Let’s define “war hero” and political “accomplishments”

[Seawytch]

I consider a man who flys into enemy territory with no support, dodging surface to air missiles a hero

I consider a man who takes a hit and bravely ejects in downtown Hanoi and is captured while severely injured to be a hero

I consider someone who endures torture on behalf of his country to be a hero

I consider someone who declines release unless others are released first to be a hero

Gee the way you put it almost makes it sound as if he defected.Like "bravely ejects in downtown Hanoi" instead of over an area where he might have been able to avoid being captured...as every other pilot did who`s plane was downed in enemy territory.

Seriously? Did you seriously just post that?

Every time I think they've hit bottom...they dig.

 

[bodecea]

I consider a man who flys into enemy territory with no support, dodging surface to air missiles a hero

I consider a man who takes a hit and bravely ejects in downtown Hanoi and is captured while severely injured to be a hero

I consider someone who endures torture on behalf of his country to be a hero

I consider someone who declines release unless others are released first to be a hero

Gee the way you put it almost makes it sound as if he defected.Like "bravely ejects in downtown Hanoi" instead of over an area where he might have been able to avoid being captured...as every other pilot did who`s plane was downed in enemy territory.

I hope you are bright enough to realize you are at the mercy of your plane

"I hope you are bright enough to realize you are at the mercy of your plane"
They forgot to mention that to me. I was taught that while flying VFR to always keep an eye open for suitable emergency landing sites and in IFR conditions how to avoid crashing in populated areas.
But in that case that particular plane was at the mercy of the pilot, not the other way around. He chose to fly it around over Hanoi where he wasn`t supposed to be. Maybe he was hoping they would not fire at him if he had jettisoned his armaments, was flashing his Nav-lights, dropped his landing gear and set his transponder to squawk 7700.
Assuming Soviet trained air defense in Hanoi would recognize his intentions.
And it`s not like he was hit at low altitude restricting his options where to land with a ~3 to 1 parachute glide ratio to downtown Hanoi !

Amazing...for someone who alleges they flew to post such incredible ignorance.

 

[bodecea]

Randy "Duke" Cunningham was a genuine Vietnam war hero. Duke Cunningham is credited with establishing the "Top Gun" school for fighter pilots after he shot down the top V.C. air ace in a dog fight in Vietnam. As a congressman he got in trouble accepting gifts from lobbyists similar to McCain in the Keating scandal. Democrats weren't satisfied with Cunningham's disgrace and resignation from congress. They were determined to see him behind bars in prison. McCain did nothing to help his fellow retired Navy aviator. McCain got a break because he had a reputation for betraying his own party but Cunningham went to prison.

Cunningham sold out his fellow shipmates by accepting bribes from a poor quality arms manufacturer...and he was a horrible officer who barely made Commander only because of his Ace status. And it was his RIO who actually did the work...a Flight officer who Cunningham never gave any credit to.

 

[bodecea]

damn the gop will eat their own so fast.....

View attachment 213215

Trump is in good company. Neither would want me at the funeral. Or you for that matter.

In reality, this is an indication of how deeply and bitterly the nation is divided. It's not Trump. It's the side he stands for. That's what they don't want. And they don't want that side dirtying up their world either.

Maybe it is because of the horrible things Trump said about McCain.

McCain is a scumbag. I knew that when he threw over the presidential election. I don't believe any of the story about his ship or his POW story.

Pure trumpanzee-ism.

 

[Seawytch]

McCain did more for this country and as a Senator than Hillary Clinton ever did...

You're right, he did. He served longer in the Senate than she did. Her, 3,000ish. Him 7,000ish pieces of legislation.

Hillary Rodham Clinton

Legislative Search Results

 

[bodecea]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

Keeping in mind that I personally disliked John McCain and though he was something of an asshole . . .

His "war hero" status comes less from having been captured, and more from the fact that he refused the offer of release from captivity while others remained behind. That took a level of character and loyalty to his country and his oaths as a soldier that I sincerely doubt either you or I would be able to muster.

Think very carefully before you let your political partisanship tell you that it's no big deal to piss on this memory. I advise you to err on the side of being a decent human being instead of a political hack piece of shit.

Look...you’re clearly the type to immediately move one to sainthood at the time of death...that’s cool, you be that sucker....I say **** THAT!
He was a shit-stain before he died, his legacy is that of a shit-stain. He disobeyed command and fucked a mission all up and paid a price for it. The fact that he denied release is folklore. Trump was right, good soldiers / hero’s obey commands and execute missions.

^trumpanzee lies. Pretty amazing to watch them progress like this.

 

[bodecea]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

If this were a professional football game, you would be kneeling.
What happened to giving respect to members of the military?
Another right wing LIE.

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

McCain's diseased, traitorous body is not the American flag.
And members of the military who are traitors are the foulest scumbags there are.

"members of the military who are traitors".........this from a trumpanzee, ladies and gentlemen.

 

[bodecea]

The douchebag McCain was not even born in the USA.

And Fat Donnie fought against heel spurs

and his own personal Viet Nam against STDs.....just like his supporters who lost their personal Viet Nams against STDs.

 

[evenflow1969]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

***** grabbing and hanging out with felons and the country club makes you a hero huh!

 

[easyt65]

^trumpanzee lies. Pretty amazing to watch them progress like this.

At least, thank God, we can still keep the plans and doctors we like...

 

[Flash]

McCain was a piss poor Navy Aviator.

If his Grandfather and Father weren't Navy Admirals he would have been courts martial for his cowardice and stupidity with the disaster on the Forrestal.

McCain was completely cleared of any responsibility of the USS Forrestal incident. A Navel video shows specifically where rhe errant missile came from, and it absolutely did not come from McCain's aircraft.

Navy never accused him of any kind of alleged cowardice. Only assholes like the poster "Flash" do.

Let me guess. You are a Moon Bat that believes every bit of fake news that you hear? Am I right or am I right?

When you are the son and grandson of four star admirals you can get "cleared" of a lot of things.

Here is a pretty good account of the investigation from a non biased source:

Investigating John McCain's Tragedy at Sea

Investigating John McCain's Tragedy at Sea

Whatever the circumstances of the fire’s origins, McCain did not stay on deck to help fight the blaze as the men around him did. With the firefighting crew virtually wiped out, men untrained in fighting fires had to pick up the fire hoses, rescue the wounded or frantically throw bombs and even planes over the ship’s side to prevent further tragedy. McCain left them behind and went down to the hangar-bay level, where he briefly helped crew members heave some bombs overboard. After that, he went to the pilot’s ready room and watched the fire on a television monitor hooked to a camera trained on the deck.

McCain has never been asked to explain why he claims that the Zuni rocket struck his plane. If a bomb or bombs subsequently fell from McCain’s plane as he has said, it seems to strongly suggests pilot error, and if a bomb or bombs did not fall from his plane, it suggests rash disregard for important facts in his accounts of the accident.

There is plenty more about this story that raises questions about McCain’s truthfulness and judgment. In the first hours after the fire, he apparently did not claim to have been injured. New York Times reporter R.W. Apple, who helicoptered out to the ship the day after the tragedy and sought out McCain as the “son and grandson of two noted admirals,” never mentioned him being wounded, although he reported on him more than on any other crew member. This would be an odd omission on Apple’s part if McCain indeed had been wounded, given that service wounds are usually highlighted in such reports during wartime. McCain’s own father, after seeing his son several weeks later, sent a letter to relatives and friends about the fire saying, “Happily for all of us, he [John] came through without a scratch.”2 A week after the fire, McCain made a statement in which he said that when he was on the hangar deck he noticed that he had a wound on his knee and small shrapnel cuts in his thigh and shoulder. He was not treated in sick bay, however, and he tells a story in “Faith of My Fathers” that seems to be at variance with the facts. He writes that he went to sick bay to have his wounds treated but when he got there, a “kid” who was “anonymous to me because the fire had burned off all of his identifying features” asked him if another pilot in the squadron was OK. When McCain replied that he was, the “kid” said “Thank God” and died before McCain’s eyes. McCain said that experience left him “unable to keep my composure,” and that is why he left sick bay without being treated.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

***** grabbing and hanging out with felons and the country club makes you a hero huh!

You don’t grab *****?
I thought you love felons...aren’t you always excusing criminality and encouraging criminal thirdworlders to invade the U.S.?

 

[easyt65]

McCain was a piss poor Navy Aviator.

If his Grandfather and Father weren't Navy Admirals he would have been courts martial for his cowardice and stupidity with the disaster on the Forrestal.

McCain was completely cleared of any responsibility of the USS Forrestal incident. A Navel video shows specifically where rhe errant missile came from, and it absolutely did not come from McCain's aircraft.

Navy never accused him of any kind of alleged cowardice. Only assholes like the poster "Flash" do.

Let me guess. You are a Moon Bat that believes every bit of fake news that you hear? Am I right or am I right?

When you are the son and grandson of four star admirals you can get "cleared" of a lot of things.

Here is a pretty good account of the investigation from a non biased source:

Investigating John McCain's Tragedy at Sea

Investigating John McCain's Tragedy at Sea

Whatever the circumstances of the fire’s origins, McCain did not stay on deck to help fight the blaze as the men around him did. With the firefighting crew virtually wiped out, men untrained in fighting fires had to pick up the fire hoses, rescue the wounded or frantically throw bombs and even planes over the ship’s side to prevent further tragedy. McCain left them behind and went down to the hangar-bay level, where he briefly helped crew members heave some bombs overboard. After that, he went to the pilot’s ready room and watched the fire on a television monitor hooked to a camera trained on the deck.

McCain has never been asked to explain why he claims that the Zuni rocket struck his plane. If a bomb or bombs subsequently fell from McCain’s plane as he has said, it seems to strongly suggests pilot error, and if a bomb or bombs did not fall from his plane, it suggests rash disregard for important facts in his accounts of the accident.

There is plenty more about this story that raises questions about McCain’s truthfulness and judgment. In the first hours after the fire, he apparently did not claim to have been injured. New York Times reporter R.W. Apple, who helicoptered out to the ship the day after the tragedy and sought out McCain as the “son and grandson of two noted admirals,” never mentioned him being wounded, although he reported on him more than on any other crew member. This would be an odd omission on Apple’s part if McCain indeed had been wounded, given that service wounds are usually highlighted in such reports during wartime. McCain’s own father, after seeing his son several weeks later, sent a letter to relatives and friends about the fire saying, “Happily for all of us, he [John] came through without a scratch.”2 A week after the fire, McCain made a statement in which he said that when he was on the hangar deck he noticed that he had a wound on his knee and small shrapnel cuts in his thigh and shoulder. He was not treated in sick bay, however, and he tells a story in “Faith of My Fathers” that seems to be at variance with the facts. He writes that he went to sick bay to have his wounds treated but when he got there, a “kid” who was “anonymous to me because the fire had burned off all of his identifying features” asked him if another pilot in the squadron was OK. When McCain replied that he was, the “kid” said “Thank God” and died before McCain’s eyes. McCain said that experience left him “unable to keep my composure,” and that is why he left sick bay without being treated.

I have fought in several wars now...and I will just say this... Unless you have been there, unless you have been under fire, unless you have seen chaos, fire, and death around you...you don't know. You may have an uneducated, inexperienced opinion, but you have no clue.

As far as what he remembers and does not, studies have shown that men in combat, in the same situations, have had different accounts of what goes on, of the details. I was not there. I was not on that deck as the fire raged, as men fought to keep from losing the ship,

All I will say, from one combat vet to another, Thank you for your service, Senator McCain.

 

[evenflow1969]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

***** grabbing and hanging out with felons and the country club makes you a hero huh!

You don’t grab *****?
I thought you love felons...aren’t you always excusing criminality and encouraging criminal thirdworlders to invade the U.S.?

I love felons yopur president hangs with them not me! By the way you do not know my politics at all! Find one thread of support for illegals under my name. You can't find one! You are a scum bag!

 

[BrokeLoser]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

***** grabbing and hanging out with felons and the country club makes you a hero huh!

You don’t grab *****?
I thought you love felons...aren’t you always excusing criminality and encouraging criminal thirdworlders to invade the U.S.?

I love felons yopur president hangs with them not me! By the way you do not know my politics at all! Find one thread of support for illegals under my name. You can't find one! You are a scum bag!

Awesome!
I love it when a twisted Lefty calls me a scumbag...that tells me my views are right on point.
Thanks for the confirmation...much appreciated.

 

[rightwinger]

rightwinger, let me guess, you dropped out of high school and found meth a hell of a drug.

Wrong

I am an award winning, internationally recognized message board poster

 

[koshergrl]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

If this were a professional football game, you would be kneeling.
What happened to giving respect to members of the military?
Another right wing LIE.

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

McCain's diseased, traitorous body is not the American flag.
And members of the military who are traitors are the foulest scumbags there are.

How, exactly was he a traitor?

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

Throwing the election is an act of treason if you do it to strengthen America's enemies.

I think he also committed treason as a POW, and before. I think he was responsible for his ship going up, too.

But just the fact that he lied to his constituents and then flipped on them and voted for obamacare is enough for me.

 

[Flash]

McCain was a piss poor Navy Aviator.

If his Grandfather and Father weren't Navy Admirals he would have been courts martial for his cowardice and stupidity with the disaster on the Forrestal.

McCain was completely cleared of any responsibility of the USS Forrestal incident. A Navel video shows specifically where rhe errant missile came from, and it absolutely did not come from McCain's aircraft.

Navy never accused him of any kind of alleged cowardice. Only assholes like the poster "Flash" do.

Let me guess. You are a Moon Bat that believes every bit of fake news that you hear? Am I right or am I right?

When you are the son and grandson of four star admirals you can get "cleared" of a lot of things.

Here is a pretty good account of the investigation from a non biased source:

Investigating John McCain's Tragedy at Sea

Investigating John McCain's Tragedy at Sea

Whatever the circumstances of the fire’s origins, McCain did not stay on deck to help fight the blaze as the men around him did. With the firefighting crew virtually wiped out, men untrained in fighting fires had to pick up the fire hoses, rescue the wounded or frantically throw bombs and even planes over the ship’s side to prevent further tragedy. McCain left them behind and went down to the hangar-bay level, where he briefly helped crew members heave some bombs overboard. After that, he went to the pilot’s ready room and watched the fire on a television monitor hooked to a camera trained on the deck.

McCain has never been asked to explain why he claims that the Zuni rocket struck his plane. If a bomb or bombs subsequently fell from McCain’s plane as he has said, it seems to strongly suggests pilot error, and if a bomb or bombs did not fall from his plane, it suggests rash disregard for important facts in his accounts of the accident.

There is plenty more about this story that raises questions about McCain’s truthfulness and judgment. In the first hours after the fire, he apparently did not claim to have been injured. New York Times reporter R.W. Apple, who helicoptered out to the ship the day after the tragedy and sought out McCain as the “son and grandson of two noted admirals,” never mentioned him being wounded, although he reported on him more than on any other crew member. This would be an odd omission on Apple’s part if McCain indeed had been wounded, given that service wounds are usually highlighted in such reports during wartime. McCain’s own father, after seeing his son several weeks later, sent a letter to relatives and friends about the fire saying, “Happily for all of us, he [John] came through without a scratch.”2 A week after the fire, McCain made a statement in which he said that when he was on the hangar deck he noticed that he had a wound on his knee and small shrapnel cuts in his thigh and shoulder. He was not treated in sick bay, however, and he tells a story in “Faith of My Fathers” that seems to be at variance with the facts. He writes that he went to sick bay to have his wounds treated but when he got there, a “kid” who was “anonymous to me because the fire had burned off all of his identifying features” asked him if another pilot in the squadron was OK. When McCain replied that he was, the “kid” said “Thank God” and died before McCain’s eyes. McCain said that experience left him “unable to keep my composure,” and that is why he left sick bay without being treated.

I have fought in several wars now...and I will just say this... Unless you have been there, unless you have been under fire, unless you have seen chaos, fire, and death around you...you don't know. You may have an uneducated, inexperienced opinion, but you have no clue.

As far as what he remembers and does not, studies have shown that men in combat, in the same situations, have had different accounts of what goes on, of the details. I was not there. I was not on that deck as the fire raged, as men fought to keep from losing the ship,

All I will say, from one combat vet to another, Thank you for your service, Senator McCain.

I am actually a Vietnam War veteran myself.

As a veteran I would like to honor McCain but have come to the conclusion that he is an asshole.

There are several questions about his service. I don't know if the stories are true but usually where there is smoke there is fire.

I lost respect for the sonofabitch as a politician. He epitomizes the RINO stereotype. Somebody that runs as a Conservative to get votes but seems to side with the filthy ass Democrats on too many issues.

He should have beat that worthless affirmative action dumbass Obama in 2008 but he did not have the courage to attack Obama on the issues that count. I think one of the reasons McCain hated Trump is that Trump had the courage to do what McCain didn't do.

McCain was petty and arrogant as a Senator. You should look at some of the videos of his questioning with the Senate Committee when somebody disagreed with him. For instance, he really attacked the lady lobbing to keep the search for MIA personnel funded.

One of the most despicable things I have seen a politician do was when McCain voted against the repeal of Obmacare. He campaigned on doing it but it is obvious that he voted it down just for the spite of not allowing Trump the win. Disgusting.

Piss on him.

 

[Vel]

damn the gop will eat their own so fast.....

View attachment 213215

I have already left word that Trump is not welcome at my funeral

Well damn. I bet you just broke his heart.

 

[Hellbilly]

Help me out here...outside of that backward world of LibTardia...do we refer to a soldier who fails to carry out and execute a mission as a hero?
In the world of sane folks....If a soldier disregards explicit instructions / orders, doesn’t follow a flight path and the mission ends in failure we call him a dumbass...don’t we?
Moving on....
In politics when a politician stands against members of his Party whom have all been elected and trusted by The People to carry out their wishes is he really standing for and acting on behalf of his constituency / The People?

If this were a professional football game, you would be kneeling.
What happened to giving respect to members of the military?
Another right wing LIE.

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

McCain's diseased, traitorous body is not the American flag.
And members of the military who are traitors are the foulest scumbags there are.

How, exactly was he a traitor?

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

Throwing the election is an act of treason if you do it to strengthen America's enemies.

I think he also committed treason as a POW, and before. I think he was responsible for his ship going up, too.

But just the fact that he lied to his constituents and then flipped on them and voted for obamacare is enough for me.

Let's see your proof.

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