Kansas lawmakers pass adoption bill against gay couples

[Rambunctious]

Children want a mommy and a daddy...not two daddies or two mommy's but this isn't about the children is it libs? Its not about whats best for the children its about making abnormal people feel normal...what a shame for the children...

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Personally I'm not gay so if you aren't why are you guys spending time obsessing abut what gay people do. Let them adopt children. Don't pretend that all mom and dad families have produced such outstanding results.

I'm not gay either and I do not spend a lot of time obsessing about what gay people do. That seems to be the crowd that wants to deny gays basic rights and claim that they want special rights who does that. But LGBT issues are a topic that interests me from a civil rights and legal viewpoint. We cannot turn our backs on any minority group who is experiencing discrimination and I will go to bat for any of them when the occasion rises. Having the attitude that it is every body for themselves does not speak well for us as a society.

 

[IM2]

Children want a mommy and a daddy...not two daddies or two mommy's but this isn't about the children is it libs? Its not about whats best for the children its about making abnormal people feel normal...what a shame for the children...

Children don't want a Larry Nassar for a dad and a mom that let's it happen. That's abnormal too.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Children want a mommy and a daddy...not two daddies or two mommy's but this isn't about the children is it libs? Its not about whats best for the children its about making abnormal people feel normal...what a shame for the children...

Debunked, bigoted bovine excrement. You don't know squat about children and care about them even less. They are nothing more to you than useful pawns in your quest to punish and marginalize gays people. Shame!!

 

[IM2]

Personally I'm not gay so if you aren't why are you guys spending time obsessing abut what gay people do. Let them adopt children. Don't pretend that all mom and dad families have produced such outstanding results.

I'm not gay either and I do not spend a lot of time obsessing about what gay people do. That seems to be the crowd that wants to deny gays basic rights and claim that they want special rights who does that. But LGBT issues are a topic that interests me from a civil rights and legal viewpoint. We cannot turn our backs on any minority group who is experiencing discrimination and I will go to bat for any of them when the occasion rises. Having the attitude that it is every body for themselves does not speak well for us as a society.

I agree with you on this.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Personally I'm not gay so if you aren't why are you guys spending time obsessing abut what gay people do. Let them adopt children. Don't pretend that all mom and dad families have produced such outstanding results.

From the outside looking in, I see both sides trying to use government mold society to their vision. Whatever happened to live and let live?

Yes live and let live. Lets gay folks adopt. In Kansas, they are nor using the government, they are being victimized by the government.

Hmmm.... that wasn't my reading of this law. My understanding is that it let's religious groups discriminate. Now, I'd agree that religious exemptions are bad law - everyone's right to discriminate should be protected equally - but this doesn't "victimize" anyone.

Every gay person who wants to adopt through an agency is victimized because they do not have the full choices available to others.

Every tax payer is victimized because they are being forced to subsidize discrimination. Yes, yes I know what you'll say. Tax money goes to many things that are less than savory and I would like to put a stop to that also. But this is something that did not have to happen and could be stopped and probably will be by the courts. Just because there may be other issues that involve the use of tax money, it does not mean that is a valid argument for looking the other way on this.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Yes live and let live. Lets gay folks adopt. In Kansas, they are nor using the government, they are being victimized by the government.

The law has nothing to do with the rights of gays to adopt children. This is about the rights of adoption agencies to discriminate, something we should be protecting rather than attacking.

They let them give up the tax $$$ damn it! THAT is what this is about

Sure... that's the point of getting people on the dole in the first place, right? - to twist arms. That's the scam of the welfare state. Make everyone dependent on government and government controls everyone.

You'll have to explain to me how this became about welfare, Or I'll have to call a red herring fallacy on you.

You brought it up. You were justifying government interference in the operation of the adoption agency based on the presumed fact that they receive government money.

Oh I see. Those subsidies are welfare. OK, but there is welfare that helps people ( I know, you'll say it makes them dependent) and there other kinds of welfare-corporate welfare for instance that makes the rich richer, and then there is this kind that rewards bigotry. See the difference?

 

[Rambunctious]

Debunked, bigoted bovine excrement. You don't know squat about children and care about them even less. They are nothing more to you than useful pawns in your quest to punish and marginalize gays people. Shame!!

Really? I raised three and put them through college and now I sit with my grandchildren and I believe placing children into a situation like that is wrong...You don't so fine...

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

The law has nothing to do with the rights of gays to adopt children. This is about the rights of adoption agencies to discriminate, something we should be protecting rather than attacking.

We should not be protecting the right to discriminate.

It is odd how some actually cry that they are being persecuted for their religion when they are NOT allowed to discriminate against their fellow citizens.

It's not odd at all. Discriminating is how we express our values in society. What's 'odd', and actually quite dangerous, is the desire to, instead, force our values on society via government.

So. you are one of the ones crying that we don't allow you to discriminate against your fellow citizens anymore?

Not really, but I do think government deciding these things is really dangerous. It makes personal values a matter of state mandate. Not the kind of government I want.

What kind of government do you want?. A government that allows people to run amok and discriminate against any group that they disapprove of, for any reason? What would that look like in every day life?? Rather chaotic I would guess. Anyone could be a victim at any time and my not even know it. You seem to have the idea that society will somehow sort it all out and things will be fine. I don't think so. Not big on natural selection in a world of unequal power and wealth where the strong can prey on the weak in the absence of government and law.

 

[Papageorgio]

The adoption agencies that get federal funding need to follow the federal adoption guidelines, those using state funding need to follow the state guidelines, I also believe the states have a right to set their own guidelines. The issue to me is irrelevant.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Debunked, bigoted bovine excrement. You don't know squat about children and care about them even less. They are nothing more to you than useful pawns in your quest to punish and marginalize gays people. Shame!!

Really? I raised three and put them through college and now I sit with my grandchildren and I believe placing children into a situation like that is wrong...You don't so fine...

Good for you ! But families come in many forms and the research shows that having parents of the opposite sex is one of the least important factors in child development . I would share it with you if I thought that you would be interested but I doubt that you would even look at it, because you would fear that it would undermine your preconceived ideas about gay parenting.
We now live in an evolving and more tolerant and enlightened world that seems to have left you behind.

 

[Rambunctious]

Good for you ! But families come in many forms and the research shows that having parents of the opposite sex is one of the least important factors in child development . I would share it with you if I thought that you would be interested but I doubt that you would even look at it, because you would fear that it would undermine your preconceived ideas about gay parenting.

I hope that you're not teaching your grand kids to be ignorant bigots. That is exactly what kids DO NOT NEED in order to make it in an evolving and more tolerant world that seems to have left you behind

Research shows? We can find "research" to back up any loony idea...Like I said if you think its okay fine...I don't...and no stupid liberal researcher will change my mind....

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Good for you ! But families come in many forms and the research shows that having parents of the opposite sex is one of the least important factors in child development . I would share it with you if I thought that you would be interested but I doubt that you would even look at it, because you would fear that it would undermine your preconceived ideas about gay parenting.

I hope that you're not teaching your grand kids to be ignorant bigots. That is exactly what kids DO NOT NEED in order to make it in an evolving and more tolerant world that seems to have left you behind

Research shows? We can find "research" to back up any loony idea...Like I said if you think its okay fine...I don't...and no stupid liberal researcher will change my mind....

Yup, as I thought. You are stuck in the mud and have given up the ability, and even the desire to learn anything new.

 

[dblack]

Every gay person who wants to adopt through an agency is victimized because they do not have the full choices available to others.

No, they're not. Refusing to accommodate the wishes of another person is not victimizing them.

This is the same old argument - namely the conflation of equal rights with equal privilege. Equal rights doesn't mean everyone has to treat everyone else equally. It means the law has to treat everyone equally. Your confusion would be innocent enough, but it's driving real policy, and it actually inverts the original concept of equal rights. A government preoccupied with making sure everyone is treating each other equally must, by design, treat people unequally.

 

[dblack]

Oh I see. Those subsidies are welfare. OK, but there is welfare that helps people ( I know, you'll say it makes them dependent) and there other kinds of welfare-corporate welfare for instance that makes the rich richer, and then there is this kind that rewards bigotry. See the difference?

No, I don't. It's the same conceit. The problem is everyone's version of 'helping people' is different.

 

[dblack]

We should not be protecting the right to discriminate.

It is odd how some actually cry that they are being persecuted for their religion when they are NOT allowed to discriminate against their fellow citizens.

It's not odd at all. Discriminating is how we express our values in society. What's 'odd', and actually quite dangerous, is the desire to, instead, force our values on society via government.

So. you are one of the ones crying that we don't allow you to discriminate against your fellow citizens anymore?

Not really, but I do think government deciding these things is really dangerous. It makes personal values a matter of state mandate. Not the kind of government I want.

What kind of government do you want?. A government that allows people to run amok and discriminate against any group that they disapprove of, for any reason?

Sans the 'run amok'(?), yes, people should allowed to discriminate according to their personal preferences, without having to justify those preferences to the state.

What would that look like in every day life?? Rather chaotic I would guess.

I guess you could look at it that way. Groupthink IS more orderly.

 

[IM2]

It is odd how some actually cry that they are being persecuted for their religion when they are NOT allowed to discriminate against their fellow citizens.

It's not odd at all. Discriminating is how we express our values in society. What's 'odd', and actually quite dangerous, is the desire to, instead, force our values on society via government.

So. you are one of the ones crying that we don't allow you to discriminate against your fellow citizens anymore?

Not really, but I do think government deciding these things is really dangerous. It makes personal values a matter of state mandate. Not the kind of government I want.

What kind of government do you want?. A government that allows people to run amok and discriminate against any group that they disapprove of, for any reason?

Sans the 'run amok'(?), yes, people should allowed to discriminate according to their personal preferences, without having to justify those preferences to the state.

What would that look like in every day life?? Rather chaotic I would guess.

I guess you could look at it that way. Groupthink IS more orderly.

This is ridiculous. And groupthink doesn't exist especially when you only use that to describe those who oppose you.

 

[dblack]

What would that look like in every day life?? Rather chaotic I would guess.

I guess you could look at it that way. Groupthink IS more orderly.

This is ridiculous. And groupthink doesn't exist.

Nuthin', eh?

 

[Aba Incieni]

While you people argue the nuances involved with sexual perversions, I'm supporting heteros, who outnumber homos by hundreds of millions in the US alone.

#HeteroPride

#ThinkForYourself

No problem with you supporting the sexual perversions of heteros.

I support humans- regardless of your sexual perversions- or lack thereof.

Cool. So you're good with a 35-year old man marrying an 8-year old girl.

Because you support humans, regardless of their sexual perversions.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

This is the same old argument - namely the conflation of equal rights with equal privilege. Equal rights doesn't mean everyone has to treat everyone else equally. It means the law has to treat everyone equally.

That is not what laws against discrimination say......but that is not what we are talking about here. If you want to talk about privilege , how about the privilege of being treated equally by others and the government. All should enjoy the same privilege or there is no equality. You can manipulate those words but in the end, the meaning is the same.