More On Euthanasia

[dilloduck]

As well they should...that's their job. If the attending physician had decided to give up on Terry after her brain had been without oxygen for 9 minutes, that whole mess would have been avoided.

Do you think it should work differently?

Definately!

 

[MissileMan]

Definately!

How?

 

[Gunny]

Mr. P., I think that each community, state, country what have you will have to wrestle with these questions. For each individual family, they will have to make their choices. To my way of thinking, if I had a chronic illness or the doctors told my family that they 'could keep me alive' on machines to keep an organ functioning, well that would be a bit much. On the other hand, to withhold nourishment and hydration? No, to do so is barbaric, IMO. On the level of abortion to me, I would not physically get involved to stop those, but I will speak out and try to get the laws changed.

I have to agree with you here. For the most part, you echo my sentiments on the topic.

IMO, there is a line between an artificial respirator and providing nourishment; which, we ALL require to survive, sick or not. ANYONE cut off from food and water will die.

"Barbaric" is a mild term for starving/dehydrating a human being to death.

I just can't help but wonder when it was we started playing God with our indigent. It just doesn't seem to fit right in the picture when placed next to thh ideals this Nation was founded on.

 

[dilloduck]

How?

The doc certainly shouldn't have the power to make this decision without consulting a family member.

 

[Annie]

As well they should...that's their job. If the attending physician had decided to give up on Terry after her brain had been without oxygen for 9 minutes, that whole mess would have been avoided.

Do you think it should work differently?

Sounds very similar to what the Captain that completed the mercy killing. While not guilty of murder, he was convicted:

But the military court in Germany found him guilty of assault with intent to commit voluntary manslaughter. The panel will reconvene later Thursday to consider Maynulet's sentence. The charge carries a maximum of 10 years in prison.

He was discharged from the military.

 

[MissileMan]

The doc certainly shouldn't have the power to make this decision without consulting a family member.

It's not a question of power, it's a question of reality and compassion. If someone's EEG is flatline, then why add the torment to a loved one of having to direct the doctor to stop trying? All it will do is add grief to the survivor who will continually question their decision as opposed to dealing solely with a death. We can keep almost anyone, suffering from almost anything, alive with machines these days. How long do you suppose the waiting line would be if we allowed family members to direct a doctor to use extreme means in ALL cases?

 

[Annie]

It's not a question of power, it's a question of reality and compassion. If someone's EEG is flatline, then why add the torment to a loved one of having to direct the doctor to stop trying? All it will do is add grief to the survivor who will continually question their decision as opposed to dealing solely with a death. We can keep almost anyone, suffering from almost anything, alive with machines these days. How long do you suppose the waiting line would be if we allowed family members to direct a doctor to use extreme means in ALL cases?

That's very different. At the point of 'flatline' the doc can call the time of death.

 

[Mr. P]

The doc certainly shouldn't have the power to make this decision without consulting a family member.

Yer talkin ER here,or what?..The Doc would say something like this, let me see....."Stop
bleeding-out for a sec while I check with the family to see if I can just let ya die, okay"? Get real dillo.

 

[MissileMan]

Sounds very similar to what the Captain that completed the mercy killing. While not guilty of murder, he was convicted:



He was discharged from the military.

While he may have had good intentions, I have a problem with the way the Captain handled himself. If the man were that bad off, it would have been prudent to call a medic to handle the situation. If however the bad guy was an imminent threat via grenade or firearm, a finishing shot would be in order.

 

[Annie]

While he may have had good intentions, I have a problem with the way the Captain handled himself. If the man were that bad off, it would have been prudent to call a medic to handle the situation. If however the bad guy was an imminent threat via grenade or firearm, a finishing shot would be in order.

He did call the medic, the medic 'freaked out'. The medic copped a deal, after lying 26 times.

 

[MissileMan]

That's very different. At the point of 'flatline' the doc can call the time of death.

I don't think it's limited to flat liners either. Let's say it's someone who got tore up in a car crash with little head trauma but massive bodily injuries...loss of limbs, dead liver, dead kidneys, total paralysis, with no hope of living a remotely normal life. At some point, you have to give up the ghost.

 

[Annie]

I don't think it's limited to flat liners either. Let's say it's someone who got tore up in a car crash with little head trauma but massive bodily injuries...loss of limbs, dead liver, dead kidneys, total paralysis, with no hope of living a remotely normal life. At some point, you have to give up the ghost.

I'm friends with several that worked in ER's, when they were younger. They've never spoken of anything like that. I have heard them talk of working on young people, they knew couldn't survive, with a miracle now and then, more often, working on them then crying.

 

[MissileMan]

I'm friends with several that worked in ER's, when they were younger. They've never spoken of anything like that. I have heard them talk of working on young people, they knew couldn't survive, with a miracle now and then, more often, working on them then crying.

Yes, but at a certain point, when their efforts weren't getting anywhere, they called the time of death and informed the family, they didn't go out to the waiting room and ask the family if they should hook the body up to a machine to keep the heart beating or lungs working indefinitely.

 

[Annie]

Yes, but at a certain point, when their efforts weren't getting anywhere, they called the time of death and informed the family, they didn't go out to the waiting room and ask the family if they should hook the body up to a machine to keep the heart beating or lungs working indefinitely.

Right, you're point is?

 

[MissileMan]

Right, you're point is?

I was making points to refute Dillo's notion that such decisions should be made by the families. I think we've been arguing the same side of the debate.

 

[Annie]

I was making points to refute Dillo's notion that such decisions should be made by the families. I think we've been arguing the same side of the debate.

Well you made me so mad I used a contraction in place of possesive!

 

[MissileMan]

Well you made me so mad I used a contraction in place of possesive!

:rotflmao:

 

[Mr. P]

Just to toss a wrench in here...
I flew many a patient that were alive but had no hope..They hook em up to keep the organs viable for transplant, until they can speak to the family..

 

[5stringJeff]

Mine of course..but this is not about ER Docs'...These orders are givin throughout the Hospital. Not in the ER.

I can't agree with that. If someone has a living will, who is the doctor to say, "No, sorry, your life is worth it." ?!?

 

[dilloduck]

Just to toss a wrench in here...
I flew many a patient that were alive but had no hope..They hook em up to keep the organs viable for transplant, until they can speak to the family..

What wrench?---talking to the family seems quite appropriate--at least they didn't just harvest em.