NHS fails to save life of Islamic bombing victim...failing in the most basic emergency care procedures...

[2aguy]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

 

[2aguy]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

We aren't the ones praising government controlled medicine, you are.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

We aren't the ones praising government controlled medicine, you are.

Its far superior to the system that you suffer under.

 

[2aguy]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

We aren't the ones praising government controlled medicine, you are.

Its far superior to the system that you suffer under.

It wasn't......and the only thing keeping yours afloat was the U.S. paying your bills...

 

[Turtlesoup]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

And mistakes can happen? Seriously, you need some help---------------they fricked up badly----------like I would say on purpose badly but either way--they should all be removed.

 

[Lysistrata]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

We aren't the ones praising government controlled medicine, you are.

What does "government controlled medicine" have to do with what might have been medical malpractice, which can occur anywhere?

BTW: there are states in the U.S. that have laws regulating what doctors can and can't do and what they can and can't discuss with patients, so we have government-controlled medicine here in the States, too.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

And mistakes can happen? Seriously, you need some help---------------they fricked up badly----------like I would say on purpose badly but either way--they should all be removed.

Well there is a public enquiry taking place. Perhaps you believe we should ditch the whole system because of an incident that could happen anywhere ?

 

[2aguy]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

And mistakes can happen? Seriously, you need some help---------------they fricked up badly----------like I would say on purpose badly but either way--they should all be removed.

Well there is a public enquiry taking place. Perhaps you believe we should ditch the whole system because of an incident that could happen anywhere ?

No....you should ditch that system because you can't afford it without the U.S. paying for everything else you need.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

And mistakes can happen? Seriously, you need some help---------------they fricked up badly----------like I would say on purpose badly but either way--they should all be removed.

Well there is a public enquiry taking place. Perhaps you believe we should ditch the whole system because of an incident that could happen anywhere ?

No....you should ditch that system because you can't afford it without the U.S. paying for everything else you need.

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations.

 

[ESay]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

We pay a small amount of tax every month and that covers us for all treatment, drugs the lot.The time it takes varies depending on the treatment and sometimes where you live.
I have no idea what each treatment costs because it is not something I need to worry about. The UK is still waiting for its first medical bankruptcy which is scheduled to happen in the year - never.

 

[ESay]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

We pay a small amount of tax every month and that covers us for all treatment, drugs the lot.The time it takes varies depending on the treatment and sometimes where you live.
I have no idea what each treatment costs because it is not something I need to worry about. The UK is still waiting for its first medical bankruptcy which is scheduled to happen in the year - never.

What do you mean? What medical bankruptcy?

 

[2aguy]

Yep.......the NHS is getting worse and worse, and now that the U.S. won't be paying their bills, the U.K. is about to really see what government healthcare is all about...

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the jihadist terror bombing of an Ariana Grande concert in Manchester, England, could have survived with better care, according to medical experts.
----

However, neither the ambulance crew nor the accident and emergency (A&E) department at the hospital applied tourniquets or splints to stem the bleeding, and trauma doctors did not perform a “thoracotomy” procedure to help with the blood loss for reasons which are unclear.

“Our medical experts have suggested that there were procedures that Saffie could have had and she didn’t. She was losing that much blood. And there wasn’t a successful procedure in place to get that blood into Saffie – even in A&E. Why?” demanded Mr Roussos.

UK: 8-year-old Islamic Terror Bombing Victim Could Have Survived

8-year-old Saffie Rose Roussos, the youngest victim of the Ariana Grande concert bombing, could have survived with better care, say experts.

www.breitbart.com

And mistakes can happen. You are so lucky in the US that medical negligence doesnt exist.

And mistakes can happen? Seriously, you need some help---------------they fricked up badly----------like I would say on purpose badly but either way--they should all be removed.

Well there is a public enquiry taking place. Perhaps you believe we should ditch the whole system because of an incident that could happen anywhere ?

No....you should ditch that system because you can't afford it without the U.S. paying for everything else you need.

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations.

Your system is maintained by our system, you doofus......but now that the democrats are going to trash our country, you will actually have to pay your own way....time to grow up tommy.

 

[2aguy]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

They have a formula.....and if you don't fit that formuala you don't get the treatment...

One case from the 90s..... someone in Britain was going blind......lost vision in one eye, but couldn't get it treated because he still had vision in the other eye...... an 80 year old woman had a lump......took weeks to get in to see a general practitioner......he scheduled her to see a cancer specialist.....months on the waiting list....yep....it was cancer.....set up her surgery..........months and months later....by the time they got her on the table...it had spread, and there was nothing they could do...

A construction worker shattered his ankle.....he was a smoker....he was told that before they would fix his ankle he had to stop smoking.... until he did that? No surgery for him....they did give him pain pills....of course he couldn't actually work.

That is what you get from the NHS.....

If you are young and healthy, the NHS is great....get old....or not conform to their formulas.......? You are screwed....

Ambulance service to the hospital......good luck......

And on top of that.....they are out of money..... Doctors and Nurses are in short supply since being a government clock puncher doesn't appeal to those with the inclination to become Medical miracle workers....

 

[2aguy]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

We pay a small amount of tax every month and that covers us for all treatment, drugs the lot.The time it takes varies depending on the treatment and sometimes where you live.
I have no idea what each treatment costs because it is not something I need to worry about. The UK is still waiting for its first medical bankruptcy which is scheduled to happen in the year - never.

What do you mean? What medical bankruptcy?

They have too many people wanting too many services and they don't have enough money to pay for them.....

You have to dig deep since the first pages of any search all you get is praise for the NHS...you have to punch in "NHS Failing," "NHS Collapsing," to get to the real story......

For example....

Single-Payer in Crisis: Britain's NHS Cancels 50,000 Surgeries Amid Long Waits For Care, 'Third World' Conditions


Every hospital in the country has been ordered to cancel all non-urgent surgery until at least February in an unprecedented step by NHS officials. The instructions on Tuesday night - which will see result in around 50,000 operations being axed - followed claims by senior doctors that patients were being treated in “third world” conditions, as hospital chief executives warned of the worst winter crisis for three decades. Hospitals are reporting growing chaos, with a spike in winter flu leaving frail patients facing 12-hour waits, and some units running out of corridor space. Sir Bruce Keogh, NHS medical director, on Tuesday ordered NHS trusts to stop taking all but the most urgent cases, closing outpatients clinics for weeks as well as cancelling around 50,000 planned operations. Trusts have also been told they can abandon efforts to house male and female patients in separate wards, in an effort to protect basic safety, as services become overwhelmed...By Tuesday night 12 NHS trusts - including two ambulance services covering almost nine million people - had declared they had reached the maximum state of emergency...

East of England Ambulance Service, also at maximum capacity, said some patients were being sent taxis to get them to hospital, with paramedics stuck in ambulances queuing at hospitals for more than 500 hours in the last four days...A number of NHS trust chief executives described the pressure as “relentless” with several on Tuesday saying they had never seen such pressure during 30 years in the health service. Dr Nick Scriven, president of the Society for Acute Medicine, said: "The position at the moment is as bad as I've ever known. We are simply not coping, we were at full capacity before the sorts of pressures that we should be able to manage - like a rise in flu - is pushing us over the edge. “Things are terrible now, but I am fearful the next few weeks will be horrendous."


A blanket, nationwide ban on all "non-urgent" until at least next month, with overcrowded state hospitals leaving sick and elderly patients in hallways, and treatment in some areas deteriorating to "third world" levels. Wait times for care have hit 12 hours, with ambulances forming long lines outside hospitals (hardly unprecedented over there) lasting hundreds of combined hours, forcing vulnerable citizens to travel to emergency in taxis and private vehicles, due to a chronic ambulance backlog. This is single-payer healthcare, operating in an advanced Western nation that has had their system in place for decades. A fundamentally flawed system, insufficient resources and an aging population are proving to be a recipe for disaster.

And that disaster is exactly what Bernie Sanders and a bevy of Democratic presidential hopefuls have in mind for the American people -- this, despite the stunning fiscal realities that have blocked far-left states like Vermont and Californiafrom implementing "universal healthcare" fantasies.
=====

Single-Payer Health Care Is A Terrible Option

What has been the response to the public outcry about unacceptable waits for care in virtually all single-payer systems? First, a growing list of European governments—including Denmark, England, Finland, Ireland, Italy, the Netherlands, Norway, Spain, and Sweden—have issued dozens of decrees and “guarantees” of timely care with notably lax targets, even as those guarantees continue to be unmet. Second, many single-payer systems now funnel taxpayer money to private care to solve their systems’ inadequacies, just as we now do in our own VA system, and use taxpayer money for care in other countries, as codified in Section 3A of the NHS Constitution, as well. In one year alone, £901 million targeted for medical services by the UK government was used to buy care from private and other non-NHS providers, according to research by the Financial Times in March 2017.
-----

NHS problems 'at their worst since 1990s'


Services in the NHS in England are deteriorating in a way not seen since the early 1990s, according to a leading health think tank.
The King's Fund review said waiting times for A&E, cancer care and routine operations had all started getting worse, while deficits were growing.
It said such drops in performance had not been seen for 20 years.
But the think tank acknowledged the NHS had done as well as could be expected, given the financial climate.
Professor John Appleby, chief economist at the King's Fund, which specialises in health care policy, said: "The next government will inherit a health service that has run out of money and is operating at the very edge of its limits.
================

 

[Tommy Tainant]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

We pay a small amount of tax every month and that covers us for all treatment, drugs the lot.The time it takes varies depending on the treatment and sometimes where you live.
I have no idea what each treatment costs because it is not something I need to worry about. The UK is still waiting for its first medical bankruptcy which is scheduled to happen in the year - never.

What do you mean? What medical bankruptcy?

They have too many people wanting too many services and they don't have enough money to pay for them.....

You have to dig deep since the first pages of any search all you get is praise for the NHS...you have to punch in "NHS Failing," "NHS Collapsing," to get to the real story......

For example....

Single-Payer in Crisis: Britain's NHS Cancels 50,000 Surgeries Amid Long Waits For Care, 'Third World' Conditions


Every hospital in the country has been ordered to cancel all non-urgent surgery until at least February in an unprecedented step by NHS officials. The instructions on Tuesday night - which will see result in around 50,000 operations being axed - followed claims by senior doctors that patients were being treated in “third world” conditions, as hospital chief executives warned of the worst winter crisis for three decades. Hospitals are reporting growing chaos, with a spike in winter flu leaving frail patients facing 12-hour waits, and some units running out of corridor space. Sir Bruce Keogh, NHS medical director, on Tuesday ordered NHS trusts to stop taking all but the most urgent cases, closing outpatients clinics for weeks as well as cancelling around 50,000 planned operations. Trusts have also been told they can abandon efforts to house male and female patients in separate wards, in an effort to protect basic safety, as services become overwhelmed...By Tuesday night 12 NHS trusts - including two ambulance services covering almost nine million people - had declared they had reached the maximum state of emergency...

East of England Ambulance Service, also at maximum capacity, said some patients were being sent taxis to get them to hospital, with paramedics stuck in ambulances queuing at hospitals for more than 500 hours in the last four days...A number of NHS trust chief executives described the pressure as “relentless” with several on Tuesday saying they had never seen such pressure during 30 years in the health service. Dr Nick Scriven, president of the Society for Acute Medicine, said: "The position at the moment is as bad as I've ever known. We are simply not coping, we were at full capacity before the sorts of pressures that we should be able to manage - like a rise in flu - is pushing us over the edge. “Things are terrible now, but I am fearful the next few weeks will be horrendous."


A blanket, nationwide ban on all "non-urgent" until at least next month, with overcrowded state hospitals leaving sick and elderly patients in hallways, and treatment in some areas deteriorating to "third world" levels. Wait times for care have hit 12 hours, with ambulances forming long lines outside hospitals (hardly unprecedented over there) lasting hundreds of combined hours, forcing vulnerable citizens to travel to emergency in taxis and private vehicles, due to a chronic ambulance backlog. This is single-payer healthcare, operating in an advanced Western nation that has had their system in place for decades. A fundamentally flawed system, insufficient resources and an aging population are proving to be a recipe for disaster.

And that disaster is exactly what Bernie Sanders and a bevy of Democratic presidential hopefuls have in mind for the American people -- this, despite the stunning fiscal realities that have blocked far-left states like Vermont and Californiafrom implementing "universal healthcare" fantasies.
=====

Single-Payer Health Care Is A Terrible Option

What has been the response to the public outcry about unacceptable waits for care in virtually all single-payer systems? First, a growing list of European governments—including Denmark, England, Finland, Ireland, Italy, the Netherlands, Norway, Spain, and Sweden—have issued dozens of decrees and “guarantees” of timely care with notably lax targets, even as those guarantees continue to be unmet. Second, many single-payer systems now funnel taxpayer money to private care to solve their systems’ inadequacies, just as we now do in our own VA system, and use taxpayer money for care in other countries, as codified in Section 3A of the NHS Constitution, as well. In one year alone, £901 million targeted for medical services by the UK government was used to buy care from private and other non-NHS providers, according to research by the Financial Times in March 2017.
-----

NHS problems 'at their worst since 1990s'


Services in the NHS in England are deteriorating in a way not seen since the early 1990s, according to a leading health think tank.
The King's Fund review said waiting times for A&E, cancer care and routine operations had all started getting worse, while deficits were growing.
It said such drops in performance had not been seen for 20 years.
But the think tank acknowledged the NHS had done as well as could be expected, given the financial climate.
Professor John Appleby, chief economist at the King's Fund, which specialises in health care policy, said: "The next government will inherit a health service that has run out of money and is operating at the very edge of its limits.
================

And yet we still get better outcomes than your system that lets poor people die.The whole civilised world gets better outcomes as you would expect.
Any healthcare system based on your ability to pay is uncivilised and an affront to Christian sensibilities.

 

[ESay]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

They have a formula.....and if you don't fit that formuala you don't get the treatment...

One case from the 90s..... someone in Britain was going blind......lost vision in one eye, but couldn't get it treated because he still had vision in the other eye...... an 80 year old woman had a lump......took weeks to get in to see a general practitioner......he scheduled her to see a cancer specialist.....months on the waiting list....yep....it was cancer.....set up her surgery..........months and months later....by the time they got her on the table...it had spread, and there was nothing they could do...

A construction worker shattered his ankle.....he was a smoker....he was told that before they would fix his ankle he had to stop smoking.... until he did that? No surgery for him....they did give him pain pills....of course he couldn't actually work.

That is what you get from the NHS.....

If you are young and healthy, the NHS is great....get old....or not conform to their formulas.......? You are screwed....

Ambulance service to the hospital......good luck......

And on top of that.....they are out of money..... Doctors and Nurses are in short supply since being a government clock puncher doesn't appeal to those with the inclination to become Medical miracle workers....

Yes, I have read about similar things. It is hard to get serious treatment in time (at least if it is not an emergency).

 

[ESay]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

We pay a small amount of tax every month and that covers us for all treatment, drugs the lot.The time it takes varies depending on the treatment and sometimes where you live.
I have no idea what each treatment costs because it is not something I need to worry about. The UK is still waiting for its first medical bankruptcy which is scheduled to happen in the year - never.

What do you mean? What medical bankruptcy?

They have too many people wanting too many services and they don't have enough money to pay for them.....

You have to dig deep since the first pages of any search all you get is praise for the NHS...you have to punch in "NHS Failing," "NHS Collapsing," to get to the real story......

For example....

Single-Payer in Crisis: Britain's NHS Cancels 50,000 Surgeries Amid Long Waits For Care, 'Third World' Conditions


Every hospital in the country has been ordered to cancel all non-urgent surgery until at least February in an unprecedented step by NHS officials. The instructions on Tuesday night - which will see result in around 50,000 operations being axed - followed claims by senior doctors that patients were being treated in “third world” conditions, as hospital chief executives warned of the worst winter crisis for three decades. Hospitals are reporting growing chaos, with a spike in winter flu leaving frail patients facing 12-hour waits, and some units running out of corridor space. Sir Bruce Keogh, NHS medical director, on Tuesday ordered NHS trusts to stop taking all but the most urgent cases, closing outpatients clinics for weeks as well as cancelling around 50,000 planned operations. Trusts have also been told they can abandon efforts to house male and female patients in separate wards, in an effort to protect basic safety, as services become overwhelmed...By Tuesday night 12 NHS trusts - including two ambulance services covering almost nine million people - had declared they had reached the maximum state of emergency...

East of England Ambulance Service, also at maximum capacity, said some patients were being sent taxis to get them to hospital, with paramedics stuck in ambulances queuing at hospitals for more than 500 hours in the last four days...A number of NHS trust chief executives described the pressure as “relentless” with several on Tuesday saying they had never seen such pressure during 30 years in the health service. Dr Nick Scriven, president of the Society for Acute Medicine, said: "The position at the moment is as bad as I've ever known. We are simply not coping, we were at full capacity before the sorts of pressures that we should be able to manage - like a rise in flu - is pushing us over the edge. “Things are terrible now, but I am fearful the next few weeks will be horrendous."


A blanket, nationwide ban on all "non-urgent" until at least next month, with overcrowded state hospitals leaving sick and elderly patients in hallways, and treatment in some areas deteriorating to "third world" levels. Wait times for care have hit 12 hours, with ambulances forming long lines outside hospitals (hardly unprecedented over there) lasting hundreds of combined hours, forcing vulnerable citizens to travel to emergency in taxis and private vehicles, due to a chronic ambulance backlog. This is single-payer healthcare, operating in an advanced Western nation that has had their system in place for decades. A fundamentally flawed system, insufficient resources and an aging population are proving to be a recipe for disaster.

And that disaster is exactly what Bernie Sanders and a bevy of Democratic presidential hopefuls have in mind for the American people -- this, despite the stunning fiscal realities that have blocked far-left states like Vermont and Californiafrom implementing "universal healthcare" fantasies.
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Single-Payer Health Care Is A Terrible Option

What has been the response to the public outcry about unacceptable waits for care in virtually all single-payer systems? First, a growing list of European governments—including Denmark, England, Finland, Ireland, Italy, the Netherlands, Norway, Spain, and Sweden—have issued dozens of decrees and “guarantees” of timely care with notably lax targets, even as those guarantees continue to be unmet. Second, many single-payer systems now funnel taxpayer money to private care to solve their systems’ inadequacies, just as we now do in our own VA system, and use taxpayer money for care in other countries, as codified in Section 3A of the NHS Constitution, as well. In one year alone, £901 million targeted for medical services by the UK government was used to buy care from private and other non-NHS providers, according to research by the Financial Times in March 2017.
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NHS problems 'at their worst since 1990s'


Services in the NHS in England are deteriorating in a way not seen since the early 1990s, according to a leading health think tank.
The King's Fund review said waiting times for A&E, cancer care and routine operations had all started getting worse, while deficits were growing.
It said such drops in performance had not been seen for 20 years.
But the think tank acknowledged the NHS had done as well as could be expected, given the financial climate.
Professor John Appleby, chief economist at the King's Fund, which specialises in health care policy, said: "The next government will inherit a health service that has run out of money and is operating at the very edge of its limits.
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And yet we still get better outcomes than your system that lets poor people die.The whole civilised world gets better outcomes as you would expect.
Any healthcare system based on your ability to pay is uncivilised and an affront to Christian sensibilities.

The main question is how long such a system can exist. In my opinion, due to demographic and changes in economy most European countries get to 'americanization' of their healthcare.

 

[2aguy]

You should adopt our system so that you join the civilised group of nations

If say Bill needs a medical treatment that is worth 10 thousand pounds, will the UK provide that to him? And how long should he wait?

We pay a small amount of tax every month and that covers us for all treatment, drugs the lot.The time it takes varies depending on the treatment and sometimes where you live.
I have no idea what each treatment costs because it is not something I need to worry about. The UK is still waiting for its first medical bankruptcy which is scheduled to happen in the year - never.

What do you mean? What medical bankruptcy?

They have too many people wanting too many services and they don't have enough money to pay for them.....

You have to dig deep since the first pages of any search all you get is praise for the NHS...you have to punch in "NHS Failing," "NHS Collapsing," to get to the real story......

For example....

Single-Payer in Crisis: Britain's NHS Cancels 50,000 Surgeries Amid Long Waits For Care, 'Third World' Conditions


Every hospital in the country has been ordered to cancel all non-urgent surgery until at least February in an unprecedented step by NHS officials. The instructions on Tuesday night - which will see result in around 50,000 operations being axed - followed claims by senior doctors that patients were being treated in “third world” conditions, as hospital chief executives warned of the worst winter crisis for three decades. Hospitals are reporting growing chaos, with a spike in winter flu leaving frail patients facing 12-hour waits, and some units running out of corridor space. Sir Bruce Keogh, NHS medical director, on Tuesday ordered NHS trusts to stop taking all but the most urgent cases, closing outpatients clinics for weeks as well as cancelling around 50,000 planned operations. Trusts have also been told they can abandon efforts to house male and female patients in separate wards, in an effort to protect basic safety, as services become overwhelmed...By Tuesday night 12 NHS trusts - including two ambulance services covering almost nine million people - had declared they had reached the maximum state of emergency...

East of England Ambulance Service, also at maximum capacity, said some patients were being sent taxis to get them to hospital, with paramedics stuck in ambulances queuing at hospitals for more than 500 hours in the last four days...A number of NHS trust chief executives described the pressure as “relentless” with several on Tuesday saying they had never seen such pressure during 30 years in the health service. Dr Nick Scriven, president of the Society for Acute Medicine, said: "The position at the moment is as bad as I've ever known. We are simply not coping, we were at full capacity before the sorts of pressures that we should be able to manage - like a rise in flu - is pushing us over the edge. “Things are terrible now, but I am fearful the next few weeks will be horrendous."


A blanket, nationwide ban on all "non-urgent" until at least next month, with overcrowded state hospitals leaving sick and elderly patients in hallways, and treatment in some areas deteriorating to "third world" levels. Wait times for care have hit 12 hours, with ambulances forming long lines outside hospitals (hardly unprecedented over there) lasting hundreds of combined hours, forcing vulnerable citizens to travel to emergency in taxis and private vehicles, due to a chronic ambulance backlog. This is single-payer healthcare, operating in an advanced Western nation that has had their system in place for decades. A fundamentally flawed system, insufficient resources and an aging population are proving to be a recipe for disaster.

And that disaster is exactly what Bernie Sanders and a bevy of Democratic presidential hopefuls have in mind for the American people -- this, despite the stunning fiscal realities that have blocked far-left states like Vermont and Californiafrom implementing "universal healthcare" fantasies.
=====

Single-Payer Health Care Is A Terrible Option

What has been the response to the public outcry about unacceptable waits for care in virtually all single-payer systems? First, a growing list of European governments—including Denmark, England, Finland, Ireland, Italy, the Netherlands, Norway, Spain, and Sweden—have issued dozens of decrees and “guarantees” of timely care with notably lax targets, even as those guarantees continue to be unmet. Second, many single-payer systems now funnel taxpayer money to private care to solve their systems’ inadequacies, just as we now do in our own VA system, and use taxpayer money for care in other countries, as codified in Section 3A of the NHS Constitution, as well. In one year alone, £901 million targeted for medical services by the UK government was used to buy care from private and other non-NHS providers, according to research by the Financial Times in March 2017.
-----

NHS problems 'at their worst since 1990s'


Services in the NHS in England are deteriorating in a way not seen since the early 1990s, according to a leading health think tank.
The King's Fund review said waiting times for A&E, cancer care and routine operations had all started getting worse, while deficits were growing.
It said such drops in performance had not been seen for 20 years.
But the think tank acknowledged the NHS had done as well as could be expected, given the financial climate.
Professor John Appleby, chief economist at the King's Fund, which specialises in health care policy, said: "The next government will inherit a health service that has run out of money and is operating at the very edge of its limits.
================

And yet we still get better outcomes than your system that lets poor people die.The whole civilised world gets better outcomes as you would expect.
Any healthcare system based on your ability to pay is uncivilised and an affront to Christian sensibilities.

No...you don't......you idiots in Europe count deaths differently and fix the number to support your failed system.

Again...when we stop paying your bills....how will you afford the NHS?