Norman Finkelstein on BDS

[P F Tinmore]

If it looks like a State and acts like a State and was accepted into the UN like a State, enters into treaties like a State, has international diplomatic relations like a State, has a government like a State, chances are excellent that it is a State.

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Oh please. Rocco and I have been over this with you a hundred times. The truly ironic thing is that you agree with me. You agree that since the territory in question has NEVER had an internal border -- there is only the boundaries as laid out in the treaties and mandates -- that the entire territory is one unit.

But you are trying to argue that something prevents Israel from being a State even though it acts in ALL ways as a State. Its an utterly ridiculous argument.

Palestine has had international borders since 1924. Israel has no borders.

 

[Shusha]

"You are only clever in your cult. Stop trying to be clever."

 

[Shusha]

Palestine has had international borders since 1924.

You mean the Jewish National Home has had international borders since 1924.

But this is all irrelevant anyway. First you have to prove the lack of borders prohibits a State-like entity from being a State. And to what extent that is true. You have to prove that a wanted or attempted secession, of itself, dissolves the parent State.

Did Canada cease to be a State when Quebec went to a referendum on secession? Did the UK cease to be a State when Scotland went to a referendum?

Even if you think that Israel only exists with the Green Line --- still it acts as a State and therefore is one.

 

[P F Tinmore]

You mean the Jewish National Home has had international borders since 1924.

The so called Jewish National Home was not a land transfer.

 

[rylah]

If it looks like a State and acts like a State and was accepted into the UN like a State, enters into treaties like a State, has international diplomatic relations like a State, has a government like a State, chances are excellent that it is a State.

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

 

[Shusha]

Calling for honesty about the BDS cause:

"We want to abolish Israel and this is our strategy for doing it."

 

[P F Tinmore]

If it looks like a State and acts like a State and was accepted into the UN like a State, enters into treaties like a State, has international diplomatic relations like a State, has a government like a State, chances are excellent that it is a State.

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

 

[Shusha]

"Israel will start to say, "What about us? And they won't recognize our rights." You can't answer the Israelis on that because they are making a statement that's factually correct. Its not an accident, an unwitting omission, that BDS does not mention Israel."

Yep.

 

[Hollie]

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

You poor, dear. You desperately cling to your false belief that the State of Israel does not exist. I'm afraid it's a function of your insensate Jew hatreds and an overwhelming need to deny that Israel is a successful society built on a Western model of government and a first world economy.

I read nothing in your comments which speaks to issues other than your personal hatreds and prejudices. You labor under the assumption that exeryone except moslems bear sole responsibility for every calamity that Moslems self-create. Yet, you don’t care to speak of the obstructionist and retrograde nature of Arab-Islamist societies which continually are their own worst enemies. Much of the world shakes its collective head in disbelief at the cartoon characters that the Islamist Middle have become.

I'll admit to having a little fun at your expense.

While you stagger and reel and seek to evade when your specious opinions are shown to be false and contrived, others reading this thread will certainly recognize that you have retreated to silly cartoons because you really have nothing of substance to offer.

While you stagger and reel and seek to evade when your specious opinions are shown to be false and contrived,

When has that ever happened?

Link?

I see you're still wearing your islamo-tap dancing shoes.

If it looks like a State and acts like a State and was accepted into the UN like a State, enters into treaties like a State, has international diplomatic relations like a State, has a government like a State, chances are excellent that it is a State.

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Oh please. Rocco and I have been over this with you a hundred times. The truly ironic thing is that you agree with me. You agree that since the territory in question has NEVER had an internal border -- there is only the boundaries as laid out in the treaties and mandates -- that the entire territory is one unit.

But you are trying to argue that something prevents Israel from being a State even though it acts in ALL ways as a State. Its an utterly ridiculous argument.

Palestine has had international borders since 1924. Israel has no borders.

Once again, you're spamming the thread with your silly "Magical Kingdom of Disney Pally'land" nonsense.

There is a thread dedication to your nonsense. This is not it.

 

[P F Tinmore]

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

You poor, dear. You desperately cling to your false belief that the State of Israel does not exist. I'm afraid it's a function of your insensate Jew hatreds and an overwhelming need to deny that Israel is a successful society built on a Western model of government and a first world economy.

I read nothing in your comments which speaks to issues other than your personal hatreds and prejudices. You labor under the assumption that exeryone except moslems bear sole responsibility for every calamity that Moslems self-create. Yet, you don’t care to speak of the obstructionist and retrograde nature of Arab-Islamist societies which continually are their own worst enemies. Much of the world shakes its collective head in disbelief at the cartoon characters that the Islamist Middle have become.

I'll admit to having a little fun at your expense.

While you stagger and reel and seek to evade when your specious opinions are shown to be false and contrived, others reading this thread will certainly recognize that you have retreated to silly cartoons because you really have nothing of substance to offer.

While you stagger and reel and seek to evade when your specious opinions are shown to be false and contrived,

When has that ever happened?

Link?

I see you're still wearing your islamo-tap dancing shoes.

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Oh please. Rocco and I have been over this with you a hundred times. The truly ironic thing is that you agree with me. You agree that since the territory in question has NEVER had an internal border -- there is only the boundaries as laid out in the treaties and mandates -- that the entire territory is one unit.

But you are trying to argue that something prevents Israel from being a State even though it acts in ALL ways as a State. Its an utterly ridiculous argument.

Palestine has had international borders since 1924. Israel has no borders.

Once again, you're spamming the thread with your silly "Magical Kingdom of Disney Pally'land" nonsense.

There is a thread dedication to your nonsense. This is not it.

I was responding to something that was said it the OP. It is you people who have been dancing around the issue for the last couple pages.

 

[rylah]

If it looks like a State and acts like a State and was accepted into the UN like a State, enters into treaties like a State, has international diplomatic relations like a State, has a government like a State, chances are excellent that it is a State.

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

 

[P F Tinmore]

You are missing something.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

 

[rylah]

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

 

[P F Tinmore]

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

My question was: Is Israel a legitimate state? Y'all keep ducking that question.

 

[Hollie]

You poor, dear. You desperately cling to your false belief that the State of Israel does not exist. I'm afraid it's a function of your insensate Jew hatreds and an overwhelming need to deny that Israel is a successful society built on a Western model of government and a first world economy.

I read nothing in your comments which speaks to issues other than your personal hatreds and prejudices. You labor under the assumption that exeryone except moslems bear sole responsibility for every calamity that Moslems self-create. Yet, you don’t care to speak of the obstructionist and retrograde nature of Arab-Islamist societies which continually are their own worst enemies. Much of the world shakes its collective head in disbelief at the cartoon characters that the Islamist Middle have become.

I'll admit to having a little fun at your expense.

While you stagger and reel and seek to evade when your specious opinions are shown to be false and contrived, others reading this thread will certainly recognize that you have retreated to silly cartoons because you really have nothing of substance to offer.

While you stagger and reel and seek to evade when your specious opinions are shown to be false and contrived,

When has that ever happened?

Link?

I see you're still wearing your islamo-tap dancing shoes.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders. Disputed borders do not unmake a State. Territorial secession does not unmake a State.

Canada has disputed borders with the US and Denmark, as well as claims to the Arctic which are disputed by other nations. (Santa is OURS, dammit!) This does not unmake Canada as a State.

Arguing that Israel is not a State is silly.

Oh, please. We've been through this a million times. Israel does have a defined territory and borders.

And the question has been ducked every time like you are doing again now.

Oh please. Rocco and I have been over this with you a hundred times. The truly ironic thing is that you agree with me. You agree that since the territory in question has NEVER had an internal border -- there is only the boundaries as laid out in the treaties and mandates -- that the entire territory is one unit.

But you are trying to argue that something prevents Israel from being a State even though it acts in ALL ways as a State. Its an utterly ridiculous argument.

Palestine has had international borders since 1924. Israel has no borders.

Once again, you're spamming the thread with your silly "Magical Kingdom of Disney Pally'land" nonsense.

There is a thread dedication to your nonsense. This is not it.

I was responding to something that was said it the OP. It is you people who have been dancing around the issue for the last couple pages.

As usual, you're simply carrying on with your usual spam.

There is a thread dedicated to your spamming and more to the point, these issues have all been addressed for you.

 

[rylah]

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

My question was: Is Israel a legitimate state? Y'all keep ducking that question.

I'm just not the person to ask questions on legal issues.

You've already opened a couple of threads to discuss this exact aspect of the question. So please - You can try to turn any conversation into Your rehashed talks at people.

But just respect us with an honest answer:
Do You want Israel gone? (5th time)

 

[rylah]

Like You duck this simple question, and I'll ask again:

Do You want Israel gone?

I mean, where does all this intellectual masturbation going, what's Your end goal?

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

My question was: Is Israel a legitimate state? Y'all keep ducking that question.

This question is ridiculous in my view.
I've already told You that I have close to no understanding in law or legalize.

So let me answer this in a realistic manner:

Of course it's a legitimate state, working one. It's a leading country in technology and entrepreneurship. Its' feet are strong on the ground.

Now compared to that, in reality there's a serious doubt to whether this 'international law' is something of reality, or just a piece of paper written for some clever idealists to weave it in their silly arguments.

Will You keep ducking my question?

 

[P F Tinmore]

As far as I can tell, Israel is an occupation of Palestine.

Nobody has ever posted anything to prove otherwise.

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

My question was: Is Israel a legitimate state? Y'all keep ducking that question.

This question is ridiculous in my view.
I've already told You that I have close to no understanding in law or legalize.

So let me answer this in a realistic manner:

Of course it's a legitimate state, working one. It's a leading country in technology and entrepreneurship. Its' feet are strong on the ground.

Now compared to that, in reality there's a serious doubt to whether this 'international law' is something of reality, or just a piece of paper written for some clever idealists to weave it in their silly arguments.

Will You keep ducking my question?

It is understandable that Israel and its supporters do not like international law. That is why you people always dance around the issues.

 

[Hollie]

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

My question was: Is Israel a legitimate state? Y'all keep ducking that question.

This question is ridiculous in my view.
I've already told You that I have close to no understanding in law or legalize.

So let me answer this in a realistic manner:

Of course it's a legitimate state, working one. It's a leading country in technology and entrepreneurship. Its' feet are strong on the ground.

Now compared to that, in reality there's a serious doubt to whether this 'international law' is something of reality, or just a piece of paper written for some clever idealists to weave it in their silly arguments.

Will You keep ducking my question?

It is understandable that Israel and its supporters do not like international law. That is why you people always dance around the issues.

It's actually comical that a Pom Pom flailer for Islamic terrorist franchises would want to lecture anyone on international law.

 

[rylah]

And I ask You for the 3rd time, please answer:
Is Your goal the elimination of Israel?

What is Israel? Do you have a map that does not use the armistice lines that the UN specifically stated were not to be political or territorial boundaries?

Trying to be clever... I don't really care for those laws or political definitions, at least where I'm coming from.

So I ask You again for the 4th time:
Do You want Israel gone?

My question was: Is Israel a legitimate state? Y'all keep ducking that question.

This question is ridiculous in my view.
I've already told You that I have close to no understanding in law or legalize.

So let me answer this in a realistic manner:

Of course it's a legitimate state, working one. It's a leading country in technology and entrepreneurship. Its' feet are strong on the ground.

Now compared to that, in reality there's a serious doubt to whether this 'international law' is something of reality, or just a piece of paper written for some clever idealists to weave it in their silly arguments.

Will You keep ducking my question?

It is understandable that Israel and its supporters do not like international law. That is why you people always dance around the issues.

It's not about liking, it's about reality on the ground.

While I answered Your question, You keep ducking the same question Finkelstein was talking about in the OP.
And it's because he knows well what Your (BDS) real goal is.

You're just not brave enough to be straight and honest about it.