No question that co2 is a postive forcing

[The Outsider]

Wtf is climate science. I know what biochemistry and how it is used to determine the way the world works organically but what the hell is climate science. What do they do, sit on their ass and study past information like a biologist?

 

[Old Rocks]

Hey Out, ever crack a science book? Do you know what google is? Perhaps you should try to learn a bit before posting your ignorance for all to see.

Climatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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Climatology (from Greek κλίμα, klima, "region, zone"; and -λογία, -logia) is the study of climate, scientifically defined as weather conditions averaged over a period of time,[1] and is a branch of the atmospheric sciences. Basic knowledge of climate can be used within shorter term weather forecasting using analog techniques such as the El Niño - Southern Oscillation (ENSO), the Madden-Julian Oscillation (MJO), the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO), the Northern Annualar Mode (NAM), the Arctic oscillation (AO), the Northern Pacific (NP) Index, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO), and the Interdecadal Pacific Oscillation (IPO). Climate models are used for a variety of purposes from study of the dynamics of the weather and climate system to projections of future climate.

 

[westwall]

And here is a brand new peer reviewed paper that shows little (if any) correlation between CO2 emissions and global warming.

"The main conclusion one arrives at the analysis is that CO2 has not a causal relation with global warming and it is not powerful enough to cause the historical changes in temperature that were observed. The main argument is the absence of immediate correlation between CO2 changes preceding temperature either for global or local changes.....The anthropogenic wasting of fossil fuel CO2 to the atmosphere shows no relation with the temperature changes even in an annual basis. The absence of immediate relation between CO2 and temperature is evidence that rising its mix ratio in the atmosphere will not imply more absorption and time residence of energy over the Earth surface.....The main implication is that temperature increase predictions based on CO2 driving models are not reliable." [Paulo Cesar Soares 2010: International Journal of Geosciences]

http://icecap.us/images/uploads/US_Temperatures_and_Climate_Factors_since_1895.pdf

 

[The Outsider]

Hey Out, ever crack a science book? Do you know what google is? Perhaps you should try to learn a bit before posting your ignorance for all to see.

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Climatology (from Greek κλίμα, klima, "region, zone"; and -λογία, -logia) is the study of climate, scientifically defined as weather conditions averaged over a period of time,[1] and is a branch of the atmospheric sciences. Basic knowledge of climate can be used within shorter term weather forecasting using analog techniques such as the El Niño - Southern Oscillation (ENSO), the Madden-Julian Oscillation (MJO), the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO), the Northern Annualar Mode (NAM), the Arctic oscillation (AO), the Northern Pacific (NP) Index, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO), and the Interdecadal Pacific Oscillation (IPO). Climate models are used for a variety of purposes from study of the dynamics of the weather and climate system to projections of future climate.

I work with models and its effect on the environment as a chemical engineer dipshit. Climatology deals with past events and trends not the current reality. They are no more than a biologist or a historian; citing old information in order to attempt to make a claim.

 

[Old Rocks]

And here is a brand new peer reviewed paper that shows little (if any) correlation between CO2 emissions and global warming.

"The main conclusion one arrives at the analysis is that CO2 has not a causal relation with global warming and it is not powerful enough to cause the historical changes in temperature that were observed. The main argument is the absence of immediate correlation between CO2 changes preceding temperature either for global or local changes.....The anthropogenic wasting of fossil fuel CO2 to the atmosphere shows no relation with the temperature changes even in an annual basis. The absence of immediate relation between CO2 and temperature is evidence that rising its mix ratio in the atmosphere will not imply more absorption and time residence of energy over the Earth surface.....The main implication is that temperature increase predictions based on CO2 driving models are not reliable." [Paulo Cesar Soares 2010: International Journal of Geosciences]

http://icecap.us/images/uploads/US_Temperatures_and_Climate_Factors_since_1895.pdf

OK, what peer reviewed journal was this published in? I see no referance to any journal, and clicking on 'Icecap' gets a null.

 

[Old Rocks]

Hey Out, ever crack a science book? Do you know what google is? Perhaps you should try to learn a bit before posting your ignorance for all to see.

Climatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Climate Research" redirects here. For the journal of that name, see Climate Research (journal).
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v • d • e
Climatology (from Greek κλίμα, klima, "region, zone"; and -λογία, -logia) is the study of climate, scientifically defined as weather conditions averaged over a period of time,[1] and is a branch of the atmospheric sciences. Basic knowledge of climate can be used within shorter term weather forecasting using analog techniques such as the El Niño - Southern Oscillation (ENSO), the Madden-Julian Oscillation (MJO), the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO), the Northern Annualar Mode (NAM), the Arctic oscillation (AO), the Northern Pacific (NP) Index, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO), and the Interdecadal Pacific Oscillation (IPO). Climate models are used for a variety of purposes from study of the dynamics of the weather and climate system to projections of future climate.

I work with models and its effect on the environment as a chemical engineer dipshit. Climatology deals with past events and trends not the current reality. They are no more than a biologist or a historian; citing old information in order to attempt to make a claim.

So you claim. The reality is far differant. As for your claim of credentials, anyone can claim whatever they choose on the web. Only after you post a while would I consider stating anything about your claims, although you have made a very negative start.

 

[westwall]

And here is a brand new peer reviewed paper that shows little (if any) correlation between CO2 emissions and global warming.

"The main conclusion one arrives at the analysis is that CO2 has not a causal relation with global warming and it is not powerful enough to cause the historical changes in temperature that were observed. The main argument is the absence of immediate correlation between CO2 changes preceding temperature either for global or local changes.....The anthropogenic wasting of fossil fuel CO2 to the atmosphere shows no relation with the temperature changes even in an annual basis. The absence of immediate relation between CO2 and temperature is evidence that rising its mix ratio in the atmosphere will not imply more absorption and time residence of energy over the Earth surface.....The main implication is that temperature increase predictions based on CO2 driving models are not reliable." [Paulo Cesar Soares 2010: International Journal of Geosciences]

http://icecap.us/images/uploads/US_Temperatures_and_Climate_Factors_since_1895.pdf

OK, what peer reviewed journal was this published in? I see no referance to any journal, and clicking on 'Icecap' gets a null.

International Journal of Geosciences


Paper: Warming Power of CO2 and H2O: Correlations with Temperature Changes

 

[IanC]

And here is a brand new peer reviewed paper that shows little (if any) correlation between CO2 emissions and global warming.

"The main conclusion one arrives at the analysis is that CO2 has not a causal relation with global warming and it is not powerful enough to cause the historical changes in temperature that were observed. The main argument is the absence of immediate correlation between CO2 changes preceding temperature either for global or local changes.....The anthropogenic wasting of fossil fuel CO2 to the atmosphere shows no relation with the temperature changes even in an annual basis. The absence of immediate relation between CO2 and temperature is evidence that rising its mix ratio in the atmosphere will not imply more absorption and time residence of energy over the Earth surface.....The main implication is that temperature increase predictions based on CO2 driving models are not reliable." [Paulo Cesar Soares 2010: International Journal of Geosciences]

http://icecap.us/images/uploads/US_Temperatures_and_Climate_Factors_since_1895.pdf

OK, what peer reviewed journal was this published in? I see no referance to any journal, and clicking on 'Icecap' gets a null.

International Journal of Geosciences


Paper: Warming Power of CO2 and H2O: Correlations with Temperature Changes

most of the graphs in that study have been posted in one form or another but it is very powerful to see them altogether. I am afraid it contradicts Old Rocks and Matthew when they say natural causes can't be found to explain what is going on with climate.

I find it particularly amusing that Old Rocks doesn't even read other peoples' links, he just criticizes the author or scorns the source. 'Appeal to Authority' means everything to him, ideas and data are just secondary.

 

[mdn2000]

CO2 is a harmless gas used to make Coca Cola great.

CO2 is also used to keep things cold because CO2 likes to be cold. I think you can even find CO2 resting in ice at the Arctic. Funny, its cold and you find CO2. Maybe something that loves to be cold can save us from Global Warming.

 

[Bern80]

Is the Earth Warming?

Umm, did you by chance actually read that before you posted it?

Problems abound with these directions for a high school science class experiment;

First the title, 'Is the Earth Warming' if you actually read the experiment you will see the purpose of the experiment is not to measure wether temp increases with an influx of CO2. Its purpose is to measure how quickly heat is lost. Two very different things.

Second would be the list of gases and their sources. They only list one, burning fossil fuels. Which is not only NOT the only source of CO2, but one of the smaller ones.

Third and maybe most damning is the question is never answered. There are no results. All you posted were directions for conducting a high school science experment that doesn't even answer the question in its title. Bravo rocks!

The vast majority of these types of "experiments" and I use the term very loosly, measure the Ideal Gas Laws. They don't measure CO2 effect at all.

Even taken on its face it's horribly written. The title and what the experiment actually measures are two totally different things.

Rocks is just trying to change the subject because he got caught not checking his work, so to speak. Had he actually read it, I think he would have seen posting directions for a high school science experiment probably doesn't help his case.

 

[Muhammed]

I see. So all the scientists in all the Scientific Societies are not scientists. Nor those in the National Academies of Science. Nor those in the major Universities around the world.

Yessirreeee......... Keep that tinfoil cap on your head at night so dangerous Librul thoughts do not enter your virgin skull. Watch for black helicopters as well.

A scientist must by definition be an expert.

You cite people like James Hansen, who has shown his lack of expertise, has an open political agenda of wealth redistribution via a carbon tax, has been called an "embarassment" to NASA by his supervisor, and has even been arrested for sitting in the middle of a ******* road, and has been paid alot of ******* money to spew global warming alarmism.

Physical science and political activism don't mix.

 

[The Outsider]

Hey Out, ever crack a science book? Do you know what google is? Perhaps you should try to learn a bit before posting your ignorance for all to see.

Climatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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v • d • e
Climatology (from Greek κλίμα, klima, "region, zone"; and -λογία, -logia) is the study of climate, scientifically defined as weather conditions averaged over a period of time,[1] and is a branch of the atmospheric sciences. Basic knowledge of climate can be used within shorter term weather forecasting using analog techniques such as the El Niño - Southern Oscillation (ENSO), the Madden-Julian Oscillation (MJO), the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO), the Northern Annualar Mode (NAM), the Arctic oscillation (AO), the Northern Pacific (NP) Index, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO), and the Interdecadal Pacific Oscillation (IPO). Climate models are used for a variety of purposes from study of the dynamics of the weather and climate system to projections of future climate.

I work with models and its effect on the environment as a chemical engineer dipshit. Climatology deals with past events and trends not the current reality. They are no more than a biologist or a historian; citing old information in order to attempt to make a claim.

So you claim. The reality is far differant. As for your claim of credentials, anyone can claim whatever they choose on the web. Only after you post a while would I consider stating anything about your claims, although you have made a very negative start.

The reality is I have worked for Environment Canada and have a scientific background and one can easily see that you lack said background on how science is conducted. That Sir, is the reality.

 

[westwall]

Umm, did you by chance actually read that before you posted it?

Problems abound with these directions for a high school science class experiment;

First the title, 'Is the Earth Warming' if you actually read the experiment you will see the purpose of the experiment is not to measure wether temp increases with an influx of CO2. Its purpose is to measure how quickly heat is lost. Two very different things.

Second would be the list of gases and their sources. They only list one, burning fossil fuels. Which is not only NOT the only source of CO2, but one of the smaller ones.

Third and maybe most damning is the question is never answered. There are no results. All you posted were directions for conducting a high school science experment that doesn't even answer the question in its title. Bravo rocks!

The vast majority of these types of "experiments" and I use the term very loosly, measure the Ideal Gas Laws. They don't measure CO2 effect at all.

Even taken on its face it's horribly written. The title and what the experiment actually measures are two totally different things.

Rocks is just trying to change the subject because he got caught not checking his work, so to speak. Had he actually read it, I think he would have seen posting directions for a high school science experiment probably doesn't help his case.

You give olfraud far too much credit I think. I don't believe he even begins to understand what is being stated in these "experiments". Just so you know, whenever Chris or olfraud or konradare asked to provide a legit experiment supporting CO2 AGW theory this is the type of crap they come up with. They all are invariably corrupted by outside influence and they also all invariably are an experiment of Gas Laws and not CO2's effect on temperature.

 

[westwall]

I work with models and its effect on the environment as a chemical engineer dipshit. Climatology deals with past events and trends not the current reality. They are no more than a biologist or a historian; citing old information in order to attempt to make a claim.

So you claim. The reality is far differant. As for your claim of credentials, anyone can claim whatever they choose on the web. Only after you post a while would I consider stating anything about your claims, although you have made a very negative start.

The reality is I have worked for Environment Canada and have a scientific background and one can easily see that you lack said background on how science is conducted. That Sir, is the reality.

Yeah I'm a geologist and an agnostic but because I don't "believe" in the dogma I am labeled a "unscientific religious rightwinger" So sayeth the "Defender of the Faith"

 

[mdn2000]

I work with models and its effect on the environment as a chemical engineer dipshit. Climatology deals with past events and trends not the current reality. They are no more than a biologist or a historian; citing old information in order to attempt to make a claim.

So you claim. The reality is far differant. As for your claim of credentials, anyone can claim whatever they choose on the web. Only after you post a while would I consider stating anything about your claims, although you have made a very negative start.

The reality is I have worked for Environment Canada and have a scientific background and one can easily see that you lack said background on how science is conducted. That Sir, is the reality.

Excuse me, Old Crock worked as a Lumber Jack and worked in a Steel Mill. That more than qualifies Old Crock to put his foot in his mouth. Further Old Crock can see a glacier from his window. Can you see a glacier from your window.

 

[mdn2000]

Hey Out, ever crack a science book? Do you know what google is? Perhaps you should try to learn a bit before posting your ignorance for all to see.

Climatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Climate Research" redirects here. For the journal of that name, see Climate Research (journal).
Atmospheric sciences
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Atmospheric dynamics (category)


Atmospheric chemistry (category)
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Global warming (category) · (portal)
v • d • e
Climatology (from Greek κλίμα, klima, "region, zone"; and -λογία, -logia) is the study of climate, scientifically defined as weather conditions averaged over a period of time,[1] and is a branch of the atmospheric sciences. Basic knowledge of climate can be used within shorter term weather forecasting using analog techniques such as the El Niño - Southern Oscillation (ENSO), the Madden-Julian Oscillation (MJO), the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO), the Northern Annualar Mode (NAM), the Arctic oscillation (AO), the Northern Pacific (NP) Index, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO), and the Interdecadal Pacific Oscillation (IPO). Climate models are used for a variety of purposes from study of the dynamics of the weather and climate system to projections of future climate.

This is incredibly funny. Ever crack a science book and then quote Wiki, I must say, Old Crock is pure entertainment.

 

[westwall]

Hey Out, ever crack a science book? Do you know what google is? Perhaps you should try to learn a bit before posting your ignorance for all to see.

Climatology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Climate Research" redirects here. For the journal of that name, see Climate Research (journal).
Atmospheric sciences
Aerology
Atmospheric physics

Atmospheric dynamics (category)


Atmospheric chemistry (category)
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Weather (category) · (portal)
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Climatology
Climate (category)

Climate change (category)


Global warming (category) · (portal)
v • d • e
Climatology (from Greek κλίμα, klima, "region, zone"; and -λογία, -logia) is the study of climate, scientifically defined as weather conditions averaged over a period of time,[1] and is a branch of the atmospheric sciences. Basic knowledge of climate can be used within shorter term weather forecasting using analog techniques such as the El Niño - Southern Oscillation (ENSO), the Madden-Julian Oscillation (MJO), the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO), the Northern Annualar Mode (NAM), the Arctic oscillation (AO), the Northern Pacific (NP) Index, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO), and the Interdecadal Pacific Oscillation (IPO). Climate models are used for a variety of purposes from study of the dynamics of the weather and climate system to projections of future climate.

This is incredibly funny. Ever crack a science book and then quote Wiki, I must say, Old Crock is pure entertainment.

Well, you know. He is an internet ex-spurt!

 

[ScienceRocks]

So you claim. The reality is far differant. As for your claim of credentials, anyone can claim whatever they choose on the web. Only after you post a while would I consider stating anything about your claims, although you have made a very negative start.

The reality is I have worked for Environment Canada and have a scientific background and one can easily see that you lack said background on how science is conducted. That Sir, is the reality.

Yeah I'm a geologist and an agnostic but because I don't "believe" in the dogma I am labeled a "unscientific religious rightwinger" So sayeth the "Defender of the Faith"

So you believe that the warming was caused by the earth coming out of the ice age and that would make it natural. The forcing that got us out of it is the sun...I think most of it was up until 1950 or so.

 

[westwall]

The reality is I have worked for Environment Canada and have a scientific background and one can easily see that you lack said background on how science is conducted. That Sir, is the reality.

Yeah I'm a geologist and an agnostic but because I don't "believe" in the dogma I am labeled a "unscientific religious rightwinger" So sayeth the "Defender of the Faith"

So you believe that the warming was caused by the earth coming out of the ice age and that would make it natural. This forcing that got us out of it is the sun...I think most of it was up until 1950 or so.

I believe that the world goes through cycles of warm and cold. I believe that there are long term cycles lasting thousands of years and there are short term cycles lasting hundreds of years. Additionally there are very short term cycles that last tens of years.

When all three come together at a high point you get very warm climates that can last millions of years, which is the way the world has been for the vast majority of its history, in other words over 90% of the time the world has averaged 10 to 20 degrees warmer than now.

Somehow (no one knows how) the climate takes a dramatic turn for the worse and ice ages ensue. They can last tens of thousands of years. We are currently in an interglacial period. In the last 11,000 years we have ample evidence that the world has been warmer than the current temperature today. At least 5 degrees and as much as 8 degrees. We also know that it has been a little colder than now, an average of 2-4 degrees lower was the norm during the Little Ice Age. We left that cold period 150 years ago and are still warming up from that period.

We KNOW beyond any doubt that CO2 begins to increase its percentage in the atmosphere 800 or so years AFTER the onset of warming. Even olfrauds skepticalscience nonsense website admits that.

So you tell me Matthew. What evidence do you have to present that CO2 drives the atmospheric temperature?

 

[Old Rocks]

Hey Walleyes, I thought that you earlier said that there was going to be a revolt in both the Royal Society and the American Geophysical Union against the "warmers". So what happened? Why did both come out even more strongly concerning global warming and the effects we are seeing right now. Could it be that real scientists are all in on a conspiracy? Surely you could not be full of shit?