Obama Campaign Ad....A lie.

[Listening]

blah blah thanks for the baseless opinions. LOL

Is LOL your codeword for (I need to see a priest to confess that I know I am lying).

Baseless ?

His numbers are in the tank (for an incumbent) and things are really starting to work against him.

See you in November.

 

[Listening]

Romney gets blamed for 750 but Obama is blameless for the net 1M jobs lost.

*shrug*

Good point.

I am sure the Obama campaign has a great strategy for dealing with that one.

Like:

"Hey, I've got a new idea.....let's blame it on Booooosssshhhhh".

 

[drsmith1072]

well you need to check your recollections because you did and the proof is above.

how is quoting your posts to show you as being contradictory a negative reflection on me?? LOL

Why is it wrong for obama to hold romney accountable for things that happened at GTS after romney left when romney tries to take credit for this that occured at SD after he left? If one is wrong shouldn't both be wrong?

There is no proof in the posts above. Only your mindless desire to see Obama get out of this election with his skin still in tact.

Sorry, but Obama ran an ad that was patent bull. All the twisting in the world on your part won't change that fact.

You've made the same claim six times now and been show how you were wrong.

Somehow the definition of insanity is starting to show up here.

do you actually believe that omitting the proof that I citied within my posts will make it nonexistant??

here it is again try not to trip over it as you run away this time.

Here is a Romney counter:

Steel Dynamics Chairman Hails Romney, Bain Capital For Early Funding, Thousands Of Jobs - Investors.com

Since emerging as the Republican front-runner, Mitt Romney has been pilloried as a corporate raider and greedy destroyer of working-class jobs because he once headed private equity firm Bain Capital.

A new video by a political action committee with ties to rival presidential candidate Newt Gingrich portrays Romney as someone who plundered companies for their assets, left them in debt and ruined countless lives of ordinary Americans.

That's not the view at Fort Wayne, Ind.-based Steel Dynamics (STLD), where Bain invested just as the company was getting off the ground in 1994. Today, Steel Dynamics is the fifth-largest U.S. steel maker, employing 6,437 workers, according to Chairman and just-retired CEO Keith Busse.

That number includes about 4,000 new jobs, with the rest coming via acquisitions.

But it goes further than that, Busse says. For every steel worker directly employed, there are three or four jobs created by a network of suppliers. He estimates the total employment base as the result of Steel Dynamics' success at around 25,000.

if obama's ad is bull then so is romney's counter that you cited. So why is it ok for you to prop up romney's propaganda and then argue that obama's is out of bounds??

 

[Listening]

well you need to check your recollections because you did and the proof is above.

how is quoting your posts to show you as being contradictory a negative reflection on me?? LOL

Why is it wrong for obama to hold romney accountable for things that happened at GTS after romney left when romney tries to take credit for this that occured at SD after he left? If one is wrong shouldn't both be wrong?

There is no proof in the posts above. Only your mindless desire to see Obama get out of this election with his skin still in tact.

Sorry, but Obama ran an ad that was patent bull. All the twisting in the world on your part won't change that fact.

You've made the same claim six times now and been show how you were wrong.

Somehow the definition of insanity is starting to show up here.

do you actually believe that omitting the proof that I citied within my posts will make it nonexistant??

here it is again try not to trip over it as you run away this time.

Here is a Romney counter:

Steel Dynamics Chairman Hails Romney, Bain Capital For Early Funding, Thousands Of Jobs - Investors.com

Since emerging as the Republican front-runner, Mitt Romney has been pilloried as a corporate raider and greedy destroyer of working-class jobs because he once headed private equity firm Bain Capital.

A new video by a political action committee with ties to rival presidential candidate Newt Gingrich portrays Romney as someone who plundered companies for their assets, left them in debt and ruined countless lives of ordinary Americans.

That's not the view at Fort Wayne, Ind.-based Steel Dynamics (STLD), where Bain invested just as the company was getting off the ground in 1994. Today, Steel Dynamics is the fifth-largest U.S. steel maker, employing 6,437 workers, according to Chairman and just-retired CEO Keith Busse.

That number includes about 4,000 new jobs, with the rest coming via acquisitions.

But it goes further than that, Busse says. For every steel worker directly employed, there are three or four jobs created by a network of suppliers. He estimates the total employment base as the result of Steel Dynamics' success at around 25,000.

if obama's ad is bull then so is romney's counter that you cited. So why is it ok for you to prop up romney's propaganda and then argue that obama's is out of bounds??

The only proof you have provided is the body of your posts which show you are a zealot.

I don't recall proping up anything. I simply posted it and stated it was coming from the Romney side. You, can't seem to get you hands off Obama's dick long enough to think about what you saying.

I didn't make the claims you cite above...the leaders of Steel Dynamics did.

 

[JoeB131]

One of the articles discusses how private equity firms aggressively use debt. And that was the case for GTS. The point was that they didn't extract 100 million from the company....most of that went back into the company which wasn't doing all that badly for a while.

Things turned bad for the steel industry and it became a victim.

As to "anyone"....well, I don't work in that world so I don't know. What I do know is that he made a bunch of money and it seems to have pissed off a lot of folks.

It strikes me that if you borrow a shitload of money, pay yourself 12 million in management fees on what was for you an 8 million dollar investment, and then let the company go into bankruptcy, leaving the pension fund broke, the lenders holding the bag and you walk away and talk about what a great businessman you are...

I have to ask? WHy is this even legal?

On this point, you and I would agree....IF

things are as you described them.

And your last question is telling in that it does not seem like it would be.

So, if they are not prosecuted, it leads me to believe the story isn't as you simply described it.

But the problem is, these sorts of things are perfectly legal... and thus why our economy is in the mess it's in.

Now once upon a time, Capitalism worked in such a way that you made a product, you marketted it, you sold it, you made a profit.

Today, it works in such a way that it's all about manipulating the system to make a buck, which is why accounting departments and legal departments of companies are sometimes bigger than operations.

 

[zonly1]

Romney gets blamed for 750 but Obama is blameless for the net 1M jobs lost.

*shrug*

thanks for incoherent logic

need a lesson?

The only thing not logical about the situation is that Romney didnt lose the 750 jobs and he's still on the hook for em.
Obama on the other hand....

And add the numbers into the equation 750-compared to a million?

The ides that Obama can run using the "Jobs" platform is ridicules.

his numbers are tanking but is the fix in signing ndaa, false flags, dollar collaspe, debt bigger than gdp

 

[Listening]

It strikes me that if you borrow a shitload of money, pay yourself 12 million in management fees on what was for you an 8 million dollar investment, and then let the company go into bankruptcy, leaving the pension fund broke, the lenders holding the bag and you walk away and talk about what a great businessman you are...

I have to ask? WHy is this even legal?

On this point, you and I would agree....IF

things are as you described them.

And your last question is telling in that it does not seem like it would be.

So, if they are not prosecuted, it leads me to believe the story isn't as you simply described it.

But the problem is, these sorts of things are perfectly legal... and thus why our economy is in the mess it's in.

Now once upon a time, Capitalism worked in such a way that you made a product, you marketted it, you sold it, you made a profit.

Today, it works in such a way that it's all about manipulating the system to make a buck, which is why accounting departments and legal departments of companies are sometimes bigger than operations.

What you say is true.

And Romney did not set it up that way. He simply got involved.

That being said, steel companies are not shell games or wall street money movers. They make something. Bain seemed interested in helping manufacturing.

One thing Dr.Doofus won't acknowledge is that while Bain made money on GST....it was not the kind of money they were looking to make. It was obviously in Bain's best interest if a company succeeded.

 

[HUGGY]

On this point, you and I would agree....IF

things are as you described them.

And your last question is telling in that it does not seem like it would be.

So, if they are not prosecuted, it leads me to believe the story isn't as you simply described it.

But the problem is, these sorts of things are perfectly legal... and thus why our economy is in the mess it's in.

Now once upon a time, Capitalism worked in such a way that you made a product, you marketted it, you sold it, you made a profit.

Today, it works in such a way that it's all about manipulating the system to make a buck, which is why accounting departments and legal departments of companies are sometimes bigger than operations.

What you say is true.

And Romney did not set it up that way. He simply got involved.

That being said, steel companies are not shell games or wall street money movers. They make something. Bain seemed interested in helping manufacturing.

One thing Dr.Doofus won't acknowledge is that while Bain made money on GST....it was not the kind of money they were looking to make. It was obviously in Bain's best interest if a company succeeded.

Liar.

 

[JoeB131]

What you say is true.

And Romney did not set it up that way. He simply got involved.

That being said, steel companies are not shell games or wall street money movers. They make something. Bain seemed interested in helping manufacturing.

One thing Dr.Doofus won't acknowledge is that while Bain made money on GST....it was not the kind of money they were looking to make. It was obviously in Bain's best interest if a company succeeded.

But that's not what they did. They didn't do what my GM did when he came in 4 years ago, and started reorganizing everything we did and how we thought about our work.

The first thing they did when they came in was "How do we load down GST with debt to pay ourselves salaries". Which was easy to do because for an 8 million dollar investment, they were able to take out millions in loans and pay themselves huge salaries. Then they let the place fall into bankruptcy, everyone lost their jobs, the Pension fund had to be bailed out by the government, and the assets got sold off.

Vampire Capitalism...

 

[Toro]

This week the Obama campaign debuted its attack on Bain Capital, the private-equity firm Mitt Romney founded. Its two-minute ad purports to tell the story of GS Technologies, a Kansas City-based Bain investment that went bankrupt in 2001.

To hear the Obama campaign, this is a tale of greed: GST was a healthy, happy, quality steelmaker until Bain plundered its worth and stripped its 750 workers of their due. "It was like a vampire," laments one former employee in the ad. "They came in and sucked the life out of us."

GST is a tragic tale, though in a different way. The real story of GST is that of a private-equity firm trying to spark some life into a uncompetitive, over-unionized industry. Bain's crime here—if that's what you call it—was giving a dying steel plant an unexpected eight-year lease on life.

When Bain bought the Kansas City mill in 1993, steel was a scene of carnage. Global players were pouring out cheap products, and America's high-cost steel plants couldn't compete. The industry had lost 200,000 jobs in preceding years. In 1992 alone, the six largest U.S. steel mills had lost a combined $3 billion. Armco, the company Bain would buy the plant from, would lose $641 million in 1993.

The Kansas City plant was itself dying. At its 1970 height it employed 4,500; by the late 1980s it was down to 1,000. A year before acquisition, Armco had laid off another 75. Its equipment was old; it faced fierce competition at home and abroad.

B.C. Huselton, a vice president of the business at the time, tells me that in 1990 the Armco CEO held a meeting. "He told us, 'Look, we either try to sell it, or we've got to shut it down.'" Armco had shut down another Kansas City facility, Union Wire Rope, only a few years before. ...

The late 1990s saw a new outpouring of cheap steel from elsewhere around the globe. The Asian financial crisis walloped the mining industry, cutting demand for GST products. The price of GST's electricity and natural gas skyrocketed. The union dug in, refusing to make concessions. By April 1997, it was on strike, shooting bottle rockets at guards. Labor costs spiked, and by 1999 GSI was reporting $53 million in net losses.

In 2001 it would become one of 31 steel companies that went bankrupt from 1993 to 2003. (Mr. Romney left Bain in 1999.) The steel crash was the economic drama du jour, with Congress railing about "dumping." ...

The Obama ad doesn't note that the broader company, GS Industries, employed 3,500 and that the Kansas City plant (with 750 workers) was the only one shuttered. Other plants were bought and operate today. Nor does it mention Bain's other steel investment in the early 1990s, in an Indiana start-up called Steel Dynamics. The firm touts innovative technology and a nonunion workforce. It today reports $6.3 billion in revenue—25 times what it claimed in its 1996 IPO—and employs 6,000.

A private-equity firm looking to quickly strip value from a company—to "suck" the life out of it—does not do so by investing $100 million in modernization and holding on for eight years, through bankruptcy. Bain has surely made its share of mistakes, and one may well have been trying to resuscitate a traditional steel firm in the grip of industry upheaval. The irony, says Mr. Huselton, is that this plant "wouldn't even be in today's news, if it hadn't been the opportunity that came with Bain. Those jobs would have been gone in 1993."

...

Strassel: Vampire Capitalism? Please - WSJ.com

 

[Conservative]

from the OP link...

The Obama ad doesn't note that the broader company, GS Industries, employed 3,500 and that the Kansas City plant (with 750 workers) was the only one shuttered. Other plants were bought and operate today. Nor does it mention Bain's other steel investment in the early 1990s, in an Indiana start-up called Steel Dynamics. The firm touts innovative technology and a nonunion workforce. It today reports $6.3 billion in revenue—25 times what it claimed in its 1996 IPO—and employs 6,000.

In 2001 it would become one of 31 steel companies that went bankrupt from 1993 to 2003. (Mr. Romney left Bain in 1999.) The steel crash was the economic drama du jour, with Congress railing about "dumping."

At the time, GST's union blamed the company's bankruptcy on the political class, for failing to hamstring imports. "We can't compete against the steel imports that are being sold under cost," said the president of GST's union in 2001. "Our pleas fell on deaf ears in the political arena." The Bush administration would ultimately slap on giant tariffs.

 

[blastoff]

The ad is purposely misleading - Obama camp knows it - but it is safely so because they know the dimwits it's targeted at will buy the Bain is bad mantra hook, line, and sinker. It's red meat stuff to their morons, but the folks they're really going to need come November are way too smart to fall for the b.s.

 

[jillian]

This week the Obama campaign debuted its attack on Bain Capital, the private-equity firm Mitt Romney founded. Its two-minute ad purports to tell the story of GS Technologies, a Kansas City-based Bain investment that went bankrupt in 2001.

To hear the Obama campaign, this is a tale of greed: GST was a healthy, happy, quality steelmaker until Bain plundered its worth and stripped its 750 workers of their due. "It was like a vampire," laments one former employee in the ad. "They came in and sucked the life out of us."

GST is a tragic tale, though in a different way. The real story of GST is that of a private-equity firm trying to spark some life into a uncompetitive, over-unionized industry. Bain's crime here—if that's what you call it—was giving a dying steel plant an unexpected eight-year lease on life.

When Bain bought the Kansas City mill in 1993, steel was a scene of carnage. Global players were pouring out cheap products, and America's high-cost steel plants couldn't compete. The industry had lost 200,000 jobs in preceding years. In 1992 alone, the six largest U.S. steel mills had lost a combined $3 billion. Armco, the company Bain would buy the plant from, would lose $641 million in 1993.

The Kansas City plant was itself dying. At its 1970 height it employed 4,500; by the late 1980s it was down to 1,000. A year before acquisition, Armco had laid off another 75. Its equipment was old; it faced fierce competition at home and abroad.

B.C. Huselton, a vice president of the business at the time, tells me that in 1990 the Armco CEO held a meeting. "He told us, 'Look, we either try to sell it, or we've got to shut it down.'" Armco had shut down another Kansas City facility, Union Wire Rope, only a few years before. ...

The late 1990s saw a new outpouring of cheap steel from elsewhere around the globe. The Asian financial crisis walloped the mining industry, cutting demand for GST products. The price of GST's electricity and natural gas skyrocketed. The union dug in, refusing to make concessions. By April 1997, it was on strike, shooting bottle rockets at guards. Labor costs spiked, and by 1999 GSI was reporting $53 million in net losses.

In 2001 it would become one of 31 steel companies that went bankrupt from 1993 to 2003. (Mr. Romney left Bain in 1999.) The steel crash was the economic drama du jour, with Congress railing about "dumping." ...

The Obama ad doesn't note that the broader company, GS Industries, employed 3,500 and that the Kansas City plant (with 750 workers) was the only one shuttered. Other plants were bought and operate today. Nor does it mention Bain's other steel investment in the early 1990s, in an Indiana start-up called Steel Dynamics. The firm touts innovative technology and a nonunion workforce. It today reports $6.3 billion in revenue—25 times what it claimed in its 1996 IPO—and employs 6,000.

A private-equity firm looking to quickly strip value from a company—to "suck" the life out of it—does not do so by investing $100 million in modernization and holding on for eight years, through bankruptcy. Bain has surely made its share of mistakes, and one may well have been trying to resuscitate a traditional steel firm in the grip of industry upheaval. The irony, says Mr. Huselton, is that this plant "wouldn't even be in today's news, if it hadn't been the opportunity that came with Bain. Those jobs would have been gone in 1993."

...

Strassel: Vampire Capitalism? Please - WSJ.com

reality: under some circunstances Bain invested. under other circumstances, Bain strip-mined companies. as with most things, the truth is somewhere in between.

and if i were a corporate shareholder or upper management, i'd vote mittens all the way. .. that is, if the US were a corporation. it isn't. and i'm not seeing where a return to bush's economic ideology that regressses to the 'trickle down' nonsense of the 80's, would do any better than bush did.

besides, there are other issues... and mittens sucks on all of them because he now owes the "base".

 

[Mad Scientist]

and if i were a corporate shareholder or upper management, i'd vote mittens all the way.

And if I wanted Bankers to turn America into Greece, then I'd vote Obama all the way.

 

[jillian]

and if i were a corporate shareholder or upper management, i'd vote mittens all the way.

And if I wanted Bankers to turn America into Greece, then I'd vote Obama all the way.

i suppose that's true if one lives in fantasyland.

 

[Cowman]

Those "unionized steel companies" helped build this country.

 

[jillian]

The ad is purposely misleading - Obama camp knows it - but it is safely so because they know the dimwits it's targeted at will buy the Bain is bad mantra hook, line, and sinker. It's red meat stuff to their morons, but the folks they're really going to need come November are way too smart to fall for the b.s.

mittens needs to get a thicker skin.

but rightwingers love throwing mud. they just get all up in arms when it's tossed back.

 

[Conservative]

Those "unionized steel companies" helped build this country.

and the influx of cheap Chinese steel (as well as from other countries) is what killed the ones who went under.

 

[Conservative]

The ad is purposely misleading - Obama camp knows it - but it is safely so because they know the dimwits it's targeted at will buy the Bain is bad mantra hook, line, and sinker. It's red meat stuff to their morons, but the folks they're really going to need come November are way too smart to fall for the b.s.

mittens needs to get a thicker skin.

but rightwingers love throwing mud. they just get all up in arms when it's tossed back.

so, Obama puts out a misleading ad, and Romney just 'needs thicker skin'. You of course will say the same thing if Romney puts out a misleading ad about Obama... right? That Obama just 'needs thicker skin'?

 

[Katzndogz]

Those "unionized steel companies" helped build this country.

and the influx of cheap Chinese steel (as well as from other countries) is what killed the ones who went under.

The democrat mantra is never tell the truth if a lie will do.