Mesa AZ PIG COP MURDER: Daniel Shaver seen crawling, begging in disturbing video as MURDERED!

[ChrisL]

Their job is to protect the public from dangerous suspects.

I already acknowledged that the cop was an asshole. However, he is not a mind reader and he doesn't know what the suspect is capable of doing or what the suspect is carrying, a knife, a gun, whatever.

Number Of Police Officers Killed By Firearms Rose In 2016, Study Finds

The number of law enforcement officers shot and killed in the line of duty increased sharply in 2016 relative to 2015, according to a preliminary report from The National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund.

The overall number of officer fatalities rose by 10 percent, remaining lower than the average for the previous ten years.

But the NLEOMF found that 64 officers were killed in firearm-related incidents in 2016 — a 56 percent increase over 2015, when 41 officers were killed. It's the highest number of firearms-related deaths recorded since 2011, when the tally was 73.

Those shooting deaths included 21 deaths in ambush-style shootings, "the highest total in more than two decades," NLEOMF said in a statement.

The rise was partly fueled by a few high-profile shootings that took the lives of multiple officers, NLEOMF notes:

"Eight multiple-shooting death incidents claimed the lives of 20 officers in 2016, tied with 1971 for the highest total of any year since 1932. Those incidents included five officers killed in ambush attacks in Dallas (TX) and three in Baton Rouge (LA) spanning 10 days in July."


THE TWO-WAY
Number Of Police Officers Killed By Gunfire Fell 14 Percent In 2015, Study Says
Overall, including traffic fatalities and other causes, 135 police officers died in the line of duty in 2016, NLEOMF says. That's 10 percent more than died last year, and the largest tally since 2011, when 177 officers died — 73 of them in firearms-related incidents.

That's still lower than the average of the previous ten years, when total fatalities averaged just under 144 deaths per year. And it's far lower than in decades past. According to NLEOMF data, in the 1970s, an average of 231 officers died each year. In the '80s, the number who died each year never dipped below 175.

Still, the rise in shooting fatalities in 2016 — and especially the increase in ambush killings targeting law enforcement officers — has police officers on edge, The Associated Press reports:

" 'We've never seen a year in my memory when we've had an increase of this magnitude in officer shooting deaths,' said Craig Floyd, president and chief executive of the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund. 'These officers were killed simply because of the uniform they wear and the job they do. This is unacceptable to the humane society that we are.' ...

"Floyd said the impact of this year has been profound on law enforcement. Agencies are struggling to recruit officers to their ranks and those who continue to serve 'talk about how their head is now on a swivel.'

" 'They're always looking over their shoulder, always worrying about the next attack that could come at any time from any direction,' Floyd said."

Ya , the cop sounded real worried on the vidio. They had him on the ground with his hands interlocked and legs crossed absolutely no threat at that time. They easily could have went and cuffed him, but they did not. They issued order after order that did not make sense and shot the guy. Over 4800 construction workers died on the job in 2014 so no I do not feel bad for the cops. They can either do their job or they do not belong there. This cop belongs in prison. You can expect more cop killing in the future do to this guy, we like the cops do not want to get shot and killed. This vidio and the aquital sure does not raise my trust in the cops, many people will see this vidio and think, the next time a cop points a gun at me I should likely shoot him before he shoots me. As far as him protecting my ass, I can do with out five high powered bullets in my body. I can do with out this proitection. I have never called a cop to protect me and never will.

The cops know better than to ever ASSUME that somebody is not a threat. They know this due to experience dealing with people.

There was no assumption, he could be clearly seen. So just keep going, obviously a copcan commit no crime in your eyes.Here is the thing you can score to high on a civil servicwe test to become a cop. So just keep teling me how they no more than I do and how it is to complicated for us civilians to comprehend.. If you belive that a guy with his fingers interlocked on his head, face down on the ground and legs crossed is a threat, then you do not have two IQ points to rub togeth3er just like the two idiot fucking pigs in that vidio. And yes they were fucking murdering pigs. If you belive that was good police work you have no buisness being a cop or telling me how a cop should act. Go get fucking bent you fucking dim witted boot licking dumb fuck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I hoppe that shit happens to some one in your family. Any way you slice it an umarrmed inocent person lost their life and you condone the actions of murderers.

Okay, crazy person. Go get some psychiatric help for yourself.

Ya, I am crazy because I want to hold people accountable for thier actions no matter their job title. There are no cops that have committed crimes and they should be afforded a pass on all of their actions due to thier job title. The poor guy that did nothing laying on the floor of a hotel hall that lost his life deserved to. If I make a mistake in my job I have to pay the consequences why should a cop n ot have to pay the consequences too. Most cops are decent people, how ever the blue line allows the bad apples to do what ever the fuck they want. If you murder some one like thisa guy clearly did you need to go to jail. If you think you desrve respect just due to wearing a uniform, you are sorely mistasken.

Nobody has said that he deserved to lose his life. Nobody has said that cops that have committed crimes should be able to get away with them and nobody has said any of the things that you claim in your post. What was said is that you don't understand the kind of stress that the cop was under, you weren't there, you aren't trained in dealing with potentially dangerous suspects and don't know what the hell you are talking about. A jury apparently saw the evidence. The officer was not charged. That is how our justice system works. Plenty of other people have "walked" too, like Casey Anthony, OJ Simpson, etc.

There is a damn good possibility that the stress of being a police officer in a high crime area has an affect on the human psyche. That is a fact.

 

[evenflow1969]

Ya , the cop sounded real worried on the vidio. They had him on the ground with his hands interlocked and legs crossed absolutely no threat at that time. They easily could have went and cuffed him, but they did not. They issued order after order that did not make sense and shot the guy. Over 4800 construction workers died on the job in 2014 so no I do not feel bad for the cops. They can either do their job or they do not belong there. This cop belongs in prison. You can expect more cop killing in the future do to this guy, we like the cops do not want to get shot and killed. This vidio and the aquital sure does not raise my trust in the cops, many people will see this vidio and think, the next time a cop points a gun at me I should likely shoot him before he shoots me. As far as him protecting my ass, I can do with out five high powered bullets in my body. I can do with out this proitection. I have never called a cop to protect me and never will.

The cops know better than to ever ASSUME that somebody is not a threat. They know this due to experience dealing with people.

There was no assumption, he could be clearly seen. So just keep going, obviously a copcan commit no crime in your eyes.Here is the thing you can score to high on a civil servicwe test to become a cop. So just keep teling me how they no more than I do and how it is to complicated for us civilians to comprehend.. If you belive that a guy with his fingers interlocked on his head, face down on the ground and legs crossed is a threat, then you do not have two IQ points to rub togeth3er just like the two idiot fucking pigs in that vidio. And yes they were fucking murdering pigs. If you belive that was good police work you have no buisness being a cop or telling me how a cop should act. Go get fucking bent you fucking dim witted boot licking dumb fuck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I hoppe that shit happens to some one in your family. Any way you slice it an umarrmed inocent person lost their life and you condone the actions of murderers.

Okay, crazy person. Go get some psychiatric help for yourself.

Ya, I am crazy because I want to hold people accountable for thier actions no matter their job title. There are no cops that have committed crimes and they should be afforded a pass on all of their actions due to thier job title. The poor guy that did nothing laying on the floor of a hotel hall that lost his life deserved to. If I make a mistake in my job I have to pay the consequences why should a cop n ot have to pay the consequences too. Most cops are decent people, how ever the blue line allows the bad apples to do what ever the fuck they want. If you murder some one like thisa guy clearly did you need to go to jail. If you think you desrve respect just due to wearing a uniform, you are sorely mistasken.

Nobody has said that he deserved to lose his life. Nobody has said that cops that have committed crimes should be able to get away with them and nobody has said any of the things that you claim in your post. What was said is that you don't understand the kind of stress that the cop was under, you weren't there, you aren't trained in dealing with potentially dangerous suspects and don't know what the hell you are talking about. A jury apparently saw the evidence. The officer was not charged. That is how our justice system works. Plenty of other people have "walked" too, like Casey Anthony, OJ Simpson, etc.

There is a damn good possibility that the stress of being a police officer in a high crime area has an affect on the human psyche. That is a fact.

You assume a lot. I am not sitting here saying OJ should have walked. I am not sitting here saying Casey Anthony should have walked. Do cops face stress on the job, yes they do. We all face stress on the job. You are right I was not trained to be a cop. I was trained to kill them all and let god sort them out. We were not trained to sort out who lived and died. How ever I have personaly witnessed much more intense and dangerous situations in which every one made it home when it was over. Agai you are more likely to die on the job as a construction worker as opposed to a cop. So should a construction worker be afforded more leniency than a cop? Either we are all equal under the law or not. If you can not handle the job you should not have been there. I do not give a shit about their stress. It is no excuse. It is up to you wether or not you can handle the job you are applying for or working. Stress should not relieve you of responsibility. If I design a bridge that falls down during the mornin g commute. I am responsible for those lives whether I was stressed out or not. If I could not handle the stress I am under, I would quit doing my job rather than risk the lives of people using my roads and bridges.

 

[ChrisL]

The cops know better than to ever ASSUME that somebody is not a threat. They know this due to experience dealing with people.

There was no assumption, he could be clearly seen. So just keep going, obviously a copcan commit no crime in your eyes.Here is the thing you can score to high on a civil servicwe test to become a cop. So just keep teling me how they no more than I do and how it is to complicated for us civilians to comprehend.. If you belive that a guy with his fingers interlocked on his head, face down on the ground and legs crossed is a threat, then you do not have two IQ points to rub togeth3er just like the two idiot fucking pigs in that vidio. And yes they were fucking murdering pigs. If you belive that was good police work you have no buisness being a cop or telling me how a cop should act. Go get fucking bent you fucking dim witted boot licking dumb fuck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I hoppe that shit happens to some one in your family. Any way you slice it an umarrmed inocent person lost their life and you condone the actions of murderers.

Okay, crazy person. Go get some psychiatric help for yourself.

Ya, I am crazy because I want to hold people accountable for thier actions no matter their job title. There are no cops that have committed crimes and they should be afforded a pass on all of their actions due to thier job title. The poor guy that did nothing laying on the floor of a hotel hall that lost his life deserved to. If I make a mistake in my job I have to pay the consequences why should a cop n ot have to pay the consequences too. Most cops are decent people, how ever the blue line allows the bad apples to do what ever the fuck they want. If you murder some one like thisa guy clearly did you need to go to jail. If you think you desrve respect just due to wearing a uniform, you are sorely mistasken.

Nobody has said that he deserved to lose his life. Nobody has said that cops that have committed crimes should be able to get away with them and nobody has said any of the things that you claim in your post. What was said is that you don't understand the kind of stress that the cop was under, you weren't there, you aren't trained in dealing with potentially dangerous suspects and don't know what the hell you are talking about. A jury apparently saw the evidence. The officer was not charged. That is how our justice system works. Plenty of other people have "walked" too, like Casey Anthony, OJ Simpson, etc.

There is a damn good possibility that the stress of being a police officer in a high crime area has an affect on the human psyche. That is a fact.

You assume a lot. I am not sitting here saying OJ should have walked. I am not sitting here saying Casey Anthony should have walked. Do cops face stress on the job, yes they do. We all face stress on the job. You are right I was not trained to be a cop. I was trained to kill them all and let god sort them out. We were not trained to sort out who lived and died. How ever I have personaly witnessed much more intense and dangerous situations in which every one made it home when it was over. Agai you are more likely to die on the job as a construction worker as opposed to a cop. So should a construction worker be afforded more leniency than a cop? Either we are all equal under the law or not. If you can not handle the job you should not have been there. I do not give a shit about their stress. It is no excuse. It is up to you wether or not you can handle the job you are applying for or working. Stress should not relieve you of responsibility. If I design a bridge that falls down during the mornin g commute. I am responsible for those lives whether I was stressed out or not. If I could not handle the stress I am under, I would quit doing my job rather than risk the lives of people using my roads and bridges.

A construction worker is not under the same kinds of stresses as a police officer. It is a dangerous job, but not in the same way, where you have to be careful of PEOPLE that you are having to interact with on a daily basis. Every single person in the world feels fear and stress. People are not robots.

 

[ChrisL]

Until there are forces of "robocops" then human errors are going to occur, emotions are going to cloud judgments, mistakes are going to happen.

 

[evenflow1969]

Until there are forces of "robocops" then human errors are going to occur, emotions are going to cloud judgments, mistakes are going to happen.

Yet I watched 18 and 19 year old boys deal with the enemy with real guns. I watched them deal with IEDS, scared civilians, no sleep, 115 degree temperatures, freezing temperatures at times with no training in allowing the enemy survive confrontations. I have watched them deal with armed enemy combatants and were able to disarm them with out loss of life of any body on the team. I have watched them take the enemy into custody and retreive usable intelegence all the while treatring them with respect and dignity. All this was done while these guys were making less than minimum wage. I know this, I would not want the fucking yelow belly coward(best case likely psycopath) beside me on the line.

 

[ChrisL]

Until there are forces of "robocops" then human errors are going to occur, emotions are going to cloud judgments, mistakes are going to happen.

Yet I watched 18 and 19 year old boys deal with the enemy with real guns. I watched them deal with IEDS, scared civilians, no sleep, 115 degree temperatures, freezing temperatures at times with no training in allowing the enemy survive confrontations. I have watched them deal with armed enemy combatants and were able to disarm them with out loss of life of any body on the team. I have watched them take the enemy into custody and retreive usable intelegence all the while treatring them with respect and dignity. All this was done while these guys were making less than minimum wage. I know this, I would not want the fucking yelow belly coward(best case likely psycopath) beside me on the line.

MANY police officers are former military members.

 

[evenflow1969]

Until there are forces of "robocops" then human errors are going to occur, emotions are going to cloud judgments, mistakes are going to happen.

Yet I watched 18 and 19 year old boys deal with the enemy with real guns. I watched them deal with IEDS, scared civilians, no sleep, 115 degree temperatures, freezing temperatures at times with no training in allowing the enemy survive confrontations. I have watched them deal with armed enemy combatants and were able to disarm them with out loss of life of any body on the team. I have watched them take the enemy into custody and retreive usable intelegence all the while treatring them with respect and dignity. All this was done while these guys were making less than minimum wage. I know this, I would not want the fucking yelow belly coward(best case likely psycopath) beside me on the line.

MANY police officers are former military members.

Ya, and they are likely better suited for the job than the cop that did this shooting I am not saying all cops are bad. Some are very good cops. The one in this vidio was not a good cop. I have seen police work I have been impressed with. I watched a fifty year old cop walk into a situation where some boys from the big city showed up in a small town and started waving around some small hand guns to what they thought were going to be some scared hicks. The locals responded with over fifty fire arms pointing back at these city boys. I watched Mike show up before back up. He diffused the situation and got all four city boys in the cruiser with out a shot fired. Every one went home eventually. That is the kind of job I respect and support. Bad cops like the one in this vidio destroy trust and make the job much harder for the good cops. I want that to stop happening and it will not unless we hold our peace officers to at least the same standard as the general public and in my opinion due to the importance of trust in this area they should be held to a higher standard than your typical citizen.

 

[JQPublic1]

Well, how would the cop know if this guy was reaching for a weapon or not? I agree, he was a total asshole, but when they tell you not to move, then don't go reaching behind you. He has no idea if you are reaching for a weapon or not. I'm sure plenty of cops who practice "restraint" have been murdered because of it. These guys are dealing with the lowest of the low in society on a daily basis. Of course, that is going to have an effect on them and their psyche. It is silly to think that it wouldn't. Cops should have "term limits."

He should have never been giving him those orders in the first place, the orders should have remained stay face down on the ground, legs crossed, palms on the ground. He should’ve waited till first perp was secure, then cuff and search him with partner present. The cop made himself vulnerable in that situation. If for whatever reason they needed the perp to come to them, have him crawl backwards, tell him to lift his shirt so you can see if he has a weapon. At least a dozen other scenarios would have been better than what this cop chose. That is 100% on the cop.

I’ll ask again, why is it we give enemy combatants in war zones better treatment than our own citizens. If this was in Iraq, these guys would have been court marshaled, and charged. This is unacceptable by our own soldiers standards, why do we accept it? I want police to come home safe, I want them to take necassary actions and precautions to do that, and I want them to put themselves in advantages posistions, but reaching IS NOT a viable justification. Closing with a mentally I’ll patient with a knife who lunges IS NOT a viable justification for shooting. DO NOT PUT YOURSELF IN THAT POSISTION. I get not every situation is cut and dry, and there will be times police get caught off guard, and have to make split second decisions, this was not one of those situations. Yes this kid was stupid, he was also scared shitless and clearly not thinking straight (kind of understandable if you’ve ever been scared shitless). Police should be held to civilian standards of self defense, at the very least, if not higher. Get rid of the law enforcement bill of rights, and get rid of the “when in doubt shoot training,” which is exactly what we saw in that video no matter what way you want to slice it.

Well, this I can agree with. You make a good point in how he was managing the suspect. Making them crawl over to them doesn't really seem to make much sense, but there might be a reason why they do this that we don't know about.

Having the woman crawl made sense because the cops needed them further apart for safety. Having him crawl made no sense at all.

The cops aren't going to approach Shaver not knowing who, if any one, is still in the room. They had no way of knowing that the other male, whom Shaver had been showing his gun, had already left the room. They have to assume someone else is in the room. It makes perfect sense to have him crawl to them.

BS...the cop was stupid and his stupidity caused the death of an innocent young man.
Lay down onyour face, cross your legs. Put your arms in front of you...get up on your knees...raise your arms above your head...who told you to uncross your legs...
Cross your legs...crawl to me..(with legs crossed?)

None of you apologetic bahs-turds who keep saying the poor kid should have followed orders would have been able to process that kind of incompetent barrage of stupid orders.

Robbed of his dignity...sobbing like a baby
...he was doing everything he could to comply...and he wanted to LIVE...
And after going through all the acrobatics that damn murderer put him through...he innocently just wanted to save what little dignity he had by reaching reflexively to pull up his shorts which also could be hampering his movements. He had been ordered not to talk so he was afraid to ask if he could pull up his shorts... the sound and impact of the first shot must have been terrifying to the hapless soul...what was going through his tortued mind as the bullets ripped into him and he slipped into eternal darkness...? Finally escaping to safety in the arms of death..to be tormented no more.

V

 

[sakinago]

Well, how would the cop know if this guy was reaching for a weapon or not? I agree, he was a total asshole, but when they tell you not to move, then don't go reaching behind you. He has no idea if you are reaching for a weapon or not. I'm sure plenty of cops who practice "restraint" have been murdered because of it. These guys are dealing with the lowest of the low in society on a daily basis. Of course, that is going to have an effect on them and their psyche. It is silly to think that it wouldn't. Cops should have "term limits."

He should have never been giving him those orders in the first place, the orders should have remained stay face down on the ground, legs crossed, palms on the ground. He should’ve waited till first perp was secure, then cuff and search him with partner present. The cop made himself vulnerable in that situation. If for whatever reason they needed the perp to come to them, have him crawl backwards, tell him to lift his shirt so you can see if he has a weapon. At least a dozen other scenarios would have been better than what this cop chose. That is 100% on the cop.

I’ll ask again, why is it we give enemy combatants in war zones better treatment than our own citizens. If this was in Iraq, these guys would have been court marshaled, and charged. This is unacceptable by our own soldiers standards, why do we accept it? I want police to come home safe, I want them to take necassary actions and precautions to do that, and I want them to put themselves in advantages posistions, but reaching IS NOT a viable justification. Closing with a mentally I’ll patient with a knife who lunges IS NOT a viable justification for shooting. DO NOT PUT YOURSELF IN THAT POSISTION. I get not every situation is cut and dry, and there will be times police get caught off guard, and have to make split second decisions, this was not one of those situations. Yes this kid was stupid, he was also scared shitless and clearly not thinking straight (kind of understandable if you’ve ever been scared shitless). Police should be held to civilian standards of self defense, at the very least, if not higher. Get rid of the law enforcement bill of rights, and get rid of the “when in doubt shoot training,” which is exactly what we saw in that video no matter what way you want to slice it.

Well, this I can agree with. You make a good point in how he was managing the suspect. Making them crawl over to them doesn't really seem to make much sense, but there might be a reason why they do this that we don't know about.

And I even said, if the crawling to the officer was for whatever reason needed, have him look forward and crawl backwards. It was obvious this kid begging for his life wasn’t a threat (but the cop took it upon himself to assume that it was even more likely that he was the best undiscovered actor on the planet) anyway, if you have him crawl backwards than that certainly eliminates many threats that someone could pose to you, especially if you suspected they were concealing a handgun in their back wasteband (which it’s also not uncommon for the police to ask a suspect to carefully life their shirt to see if they are armed).

This whole case is more than police using negligent methods. I’m saying reaching alone CANNOT be the standard for opening fire. In my other video I’ve posted, I show you all a real life example where a guy was shot because he was following police orders...which were “can I see your license,” in which he reached for his license (like we all do in that situation), and then he was shot by the officer immediately...reaching cannot be the low standard to justify police shootings. THEY NEED TO IDENTIFY AN ACTUAL THREAT. So if someone is reaching, it’s ok for an officer to draw their firearm, however they need to wait before opening fire until they identify that threat. This isn’t asking a lot. I don’t want to hear any strawmen about how this is going to leave scores of cops dead on the side of the road. That’s just a ridiculous statement... for multiple reasons that I shouldn’t have to explain to people who actually think this through.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You know, considering that it takes a very short time to draw a gun from your waist (approx 1/2 to 1 sec), you should NEVER reach down when a police officer has you in their sights.

I worked in the Security Force for 4 years when I was stationed in Newport RI, and after watching the video, I probably would have shot him as well. Not 5 times mind you, because the Gunny who did the training also taught us ammo control, but I more than likely would have shot him if I was the cop.

And....................I say that even though there have been many other police shootings that I definitely did not agree with.

 

[sakinago]

Ok so, some of my friends and their family have been like my second family for years. Their dad, who I’ve know since highschool, is now the chief of police. I knew him when he was just a Sargent detective. There was a situation about 2 years ago, where there was a shooting over a drug deal gone bad or something. The police responded, one who I actually know him and his wife from school as well, found the victim dying on the street. They called for paramedics, and rushed over to the victim, and try to stop the bleeding. While they are elbows deep in him, the actual shooters, with a group of about 20 people come out. Their intentions, to stop them from saving this guys life. What they do is beat the officers within an inch of their life, to the point where both officers were in the hospital alone for months, and took their radios so they couldn’t call for backup. They never drew their weapons. I asked chief, “why the hell didn’t they draw?!” He tells me they made the right call, that had they done so, they would’ve escalated the situation and been killed for sure. I, still to this day, disagree with him, seeing how if they were willing to nearly kill the officers by beating them...then it’s not much of a leap to think why wouldn’t they just follow through and eliminate the witnesses to that... but he still insists they made the right call. And the officer I knew from school (whose wife was an ex of mine who just had their first baby) was a marine, spent almost everyday clearing out buildings. Certainly he knows when a shooting is justified.

My point is. How can the above be the “right call” and the shooting in this OP also be “the right call.” They are on opposite sides of the planet...

 

[sakinago]

Well, how would the cop know if this guy was reaching for a weapon or not? I agree, he was a total asshole, but when they tell you not to move, then don't go reaching behind you. He has no idea if you are reaching for a weapon or not. I'm sure plenty of cops who practice "restraint" have been murdered because of it. These guys are dealing with the lowest of the low in society on a daily basis. Of course, that is going to have an effect on them and their psyche. It is silly to think that it wouldn't. Cops should have "term limits."

He should have never been giving him those orders in the first place, the orders should have remained stay face down on the ground, legs crossed, palms on the ground. He should’ve waited till first perp was secure, then cuff and search him with partner present. The cop made himself vulnerable in that situation. If for whatever reason they needed the perp to come to them, have him crawl backwards, tell him to lift his shirt so you can see if he has a weapon. At least a dozen other scenarios would have been better than what this cop chose. That is 100% on the cop.

I’ll ask again, why is it we give enemy combatants in war zones better treatment than our own citizens. If this was in Iraq, these guys would have been court marshaled, and charged. This is unacceptable by our own soldiers standards, why do we accept it? I want police to come home safe, I want them to take necassary actions and precautions to do that, and I want them to put themselves in advantages posistions, but reaching IS NOT a viable justification. Closing with a mentally I’ll patient with a knife who lunges IS NOT a viable justification for shooting. DO NOT PUT YOURSELF IN THAT POSISTION. I get not every situation is cut and dry, and there will be times police get caught off guard, and have to make split second decisions, this was not one of those situations. Yes this kid was stupid, he was also scared shitless and clearly not thinking straight (kind of understandable if you’ve ever been scared shitless). Police should be held to civilian standards of self defense, at the very least, if not higher. Get rid of the law enforcement bill of rights, and get rid of the “when in doubt shoot training,” which is exactly what we saw in that video no matter what way you want to slice it.

Well, this I can agree with. You make a good point in how he was managing the suspect. Making them crawl over to them doesn't really seem to make much sense, but there might be a reason why they do this that we don't know about.

I think it's really obvious. You've all seen video of cops arresting someone out on the street. They have them first put their hands up then drop to the ground. The street is an open area and the people they are arresting have come out of cars. The cops can clearly see that no one else is in the car or around to be a threat. In this case they are in a narrow hallway. There is a room behind the woman and man with the door open, the room they came out of. The cops don't know who is or isn't in that room and if they are or not a threat. So instead of walking up to the people they are arresting and cuffing them, they have them come to them. They are on their knees with hands up to make them helpless. The cops are not going to go to them because there may be an armed person in the hotel room at the end of the hall.

If the young man had only followed instructions, as the woman did, he would have been fine. He was warned repeatedly. It's very sad. We know now there was no leathal gun and that he was not a criminal, but that is hindsight. It's a horrible situation. I don't like what happened, but I can understand why it had to happen. Most cops are good people and trying to do their job. They are not evil. It's the bad ones who give them a bad reputation. Saying all cops are bad is like saying all blacks are bad, and we know that isn't true.

I

No this was not necessary, nor was hindsight needed to prove that. We ask our soliders in war zones, to correctly asses a threat before engaging a threat. In which, reaching is not a threat, reaching mean you can prepare for threat, but not engage until you have identified the threat....why the hell are our police standards lower with citizens, then they are with our soldiers and enemy combatants? There is no excuse.

 

[eflatminor]

Again, whether it was the cops or a home invader, if the perp reaches for his waistline after I've told him not to do so, he's going to get shot.

What perp?

The only perps were the cops. One committed aggravated menacing and the other committed murder.

The courts disagreed. Your opinion is irrelevant and your logic entirely lacking.

I agree with the jury's finding. The idiot reached when told not to. The cop did the right thing. The cops in the other videos that hesitated ended up dead.

Bullshit. The innocent man committed no crime whatsoever and the cop murdered him.

People like you are mental weaklings.

Not an argument.

Your concession is respectfully accepted.

Still not an argument.

Strike two!

 

[eflatminor]

...we think it’s ok for police to use lethal force on assumptions?

Again, whether it was the cops or a home invader, if the perp reaches for his waistline after I've told him not to do so, he's going to get shot. This has nothing to do with a theater of war and everything to do with the right of self defense. This does not change if it's me or a cop. So, if I have a firearm on you and you reach into your belt, I'm going to assume you're doing so to produce a weapon. No different for a cop.

No it does change, if this was you and me on tape, outside of our home, we absolutely get charged.

You're correct it depends on the circumstances, and what was demonstrated in this case, affirmed by a jury, is that the cops acted reasonably.

Don't act like you're reaching for a weapon and you'll be fine.

Sadly jury verdicts can be manipulated or influenced by the introduction of strange court rules that favor killer cops. And all too often, jurors are selected who seem sympathetic to cops...and all it takes is one to get a hung jury. Unfortunately this killer cop was acquitted even in the face of overwhelming video evidence. It isn't that he wasn't guilt of murder...we all saw that for ourselves... the issue is that a jury refused to do the right thing and convict that murdering son of a bitch

I would have voted not to prosecute, just like the grand jury did.

Your emotional arguments are irrelevant. Your logic lacking.

 

[Muhammed]

What perp?

The only perps were the cops. One committed aggravated menacing and the other committed murder.

The courts disagreed. Your opinion is irrelevant and your logic entirely lacking.

I agree with the jury's finding. The idiot reached when told not to. The cop did the right thing. The cops in the other videos that hesitated ended up dead.

Bullshit. The innocent man committed no crime whatsoever and the cop murdered him.

People like you are mental weaklings.

Not an argument.

Your concession is respectfully accepted.

Still not an argument.

Strike two!

You're out!



Jackass.

 

[Muhammed]

Until there are forces of "robocops" then human errors are going to occur, emotions are going to cloud judgments, mistakes are going to happen.

Yet I watched 18 and 19 year old boys deal with the enemy with real guns. I watched them deal with IEDS, scared civilians, no sleep, 115 degree temperatures, freezing temperatures at times with no training in allowing the enemy survive confrontations. I have watched them deal with armed enemy combatants and were able to disarm them with out loss of life of any body on the team. I have watched them take the enemy into custody and retreive usable intelegence all the while treatring them with respect and dignity. All this was done while these guys were making less than minimum wage. I know this, I would not want the fucking yelow belly coward(best case likely psycopath) beside me on the line.

MANY police officers are former military members.

That's not a legitimate excuse.

 

[Godboy]

MESA -- Police in Mesa, Arizona released disturbing body camera video on Thursday hours after a former officer was acquitted of a murder charge in the fatal shooting of an unarmed man.

The verdict cleared Philip Brailsford, 27, of criminal liability in the 2016 death of Daniel Shaver, of Granbury, Texas. He was also found not guilty of reckless manslaughter, reports CBS Phoenix affiliate KPHO-TV.

The shooting occurred at a hotel in the Phoenix suburb where officers responded to a report of someone pointing a gun out of a window. The video, obtained by KPHO, shows Brailsford pointing a gun at Shaver as Shaver lies on the ground, holds his hands in the air, cries and begs the officer not to shoot.

[WARNING: Graphic content] Body-cam video shows Mesa police shooting



Mesa Police shooting: Daniel Shaver seen crawling, begging in disturbing video

No gun was seen in hand when GANG MEMBER PIG COP Scores Another MURDER TROPHY
for the murdering Anti-American PIG COP COWARD Murder Association! Over 700 plus people
were murdered this year by sick cowardly scumbag pig cops.

BTW:
Shaver, who was intoxicated and could be heard sobbing, begging officers, "Please don't shoot," made a single hand motion, towards his waist, possibly to adjust his pants. Brailsford yelled at Shaver that if Shaver did anything whatsoever that deviated from his instructions he would shoot him and he probably wouldn’t survive. Shaver’s arm then moved again as he wobbled while crawling forward, at which point Brailsford can be heard yelling "Don't-" before immediately opening fire with his AR-15 rifle, striking Shaver 5 times and killing him almost instantly. Shaver was unarmed.

Whoa, youre weird. That cop sucks, but youre fucking weird.

 

[Esmeralda]

Well, how would the cop know if this guy was reaching for a weapon or not? I agree, he was a total asshole, but when they tell you not to move, then don't go reaching behind you. He has no idea if you are reaching for a weapon or not. I'm sure plenty of cops who practice "restraint" have been murdered because of it. These guys are dealing with the lowest of the low in society on a daily basis. Of course, that is going to have an effect on them and their psyche. It is silly to think that it wouldn't. Cops should have "term limits."

He should have never been giving him those orders in the first place, the orders should have remained stay face down on the ground, legs crossed, palms on the ground. He should’ve waited till first perp was secure, then cuff and search him with partner present. The cop made himself vulnerable in that situation. If for whatever reason they needed the perp to come to them, have him crawl backwards, tell him to lift his shirt so you can see if he has a weapon. At least a dozen other scenarios would have been better than what this cop chose. That is 100% on the cop.

I’ll ask again, why is it we give enemy combatants in war zones better treatment than our own citizens. If this was in Iraq, these guys would have been court marshaled, and charged. This is unacceptable by our own soldiers standards, why do we accept it? I want police to come home safe, I want them to take necassary actions and precautions to do that, and I want them to put themselves in advantages posistions, but reaching IS NOT a viable justification. Closing with a mentally I’ll patient with a knife who lunges IS NOT a viable justification for shooting. DO NOT PUT YOURSELF IN THAT POSISTION. I get not every situation is cut and dry, and there will be times police get caught off guard, and have to make split second decisions, this was not one of those situations. Yes this kid was stupid, he was also scared shitless and clearly not thinking straight (kind of understandable if you’ve ever been scared shitless). Police should be held to civilian standards of self defense, at the very least, if not higher. Get rid of the law enforcement bill of rights, and get rid of the “when in doubt shoot training,” which is exactly what we saw in that video no matter what way you want to slice it.

Well, this I can agree with. You make a good point in how he was managing the suspect. Making them crawl over to them doesn't really seem to make much sense, but there might be a reason why they do this that we don't know about.

I think it's really obvious. You've all seen video of cops arresting someone out on the street. They have them first put their hands up then drop to the ground. The street is an open area and the people they are arresting have come out of cars. The cops can clearly see that no one else is in the car or around to be a threat. In this case they are in a narrow hallway. There is a room behind the woman and man with the door open, the room they came out of. The cops don't know who is or isn't in that room and if they are or not a threat. So instead of walking up to the people they are arresting and cuffing them, they have them come to them. They are on their knees with hands up to make them helpless. The cops are not going to go to them because there may be an armed person in the hotel room at the end of the hall.

If the young man had only followed instructions, as the woman did, he would have been fine. He was warned repeatedly. It's very sad. We know now there was no leathal gun and that he was not a criminal, but that is hindsight. It's a horrible situation. I don't like what happened, but I can understand why it had to happen. Most cops are good people and trying to do their job. They are not evil. It's the bad ones who give them a bad reputation. Saying all cops are bad is like saying all blacks are bad, and we know that isn't true.

I

No this was not necessary, nor was hindsight needed to prove that. We ask our soliders in war zones, to correctly asses a threat before engaging a threat. In which, reaching is not a threat, reaching mean you can prepare for threat, but not engage until you have identified the threat....why the hell are our police standards lower with citizens, then they are with our soldiers and enemy combatants? There is no excuse.

Maybe saying it had to happen is going too far. I can understand how it happened. I think the cop who shot could have been aware that the young man was not a threat. But the cop was following all procedures learned in their training. The other cops there did not shoot. Maybe the one who shot could have been more circumspect. But human beings are not perfect. He was following training, but could have used better personal judgement.

It's a terrible situation, but I don't think it is a situation of cops being evil or being intentiional murderers. I had an acquaintance who was a cop, long time ago. He wasn't a good friend or someone I particularly liked. He was a deputy in a county that didn't have high crime, not a big urban area. He quit because he didn't like being shot at, as he said. So even in a non large urban, non high crime area, these guys get shot at. It's a dangerous job. He went on to be a safety consultant in private industry. He had a college degree. A lot of police are educated. They don't need to do dangerous work. Most cops are doing the right thing despite the hazards.

 

[JQPublic1]

...we think it’s ok for police to use lethal force on assumptions?

Again, whether it was the cops or a home invader, if the perp reaches for his waistline after I've told him not to do so, he's going to get shot. This has nothing to do with a theater of war and everything to do with the right of self defense. This does not change if it's me or a cop. So, if I have a firearm on you and you reach into your belt, I'm going to assume you're doing so to produce a weapon. No different for a cop.

No it does change, if this was you and me on tape, outside of our home, we absolutely get charged.

You're correct it depends on the circumstances, and what was demonstrated in this case, affirmed by a jury, is that the cops acted reasonably.

Don't act like you're reaching for a weapon and you'll be fine.

Sadly jury verdicts can be manipulated or influenced by the introduction of strange court rules that favor killer cops. And all too often, jurors are selected who seem sympathetic to cops...and all it takes is one to get a hung jury. Unfortunately this killer cop was acquitted even in the face of overwhelming video evidence. It isn't that he wasn't guilt of murder...we all saw that for ourselves... the issue is that a jury refused to do the right thing and convict that murdering son of a bitch

I would have voted not to prosecute, just like the grand jury did.

Your emotional arguments are irrelevant. Your logic lacking.

People like you are the weak links in the justice system. You're just as inhuman as that killer cop.

 

[harmonica]

Until there are forces of "robocops" then human errors are going to occur, emotions are going to cloud judgments, mistakes are going to happen.

Yet I watched 18 and 19 year old boys deal with the enemy with real guns. I watched them deal with IEDS, scared civilians, no sleep, 115 degree temperatures, freezing temperatures at times with no training in allowing the enemy survive confrontations. I have watched them deal with armed enemy combatants and were able to disarm them with out loss of life of any body on the team. I have watched them take the enemy into custody and retreive usable intelegence all the while treatring them with respect and dignity. All this was done while these guys were making less than minimum wage. I know this, I would not want the fucking yelow belly coward(best case likely psycopath) beside me on the line.

what about::
Blackwater killings 2007?
Battle of Mogadishu Somalia 1993?
My Lai Nam 1968?
No Gun Ri, Korea1950?

For almost 50 years, South Korean villagers have insisted that early in the Korean War, American soldiers machine-gunned hundreds of helpless civilians under a railroad bridge near a hamlet some 100 miles southeast of Seoul.

G.I.'s Tell of a U.S. Massacre in Korean War

etc

up to dozens, hundreds of INNOCENT civilians were killed by American military
all through history, US soldiers/Marines have killed INNOCENT civilians
..this happens in wars...you can't deny it
...and this not counting friendly fire deaths