Nosmo's dialogue

[The Rabbi]

The desperate propensity of many conservatives to lie is both telling and troubling; to lie, to distort, to spin, to contrive, and then seek to propagate those lies in the hope they're perceived to be true.

Take, for example, the economic sanctions against Russia as a consequence of Ukraine.

The rightist internet was ablaze with the lie that the president had 'banned' AK 47s via an EO.

Did the conservatives who contrived and propagated this lie know the truth? Did they care? Did they seek to remain willfully ignorant? And why were there no conservatives of good faith and good conscience who knew the truth, that the president did not in fact 'ban' AK 47s, speak out to denounce the lie?

Sadly, conservative dogma is evolving from being simply wrong to being both wrong and nothing more than a pack of lies.

Actually you lie in this very post.
First off, the internet was not ablaze. There was a thread on this forum. Second, many conservatives like myself pointed out the ban was limited in scope. Third, there was a ban on some AK47s, so it was not a lie, so much as a distortion.
So we see that you have lied, distorted, and told half truths while accusing conservatives of doing the very same. That is what makes liberals so annoying.

 

[deltex1]

That's your opinion, but it does nothing to advance your cause.

Of course its my opinion. But based on fact and past experience. You cannot get over the idea that corporations are mean nasty beings intent on screwing people while the government is a nice benevolent institution with the purest motives. And it doesnt matter how many times both the theory and history contradict your view,you persist in it.

If you had my experiences here in Pittsburgh since the mid 1970s, you might have a different outlook. The steel mills polluted the sky, earth and water, then packed up and took the middle class jobs to Asia for greater profit.

Tell me how noble that was.

I suppose you could see the mills though your broken front window while sitting on your couch with the remote in one hand and your EBT card in the other.

 

[Cowman]

I gotta say, I never quite understood the conservative worship and admiration of Putin. They admire him like a proper Russian "ought" to.

 

[deltex1]

I gotta say, I never quite understood the conservative worship and admiration of Putin. They admire him like a proper Russian "ought" to.

Putin is a piece shit with balls...Obabble is a piece of shit....period.

 

[R.D.]

I gotta say, I never quite understood the conservative worship and admiration of Putin. They admire him like a proper Russian "ought" to.

Of course you do. It a liberal invention you've been programmed to repeat.

 

[LoneLaugher]

I gotta say, I never quite understood the conservative worship and admiration of Putin. They admire him like a proper Russian "ought" to.

Putin is a piece shit with balls...Obabble is a piece of shit....period.

I wonder how you'd view Obama if he did some of the things that Putin does. Would you be impressed? You lying asshole.

 

[Erand7899]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

It's disconcerting because I believe in open debate. I believe that the constitution was wrought by compromise. I believe that this nation is served best when there is loyal opposition from which ever party/ideology is in the minority.

But those virtues are seen as vices by contemporary American Conservatives. So I ask again, why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives?

Conservatism is constantly on the wrong side of history. Every effort to bring about real genuine freedoms have been resisted by Conservatives. From Slavery through women's suffrage to Jim Crow and women's rights right down to today and LGBT equality, the Conservatives have made what should be a slam dunk in the name of Liberty into a struggle.

Conservatives claim to uphold Christian virtues while calling fro the rejection of children seeking asylum here in the Land of the Free. Christian virtues while demeaning, degrading and discriminating against the LGBT community (a community that seeks only tolerance and equality while committing no infractions against the law)

Conservatives see profit as the one noble aspect of corporate activities. Wage stagnation, pollution, shoddy and dangerous products are issues ignored by the Right.

Conservatives will fight tooth and nail to keep the deadliest weapons on our streets claiming it's their right to own weapons designed for warfare while they resist every effort to grant equal rights to their fellow citizens.

It leaves me incredulous.

Conservatives seem to admire the 'style' of Vladimir Putin while they over look the substance of this villain. They further accuse the President of the United States of appearing foolish, feminine or aloof in comparison to the authoritarian Putin. All while the Conservatives want smaller government, as if Putin shares their dreams.

I know that this thread will be called 'trolling' by some Conservatives. Some will show the depths of their intellect and call me and my fellow Liberals all manner of names, thinking that they are winning a debate. But I had these thoughts on my mind for some time now and I think it would be healthy for our nation if we cleared the air and determined what the virtues of Conservatism are so at least I could take them seriously again.

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

 

[Nosmo King]

Sorry but what does that have to do with anything?

The steel mills also provided factory jobs with outsized wages, so big that companies couldn't continue offering them and still compete in the market.
But that's irrelevant. Your personal experience is fairly irrelevant here. And since then Pittsburg has recovered its economic base through, yeah, corporations.

If the wages were so cripplingly high, one might assume that there are mansions scattered all through our valley. That yacht clubs and stables are as common as food pantries and homeless shelters. The wages were never that high and they were negotiated in good faith by both labor and management.

And Pittsburgh's recovery had more to do with higher education than further corporate involvement.

Why woud someone assume factory workers making top wages would still be able to buy mansions?

See, this is the problem. You throw out irrelevant crap with every post and take that as some kind of proof of something.
Steel workers earned outsized wages. T hat they were negotiated doesnt change that fact, nor the fact that it make Pittsburg's steel products uncompetitive in the world market.

Could you tell me, with your inexhaustible knowledge of world markets, what "dumping" means? Because that was the tactic permitted by the Reagan administration that drove the last nail into the domestic steel casket. Steel. Arguably the greatest strategic resource of our nation. Without steel, you cannot build an aircraft carrier, a bridge, a rail system or a building over four stories tall.

 

[Nosmo King]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

It's disconcerting because I believe in open debate. I believe that the constitution was wrought by compromise. I believe that this nation is served best when there is loyal opposition from which ever party/ideology is in the minority.

But those virtues are seen as vices by contemporary American Conservatives. So I ask again, why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives?

Conservatism is constantly on the wrong side of history. Every effort to bring about real genuine freedoms have been resisted by Conservatives. From Slavery through women's suffrage to Jim Crow and women's rights right down to today and LGBT equality, the Conservatives have made what should be a slam dunk in the name of Liberty into a struggle.

Conservatives claim to uphold Christian virtues while calling fro the rejection of children seeking asylum here in the Land of the Free. Christian virtues while demeaning, degrading and discriminating against the LGBT community (a community that seeks only tolerance and equality while committing no infractions against the law)

Conservatives see profit as the one noble aspect of corporate activities. Wage stagnation, pollution, shoddy and dangerous products are issues ignored by the Right.

Conservatives will fight tooth and nail to keep the deadliest weapons on our streets claiming it's their right to own weapons designed for warfare while they resist every effort to grant equal rights to their fellow citizens.

It leaves me incredulous.

Conservatives seem to admire the 'style' of Vladimir Putin while they over look the substance of this villain. They further accuse the President of the United States of appearing foolish, feminine or aloof in comparison to the authoritarian Putin. All while the Conservatives want smaller government, as if Putin shares their dreams.

I know that this thread will be called 'trolling' by some Conservatives. Some will show the depths of their intellect and call me and my fellow Liberals all manner of names, thinking that they are winning a debate. But I had these thoughts on my mind for some time now and I think it would be healthy for our nation if we cleared the air and determined what the virtues of Conservatism are so at least I could take them seriously again.

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

Conservatives provided the resistance to Civil Rights, Women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, LGBT equality, aid to senior citizens, the indigent and infirmed. Quite a record.

Meanwhile, Conservatives championed Joe McCarthy, George Wallace, Bush/Cheney and Michelle Bachmann. Hardly a list of folks advocating freedom for all citizens.

 

[The Rabbi]

If the wages were so cripplingly high, one might assume that there are mansions scattered all through our valley. That yacht clubs and stables are as common as food pantries and homeless shelters. The wages were never that high and they were negotiated in good faith by both labor and management.

And Pittsburgh's recovery had more to do with higher education than further corporate involvement.

Why woud someone assume factory workers making top wages would still be able to buy mansions?

See, this is the problem. You throw out irrelevant crap with every post and take that as some kind of proof of something.
Steel workers earned outsized wages. T hat they were negotiated doesnt change that fact, nor the fact that it make Pittsburg's steel products uncompetitive in the world market.

Could you tell me, with your inexhaustible knowledge of world markets, what "dumping" means? Because that was the tactic permitted by the Reagan administration that drove the last nail into the domestic steel casket. Steel. Arguably the greatest strategic resource of our nation. Without steel, you cannot build an aircraft carrier, a bridge, a rail system or a building over four stories tall.

OK, so you've deflected from the question about mansions and steel workers. Now you want to blame Reagan for the steel industry decline, even though it began long before Reagan's term.
Even so the US had steel tariffs from 1969 until 1992 that controlled how much foreign steel could be imported.
So the industry's decline was not due to "dumping" but to being uncompetitive, due to the outsized wages I mentioned earlier, among other factors.

 

[The Rabbi]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

It's disconcerting because I believe in open debate. I believe that the constitution was wrought by compromise. I believe that this nation is served best when there is loyal opposition from which ever party/ideology is in the minority.

But those virtues are seen as vices by contemporary American Conservatives. So I ask again, why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives?

Conservatism is constantly on the wrong side of history. Every effort to bring about real genuine freedoms have been resisted by Conservatives. From Slavery through women's suffrage to Jim Crow and women's rights right down to today and LGBT equality, the Conservatives have made what should be a slam dunk in the name of Liberty into a struggle.

Conservatives claim to uphold Christian virtues while calling fro the rejection of children seeking asylum here in the Land of the Free. Christian virtues while demeaning, degrading and discriminating against the LGBT community (a community that seeks only tolerance and equality while committing no infractions against the law)

Conservatives see profit as the one noble aspect of corporate activities. Wage stagnation, pollution, shoddy and dangerous products are issues ignored by the Right.

Conservatives will fight tooth and nail to keep the deadliest weapons on our streets claiming it's their right to own weapons designed for warfare while they resist every effort to grant equal rights to their fellow citizens.

It leaves me incredulous.

Conservatives seem to admire the 'style' of Vladimir Putin while they over look the substance of this villain. They further accuse the President of the United States of appearing foolish, feminine or aloof in comparison to the authoritarian Putin. All while the Conservatives want smaller government, as if Putin shares their dreams.

I know that this thread will be called 'trolling' by some Conservatives. Some will show the depths of their intellect and call me and my fellow Liberals all manner of names, thinking that they are winning a debate. But I had these thoughts on my mind for some time now and I think it would be healthy for our nation if we cleared the air and determined what the virtues of Conservatism are so at least I could take them seriously again.

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

Conservatives provided the resistance to Civil Rights, Women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, LGBT equality, aid to senior citizens, the indigent and infirmed. Quite a record.

Meanwhile, Conservatives championed Joe McCarthy, George Wallace, Bush/Cheney and Michelle Bachmann. Hardly a list of folks advocating freedom for all citizens.

Republicans championed civil rights. Nixon originated the EPA. I dont know WTF you're talking about with aid to senior citizens (like Bush's prescription drug benefit), indigent and infirm.
Wallace was a progressive Democrat. Bush was a big government Rockefeller Republican. And who gives a shit about Michelle bachmann?
It isnt that you know nothing. It's that everything you know is wrong.

 

[BillyV]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

It's disconcerting because I believe in open debate. I believe that the constitution was wrought by compromise. I believe that this nation is served best when there is loyal opposition from which ever party/ideology is in the minority.

But those virtues are seen as vices by contemporary American Conservatives. So I ask again, why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives?

Conservatism is constantly on the wrong side of history. Every effort to bring about real genuine freedoms have been resisted by Conservatives. From Slavery through women's suffrage to Jim Crow and women's rights right down to today and LGBT equality, the Conservatives have made what should be a slam dunk in the name of Liberty into a struggle.

Conservatives claim to uphold Christian virtues while calling fro the rejection of children seeking asylum here in the Land of the Free. Christian virtues while demeaning, degrading and discriminating against the LGBT community (a community that seeks only tolerance and equality while committing no infractions against the law)

Conservatives see profit as the one noble aspect of corporate activities. Wage stagnation, pollution, shoddy and dangerous products are issues ignored by the Right.

Conservatives will fight tooth and nail to keep the deadliest weapons on our streets claiming it's their right to own weapons designed for warfare while they resist every effort to grant equal rights to their fellow citizens.

It leaves me incredulous.

Conservatives seem to admire the 'style' of Vladimir Putin while they over look the substance of this villain. They further accuse the President of the United States of appearing foolish, feminine or aloof in comparison to the authoritarian Putin. All while the Conservatives want smaller government, as if Putin shares their dreams.

I know that this thread will be called 'trolling' by some Conservatives. Some will show the depths of their intellect and call me and my fellow Liberals all manner of names, thinking that they are winning a debate. But I had these thoughts on my mind for some time now and I think it would be healthy for our nation if we cleared the air and determined what the virtues of Conservatism are so at least I could take them seriously again.

I had considered writing a long, boring, likely poorly-written response to the excessively slanted (and unexamined) view stated in your OP that no one would likely read. Instead, I decided to quote some parts of a column written by Charles Krauthammer several years ago. I know, he’s a Fox News contributor, but bear with me.

To understand the workings of American politics, you have to understand this fundamental law: Conservatives think liberals are stupid. Liberals think conservatives are evil. For the first side of this equation, I need no sources. As a conservative, I can confidently attest that whatever else my colleagues might disagree about--Bosnia, John McCain, precisely how many orphans we're prepared to throw into the snow so the rich can have their tax cuts--we all agree that liberals are stupid. We mean this, of course, in the nicest way. Liberals tend to be nice, and they believe--here is where they go stupid--that most everybody else is nice too. Deep down, that is. Sure, you've got your multiple felon and your occasional war criminal, but they're undoubtedly depraved 'cause they're deprived. If only we could get social conditions right--eliminate poverty, teach anger management, restore the ozone, arrest John Ashcroft--everyone would be holding hands smiley-faced, rocking back and forth to ``We Shall Overcome.'' Liberals believe that human nature is fundamentally good. The fact that this is contradicted by, oh, 4,000 years of human history simply tells them how urgent is the need for their next seven-point program for the social reform of everything. Liberals suffer incurably from naivete, the stupidity of the good heart.

More here:
Stupid vs. Evil? - Charles Krauthammer - Page 1

Now if you'll excuse me, I plan to use the time I saved by "cut and paste" to go back to depriving widows and orphans of the food on their table so I can buy another Porsche.

 

[norwegen]

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

Conservatives provided the resistance to Civil Rights, Women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, LGBT equality, aid to senior citizens, the indigent and infirmed. Quite a record.

Meanwhile, Conservatives championed Joe McCarthy, George Wallace, Bush/Cheney and Michelle Bachmann. Hardly a list of folks advocating freedom for all citizens.

Republicans championed civil rights. Nixon originated the EPA. I dont know WTF you're talking about with aid to senior citizens (like Bush's prescription drug benefit), indigent and infirm.
Wallace was a progressive Democrat. Bush was a big government Rockefeller Republican. And who gives a shit about Michelle bachmann?
It isnt that you know nothing. It's that everything you know is wrong.

You waste your breath telling liberals that Republicans passed the Civil Rights Act. It doesn't fit their narrative.

 

[Erand7899]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

It's disconcerting because I believe in open debate. I believe that the constitution was wrought by compromise. I believe that this nation is served best when there is loyal opposition from which ever party/ideology is in the minority.

But those virtues are seen as vices by contemporary American Conservatives. So I ask again, why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives?

Conservatism is constantly on the wrong side of history. Every effort to bring about real genuine freedoms have been resisted by Conservatives. From Slavery through women's suffrage to Jim Crow and women's rights right down to today and LGBT equality, the Conservatives have made what should be a slam dunk in the name of Liberty into a struggle.

Conservatives claim to uphold Christian virtues while calling fro the rejection of children seeking asylum here in the Land of the Free. Christian virtues while demeaning, degrading and discriminating against the LGBT community (a community that seeks only tolerance and equality while committing no infractions against the law)

Conservatives see profit as the one noble aspect of corporate activities. Wage stagnation, pollution, shoddy and dangerous products are issues ignored by the Right.

Conservatives will fight tooth and nail to keep the deadliest weapons on our streets claiming it's their right to own weapons designed for warfare while they resist every effort to grant equal rights to their fellow citizens.

It leaves me incredulous.

Conservatives seem to admire the 'style' of Vladimir Putin while they over look the substance of this villain. They further accuse the President of the United States of appearing foolish, feminine or aloof in comparison to the authoritarian Putin. All while the Conservatives want smaller government, as if Putin shares their dreams.

I know that this thread will be called 'trolling' by some Conservatives. Some will show the depths of their intellect and call me and my fellow Liberals all manner of names, thinking that they are winning a debate. But I had these thoughts on my mind for some time now and I think it would be healthy for our nation if we cleared the air and determined what the virtues of Conservatism are so at least I could take them seriously again.

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

Conservatives provided the resistance to Civil Rights, Women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, LGBT equality, aid to senior citizens, the indigent and infirmed. Quite a record.

Meanwhile, Conservatives championed Joe McCarthy, George Wallace, Bush/Cheney and Michelle Bachmann. Hardly a list of folks advocating freedom for all citizens.

Once again, you just throw out shit, and hope some of it sticks. I'm a conservative, and I didn't oppose civil rights, women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, or aid to senior citizens, the indigent and/or infirmed. Nor, do I know any conservatives who did.

Perhaps you noticed in your rant that you always reference political groups, as if people actually exist as groups. Just more of your ignorance that you should reflect on.

 

[Nosmo King]

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

Conservatives provided the resistance to Civil Rights, Women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, LGBT equality, aid to senior citizens, the indigent and infirmed. Quite a record.

Meanwhile, Conservatives championed Joe McCarthy, George Wallace, Bush/Cheney and Michelle Bachmann. Hardly a list of folks advocating freedom for all citizens.

Republicans championed civil rights. Nixon originated the EPA. I dont know WTF you're talking about with aid to senior citizens (like Bush's prescription drug benefit), indigent and infirm.
Wallace was a progressive Democrat. Bush was a big government Rockefeller Republican. And who gives a shit about Michelle bachmann?
It isnt that you know nothing. It's that everything you know is wrong.

Once again I see you are hiding behind the flimsyskirts of party identity and running away from political ideology. Do you expect us to believe that George Wallace was a tree hugging, big government, Birkenstock wearing Progressive? He was an arch Conservative! As were the other Democrat Conservative bigots who advocated state's rights and segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever.

Your knowledge of history and politics is so shallow that truth won't float in it.

 

[Nosmo King]

Conservatives provided the resistance to Civil Rights, Women's equality, environmental safeguards, collective bargaining rights, LGBT equality, aid to senior citizens, the indigent and infirmed. Quite a record.

Meanwhile, Conservatives championed Joe McCarthy, George Wallace, Bush/Cheney and Michelle Bachmann. Hardly a list of folks advocating freedom for all citizens.

Republicans championed civil rights. Nixon originated the EPA. I dont know WTF you're talking about with aid to senior citizens (like Bush's prescription drug benefit), indigent and infirm.
Wallace was a progressive Democrat. Bush was a big government Rockefeller Republican. And who gives a shit about Michelle bachmann?
It isnt that you know nothing. It's that everything you know is wrong.

You waste your breath telling liberals that Republicans passed the Civil Rights Act. It doesn't fit their narrative.

Republicans, like Teddy Roosevelt and Evert Dirkson have not consistently been rock ribbed Conservatives. Just as Democrats like George Wallace and Strom Thurmond have not consistently been Liberals.

Conservatives believe that deflecting to party identity will somehow fool everyone. Perhaps because Conservatives think everyone is as blind to truth as they are, but I believe it's due to their por knowledge of history and political ideology.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Obviously a liberal should not even discuss anything with a conservative. I know that I don't pay the slightest bit of attention to liberals. They still think the illegals flooding into the country are children, when those children are mostly full grown men who have already started killing Americans. Don't accept the views or values of conservatives. Just recognize that the nation has divided and getting further and further apart. Eventually the fracture lines will be so large there will be no point to even calling it one country.

If you believe that you represent 50% of the population you are sorely mistaken. 51% are moderate Independents like myself. We want nothing whatsoever to do with the extreme right just as we shun the extreme left. However we will work with moderate Democrats and Republicans to do what is best for We the People.

But your extreme RW fringe only represents about 20% of this nation at most. You are divided amongst the 50 states. No matter how far you alienate yourself from mainstream America you will never have the power to destroy this nation by dividing it into two.

At some point you will be so far from the mainstream that you will be ignored by the political parties because you bring nothing of value to the table. Obstruction worked while you pretended to care about fiscal issues. But every time you get any power at all your extremist social conservative agenda surfaces and exposes you for what you really are. The Religious Right pretending to be the Tea Party faction.

The moderate majority of Americans are not interested in your extremist religious agenda.

 

[Derideo_Te]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

It's disconcerting because I believe in open debate. I believe that the constitution was wrought by compromise. I believe that this nation is served best when there is loyal opposition from which ever party/ideology is in the minority.

But those virtues are seen as vices by contemporary American Conservatives. So I ask again, why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives?

Conservatism is constantly on the wrong side of history. Every effort to bring about real genuine freedoms have been resisted by Conservatives. From Slavery through women's suffrage to Jim Crow and women's rights right down to today and LGBT equality, the Conservatives have made what should be a slam dunk in the name of Liberty into a struggle.

Conservatives claim to uphold Christian virtues while calling fro the rejection of children seeking asylum here in the Land of the Free. Christian virtues while demeaning, degrading and discriminating against the LGBT community (a community that seeks only tolerance and equality while committing no infractions against the law)

Conservatives see profit as the one noble aspect of corporate activities. Wage stagnation, pollution, shoddy and dangerous products are issues ignored by the Right.

Conservatives will fight tooth and nail to keep the deadliest weapons on our streets claiming it's their right to own weapons designed for warfare while they resist every effort to grant equal rights to their fellow citizens.

It leaves me incredulous.

Conservatives seem to admire the 'style' of Vladimir Putin while they over look the substance of this villain. They further accuse the President of the United States of appearing foolish, feminine or aloof in comparison to the authoritarian Putin. All while the Conservatives want smaller government, as if Putin shares their dreams.

I know that this thread will be called 'trolling' by some Conservatives. Some will show the depths of their intellect and call me and my fellow Liberals all manner of names, thinking that they are winning a debate. But I had these thoughts on my mind for some time now and I think it would be healthy for our nation if we cleared the air and determined what the virtues of Conservatism are so at least I could take them seriously again.

One of the key defects in your thesis is that you assume facts that are not in evidence, and then build strawmen based on those bad assumptions.

Conservatives have never been on the wrong side of history, and probably never will be. You, and your ilk, call yourselves liberals and/or progressives, and you are neither. If you were just half as smart as you think you are, you would recognize that fact.

Conservatives resist change that common sense recognizes as faulty, and they resist change just for the sake of change. Nothing that the so called liberal/progressives have come up with, political policy wise, in the last seventy plus years is of any real value to our society. Even when they do get a decent idea, they screw it up, and then have to rely on conservatives to fix it.

Meanwhile, back at the progressive funny farm, the ever loyal, useful idiots, attempt to dream up ways to demonize those that actually think for themselves.

Conservatives sided with King George and England!

 

[Nosmo King]

Conservatism by definition resists change. Is it resistance for resistance's sake, or is it a more organic, ingrained response to change? Or is it all self interest in the cause of resistance?

One response suggests a certain intractability and lack of curiosity. Another of my inquiries suggests some immutable characteristic. But the last course of action betrays cynicism and empowering in the face of change.

One can be excused, the second must be tolerated, but the third seems sinister and duplicitous.

 

[boedicca]

I've been wondering why I should listen to and accept the views of Conservatives.

(blah blah blah)

That's a monologue, not a dialogue, bub.