Zone1 No One Who Has Died Has Returned Back To Earth...

[crossbody]

On TV? You mean fictional TV shows? Get a grip...They are not resurrected beings in those TV shows. Those are the spirits of the dead.

Here is what you wrote: “Every now and then they put a male or female witch on TV to pretend they are talking to the dead- a dead human or dead animal. People shed tears behind such lies because they've been tricked into believing a lie.”
Sometimes people so wrapped up in their long-winded posts they don’t remember what they wrote.

I combined both of your posts. As for the first post I was speaking of the male and female witches... psychics, etc... that have been on TV before faking to tell others that they are able to speak with the dead when that is demonic, and they are only manipulating them for profit. Those dead people there spirits have already returned to God. The rest of their dead body has returned to the dust.

Understand the whole shenanigan trickery of it is demonic in that if the psychic has any powerful ability to speak to the dead ask them why they have no powerful ability to bring back to life those whom they are speaking to? What they are doing is an act of ventriloquism buffoonery.

As for your second post, you are right, I was focused on Matthew 27 of which I had been discussing earlier.

 

[crossbody]

Those tombs held the bodies of the souls that belonged to God, but had to wait to enter Heaven until Christ paid the debt for their sins. Remember that Christ told the thief that he would be with Him in Paradise that day. And days later told Mary that He had not yet risen. So we know the Paradise they went to wasn't Heaven. Abraham's Bosom was also referred to as Paradise. The location was in the heart of the earth:

Matthew 12:40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

There was a huge chasm between those in Hell and those in Paradise. Christ went to Abraham's side and proclaimed who He was to the other side.

The description of the place is laid out in Luke 16:19-31.

There is no longer a need for Abraham's Bosom because Christ has paid our debt. We step right out of our heavy clay suits and go straight up:

2 Cor. 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.

Our last breath on earth is our 1st. breath in Heaven if we belong to Jesus.

You are mixing in so many different events, and so many different Bible scriptures. This thread is about no one has died and returned back to earth again.

You say our last breath on earth is our first breath in heaven if we belong to Jesus. You may have gotten that from the internet, but is that really true? Give it some thought.

Peep this, flesh and blood will not enter into heaven, so will we NEED to breathe with our resurrected body??? Give that some thought as well.

 

[task0778]

When one dies the spirit returns to God who gave it. It is my belief that our spirit is also able to give an account to God of everything we have ever said and done while on earth.

That does not mean that our spirit does not return to Earth in a different life. Consider John 9, where Jesus and his disciples pass a blind man on the side of the road. The disciples then asked Jesus if it was this man or his parents who sinned to make him be born blind. The question reveals what they believed, how can a man come into this world blind because of sin if he had not lived a previous life to do the sinning?

It is believed by many scholars that reincarnation was so widespread in the ancient world both before and after the crucifixion that the Roman emperor Justinian took action that led to its banishment in the mid sixth century AD. It is interesting that this was accomplished by a Roman emperor. In those days, the church was more of a state institution than an avenue of spirituality, and a belief in reincarnation probably wasn’t in the best interest of an emperor who demanded total obedience from his subjects. The idea that a soul would get as many chances as necessary to gain salvation does kinda reduce the power of the emperor and his church as far as your current life is concerned.

 

[Moonglow]

That is of course, aside from Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior and he didn't return from the death to remain here on earth, but only as proof.

If the Bible is a lie how come the dead have not returned back to earth? People eyes, but see not, and ears but hear not. God says when one dies their Spirit returns to Him.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Thus far, aside from the begotten Son of God; Jesus... not one regular human being born from the seed of man (not even Adam nor Eve) has returned back to earth to live again. Every now and then they put a male or female witch on TV to pretend they are talking to the dead- a dead human or dead animal. People shed tears behind such lies because they've been tricked into believing a lie.

Question: Why is it so hard for people to believe and understand that God cannot lie concerning His Word?

Dante did it as did Orpheus and Eurydice

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Not according to the Hindus

 

[Cougarbear]

I combined both of your posts. As for the first post I was speaking of the male and female witches... psychics, etc... that have been on TV before faking to tell others that they are able to speak with the dead when that is demonic, and they are only manipulating them for profit. Those dead people there spirits have already returned to God. The rest of their dead body has returned to the dust.

Understand the whole shenanigan trickery of it is demonic in that if the psychic has any powerful ability to speak to the dead ask them why they have no powerful ability to bring back to life those whom they are speaking to? What they are doing is an act of ventriloquism buffoonery.

As for your second post, you are right, I was focused on Matthew 27 of which I had been discussing earlier.

Yes, they don’t just speak on TV. But, to have our freedom to live our religion, all must be able to do likewise or we are no better than the mid evil Catholic Church who ran governments putting non-believers to torture or death. Instead of converting by the word of God and testimony of the Holy Ghost. We are converted freely and not by force.

 

[task0778]

Not according to the Hindus

And quite a few other religions from Asia, Africa, and other parts of the world. Which doesn't make them right or wrong, true or false, but since there's no proof one way or the other then it is up to each individual to decide for themselves what to believe in. And no, the Bible is not proof.

 

[onefour1]

If we read the story of Lazarus in John 11, we understand that Jesus brought back Lazarus from the dead. This miracle only brought Lazarus back to a mortal state of life. Jesus, on the other hand, was the first to resurrect to immortality and eternal life. Jesus is the firstborn of the dead to take on immortality. Eventually all mankind will resurrect to a state of immortality. However, Jesus is the first and through him, all mankind will resurrect to have immortal bodies of flesh an bones even as Jesus himself did.

 

[kjw47]

Does it say, coming out, entering a city, seen by many? All of those things require one to be alive and able to move and be seen. The dead can do none of those things. Matthew says what it means. Read it again.
Matthew 27:52-53 The tombs were opened, and many bodies of the saints (God's people) who had fallen asleep [in death] were raised [to life]; and coming out of the tombs after His resurrection, they entered the holy city (Jerusalem) and appeared to many people.
If they were still alive, they would not need to be raised. Huge stones had to be removed in order for them to come out of the tombs. It is why the earthquake was necessary. People didn't just show up after they were entombed. They couldn't remove the boulders to get out. Those who came back with Christ, were a unique group at a unique event. And some had been dead long enough that only bones remained. King David, the apple of God's eye, had been dead for 1,000 years before He was raised with Christ and the rest.
Those waiting in Abraham's bosom were able to be raised because Christ defeated death. They were proof of that fact.

Luke explains that were are indeed eternal beings and what our souls resemble without the body. We are recognizable as who we were even without the body. We can speak, retain all memory, thirst, regret...

bodies.

 

[Meriweather]

When it comes to God renting the veil in two from top to bottom that did give us access to God without us having to go through a priest, and you did mention that. Also, keep in mind that some religions such as the Catholic Church religion teaches its members to continue going through a priest despite God doing away with that practice/ritual. Do you see what I'm gettin at? I'm showing you that the "power" you mentioned, did not get taken from the law. There are some aspects of the law being kept by others out of ignorance, and other aspects of the law are being kept due to religious blindness. There are parts of the law Jesus needs power to remain in them because Jesus is fulfilling them. Hopefully that sheds some light on #1 and #2.

Why did Jesus send out the Apostles? Why did people have to go through the Apostles to get to know Jesus and his teachings? Why didn't Jesus say, God's laws and his ways are written on everyone's heart...go live life. If God's laws are written on our hearts, what is the need for a Bible, a congregation, or gathering people together for worship?

For all who say, No need to go through a priest, what else is there no need for? Was there any need for Jesus to say those who came to him, "Your sins are forgiven"? Was there any need for any of the Apostles to follow in Jesus steps--his ways--and tell those who came to them, "Your sins are forgiven"? Was there any need to tell people the parables Jesus told or the things that he did? Was there any need to write them down? In fact, Jesus did not do away with any ritual, he introduced for all of us the role of priest, prophet, and king...and the responsibilities that go with each of these undertakings.

What I am getting at is that each of us can be a solitary hermit alone with God, with a motto of, "I don't need anyone else--I have God," or we can be a family of God where we see God, that spark of divinity, in all of humanity.

 

[Cougarbear]

And quite a few other religions from Asia, Africa, and other parts of the world. Which doesn't make them right or wrong, true or false, but since there's no proof one way or the other then it is up to each individual to decide for themselves what to believe in. And no, the Bible is not proof.

Agreed. The Bible, Book of Mormon, Koran and whatever other book of beliefs has to be up to the individual which they will follow. I choose the Bible, Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants and Pearl of Great Price because through prayer, study, meditation and without a double mind, the Spirit of God has told me they are true enough scriptures to gain exaltation and eternal life in Heaven if I follow them, repent, be baptized receive the Holy Ghost and do all that I can do.

 

[Cougarbear]

Why did Jesus send out the Apostles? Why did people have to go through the Apostles to get to know Jesus and his teachings? Why didn't Jesus say, God's laws and his ways are written on everyone's heart...go live life. If God's laws are written on our hearts, what is the need for a Bible, a congregation, or gathering people together for worship?

For all who say, No need to go through a priest, what else is there no need for? Was there any need for Jesus to say those who came to him, "Your sins are forgiven"? Was there any need for any of the Apostles to follow in Jesus steps--his ways--and tell those who came to them, "Your sins are forgiven"? Was there any need to tell people the parables Jesus told or the things that he did? Was there any need to write them down? In fact, Jesus did not do away with any ritual, he introduced for all of us the role of priest, prophet, and king...and the responsibilities that go with each of these undertakings.

What I am getting at is that each of us can be a solitary hermit alone with God, with a motto of, "I don't need anyone else--I have God," or we can be a family of God where we see God, that spark of divinity, in all of humanity.

I don't always agree with you on some things. But, you are spot on with this response. Good job. Where he gets the idea Jesus did away with anything is unbelievable. Jesus said that he came not to change the law but to fulfill the law of Moses. There are some unnecessary rituals because of this. But, I've seen nowhere that this gets rid of the need for the Priesthood of God and therefore, no priests are needed. In fact, in Hebrews, Paul establishes the fact that there are two orders of the Priesthood after Melchizedek and Aaron. The Melchizedek Priesthood is actually the Priesthood after the order of the Son of God.

 

[Meriweather]

I don't always agree with you on some things. But, you are spot on with this response. Good job. Where he gets the idea Jesus did away with anything is unbelievable. Jesus said that he came not to change the law but to fulfill the law of Moses. There are some unnecessary rituals because of this. But, I've seen nowhere that this gets rid of the need for the Priesthood of God and therefore, no priests are needed. In fact, in Hebrews, Paul establishes the fact that there are two orders of the Priesthood after Melchizedek and Aaron. The Melchizedek Priesthood is actually the Priesthood after the order of the Son of God.

Thank you. I appreciate finding common ground as well.

 

[crossbody]

That does not mean that our spirit does not return to Earth in a different life. Consider John 9, where Jesus and his disciples pass a blind man on the side of the road. The disciples then asked Jesus if it was this man or his parents who sinned to make him be born blind. The question reveals what they believed, how can a man come into this world blind because of sin if he had not lived a previous life to do the sinning?

You would be leaning to your own understanding to assume that. John 9 in no way at all implies that the disciples believed the man had lived a previous life. During that time it was commonly supposed that sickness was a result of sin. Therefore the disciples were asking Jesus about sins committed by a baby while still in the mother's womb, or if sin committed by parents could result in a baby being born with a disease. Jesus rejected both suggestions. You went off the cliff with the notion that the disciples were thinking the man had a previous life. That's incorrect.

We have to learn to trust God, as God just absolutely cannot lie.

1. God says it is given unto man once to die then the judgment.
2. God says absent from the body, present with the Lord.
3. God says the spirit returns to God who gave it, when one dies.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

How do you know?

Simple.

It's impossible.

They make a magical exception for Jesus.

And for Lazarus. They always forget him, in these discussions.

Poor Lazarus. Resurrected, and all he got was a lousy t-shirt.

 

[task0778]

You would be leaning to your own understanding to assume that. John 9 in no way at all implies that the disciples believed the man had lived a previous life. During that time it was commonly supposed that sickness was a result of sin. Therefore the disciples were asking Jesus about sins committed by a baby while still in the mother's womb, or if sin committed by parents could result in a baby being born with a disease. Jesus rejected both suggestions. You went off the cliff with the notion that the disciples were thinking the man had a previous life. That's incorrect.

We have to learn to trust God, as God just absolutely cannot lie.

1. God says it is given unto man once to die then the judgment.
2. God says absent from the body, present with the Lord.
3. God says the spirit returns to God who gave it, when one dies.

I went off a cliff? LOL, like it's possible that an unborn baby sinned? Okay, you roll with that but I think that notion is ridiculous.

 

[crossbody]

I went off a cliff? LOL, like it's possible that an unborn baby sinned? Okay, you roll with that but I think that notion is ridiculous.

John 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?

The disciples make mention of:
1. the man
2. his parents
3. the man sinning as a baby just before being born

Just going by the scripture and the words used by the disciples themselves.

 

[onefour1]

John 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?

The disciples make mention of:
1. the man
2. his parents
3. the man sinning as a baby just before being born

Just going by the scripture and the words used by the disciples themselves.

In The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, we believe that we existed even before entering our mother's womb. We believe that we were all born as the spirit children of God the Father. Thus when considering if the man sinned and thus was born blind we do believe this had reference to when he was a preborn infant in his mother's womb but to his life as a spirit before being born.

Here are some biblical references that suggest we existed before being born:

• When God laid the foundations of the earth, all the sons of God shouted for joy, Job 38:4–7.
• The spirit shall return unto God who gave it, Eccl. 12:7.
• Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee, Jer. 1:4–5.
• We are all his offspring, Acts 17:28.
• God chose us before the foundation of the world, Eph. 1:3–4.
• We are to be in subjection to the Father of spirits, Heb. 12:9.
• The angels which kept not their first estate, he hath reserved in everlasting chains, Jude 1:6 (Abr. 3:26).
• The Devil and his angels were cast out, Rev. 12:9.

We believe that Lucifer and those who followed after him were denied the opportunity to gain a physical body here on earth. They were all spirit children of God but came out in open rebellion against God and thus there was a war in heaven and the devil and his angels were established. The rest of us sided with God the Father and Jesus in the war in heaven and were allowed to come to earth and receive bodies of flesh and bones. Thus we read:

Revelation 12:7-11
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

Lucifer's name was changed to Perdition and Satan. He and his followers were cast into the earth but were denied the opportunity to progress and receive bodies. The faithful who sided with God the Father and Jesus Christ were to received bodies of flesh and bones and be born into this world with them. We were then, as verse 11 states, to overcome Satan by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of our testimonies and eventually experience death. But thanks to our Savior, we will all ultimately resurrect to immortality.

 

[task0778]

John 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?

The disciples make mention of:
1. the man
2. his parents
3. the man sinning as a baby just before being born

Just going by the scripture and the words used by the disciples themselves.

You tell me, how does a man sin before he was born?

 

[Couchpotato]

That is of course, aside from Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior and he didn't return from the death to remain here on earth, but only as proof.

If the Bible is a lie how come the dead have not returned back to earth? People eyes, but see not, and ears but hear not. God says when one dies their Spirit returns to Him.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Thus far, aside from the begotten Son of God; Jesus... not one regular human being born from the seed of man (not even Adam nor Eve) has returned back to earth to live again. Every now and then they put a male or female witch on TV to pretend they are talking to the dead- a dead human or dead animal. People shed tears behind such lies because they've been tricked into believing a lie.

Question: Why is it so hard for people to believe and understand that God cannot lie concerning His Word?

Lazarus.