No One Has a Right to Health Care

[Ray From Cleveland]

But hey!!! My Pizza Hut employed tenant now has healthcare. Isn't that a good thing; taking from the productive and giving to the irresponsible non-productive? That's the liberal way.

Geez, the lesser than thou Pizza Hut employee. I guess you work harder than that bastard, heh?

and...if you do that makes you a greater being than them???

No, what it means is that people like myself who took on the responsibility to have a trade or skill and secure our healthcare by getting a job with healthcare benefits are now robbed of them so that people who wanted to smoke pot and work minimum wage jobs can have healthcare.

. If you think that it's this cut and dry it's not.. Yes there is mismanagement sure, and things need to be fixed, but the things we see don't make up the whole show.

It is cut and dry if you look at the entire picture. Ask yourself: do you really believe politicians (on either side) give a damn if you have healthcare insurance or not? Of course they don't. They needed a Trojan horse to usher in their real agendas.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

So is the United States to escape persecution and oppression from the Euros only to allow ourselves to be oppressed from within? God forbid!

Are all men created equal or not?

Is some employer crying poor me more equal than a homeless man?

Employers do one thing: create products or services for a profit. That's it. They have no social obligation that many liberals think they have. Social obligations are not why anybody created an industry.

Conservatives have always believed that all men are created equal. Liberalism is the belief that all men are not, and it's up to government to make all people equal.

. People and industry are to very different things, and the U.S. is not run and made up by just industry. The people have to have relief from the tyranny of industry, just like it's supposed to be the same if government gets out of control as well.

If you're tired of industry, you can start your own business if you so desire. When you are tired of your government and want change, the only way to change it is if a majority of people think the way you do.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Even prior to the ACA nobody was denied access to healthcare. If you walked into a publicly funded hospital with a stab wound or drug overdose they were required to take care of you.

It worked so well. (sarcasm)

But, I agree that talk about "rights" is counterproductive and dishonest.

What was wrong with medical care in the US before ACA became law?

. It was spiraling out of control on price, people being canceled left and right if thought to have become a high risk, no care plan for anyone with pre-existing conditions, and cancelations if found to be the case, and no consistancy in keeping a policy because carriers began playing the swap up game, just like the banks were doing with all those high risk loans or mortgages.

Banks can only make loans by government standards if they wish to sell them off. Don't blame the banks--blame your government for the housing collapse.

Yes, there were problems with our former healthcare system. But if cancelations were the problem, then all government had to do is insure those people once they got canceled--not rip down the entire system and make things better for some people and much worse for others. Nothing was really solved that way.

 

[beagle9]

Okay Rustic,
Just what in your opinion are the "priorities"? World policeman, killing muslims, damn them jews or what?

Playing Robin Hood is not responsible...
Lol

Just as I thought, no substance, all snide ass comments. A little mind following the conservative sheeple.

I gave you a chance to actually state your case and you failed miserably.

Performance of socialism throughout history is all the proof anyone needs... 100% failure rate.
Socialists are really dense...

. How can it be a 100% failure, when it is mixed in with our system, and has been forever?

This nation is failing... Because of socialism
20+ trillion in debt
125-175 trillion in unfunded liabilities
Open borders
Spineless career politicians
Just to name a few...

. All because of socialism ? There are no other factors or forces at work ?

 

[beagle9]

Even prior to the ACA nobody was denied access to healthcare. If you walked into a publicly funded hospital with a stab wound or drug overdose they were required to take care of you.

It worked so well. (sarcasm)

But, I agree that talk about "rights" is counterproductive and dishonest.

What was wrong with medical care in the US before ACA became law?

. It was spiraling out of control on price, people being canceled left and right if thought to have become a high risk, no care plan for anyone with pre-existing conditions, and cancelations if found to be the case, and no consistancy in keeping a policy because carriers began playing the swap up game, just like the banks were doing with all those high risk loans or mortgages.

Banks can only make loans by government standards if they wish to sell them off. Don't blame the banks--blame your government for the housing collapse.

Yes, there were problems with our former healthcare system. But if cancelations were the problem, then all government had to do is insure those people once they got canceled--not rip down the entire system and make things better for some people and much worse for others. Nothing was really solved that way.

. All sorts of blame to go around... But owning up to the parts that may hurt peoples pride and fellings is important to. There is a huge problem with that.

 

[Rustic]

Playing Robin Hood is not responsible...
Lol

Just as I thought, no substance, all snide ass comments. A little mind following the conservative sheeple.

I gave you a chance to actually state your case and you failed miserably.

Performance of socialism throughout history is all the proof anyone needs... 100% failure rate.
Socialists are really dense...

. How can it be a 100% failure, when it is mixed in with our system, and has been forever?

This nation is failing... Because of socialism
20+ trillion in debt
125-175 trillion in unfunded liabilities
Open borders
Spineless career politicians
Just to name a few...

. All because of socialism ? There are no other factors or forces at work ?

Ya, a socialist government ran by progressive career politicians spending like there is no tomorrow. Who are also so politically correct they are nothing more than a human wind sock...
The majority of problems are from decades of fucked up government behavior...

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Even prior to the ACA nobody was denied access to healthcare. If you walked into a publicly funded hospital with a stab wound or drug overdose they were required to take care of you.

It worked so well. (sarcasm)

But, I agree that talk about "rights" is counterproductive and dishonest.

What was wrong with medical care in the US before ACA became law?

. It was spiraling out of control on price, people being canceled left and right if thought to have become a high risk, no care plan for anyone with pre-existing conditions, and cancelations if found to be the case, and no consistancy in keeping a policy because carriers began playing the swap up game, just like the banks were doing with all those high risk loans or mortgages.

Banks can only make loans by government standards if they wish to sell them off. Don't blame the banks--blame your government for the housing collapse.

Yes, there were problems with our former healthcare system. But if cancelations were the problem, then all government had to do is insure those people once they got canceled--not rip down the entire system and make things better for some people and much worse for others. Nothing was really solved that way.

. All sorts of blame to go around... But owning up to the parts that may hurt peoples pride and fellings is important to. There is a huge problem with that.

Really? Well what hurts ones pride anymore than not being able to afford your own insurance and then the government stealing your hard earned money because you can't afford it? The Republicans wanted to change at least that part of the law but DumBama would have nothing to do with it.

 

[Rustic]

It's a far better thing to earn a way in this world, than be given everything by a federal government.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Even prior to the ACA nobody was denied access to healthcare. If you walked into a publicly funded hospital with a stab wound or drug overdose they were required to take care of you.

It worked so well. (sarcasm)

But, I agree that talk about "rights" is counterproductive and dishonest.

What was wrong with medical care in the US before ACA became law?

. It was spiraling out of control on price, people being canceled left and right if thought to have become a high risk, no care plan for anyone with pre-existing conditions, and cancelations if found to be the case, and no consistancy in keeping a policy because carriers began playing the swap up game, just like the banks were doing with all those high risk loans or mortgages.

Guess what? IN theory, ACA does have a way for those with a preexisting condition to actually buy a policy. However, the deductible is very high and the actual condition that the person had is not covered...
Now, since ACA was enacted, premiums have risen at a pace never seen before. Large insurers which endorsed Obamacare are looking to get out because they are losing money.
BTW, how can anyone in their right mind be able to skip out on getting at least some coverage and one day realize they have a situation, THEN run out and buy insurance?....
Don't tell me they couldn't afford it. Bottom line is many of those who did not and STILL do not have a health insurance policy, make that choice.
NOw, the solution to all of this is to get rid of health insurance as we know it..
1. Get the federal government out of the business entirely. No federal mandates, none of the regulatory madness...
2. offer coverage for catastrophic, short term and long term disability. These are two types of coverages available only to small business owners and sole proprietary businesses.
3, allow doctors and medical facilities to compete in an open marketplace for patients,. This would drive down prices.
4. allow those who wish to do so, become cash patients.
5 allow insurance companies to sell and compete across ALL state lines for business.
6. bar health carriers from investing in businesses other than health related industries.
7 preferential treatment by government regulation those health insurance companies that are privately owned, rather than publicly traded. And insurance company that does not have to answer to a Board of Directors or stock holders is going to concentrate its attention solely on its customers.

 

[beagle9]

Even prior to the ACA nobody was denied access to healthcare. If you walked into a publicly funded hospital with a stab wound or drug overdose they were required to take care of you.

It worked so well. (sarcasm)

But, I agree that talk about "rights" is counterproductive and dishonest.

What was wrong with medical care in the US before ACA became law?

. It was spiraling out of control on price, people being canceled left and right if thought to have become a high risk, no care plan for anyone with pre-existing conditions, and cancelations if found to be the case, and no consistancy in keeping a policy because carriers began playing the swap up game, just like the banks were doing with all those high risk loans or mortgages.

Guess what? IN theory, ACA does have a way for those with a preexisting condition to actually buy a policy. However, the deductible is very high and the actual condition that the person had is not covered...
Now, since ACA was enacted, premiums have risen at a pace never seen before. Large insurers which endorsed Obamacare are looking to get out because they are losing money.
BTW, how can anyone in their right mind be able to skip out on getting at least some coverage and one day realize they have a situation, THEN run out and buy insurance?....
Don't tell me they couldn't afford it. Bottom line is many of those who did not and STILL do not have a health insurance policy, make that choice.
NOw, the solution to all of this is to get rid of health insurance as we know it..
1. Get the federal government out of the business entirely. No federal mandates, none of the regulatory madness...
2. offer coverage for catastrophic, short term and long term disability. These are two types of coverages available only to small business owners and sole proprietary businesses.
3, allow doctors and medical facilities to compete in an open marketplace for patients,. This would drive down prices.
4. allow those who wish to do so, become cash patients.
5 allow insurance companies to sell and compete across ALL state lines for business.
6. bar health carriers from investing in businesses other than health related industries.
7 preferential treatment by government regulation those health insurance companies that are privately owned, rather than publicly traded. And insurance company that does not have to answer to a Board of Directors or stock holders is going to concentrate its attention solely on its customers.

All I know is that something needs to make the system better.. wow..

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Even prior to the ACA nobody was denied access to healthcare. If you walked into a publicly funded hospital with a stab wound or drug overdose they were required to take care of you.

It worked so well. (sarcasm)

But, I agree that talk about "rights" is counterproductive and dishonest.

What was wrong with medical care in the US before ACA became law?

. It was spiraling out of control on price, people being canceled left and right if thought to have become a high risk, no care plan for anyone with pre-existing conditions, and cancelations if found to be the case, and no consistancy in keeping a policy because carriers began playing the swap up game, just like the banks were doing with all those high risk loans or mortgages.

Guess what? IN theory, ACA does have a way for those with a preexisting condition to actually buy a policy. However, the deductible is very high and the actual condition that the person had is not covered...
Now, since ACA was enacted, premiums have risen at a pace never seen before. Large insurers which endorsed Obamacare are looking to get out because they are losing money.
BTW, how can anyone in their right mind be able to skip out on getting at least some coverage and one day realize they have a situation, THEN run out and buy insurance?....
Don't tell me they couldn't afford it. Bottom line is many of those who did not and STILL do not have a health insurance policy, make that choice.
NOw, the solution to all of this is to get rid of health insurance as we know it..
1. Get the federal government out of the business entirely. No federal mandates, none of the regulatory madness...
2. offer coverage for catastrophic, short term and long term disability. These are two types of coverages available only to small business owners and sole proprietary businesses.
3, allow doctors and medical facilities to compete in an open marketplace for patients,. This would drive down prices.
4. allow those who wish to do so, become cash patients.
5 allow insurance companies to sell and compete across ALL state lines for business.
6. bar health carriers from investing in businesses other than health related industries.
7 preferential treatment by government regulation those health insurance companies that are privately owned, rather than publicly traded. And insurance company that does not have to answer to a Board of Directors or stock holders is going to concentrate its attention solely on its customers.

Plus you want to add to it that the government start paying the full bill for their patients. Currently, Medicare and Medicaid only pay about 2/3 of billed services. Hospitals and doctors need to recoup that money somewhere, and that somewhere is private pay and private insured patients. That of course is a big player in premium increases. We need to increase Medicare contributions on working people if we want to keep this program.

Secondly is a mandatory health savings account. It's money used only for medical purposes. It would be deducted from your pay before taxes, and that money would go into an account that you use first when you need medical care. It doesn't have to be that much because it adds up quickly, say 2%.

Insurance companies often complain about the cost of paper work for nickel-dime procedures. You see a doctor for about a hundred bucks, and all that paperwork has to be processed by the doctors office and the insurance company even if they don't pay a dime on the charges. A health savings account would eliminate some of that costly paperwork.

 

[Wilbur Right]

We need to increase Medicare contributions on working people if we want to keep this program.

Secondly is a mandatory health savings account. It's money used only for medical purposes.

Right here we have another hypocrite Republican.

Wanting to increase taxes for some (with lower incomes) and create another giant government program to track health savings accounts.

WtF? I thought taxes were bad and government run programs worse?
What happened?

 

[beagle9]

We need to increase Medicare contributions on working people if we want to keep this program.

Secondly is a mandatory health savings account. It's money used only for medical purposes.

Right here we have another hypocrite Republican.

Wanting to increase taxes for some (with lower incomes) and create another giant government program to track health savings accounts.

WtF? I thought taxes were bad and government run programs worse?
What happened?

. What happened was he figures that if the government is being run by repubs, then it will be run right, so anything that is done then will be OK.

 

[beagle9]

So it just comes down to management styles or who will then figure it to be the best group in charge of the government, and that will legitimize the government once again in the citizens minds who would agree to the government once again

 

[Rustic]

Why do progressives want everyone else's money??

 

[beagle9]

Why do progressives want everyone else's money??

. Are you talking about the whine-o on the street corner asking for a dollar or the ones in government trying to fund programs that they were voted in to keep running or programs they create ?

 

[Rustic]

Why do progressives want everyone else's money??

. Are you talking about the whine-o on the street corner asking for a dollar or the ones in government trying to fund programs that they were voted in to keep running or programs they create ?

The ones who are using career politicians and their federal government to take what is not theirs....

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

We need to increase Medicare contributions on working people if we want to keep this program.

Secondly is a mandatory health savings account. It's money used only for medical purposes.

Right here we have another hypocrite Republican.

Wanting to increase taxes for some (with lower incomes) and create another giant government program to track health savings accounts.

WtF? I thought taxes were bad and government run programs worse?
What happened?

What happened? I call it my raccoon theory:

You see a hungry raccoon digging in your garbage, so you give him a nice meaty ham bone to enjoy. The raccoon dines in delight knowing you gave him the bone. Now try to take it away and see what that raccoon does.

This is what's wrong with all social programs; once you get people on them, it's almost impossible to get them off. More government control.

And since most people will never get rid of Medicare, then we have to fund it. It's that simple. We can no longer do it governments way where they cheat people out of money and then it falls back on us as it always does in hidden costs, and then blame those greedy insurance companies.

So why haven't they increased Medicare contributions to keep up with the payments they must make? Because once people see those increases, they may want to get rid of the program and try something else. If we elect leaders to switch us to a private senior healthcare plan, that takes power away from Democrats.

If you work, you should pay into your healthcare system even if you make minimum wage. That would reduce paperwork costs, employees, and even lower the amount of people using other government programs for piddly crap like a broken finger.

 

[Wilbur Right]

Ray you are advocating for another government program and another tax.

the rest of the bullshit you wrote is just trying to hide that fact.

Dont worry, you are a typical Repub, Hate that government till you want to use it for something you want. then its aok. Same with taxes.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Ray you are advocating for another government program and another tax.

the rest of the bullshit you wrote is just trying to hide that fact.

Dont worry, you are a typical Repub, Hate that government till you want to use it for something you want. then its aok. Same with taxes.

I do hate the government, but I don't decide what other people want.

I say get government out of all of it. If you don't have the ability to pay for care, then you don't get any. Die. But since I don't make those decisions nor can decide what the majority of people want, then you have to do it the right way.

Most Democrat voters don't have the smarts to realize nothing is really free. It may not cost you anything, but somebody else has to pay for your free. Instead of giving people stuff and billing somebody else, let the people getting the stuff pay for the stuff.