'Let's Not Shoot These Kids': Florida Police Caught In Shootout With 12yo Boy, 14yo Girl

[Pellinore]

In instances such as this, I fall back on the legal standard of "if not for."

If not for the homeowners keeping their guns as they did, is it definite, probable, possible, or impossible that the rampage would still have occurred? I say probable. These two kids were so intent on destruction that even with no access to the firearms, they would have done something else, such as ambush the homeowner with kitchen knives, or simply move on to a different house until they find some.

If not for the juvenile detention system mishandling the case, is it definite, probable, possible, or impossible that the rampage would still have occurred? I say impossible. Without access to minimal restraint and a 12-year-old acolyte, the 14-year-old violence machine would never have had the opportunity.

That makes it pretty clear to me where I place the blame. Someone needs to get fired, and a system overhauled down there in ... oh, Florida. Okay.

 

[2aguy]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

You don't think like they do....that's why.

They don't care about guns being stored safely........they just know it now will cost you more to own your gun, and that some people will not want to have the hassle and the expense, and the safe taking up room....so they won't bother to get a gun........also....if they can get a mandatory law, then they can create an increased penalty if you fail to comply.......if you are burgled and they take your guns despite your gun safe? You then have to prove you actually locked up your guns, and you will still face the penalties of having your guns stolen....you won't have any benefit, just more expense and more risk...

It used to be just locks on your guns......now .....as you see in this post, that isn't enough...now they want a safe......will a safe on your nightstand be enough? Or will they next want a 700 pound safe bolted to your floor even if all you have is a .22 pistol.....

You had the Titan model A safe? Well according to new government regulations you need a Titan model B and if you don't get it, you will be committing a misdemeanor and will lose your gun rights forever......

You still don't understand how they think, and how they will fight this fight....

Oh I understand how they think, and yes you are right on alot of points, but then you just go bonkers attempting to clean up someone's damned mess that they caused in hopes to keep the government at bay over it. The problem we have today, is that we're not dealing with the same citizenry that we were dealing with years ago, so we have to adjust to the threat's, and to the government who is also dealing with the same situation's even if they created alot of it.

Okay.....I have a .22 caliber revolver I use for self defense...( I don't, but let's say I do....)

Which safe should I now be required to get to own that gun...before they allow me to own and carry that gun....the 2,818 dollar model or the 4 thousand dollar model...

Please.....tell me which one........and then tell me that the 4 thousand dollar model won't be the standard they set or you will be breaking the law...

Top Gun Safe Brands, Gun Safes For Security, American Made Gun Safes: GunSafes.com

Safeguard your firearms with reliable gun safes. Explore a wide range of gun safes at Gunsafes.com and keep your guns secure and accessible.

www.gunsafes.com

Here's a deal...only about 2 thousand dollars....and I am sure it will not take up too much room in my 2 bedroom apartment...

View attachment 497825

Here's a smaller one...only 4 thousand dollars...

View attachment 497826

Surely you jest, because your not including trigger lock's or supporting future technology that secures weapons through those processes. So you attempt to create this horse verses buggy type scenario, where as you present this ohhhh what do we do, try and fit the second huge old timey safe illustrated, into ones new millennial tiny house ???

The trigger lock technology should be good enough for that 22.cal, wherefore if it is unfortunately stolen, and they try to remove it, then it would destroy the weapons trigger system in doing so. But you know as well as I, that a determined thief with nothing but time on their hands, well they can do some very amazing things. Nothing truly is safe or truly can be locked down completely, but in each case presented we can study, look at the faults, critique it, and hopefully come up with future solutions that help us to do better.

Wow........create brand new technology so that if the criminal who breaks into the house will wreck the gun if they remove the trigger lock...

This is why the anti-gun extremists win....people like you who stretch and twist and bend and try to conform so they won't get mad.........

You are no better than the republicans in congress who fold to the democrats and give in a little each time because they think the democrats won't take everything at once if they give in an inch at a time......not thinking that each inch is an inch the democrats aren't giving back and they won't stop till they get it all.....you are just helping them, and giving them reason to keep fighting...

 

[2aguy]

View attachment 497923

Exactly, so don't just give them a loaded gun, and then say go play these days right ? I have my guns secure, so I guess I'm not understanding, because I'm not rich, but I saw it as a responsibility in owning weapons.

Your guns aren't secure enough.......whatever you have them in isn't up to what we want you to have them in, so you are going to have to fix that if you want to keep your guns...

First....we need you to pay a safe storage tax...this new tax will help us fight gun violence....but don't worry, it is only 10 dollars per gun.....anyone who doesn't want to murder people with their legal guns when criminals steal them should want to pay this tax....

Next....we need you to pay a tax on the size and weight of your safe....and for each locking device on your guns...this too will go to fight gun violence, and you should also be happy to pay this fee....if you don't, you obviously don't care if children kill each other with your guns....

Next.....we have updated our requirements for what is "safe storage." We can tell right now that whatever you have isn't enough......once you tell us how you store your guns we will tell you what we expect you to actually have...it should cost more than a few hundred to a few thousand dollars....otherwise you want mass public shooters to murder gay people and asians with your guns....

Next......we want you to get new technology....this technology makes your guns only work for you, on every other day of the week, and, of course, you will have to pay a new tax on that technology...........of course, we don't have this technology yet...so you will have to store your guns at a gun store or a police station until someone invents the technology....and since we want to shut down every gun store, you will either have to turn in your guns or sell them to the government.....but once we have the imaginary technology you can petition the government to get a new permit to pay a new tax and a new fee to wait to see if you qualify to own guns..........it shouldn't take more than 5 years, and odds are you won't be able to pass the new mandatory training and insurance requirements anyway...

And if you don't comply with this it is obvious that you want to commit a mass shooting after letting children use your guns to shoot each other after you commit suicide with your gun....



This is why I can't take you seriously........you actually think this is about safe gun storage...

 

[beagle9]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

You don't think like they do....that's why.

They don't care about guns being stored safely........they just know it now will cost you more to own your gun, and that some people will not want to have the hassle and the expense, and the safe taking up room....so they won't bother to get a gun........also....if they can get a mandatory law, then they can create an increased penalty if you fail to comply.......if you are burgled and they take your guns despite your gun safe? You then have to prove you actually locked up your guns, and you will still face the penalties of having your guns stolen....you won't have any benefit, just more expense and more risk...

It used to be just locks on your guns......now .....as you see in this post, that isn't enough...now they want a safe......will a safe on your nightstand be enough? Or will they next want a 700 pound safe bolted to your floor even if all you have is a .22 pistol.....

You had the Titan model A safe? Well according to new government regulations you need a Titan model B and if you don't get it, you will be committing a misdemeanor and will lose your gun rights forever......

You still don't understand how they think, and how they will fight this fight....

Oh I understand how they think, and yes you are right on alot of points, but then you just go bonkers attempting to clean up someone's damned mess that they caused in hopes to keep the government at bay over it. The problem we have today, is that we're not dealing with the same citizenry that we were dealing with years ago, so we have to adjust to the threat's, and to the government who is also dealing with the same situation's even if they created alot of it.

Okay.....I have a .22 caliber revolver I use for self defense...( I don't, but let's say I do....)

Which safe should I now be required to get to own that gun...before they allow me to own and carry that gun....the 2,818 dollar model or the 4 thousand dollar model...

Please.....tell me which one........and then tell me that the 4 thousand dollar model won't be the standard they set or you will be breaking the law...

Top Gun Safe Brands, Gun Safes For Security, American Made Gun Safes: GunSafes.com

Safeguard your firearms with reliable gun safes. Explore a wide range of gun safes at Gunsafes.com and keep your guns secure and accessible.

www.gunsafes.com

Here's a deal...only about 2 thousand dollars....and I am sure it will not take up too much room in my 2 bedroom apartment...

View attachment 497825

Here's a smaller one...only 4 thousand dollars...

View attachment 497826

Surely you jest, because your not including trigger lock's or supporting future technology that secures weapons through those processes. So you attempt to create this horse verses buggy type scenario, where as you present this ohhhh what do we do, try and fit the second huge old timey safe illustrated, into ones new millennial tiny house ???

The trigger lock technology should be good enough for that 22.cal, wherefore if it is unfortunately stolen, and they try to remove it, then it would destroy the weapons trigger system in doing so. But you know as well as I, that a determined thief with nothing but time on their hands, well they can do some very amazing things. Nothing truly is safe or truly can be locked down completely, but in each case presented we can study, look at the faults, critique it, and hopefully come up with future solutions that help us to do better.

Wow........create brand new technology so that if the criminal who breaks into the house will wreck the gun if they remove the trigger lock...

This is why the anti-gun extremists win....people like you who stretch and twist and bend and try to conform so they won't get mad.........

You are no better than the republicans in congress who fold to the democrats and give in a little each time because they think the democrats won't take everything at once if they give in an inch at a time......not thinking that each inch is an inch the democrats aren't giving back and they won't stop till they get it all.....you are just helping them, and giving them reason to keep fighting...

By your way of thinking, safety in anything relating to firearm's would have never gotten passed, and then what ?

Where would we be today if gun safety was left in the hands of million's who didn't ever have any gun training, no back ground checks, no gun experience, automatic's still legal to all who desires them, and worst of all we now live in a new situation where society is turning bad in the most rapid waves ever, but you decry any additional safety being implemented with the knowledge of what we are seeing today, (either created or engineered), and all because you just can't trust anyone in the government ?

I agree that I don't trust government today either, but seeing a safety issue that can be fixed very easily, is tremendously hard for me not to comment on. My conscious would kill me if I knew that my guns weren't secured to the best of my ability, and then worse if two kids actually breached my home security lock system, got into my home, and actually found my gun's laying around with the ammo nearby, and they did it without any struggle, then Houston we have a problem. That's just me I guess.

 

[2aguy]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

You don't think like they do....that's why.

They don't care about guns being stored safely........they just know it now will cost you more to own your gun, and that some people will not want to have the hassle and the expense, and the safe taking up room....so they won't bother to get a gun........also....if they can get a mandatory law, then they can create an increased penalty if you fail to comply.......if you are burgled and they take your guns despite your gun safe? You then have to prove you actually locked up your guns, and you will still face the penalties of having your guns stolen....you won't have any benefit, just more expense and more risk...

It used to be just locks on your guns......now .....as you see in this post, that isn't enough...now they want a safe......will a safe on your nightstand be enough? Or will they next want a 700 pound safe bolted to your floor even if all you have is a .22 pistol.....

You had the Titan model A safe? Well according to new government regulations you need a Titan model B and if you don't get it, you will be committing a misdemeanor and will lose your gun rights forever......

You still don't understand how they think, and how they will fight this fight....

Oh I understand how they think, and yes you are right on alot of points, but then you just go bonkers attempting to clean up someone's damned mess that they caused in hopes to keep the government at bay over it. The problem we have today, is that we're not dealing with the same citizenry that we were dealing with years ago, so we have to adjust to the threat's, and to the government who is also dealing with the same situation's even if they created alot of it.

Okay.....I have a .22 caliber revolver I use for self defense...( I don't, but let's say I do....)

Which safe should I now be required to get to own that gun...before they allow me to own and carry that gun....the 2,818 dollar model or the 4 thousand dollar model...

Please.....tell me which one........and then tell me that the 4 thousand dollar model won't be the standard they set or you will be breaking the law...

Top Gun Safe Brands, Gun Safes For Security, American Made Gun Safes: GunSafes.com

Safeguard your firearms with reliable gun safes. Explore a wide range of gun safes at Gunsafes.com and keep your guns secure and accessible.

www.gunsafes.com

Here's a deal...only about 2 thousand dollars....and I am sure it will not take up too much room in my 2 bedroom apartment...

View attachment 497825

Here's a smaller one...only 4 thousand dollars...

View attachment 497826

Surely you jest, because your not including trigger lock's or supporting future technology that secures weapons through those processes. So you attempt to create this horse verses buggy type scenario, where as you present this ohhhh what do we do, try and fit the second huge old timey safe illustrated, into ones new millennial tiny house ???

The trigger lock technology should be good enough for that 22.cal, wherefore if it is unfortunately stolen, and they try to remove it, then it would destroy the weapons trigger system in doing so. But you know as well as I, that a determined thief with nothing but time on their hands, well they can do some very amazing things. Nothing truly is safe or truly can be locked down completely, but in each case presented we can study, look at the faults, critique it, and hopefully come up with future solutions that help us to do better.

Wow........create brand new technology so that if the criminal who breaks into the house will wreck the gun if they remove the trigger lock...

This is why the anti-gun extremists win....people like you who stretch and twist and bend and try to conform so they won't get mad.........

You are no better than the republicans in congress who fold to the democrats and give in a little each time because they think the democrats won't take everything at once if they give in an inch at a time......not thinking that each inch is an inch the democrats aren't giving back and they won't stop till they get it all.....you are just helping them, and giving them reason to keep fighting...

By your way of thinking, safety in anything relating to firearm's would have never gotten passed, and then what ?

Where would we be today if gun safety was left in the hands of million's who didn't ever have any gun training, no back ground checks, no gun experience, automatic's still legal to all who desires them, and worst of all we now live in a new situation where society is turning bad in the most rapid waves ever, but you decry any additional safety being implemented with the knowledge of what we are seeing today, (either created or engineered), and all because you just can't trust anyone in the government ?

I agree that I don't trust government today either, but seeing a safety issue that can be fixed very easily, is tremendously hard for me not to comment on. My conscious would kill me if I knew that my guns weren't secured to the best of my ability, and then worse if two kids actually breached my home security lock system, got into my home, and actually found my gun's laying around with the ammo nearby, and they did it without any struggle, then Houston we have a problem. That's just me I guess.

Sorry....we don't have an increase in gun accidents....and gun murder and gun crime was going down while more people owned and carried guns...

Responsible people are responsible and take gun safety classes...irresponsible people and criminals won't benefit from them...

Allowing anti-gun extremists in the government to set the standards that will decide if you can or can't own or carry a gun is just stupid.

It is a Right......you do not let the government decide if they will let you exercise a Right.

The guns were in a locked home. The home was violated........that is on the criminals who broke into the home...not the homeowner...

Get back to me if the homeowner leaves his guns in the middle of the street, unsupervised...then we can talk...

 

[beagle9]

View attachment 497923

Exactly, so don't just give them a loaded gun, and then say go play these days right ? I have my guns secure, so I guess I'm not understanding, because I'm not rich, but I saw it as a responsibility in owning weapons.

Your guns aren't secure enough.......whatever you have them in isn't up to what we want you to have them in, so you are going to have to fix that if you want to keep your guns...

First....we need you to pay a safe storage tax...this new tax will help us fight gun violence....but don't worry, it is only 10 dollars per gun.....anyone who doesn't want to murder people with their legal guns when criminals steal them should want to pay this tax....

Next....we need you to pay a tax on the size and weight of your safe....and for each locking device on your guns...this too will go to fight gun violence, and you should also be happy to pay this fee....if you don't, you obviously don't care if children kill each other with your guns....

Next.....we have updated our requirements for what is "safe storage." We can tell right now that whatever you have isn't enough......once you tell us how you store your guns we will tell you what we expect you to actually have...it should cost more than a few hundred to a few thousand dollars....otherwise you want mass public shooters to murder gay people and asians with your guns....

Next......we want you to get new technology....this technology makes your guns only work for you, on every other day of the week, and, of course, you will have to pay a new tax on that technology...........of course, we don't have this technology yet...so you will have to store your guns at a gun store or a police station until someone invents the technology....and since we want to shut down every gun store, you will either have to turn in your guns or sell them to the government.....but once we have the imaginary technology you can petition the government to get a new permit to pay a new tax and a new fee to wait to see if you qualify to own guns..........it shouldn't take more than 5 years, and odds are you won't be able to pass the new mandatory training and insurance requirements anyway...

And if you don't comply with this it is obvious that you want to commit a mass shooting after letting children use your guns to shoot each other after you commit suicide with your gun....



This is why I can't take you seriously........you actually think this is about safe gun storage...

No it's about having government representation that doesn't screw you or me over, but we have always improved our lives with the aid of government, but we don't have the proper government representation anymore, so it best to be responsible while in the absence of government that did work, instead of in the jaw's of a corrupt government that does not work... It only works for it's narratives or ideology given to it by it's powerful handlers. We currently have a governance problem that leads to many bad thing's, and it needs to be fixed.

 

[beagle9]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

You don't think like they do....that's why.

They don't care about guns being stored safely........they just know it now will cost you more to own your gun, and that some people will not want to have the hassle and the expense, and the safe taking up room....so they won't bother to get a gun........also....if they can get a mandatory law, then they can create an increased penalty if you fail to comply.......if you are burgled and they take your guns despite your gun safe? You then have to prove you actually locked up your guns, and you will still face the penalties of having your guns stolen....you won't have any benefit, just more expense and more risk...

It used to be just locks on your guns......now .....as you see in this post, that isn't enough...now they want a safe......will a safe on your nightstand be enough? Or will they next want a 700 pound safe bolted to your floor even if all you have is a .22 pistol.....

You had the Titan model A safe? Well according to new government regulations you need a Titan model B and if you don't get it, you will be committing a misdemeanor and will lose your gun rights forever......

You still don't understand how they think, and how they will fight this fight....

Oh I understand how they think, and yes you are right on alot of points, but then you just go bonkers attempting to clean up someone's damned mess that they caused in hopes to keep the government at bay over it. The problem we have today, is that we're not dealing with the same citizenry that we were dealing with years ago, so we have to adjust to the threat's, and to the government who is also dealing with the same situation's even if they created alot of it.

Okay.....I have a .22 caliber revolver I use for self defense...( I don't, but let's say I do....)

Which safe should I now be required to get to own that gun...before they allow me to own and carry that gun....the 2,818 dollar model or the 4 thousand dollar model...

Please.....tell me which one........and then tell me that the 4 thousand dollar model won't be the standard they set or you will be breaking the law...

Top Gun Safe Brands, Gun Safes For Security, American Made Gun Safes: GunSafes.com

Safeguard your firearms with reliable gun safes. Explore a wide range of gun safes at Gunsafes.com and keep your guns secure and accessible.

www.gunsafes.com

Here's a deal...only about 2 thousand dollars....and I am sure it will not take up too much room in my 2 bedroom apartment...

View attachment 497825

Here's a smaller one...only 4 thousand dollars...

View attachment 497826

Surely you jest, because your not including trigger lock's or supporting future technology that secures weapons through those processes. So you attempt to create this horse verses buggy type scenario, where as you present this ohhhh what do we do, try and fit the second huge old timey safe illustrated, into ones new millennial tiny house ???

The trigger lock technology should be good enough for that 22.cal, wherefore if it is unfortunately stolen, and they try to remove it, then it would destroy the weapons trigger system in doing so. But you know as well as I, that a determined thief with nothing but time on their hands, well they can do some very amazing things. Nothing truly is safe or truly can be locked down completely, but in each case presented we can study, look at the faults, critique it, and hopefully come up with future solutions that help us to do better.

Wow........create brand new technology so that if the criminal who breaks into the house will wreck the gun if they remove the trigger lock...

This is why the anti-gun extremists win....people like you who stretch and twist and bend and try to conform so they won't get mad.........

You are no better than the republicans in congress who fold to the democrats and give in a little each time because they think the democrats won't take everything at once if they give in an inch at a time......not thinking that each inch is an inch the democrats aren't giving back and they won't stop till they get it all.....you are just helping them, and giving them reason to keep fighting...

By your way of thinking, safety in anything relating to firearm's would have never gotten passed, and then what ?

Where would we be today if gun safety was left in the hands of million's who didn't ever have any gun training, no back ground checks, no gun experience, automatic's still legal to all who desires them, and worst of all we now live in a new situation where society is turning bad in the most rapid waves ever, but you decry any additional safety being implemented with the knowledge of what we are seeing today, (either created or engineered), and all because you just can't trust anyone in the government ?

I agree that I don't trust government today either, but seeing a safety issue that can be fixed very easily, is tremendously hard for me not to comment on. My conscious would kill me if I knew that my guns weren't secured to the best of my ability, and then worse if two kids actually breached my home security lock system, got into my home, and actually found my gun's laying around with the ammo nearby, and they did it without any struggle, then Houston we have a problem. That's just me I guess.

Sorry....we don't have an increase in gun accidents....and gun murder and gun crime was going down while more people owned and carried guns...

Responsible people are responsible and take gun safety classes...irresponsible people and criminals won't benefit from them...

Allowing anti-gun extremists in the government to set the standards that will decide if you can or can't own or carry a gun is just stupid.

It is a Right......you do not let the government decide if they will let you exercise a Right.

The guns were in a locked home. The home was violated........that is on the criminals who broke into the home...not the homeowner...

Get back to me if the homeowner leaves his guns in the middle of the street, unsupervised...then we can talk...

You are worse or just as bad as a Democrat in the way that you spin and make excuses over something that you are compassionate about. Doesn't make you totally right, just like it doesn't make the Democrat's right either, so one just hopes that a balance is met, and the right things are done.

In the case of the home owner, just get your guns locked up dude, especially if you are going on a trip or whatever. The end.

 

[2aguy]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

You don't think like they do....that's why.

They don't care about guns being stored safely........they just know it now will cost you more to own your gun, and that some people will not want to have the hassle and the expense, and the safe taking up room....so they won't bother to get a gun........also....if they can get a mandatory law, then they can create an increased penalty if you fail to comply.......if you are burgled and they take your guns despite your gun safe? You then have to prove you actually locked up your guns, and you will still face the penalties of having your guns stolen....you won't have any benefit, just more expense and more risk...

It used to be just locks on your guns......now .....as you see in this post, that isn't enough...now they want a safe......will a safe on your nightstand be enough? Or will they next want a 700 pound safe bolted to your floor even if all you have is a .22 pistol.....

You had the Titan model A safe? Well according to new government regulations you need a Titan model B and if you don't get it, you will be committing a misdemeanor and will lose your gun rights forever......

You still don't understand how they think, and how they will fight this fight....

Oh I understand how they think, and yes you are right on alot of points, but then you just go bonkers attempting to clean up someone's damned mess that they caused in hopes to keep the government at bay over it. The problem we have today, is that we're not dealing with the same citizenry that we were dealing with years ago, so we have to adjust to the threat's, and to the government who is also dealing with the same situation's even if they created alot of it.

Okay.....I have a .22 caliber revolver I use for self defense...( I don't, but let's say I do....)

Which safe should I now be required to get to own that gun...before they allow me to own and carry that gun....the 2,818 dollar model or the 4 thousand dollar model...

Please.....tell me which one........and then tell me that the 4 thousand dollar model won't be the standard they set or you will be breaking the law...

Top Gun Safe Brands, Gun Safes For Security, American Made Gun Safes: GunSafes.com

Safeguard your firearms with reliable gun safes. Explore a wide range of gun safes at Gunsafes.com and keep your guns secure and accessible.

www.gunsafes.com

Here's a deal...only about 2 thousand dollars....and I am sure it will not take up too much room in my 2 bedroom apartment...

View attachment 497825

Here's a smaller one...only 4 thousand dollars...

View attachment 497826

Surely you jest, because your not including trigger lock's or supporting future technology that secures weapons through those processes. So you attempt to create this horse verses buggy type scenario, where as you present this ohhhh what do we do, try and fit the second huge old timey safe illustrated, into ones new millennial tiny house ???

The trigger lock technology should be good enough for that 22.cal, wherefore if it is unfortunately stolen, and they try to remove it, then it would destroy the weapons trigger system in doing so. But you know as well as I, that a determined thief with nothing but time on their hands, well they can do some very amazing things. Nothing truly is safe or truly can be locked down completely, but in each case presented we can study, look at the faults, critique it, and hopefully come up with future solutions that help us to do better.

Wow........create brand new technology so that if the criminal who breaks into the house will wreck the gun if they remove the trigger lock...

This is why the anti-gun extremists win....people like you who stretch and twist and bend and try to conform so they won't get mad.........

You are no better than the republicans in congress who fold to the democrats and give in a little each time because they think the democrats won't take everything at once if they give in an inch at a time......not thinking that each inch is an inch the democrats aren't giving back and they won't stop till they get it all.....you are just helping them, and giving them reason to keep fighting...

By your way of thinking, safety in anything relating to firearm's would have never gotten passed, and then what ?

Where would we be today if gun safety was left in the hands of million's who didn't ever have any gun training, no back ground checks, no gun experience, automatic's still legal to all who desires them, and worst of all we now live in a new situation where society is turning bad in the most rapid waves ever, but you decry any additional safety being implemented with the knowledge of what we are seeing today, (either created or engineered), and all because you just can't trust anyone in the government ?

I agree that I don't trust government today either, but seeing a safety issue that can be fixed very easily, is tremendously hard for me not to comment on. My conscious would kill me if I knew that my guns weren't secured to the best of my ability, and then worse if two kids actually breached my home security lock system, got into my home, and actually found my gun's laying around with the ammo nearby, and they did it without any struggle, then Houston we have a problem. That's just me I guess.

Sorry....we don't have an increase in gun accidents....and gun murder and gun crime was going down while more people owned and carried guns...

Responsible people are responsible and take gun safety classes...irresponsible people and criminals won't benefit from them...

Allowing anti-gun extremists in the government to set the standards that will decide if you can or can't own or carry a gun is just stupid.

It is a Right......you do not let the government decide if they will let you exercise a Right.

The guns were in a locked home. The home was violated........that is on the criminals who broke into the home...not the homeowner...

Get back to me if the homeowner leaves his guns in the middle of the street, unsupervised...then we can talk...

You are worse or just as bad as a Democrat in the way that you spin and make excuses over something that you are compassionate about. Doesn't make you totally right, just like it doesn't make the Democrat's right either, so one just hopes that a balance is met, and the right things are done.

In the case of the home owner, just get your guns locked up dude, especially if you are going on a trip or whatever. The end.

And that is why the democrat walk all over individuals like you....

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

Sorry......that argument is foolish.....

Gun control....

Do what we want now, or we will get mad and take everything.

Gun Control....

Okay, now, we want this.....and if you don't give us this, this time...we will get mad and take everything....

Gun Control...

Okay, now, we also want this and you better give us this even though we said we only wanted those other things......because if you don't give us this, now.....we will get mad and take everything....


Sorry....you tell the fuckers...nope....we are going to push our side, convince people you are fascists, and you can go fuck yourselves.....

Listen you numbskull, people just like you are why the government is the way it is today, and why it takes advantage of you, because you lack the damn common sense the good Lord gave to a knat. Sorry, but that's the problem we are having today (people with no common sense anymore), and if you think that I'm not on the conservative side of all issues being a conservative myself, then you are the extremist here. I mean you actually pulled the damned race card to try and make a point. Good grief.

Didn't say you weren't a conservative.....I am saying you don't understand the left....and why they demand what they demand....and why giving them a bite at the time just allows them to digest the entire apple......sorry......you don't win by losing a baby step at a time...

I am a conservative, vote republican, and work for a living. I know what you are saying, but giving the government the keys to the car when we know it can't drive is just ludicrous. I ain't giving them those key's, so my guns are in the safe except for the one I carry.

It's actually sad we had to even have to deal with this in front of the government, because it never sleeps trying to destroy conservatism in this country.

I'm curious, what does stating "I work for a living" convey?

None of your business.

LOL, that's is so sad lol.

 

[beagle9]

Gun owners are amazingly responsible but when criminals break the law, break into homes, it isn't the fault of the home owner.......

This is why even the NRA agrees with guns having trigger locks, being kept in gun safes, and keeping the guns completely separate from the ammunition.

None of that was done.

Until you need the gun....you mean except for that...right? When the guy is in your home and you don't have 10 minutes to get to the safe, punch in the code, take out the gun, find the key to the trigger lock, unlock the lock, then go to where you keep the ammo, and, I imagine you want that in a separate safe too.........then load the gun....

The guy, or guys are in your home, likely armed.....but the 30 steps you need to deploy your weapon....I am sure they will wait till you get all the steps done...

Right?

These guns were in a locked house....they broke the law.....

If we let idiots like you set up mandatory storage rules then we will have to eventually store the keys to the gun locks at a police station or gun store and get written permission to access those keys before we can unlock the guns...

Sorry, no thanks.

They broke into a home......this is on them.

To start with, you are carrying your concealed weapon while you are away from the home, so if you return home and it's being robbed, then 1st you contact the law, and you get them on the way while you secure the perimeter. If you surprise the criminal's because you walked in on them, then hopefully you get the drop on them before they get you with your own guns left in an unsafe manor. But if you have your weapons secured, then you have the upper hand if they didn't bring the weapons with them. If you have your home secured, then you have the upper hand again, because hopefully their weaponry won't be as good as what you are carrying on your person. If they get the drop on you, then the the only hope is that the 9-11 call you might have made in the first senario (if you couldn't wait on them before going in) will have the police on the way in order to secure the location again, hopefully save you, and deal with the burglar's before they escape. The second situation is just going to be you and them if they get surprised.

I agree.....

But I will never support government mandates on storing your guns in your own home....that leads to draconian rules meant to entrap normal gun owners....not going to support it.

And I had a situation where we came home and the door was open.........we left the door open accidentally as it turned out....I didn't enter, I called the police....they searched the house...I didn't "secure the perimeter," I let them do it...that is how you do it...I also informed them that I had guns in the home........

Guns were secure, good work.

Yep....then the criminals broke in and stole them.

What you don't understand is there is no security level that will be acceptable to the anti-gun extremists.......and they want all locks and safes to be mandatory.....barring a lot of people from owning or carrying guns.......and then will come the home inspections to make sure you are following every single "i" and "t" they want you to dot and cross......

Life sentence if you steal guns.....that is how you stop this........but you want to help them make it impossible for normal people to own and carry guns......you think this is a ratinal, legitimate demand....it is not......they want mandatory locks and safes not for safety, but as an impediment to own and carry guns especially for the poor and minorities....it is also racist at its core...

I understand your fears of government, because I see it also big time these days, but if these things aren't addressed properly by we the citizen's, then the government that you fear will become a reality, because it's going to use or exploit everything to it's advantage, so if you leave the door open (metaphorically speaking), then the government is going to exploit that open doorway whether you and I like it or not. Most citizen's lock and secure their weapons, so I really don't think that we have an issue on our hands because of this case.

You don't think like they do....that's why.

They don't care about guns being stored safely........they just know it now will cost you more to own your gun, and that some people will not want to have the hassle and the expense, and the safe taking up room....so they won't bother to get a gun........also....if they can get a mandatory law, then they can create an increased penalty if you fail to comply.......if you are burgled and they take your guns despite your gun safe? You then have to prove you actually locked up your guns, and you will still face the penalties of having your guns stolen....you won't have any benefit, just more expense and more risk...

It used to be just locks on your guns......now .....as you see in this post, that isn't enough...now they want a safe......will a safe on your nightstand be enough? Or will they next want a 700 pound safe bolted to your floor even if all you have is a .22 pistol.....

You had the Titan model A safe? Well according to new government regulations you need a Titan model B and if you don't get it, you will be committing a misdemeanor and will lose your gun rights forever......

You still don't understand how they think, and how they will fight this fight....

Oh I understand how they think, and yes you are right on alot of points, but then you just go bonkers attempting to clean up someone's damned mess that they caused in hopes to keep the government at bay over it. The problem we have today, is that we're not dealing with the same citizenry that we were dealing with years ago, so we have to adjust to the threat's, and to the government who is also dealing with the same situation's even if they created alot of it.

Okay.....I have a .22 caliber revolver I use for self defense...( I don't, but let's say I do....)

Which safe should I now be required to get to own that gun...before they allow me to own and carry that gun....the 2,818 dollar model or the 4 thousand dollar model...

Please.....tell me which one........and then tell me that the 4 thousand dollar model won't be the standard they set or you will be breaking the law...

Top Gun Safe Brands, Gun Safes For Security, American Made Gun Safes: GunSafes.com

Safeguard your firearms with reliable gun safes. Explore a wide range of gun safes at Gunsafes.com and keep your guns secure and accessible.

www.gunsafes.com

Here's a deal...only about 2 thousand dollars....and I am sure it will not take up too much room in my 2 bedroom apartment...

View attachment 497825

Here's a smaller one...only 4 thousand dollars...

View attachment 497826

Surely you jest, because your not including trigger lock's or supporting future technology that secures weapons through those processes. So you attempt to create this horse verses buggy type scenario, where as you present this ohhhh what do we do, try and fit the second huge old timey safe illustrated, into ones new millennial tiny house ???

The trigger lock technology should be good enough for that 22.cal, wherefore if it is unfortunately stolen, and they try to remove it, then it would destroy the weapons trigger system in doing so. But you know as well as I, that a determined thief with nothing but time on their hands, well they can do some very amazing things. Nothing truly is safe or truly can be locked down completely, but in each case presented we can study, look at the faults, critique it, and hopefully come up with future solutions that help us to do better.

Wow........create brand new technology so that if the criminal who breaks into the house will wreck the gun if they remove the trigger lock...

This is why the anti-gun extremists win....people like you who stretch and twist and bend and try to conform so they won't get mad.........

You are no better than the republicans in congress who fold to the democrats and give in a little each time because they think the democrats won't take everything at once if they give in an inch at a time......not thinking that each inch is an inch the democrats aren't giving back and they won't stop till they get it all.....you are just helping them, and giving them reason to keep fighting...

By your way of thinking, safety in anything relating to firearm's would have never gotten passed, and then what ?

Where would we be today if gun safety was left in the hands of million's who didn't ever have any gun training, no back ground checks, no gun experience, automatic's still legal to all who desires them, and worst of all we now live in a new situation where society is turning bad in the most rapid waves ever, but you decry any additional safety being implemented with the knowledge of what we are seeing today, (either created or engineered), and all because you just can't trust anyone in the government ?

I agree that I don't trust government today either, but seeing a safety issue that can be fixed very easily, is tremendously hard for me not to comment on. My conscious would kill me if I knew that my guns weren't secured to the best of my ability, and then worse if two kids actually breached my home security lock system, got into my home, and actually found my gun's laying around with the ammo nearby, and they did it without any struggle, then Houston we have a problem. That's just me I guess.

Sorry....we don't have an increase in gun accidents....and gun murder and gun crime was going down while more people owned and carried guns...

Responsible people are responsible and take gun safety classes...irresponsible people and criminals won't benefit from them...

Allowing anti-gun extremists in the government to set the standards that will decide if you can or can't own or carry a gun is just stupid.

It is a Right......you do not let the government decide if they will let you exercise a Right.

The guns were in a locked home. The home was violated........that is on the criminals who broke into the home...not the homeowner...

Get back to me if the homeowner leaves his guns in the middle of the street, unsupervised...then we can talk...

You are worse or just as bad as a Democrat in the way that you spin and make excuses over something that you are compassionate about. Doesn't make you totally right, just like it doesn't make the Democrat's right either, so one just hopes that a balance is met, and the right things are done.

In the case of the home owner, just get your guns locked up dude, especially if you are going on a trip or whatever. The end.

And that is why the democrat walk all over individuals like you....

They've walked on you, and you haven't been able to do a damned thing about it, so IMO people in glass houses ought not to be throwing rocks.

 

[Baron Von Murderpaws]

Guns are ok.

For home protection, I prefer boobie traps.