Obamacare train pulls safely into the station

[Antares]

Here is something I just discovered last week....and THIS is where the reform should have started.

A knee replacement in Omaha costs 25000 dollars...a knee replacement in California costs 125000......that's just wrong all the way around.

Yeah. That is the result of "free market" forces when it comes to health care. One of the things we need our elected representatives to regulate.

Did you miss this? I wonder how? It was well publicized.

http://www.uta.edu/faculty/story/2311/Misc/2013,2,26,MedicalCostsDemandAndGreed.pdf

Or how about this?

http://www.newsweek.com/2014/01/03/myth-health-cares-free-market-244994.html

Oh ye of the superior intellect.....

As of Jan 1 there IS no free market in terms of Insurance.

Why?

ALL pre-existings MUST be covered.....and,
ALL Companies MUST spend 80cents of every premium dollar collected on claims....

That effectively eliminated "competition".

 

[Antares]

Oh yes...and LL that is the greed of the PRIVIDERS and NOT insurance companies.

Did I mention that I work for a non-profit?

 

[LoneLaugher]

Oh yes...and LL that is the greed of the PRIVIDERS and NOT insurance companies.

Did I mention that I work for a non-profit?

None of that matters. Why did you say it?

 

[dblack]

... the only reason the Republicans seek to end Medicare and Social Security and Obamacare is simple, when privatized each offers the nations power elite the ability to take more $$$ from the many. It has nothing to do with Freedom or fear of Socialism; those 'concerns' are a charade, it has to do with power, control and greed.

Certainly any kind of "managed" privatization of these institutions would turn into another corporatist boondoggle. But some republicans, and most libertarians, want to see government out of these functions for the opposite reason.

Huh? What is the opposite of a "corporatist boondoggle"? Boondoggle has a number of different connotations so I can't determine which applies in context.

I'm referring to the Republican pattern of "privatizing" government services by farming them out to corporate partners as a cronyist gift. When libertarians, and real limited government conservatives advocate for privatization, we're talking about simply ending government involvement flatly.

 

[bluesman]

They can vote for whatever they want. But when what they want violates the Constitution, they can't have it. The system only works, however, when the Court does its job.

Just because you disagree with the ruling, it isn't fair to say that the court didn't do its job. Congress passed the law and congress has the right to levy taxes. John Roberts was the swing vote and he said it wasn't his place to protect the people from themselves.

It is, in fact, his job to protect the people from themselves. In a democracy, the entire point of a constitution is to 'protect the people from themselves'. Roberts failed to recognize that.

The relevant question of ACA wasn't whether Congress has the power to levy taxes, it was whether they have the power to use discriminatory taxation to conduct social engineering. Doing so is a blatant violation of the equal protection provisions of the 14th amendment. By signing off on this practice, Roberts has authorized Congress to do dictate virtually any behavior, with only the dwindling protections of the Bill of Rights remaining.

From my own perspective, I prefer that everyone pays for health insurance.

From my perspective, I prefer that everyone stop watching reality TV. But I shouldn't be allowed to force my preferences on the rest of the nation, even if I can get half of Congress to agree.

You are kind of being a smart ass and missing the point at the same time. Other people watching reality TV has no impact on you. It doesn't take money out of your pocket. As far as the constitutional process, that is something you have to take up with the founders. They wrote it and I think they did a good job. Two separate congressional entities passed the law. The people in congress were elected by the people of the United States. So was the president. You keep coming back to saying it is constitutionally wrong but don't really seem to have a constitutional argument. This is a case where we have to agree to disagree. I agree with the Supreme court on this one and you disagree. Just because a minority doesn't like Obama no matter what he does, that doesn't mean we have to scrap everything. Healthcare costs have continued to eat up a bigger chunk of the budget year after year. The right has offered nothing but rhetoric. Obama got something done. It may get changed but the simple fact is that he was willing to take the political hit and get it done.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Tell me what you think are lies.

I don't think they're lies, they are exposed as lies and not only the ones in the video above. Hannity had several on his show who lied about the costs and their experiences with the PPACA and John Stewert exposed Hannity quite well for the liar he is here:

Sean Hannity?s Lies Exposed By Jon Stewart | News Corpse

One video is worth 45,000 pretend protesters.

I watch Fox, big surprise?


I can tell you that I turn to my wife every time they spout bullshit about the law.

Hannity, O'reilley, Kelly....ALL have had bullshit guests and outright liars on their shows.

You mentioned lies, I am asking what lies YOU have seen being espoused?

See Zander's post above. It may not be a lie, per se, but without posting evidence that his new policy is identical except for cost his post must be considered a lie of omission.

 

[dblack]

Just because you disagree with the ruling, it isn't fair to say that the court didn't do its job. Congress passed the law and congress has the right to levy taxes. John Roberts was the swing vote and he said it wasn't his place to protect the people from themselves.

It is, in fact, his job to protect the people from themselves. In a democracy, the entire point of a constitution is to 'protect the people from themselves'. Roberts failed to recognize that.

The relevant question of ACA wasn't whether Congress has the power to levy taxes, it was whether they have the power to use discriminatory taxation to conduct social engineering. Doing so is a blatant violation of the equal protection provisions of the 14th amendment. By signing off on this practice, Roberts has authorized Congress to do dictate virtually any behavior, with only the dwindling protections of the Bill of Rights remaining.

From my own perspective, I prefer that everyone pays for health insurance.

From my perspective, I prefer that everyone stop watching reality TV. But I shouldn't be allowed to force my preferences on the rest of the nation, even if I can get half of Congress to agree.

You are kind of being a smart ass and missing the point at the same time. Other people watching reality TV has no impact on you.

Sure it does. My favorite series (Firefly) gets cancelled, and their retarded shit flourishes.

You keep coming back to saying it is constitutionally wrong but don't really seem to have a constitutional argument. This is a case where we have to agree to disagree. I agree with the Supreme court on this one and you disagree. Just because a minority doesn't like Obama no matter what he does, that doesn't mean we have to scrap everything.

This has nothing to do with Obama. Romney led the way with the mandate shit.

Healthcare costs have continued to eat up a bigger chunk of the budget year after year. The right has offered nothing but rhetoric. Obama got something done. It may get changed but the simple fact is that he was willing to take the political hit and get it done.

And he sold us out in the process. He should take the hit for that.

 

[LoneLaugher]

I don't think they're lies, they are exposed as lies and not only the ones in the video above. Hannity had several on his show who lied about the costs and their experiences with the PPACA and John Stewert exposed Hannity quite well for the liar he is here:

Sean Hannity?s Lies Exposed By Jon Stewart | News Corpse

One video is worth 45,000 pretend protesters.

I watch Fox, big surprise?


I can tell you that I turn to my wife every time they spout bullshit about the law.

Hannity, O'reilley, Kelly....ALL have had bullshit guests and outright liars on their shows.

You mentioned lies, I am asking what lies YOU have seen being espoused?

See Zander's post above. It may not be a lie, per se, but without posting evidence that his new policy is identical except for cost his post must be considered a lie of omission.

Zander would never be dishonest about the ACA. He has been a fair observer of the law since day one. Maybe he'll find another treasure trove of cartoons to post in succession........you know.....liven up the joint.

 

[Antares]

Oh yes...and LL that is the greed of the PRIVIDERS and NOT insurance companies.

Did I mention that I work for a non-profit?

None of that matters. Why did you say it?

Because the truth is this...you simply have NO idea about anything you type.

You are a parrot, no more, no less.

 

[Antares]

I watch Fox, big surprise?


I can tell you that I turn to my wife every time they spout bullshit about the law.

Hannity, O'reilley, Kelly....ALL have had bullshit guests and outright liars on their shows.

You mentioned lies, I am asking what lies YOU have seen being espoused?

See Zander's post above. It may not be a lie, per se, but without posting evidence that his new policy is identical except for cost his post must be considered a lie of omission.

Zander would never be dishonest about the ACA. He has been a fair observer of the law since day one. Maybe he'll find another treasure trove of cartoons to post in succession........you know.....liven up the joint.

Now you are just laughable nigga......I've never lied about one thing....

 

[Antares]

Never mind he agreed with what I posted....c'mon LL......you jus one mo lyin Nigga chile?

 

[Zander]

I don't think they're lies, they are exposed as lies and not only the ones in the video above. Hannity had several on his show who lied about the costs and their experiences with the PPACA and John Stewert exposed Hannity quite well for the liar he is here:

Sean Hannity?s Lies Exposed By Jon Stewart | News Corpse

One video is worth 45,000 pretend protesters.

I watch Fox, big surprise?


I can tell you that I turn to my wife every time they spout bullshit about the law.

Hannity, O'reilley, Kelly....ALL have had bullshit guests and outright liars on their shows.

You mentioned lies, I am asking what lies YOU have seen being espoused?

See Zander's post above. It may not be a lie, per se, but without posting evidence that his new policy is identical except for cost his post must be considered a lie of omission.

Sophistrty, plain and simple.

Because of O'care - we can no longer purchase our old policy.

next you'll tell me that our old policy was "garbage", right? a crappy policy, right?

Here's a news flash for ya- the garbage is called Obamacare.

 

[Wry Catcher]

I watch Fox, big surprise?


I can tell you that I turn to my wife every time they spout bullshit about the law.

Hannity, O'reilley, Kelly....ALL have had bullshit guests and outright liars on their shows.

You mentioned lies, I am asking what lies YOU have seen being espoused?

See Zander's post above. It may not be a lie, per se, but without posting evidence that his new policy is identical except for cost his post must be considered a lie of omission.

Sophistrty, plain and simple.

Because of O'care - we can no longer purchase our old policy.

next you'll tell me that our old policy was "garbage", right? a crappy policy, right?

Here's a news flash for ya- the garbage is called Obamacare.

Nothing changed for me, I planned ahead. BTW, A lie by omission is still a lie, and now you've doubled down.

 

[bluesman]

See Zander's post above. It may not be a lie, per se, but without posting evidence that his new policy is identical except for cost his post must be considered a lie of omission.

Sophistrty, plain and simple.

Because of O'care - we can no longer purchase our old policy.

next you'll tell me that our old policy was "garbage", right? a crappy policy, right?

Here's a news flash for ya- the garbage is called Obamacare.

Nothing changed for me, I planned ahead. BTW, A lie by omission is still a lie, and now you've doubled down.

My plan didn't change either. It is weird how the right winger's plans doubled in cost, etc. I guess everybody is just supposed to trust the Obama-haters.

I get it that there are going to be doctors who don't like Obama-care because they want to milk the system. Higher deductibles are part of the answer. When there is no deductible, then the customer (patient) pays no attention to how much tests costs. The doctors will always recommend every test possible to be "safe". However, they are making big bucks off the testing. Higher deductibles encourage a more capitalistic approach. If getting a test or a shot costs a certain amount with a doctor but the same test or shot is available at the drugstore for half the cost, then in a free market based system, the customer will choose the cheaper option. This will drive costs down. When doctors see that their customers are getting shots and tests elsewhere, then they will have to respond by lowering the price that they charge.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/bruceja...it-patient-pocketbooks-and-hospital-finances/

When deductibles and co-payments are high, patients tend to think twice about their health care purchases, making them more likely to shop around for the best deal. Fitch sees this impacting hospital patient volumes with choosier patients more likely to demand “price and quality information,” the New York based financial ratings firm said in its report.

 

[billyerock1991]

Needs a repeat.

if you say so ....I personally am not to familiar with greenbeards post ... I've seen him here, read them, every now and then ... I know Antares is he slipped up in one of his rants one after noon ... I caught him ...whats your source that greenbeard is a paid poster ... I personally don't take paid posters serious ... if he is, then I won't take him serious.. I don't care if they are republican or a Dem paid poster I won't take them serious ... they are doing their job, distort the reality here... I for one won't stand for it...

LOL Billie you are a moron plain and simple.

LOL you keep denying what you are Antares ... we know you're a paid poster for BCBS ... we don't need your kind here trying to lie about what is or what isn't ...

 

[billyerock1991]

Poor hillbilly, you seem to be quite full of yourself...with no apparent reason to be.

Why would your opinion matter to anyone but you?

Where you fail is that you never post anything BUT your opinion and when asked for sources to back up your claim, you simply shrug and claim you have no need to post ANY sources at all.

You fail kid, but then you are used to that.

translation=antares is pissed because he has been expost as a political hack for the right wing nut jobs of this country... he actually think he has valuer here ... antares nobody like a political liar like you, and that's what you are ... you lie for money ... you get paid to post your pack of lies here from Blue cross Blue shield ...the company you work for... they don't like obama care ...because they can no longer rape the American people of their health care any more ... you are paid to lie here, you paid poster piece of crap ... I've exposed you for what you are and you can't stand that... so you don't need to pity me ... I'm just doing fine with my obama care and my subsidy and pissing your kind off to the max ....

BWA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA BWA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You have a screw loose kid.

The BCBS company I work for is a non-profit company, you understand what that means?

I am seriously beginning to think you are an order of fries short of a Happy Meal.

I have no doubt you are happy with your subsidy, its obvious you've been on some sort of Government Assistance your entire life.

yeah, yeah, yeah, we get it paid poster... keep tap dancing ... I've never been on any government assistance ever in my life ... I retired in 1980 because of my electronic skills ... i've been living off the stock and bond market ever sense, not to mention covered calls ... mostly covered calls ... the only time I've had any assistance is this year when ACA was passed ...but you keep trying to justify why your are here.... by slandering people and the ACA .... we get it paid poster ... if they point out your lies then of course we must be on "merican gubment assistance program ... that's the repub-lie-tard way ... what next Antares are you going to start with the gay references ??? that's what your repub-lie-tards do when you are confronted with the truth ... LOL

P.S.
with my social security that I get now and the money I make from the market ... I decided to stop taking so much of my market money you see social security isn't taxed ... so I'll make just enough to get medicaid an pay nothing at all for my health care ... then I will go on medicare the following year ...that way I can piss more republicans of by getting you to pay for my health care ... see that's what happens when you have the ability to think ... you on the other hand are just another puppet from the right ...

 

[billyerock1991]

How many per day?

For every day that the ACA does not result in the ruin of the economy and the destruction of our health care delivery system....how many Americans will realize that the GOP has been serving them a pile of shit?

well I know of one ... Antares ...he's a paid poster and if he realizes its not failing, he'll be out of work ...

 

[billyerock1991]

How many per day?

For every day that the ACA does not result in the ruin of the economy and the destruction of our health care delivery system....how many Americans will realize that the GOP has serving them a pile of shit?

And in November when the shit hits the fan and all you have left is Obama, what then?

you sure have a active imagination but that'''s all you got ...we will see won't we

 

[billyerock1991]

And in November when the shit hits the fan and all you have left is Obama, what then?

As if it will make a difference. It is hard to imagine a scenario where things are made more difficult for the Obama administration than they have been for the past 4 years. What is the GOP gonna do? Have negative level of support instead of zero level of support?

You are making predictions here based on wishful thinking. Haven't you learned from the past?

I am making a prediction based on my contact with the public 5 days a week concerning this issue.

You do realize that in 2010 American's VOTED to stop Obama's agenda?

The House is a duly elected body doing what we sent them there to do.

not really paid poster ...they got en because everybody knows that the only way a republican can get in is in the mid terms... this time you republicans have really pissed of the independents, women, minorities, old people with your voter Id laws you've been trying to pass, you any your kind will regret the day you were born, after we dem/liberals get finished with your lying Kind

 

[billyerock1991]

You're much like the preacher who predicts the end of the world, then when the sun rises he is not one bit shaken in his faith, and claims the world will end in November.

What will doomsayers like you do, if by November the sun rises, more and more citizens flood a now working data base and sign up in droves during the next open enrollment period? Don't answer, you'll demand the President's birth certificate, of course.

I'll make a shit load of money just like I did this time around.

I'm just telling you that the public is NOT in support of this law.

I suppose in your reality the public is opposed to Medicare and Social Security too. Get with it, the only reason the Republicans seek to end Medicare and Social Security and Obamacare is simple, when privatized each offers the nations power elite the ability to take more $$$ from the many. It has nothing to do with Freedom or fear of Socialism; those 'concerns' are a charade, it has to do with power, control and greed.

Your comment, "I'll make a shit load of money just like I did this time around" is very telling. As one who spent a career investigating, those words tell me a good deal about you.

it says he's a paid poster ... he gets more money trying to convince us that obama care bad... antares believes paying through your nose, good thing... lose everything you own, great thing... then cut them off, even a greater thing ... thats the antares way of life..