...but YOU CAN HELP ...

Tell us how you use temperature to calculate density altitude ... say Aspen, Colorado (7,800 ft), on a 95ºF day ... how many extra loops should you fly to get over those 12,000 foot ridge lines all around you? ...

I agree. True engineers look at everything available to them, test any theory and then confirm that theory with empirical evidence. It seems she doesn’t do any of that

 

[ReinyDays]

... I hope you are a pilot ...

Oh no ... shit ... you mean I GOTTA FLY THIS THING ??? ... that means we're dead ...

My brother soloed before he could drive a car ... if we paid the rental, he was more than happy to fly us around ... and that included lessons, but I'm a father and have pictures where my money used to be ...

 

[Crick]

Notice that I did not bring up water spin. I focused on climate.

WRT to Coriolis? Where was that?

The impact the spin of the earth has on global climate.

I'm sorry but I missed that. Can you point it out for me?

It has been a few months but I have also brought up a global presentation showing that different parts of earth have some huge changes in climate in relation to other parts.
Let me illustrate. Where the Sahara desert is, we can postulate, accurately of course, that it is a dry region that approximates the size of the United States of America. It has a climate that is drastically different from say Canada or areas north of Canada and areas south of Argentina. We do not find snow on the Sahara desert. Plant life there is unique to this hot area. Check out Death Valley, one of my favorites where even inside of CA, you see vastly different climate in the southern area than say where Santa Rosa north is like. Redwood trees do not grow south of a sort of demarcation point that is in northern CA. If they are planted in the South of CA, and surely some must be there, it is not mentioned. Because they are not natural of the South.

The issue of man made global warming is a GLOBAL one.

Anyway, the huge fight on this forum is do you want you, your children, your family, your friends ... to be blamed for climate or not?

That is a factor that has been brought up but that is not what the fight on this forum is about. It is about whether or not anthropogenic global warming is taking place and, if it is, whether or not it is a threat that requires a response. And, if that as well, what that response could or should entail.

Will you tolerate a Government that persists on knocking you down and changing your life on the premise you are the party changing climate?

No one is suggesting any such thing.

I say hell no. I will not go along with a Government doing this to me, my family and friends.

Would you go along with taking rational measures to deal effectively with an actual threat facing every one of us?

 

[jc456]

The issue of man made global warming is a GLOBAL one

Nope, and you still can’t prove it. It’s clear you have no clue about the equator. And the northern hemisphere is much more influential.

Hurricane Facts

“ Since the Corioles force is at a maximum at the poles and a minimum at the equator, hurricanes can not form within 5 degrees latitude of the equator. The Corioles force generates a counterclockwise spin to low pressure in the Northern Hemisphere and a clockwise spin to low pressure in the Southern Hemisphere.”

 

[Robert W]

Oh no ... shit ... you mean I GOTTA FLY THIS THING ??? ... that means we're dead ...

My brother soloed before he could drive a car ... if we paid the rental, he was more than happy to fly us around ... and that included lessons, but I'm a father and have pictures where my money used to be ...

Here is the thing. Pilots get training in the use of the calculator used to compute density altitude.
I hope your brother has a license because if not, students are not to fly passengers until licensed. Many times I would take my daughter with us and by us i mean me and the flight instructor. Once I got my license, I could fly anybody for free. Sharing fuel expenses would be okay but it is not okay to pay a charge to the pilot for flying you. One needs the commercial license to fly for profit, passengers.
Based on your incomplete information I believed you are not a pilot.

Now, we can buy electronic computers designed for pilots.
But for eons pilots have used the E6B shown in the photo below.

 

[Robert W]

WRT to Coriolis? Where was that?

I'm sorry but I missed that. Can you point it out for me?

The issue of man made global warming is a GLOBAL one.

That is a factor that has been brought up but that is not what the fight on this forum is about. It is about whether or not anthropogenic global warming is taking place and, if it is, whether or not it is a threat that requires a response. And, if that as well, what that response could or should entail.

No one is suggesting any such thing.

Would you go along with taking rational measures to deal effectively with an actual threat facing every one of us?

What threat do you control?

 

[Crick]

Chick is a liar

Prove for us that anything I have ever posted here was a willful lie.

... she's not an engineer ...

Reiny doesn't like me because I've embarrassed him on several occasions by correcting his mistakes. In response he has hysterically screamed at me, accused me of lying and consistently calls me by female pronouns.

I've taken a few college science classes and Chick has never ...

A conclusion for which he has no evidence.

there's a couple of things every lab section goes over, every time, that she misses, completely ...

Every lab section? How would have "taken a few college science classes" inform him of that?

Scientific Theory is nothing without a demonstration ... in the laboratory ... and this is completely lacking in the Hysterical Climate Change movement ... at most, 1,000,000 ppm gives a +5ºC increase ... by ratios, we should see 0.005ºC increase for 150 ppm increase ...

There are lots of fields in which it is not always possible to create meaningful laboratory simulations. Cosmology, astronomy, theoretical physics and so forth. Climate theory is one of them. You cannot create a simulacrum of the Earth's climate in a laboratory. What can be created there has been. If he would care to identify the process he believes can and should be demonstrated, we could talk about it. But he hasn't so far, has he.

We don't measure temperature that accurately ...but YOU CAN HELP ...

This is an old claim of some deniers. They believe that the average of a 1,000 temperatures recorded to a tenth of a degree may only be quoted to a tenth of a degree. I have demonstrated on multiple occasions that this is false.

Tell us how you use temperature to calculate density altitude ... say Aspen, Colorado (7,800 ft), on a 95ºF day ... how many extra loops should you fly to get over those 12,000 foot ridge lines all around you? ...

Are you now testing Robert to see if he can match YOUR piloting expertise?

 

[Crick]

What threat do you control?

Bad coffee.

 

[jc456]

Prove for us that anything I have ever posted here was a willful lie

How many times did you post that incompetent IPCC report when you knew it was wrong

 

[Crick]

How many times did you post that incompetent IPCC report when you knew it was wrong

What report would that be?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Would you go along with taking rational measures to deal effectively with an actual threat facing every one of us?

That's the problem with most climate doomers. Their measures aren't rational.

 

[Robert W]

When talking of Earth, and it's size, and climate
1. There are many climates on Earth
2. Earth is huge. How many square miles is the surface of Earth? The surface of our planet measures 197,060,800 square miles.
3. There are 5 Major climate zones. The Main Climate Zones Using his botanical hypothesis, Köppen determined that five major climates exist worldwide: tropical, dry, temperate, continental, and polar.

Obviously the easiest to understand is the Polar.

How many climate types are there on Earth?



Are there 12 climate zones?

There are 12 different types of climate found on Earth. Sometimes climate types are called climate zones. Each of the 12 climate types are grouped into 5 categories, except 1 (Highland). Climates in the same category share characteristics and usually are found in the same area.

 

[Robert W]

A lot of posters, by daily living in weather, talk about climate as it not being weather. But it is weather over spans of 30 years per climate scientists.

This section will explain what you must know about weather and climates.
I won't paste all the information but suggest if you truly want to know, the link is here for you. I recommend on any topic, arm yourself with as much information as you can and then deal with the topic.

All About Climate

Climate is the long-term pattern of weather in a particular area.

education.nationalgeographic.org