Jury deliberating in Michael Dunn trial

[BDBoop]

Nice dodge. See Post # 47. Point is, the white on black cases are sensationalized, but not the black on white cases. THAT is what we were talking about before you changed the subject.

Tell OJ that.

OJ's case was 20 years ago. If you have to go that far back, you've made my point.

Murder doesn't have a statute of limitations. It's not fluid. Therefore, your point is a crock o'shit.

 

[Sallow]

If you think you can do it, let's hear it, right now. I'm asking YOU, Asclepias. Now don't go ducking under that desk.

No gun was ever found in the car the victim was in.

He never called the cops even after claiming he was afraid of gang retaliation.

He never told his fiance the kid threatened him with a gun.

He lied about several parts of his testimony or changed his story.

Maybe you haven't heard all the facts. No gun was found. BUT, the SUV left the scene for a short time and went to the next shopping mall about 400 ft away, and then returned. Plenty of time to dump the gun, if there was one. And the police didn't come and look for the gun until 4 days later.

If he was afraid of gang retaliation, that would explain not calling the cops.

I don't know about the fiancee, but the SUV leaving and returning is the main thing, IMO.

Changing a story happens frequently among criminal defendants, and often turns out to be just stress and confusion. The main thing here is the SUV. Who can PROVE (beyond a reasonable doubt) that they didn't have a gun, and dumped it in that adjacent shopping plaza ? And without being able to prove that, I see conviction as impossible.

And this is the main problem with Stand Your Ground. The victim is left to prove the case.

Which is why it should be flushed down what ever toilet it crawled out of..

 

[jon_berzerk]

dunn didnt use stand your ground

 

[dannyboys]

Guilty or not guilty, these incidents are going to keep occurring because whites are getting tired of being harassed, threatened, and victimized by these thugs.

You being frightened has nothing to do with someone harrassing or threatening you. Grow a pair wussy.

Wake up genius. The ONLY way anyone becomes "frightened" is if something/some one is "threatening" or "harassing " them. God Almighty you are dumb.
All many 'young Black men' know how to do for fun is ****, fight, steal or assault or frighten innocent people. It's all they live for. Four of them cruising around in an SUV with 'thug music' turned up as loud as it will go is aggressive intimidating behavior. They know it. Everyone knows it.
It's little wonder the entire population of the planet will choose to move to the over side of the street when they see a 'crew' of 'young Black men' approaching them.

 

[Agit8r]

Only your warped brain would interpret it like that. If you could read everyone already contributed to the intellectual inferiors like you. Go back and concentrate hard on the evidence and you will have your explanation.

If you think you can do it, let's hear it, right now. I'm asking YOU, Asclepias. Now don't go ducking under that desk.

No gun was ever found in the car the victim was in.

He never called the cops even after claiming he was afraid of gang retaliation.

He never told his fiance the kid threatened him with a gun.

He lied about several parts of his testimony or changed his story.

Yeah, pretty telling that he never called the cops. Clearly just another psychopath looking for people to kill. You can see it in his eyes. It pains me as a liberal to admit that some members of humanity (like this guy) are simply irredeemable :-[

 

[dannyboys]

Guilty or not guilty, these incidents are going to keep occurring because whites are getting tired of being harassed, threatened, and victimized by these thugs.

There's some truth in that, seems to me.
White people though need to get some tolerance, patience, and cool, calm and rational thinking...and make sure they always obey the law.
Penalties for breaking the law can be very severe, especially in America.

Retreat is often the wisest part of valour.

There is a limit to what people will tolerate. Why does anyone have to "retreat" when they feel they are being threatened?
Hence the SYG law in virtually every state now. And it's driving the LIBs crazy. B/c virtually every crime committed is by their 'base'.
Is this what's it's come to? A bunch of simian thugs roaming the streets looking to commit felony assault 'because they are "bored" is allowed to threaten and intimidate and assault innocent people and it wouldn't have happened if the victim had only "retreated"? Is this what a civilized society must tolerate for fear of being called "racist"?
Why must anyone be "tolerant" or "patient" or "cool" or "calm"?
What is civilized society dealing with? A race of people who are apparently genetically incapable of behaving themselves so the rest of society must continually make excuses for their endemic antisocial behavior b/c a chef in Africa sold his Black slaves to a Dutch trading ship for a pice of broken mirror centuries ago?

 

[jon_berzerk]

Guilty or not guilty, these incidents are going to keep occurring because whites are getting tired of being harassed, threatened, and victimized by these thugs.

There's some truth in that, seems to me.
White people though need to get some tolerance, patience, and cool, calm and rational thinking...and make sure they always obey the law.
Penalties for breaking the law can be very severe, especially in America.

Retreat is often the wisest part of valour.

it isnt only "white people" who benefit from STG or self defense laws

this laws are available to any law abiding person

regardless of race or sex

 

[JakeStarkey]

The HLN 'Verdict Watch', for what it is or is not worth, seem to believe that the jury is fighting over Murder 1 vs Murder 2, with maybe 1 or 2 or 3 hold outs for the Murder 2 verdict.

How could either of those be the verdict ? How can anyone establish that it was not self-defense ? (beyond a reasonable doubt)

No proof of a gun by the victim or his friends.

Firing at least three shots at a fleeing car.

Death is not the punishment for loud music.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Perspective: In defense of stand your ground laws

...
Who benefits from the law? Actually, since poor blacks who live in high-crime urban areas are the most likely victims of crime, they are also the ones who benefit the most from stand your ground laws. The laws make it easier for would-be victims to protect themselves when the police can't arrive fast enough. Therefore, rules that make self-defense more difficult disproportionately impact blacks.

Blacks make up 16.6 percent of Florida's population but account for 31 percent of the defendants invoking the stand your ground defense. Black defendants who invoke this statute are actually acquitted 8 percentage points more frequently than whites who use this very same defense.

Those who conclude the law is racially biased point to data compiled by the Tampa Bay Tribune, which collected 112 cases where people charged with murder relied on Florida's stand your ground law, from the first cases in 2006 to July 24 of this year. The Tribune's "shocking" claim: 72 percent of those who killed a black person faced no penalty compared to 59 percent of those who killed a white.

But this doesn't tell the whole story as blacks are overwhelmingly killed by other blacks. Thus, it is also true that blacks claiming self-defense under the stand your ground law are convicted at a lower rate than are whites. About 69 percent of blacks raising the stand your Ground defense were not convicted compared to 62 percent of whites.

In defense of stand your ground laws - Chicago Tribune

 

[jon_berzerk]

The HLN 'Verdict Watch', for what it is or is not worth, seem to believe that the jury is fighting over Murder 1 vs Murder 2, with maybe 1 or 2 or 3 hold outs for the Murder 2 verdict.

How could either of those be the verdict ? How can anyone establish that it was not self-defense ? (beyond a reasonable doubt)

No proof of a gun by the victim or his friends.

Firing at least three shots at a fleeing car.

Death is not the punishment for loud music.

No proof of a gun by the victim or his friends.

Firing at least three shots at a fleeing car.

there does not have to be proof of a gun in the car

it is if dunn reasonably had fear for his life

what i find hard for the defense to overcome

is the not reporting the incident to the cops

and leaving the city like nothing happened

the girlfriend must have gotten a sweetheart deal to take the stand

she should have been charged as well

 

[PredFan]

Perspective: In defense of stand your ground laws

...
Who benefits from the law? Actually, since poor blacks who live in high-crime urban areas are the most likely victims of crime, they are also the ones who benefit the most from stand your ground laws. The laws make it easier for would-be victims to protect themselves when the police can't arrive fast enough. Therefore, rules that make self-defense more difficult disproportionately impact blacks.

Blacks make up 16.6 percent of Florida's population but account for 31 percent of the defendants invoking the stand your ground defense. Black defendants who invoke this statute are actually acquitted 8 percentage points more frequently than whites who use this very same defense.

Those who conclude the law is racially biased point to data compiled by the Tampa Bay Tribune, which collected 112 cases where people charged with murder relied on Florida's stand your ground law, from the first cases in 2006 to July 24 of this year. The Tribune's "shocking" claim: 72 percent of those who killed a black person faced no penalty compared to 59 percent of those who killed a white.

But this doesn't tell the whole story as blacks are overwhelmingly killed by other blacks. Thus, it is also true that blacks claiming self-defense under the stand your ground law are convicted at a lower rate than are whites. About 69 percent of blacks raising the stand your Ground defense were not convicted compared to 62 percent of whites.

In defense of stand your ground laws - Chicago Tribune

This isn't a case of stand your ground.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Perspective: In defense of stand your ground laws

...
Who benefits from the law? Actually, since poor blacks who live in high-crime urban areas are the most likely victims of crime, they are also the ones who benefit the most from stand your ground laws. The laws make it easier for would-be victims to protect themselves when the police can't arrive fast enough. Therefore, rules that make self-defense more difficult disproportionately impact blacks.

Blacks make up 16.6 percent of Florida's population but account for 31 percent of the defendants invoking the stand your ground defense. Black defendants who invoke this statute are actually acquitted 8 percentage points more frequently than whites who use this very same defense.

Those who conclude the law is racially biased point to data compiled by the Tampa Bay Tribune, which collected 112 cases where people charged with murder relied on Florida's stand your ground law, from the first cases in 2006 to July 24 of this year. The Tribune's "shocking" claim: 72 percent of those who killed a black person faced no penalty compared to 59 percent of those who killed a white.

But this doesn't tell the whole story as blacks are overwhelmingly killed by other blacks. Thus, it is also true that blacks claiming self-defense under the stand your ground law are convicted at a lower rate than are whites. About 69 percent of blacks raising the stand your Ground defense were not convicted compared to 62 percent of whites.

In defense of stand your ground laws - Chicago Tribune

This isn't a case of stand your ground.

yes i am well aware of that

 

[jon_berzerk]

jury is coming back in it appears

maybe have the verdict(s)

Michael Dunn Jordan Davis | Jury Verdict | Verdict Watch

 

[jon_berzerk]

it turns out another question

is the defense of self defense for each person

is justifiable in each against before each person

 

[dannyboys]

it turns out another question

is the defense of self defense for each person

is justifiable in each against before each person

All three questions related to 'self-defense'. Which means that is what the jury is focused on. They have long since decided against M1 or M2 or even man-slaughter.
Like I said: "Dunn The Walking Man". Next time some simians decide to try to threaten and intimidate '******' maybe some of them are sentient enough to remember what happens if they choose someone who is willing to defend themselves.

 

[protectionist]

Guilty or not guilty, these incidents are going to keep occurring because whites are getting tired of being harassed, threatened, and victimized by these thugs.

There's some truth in that, seems to me.
White people though need to get some tolerance, patience, and cool, calm and rational thinking...and make sure they always obey the law.
Penalties for breaking the law can be very severe, especially in America.

Retreat is often the wisest part of valour.

Trouble with that is "retreat" creates a culture wherin Blacks (the loony segment of them) harass (if not physically harm) whites, and other races. Question to consider is, being harassed, if not attacked, any way to go through life ?

Also, by continually retreating, that encourages MORE harassment, and the situation gets worse. As a White/Hispanic, I carry a gun, with a concealed weapon permit, bullet in the chamber, ready to fire, and won't hestitate to shoot if I am attacked. If anyone of any race gives me verbal crap, I give it right back to them.

I just wonder how many of these kind of shootings it's going to take before people learn to conduct themselves in a civil manner when out in public. And realize (at least here in Florida) it can be dangerous not to. Hopefully Blacks, and anybody, will get focused soon.

 

[Shaarona]

Guilty or not guilty, these incidents are going to keep occurring because whites are getting tired of being harassed, threatened, and victimized by these thugs.

There's some truth in that, seems to me.
White people though need to get some tolerance, patience, and cool, calm and rational thinking...and make sure they always obey the law.
Penalties for breaking the law can be very severe, especially in America.

Retreat is often the wisest part of valour.

Trouble with that is "retreat" creates a culture wherin Blacks (the loony segment of them) harass (if not physically harm) whites, and other races. Question to consider is, being harassed, if not attacked, any way to go through life ?

Also, by continually retreating, that encourages MORE harassment, and the situation gets worse. As a White/Hispanic, I carry a gun, with a concealed weapon permit, bullet in the chamber, ready to fire, and won't hestitate to shoot if I am attacked. If anyone of any race gives me verbal crap, I give it right back to them.

I just wonder how many of these kind of shootings it's going to take before people learn to conduct themselves in a civil manner when out in public. And realize (at least here in Florida) it can be dangerous not to. Hopefully Blacks, and anybody, will get focused soon.

Your hero is a wife beater and cocaine fueled idiot.

 

[bodecea]

If he walks...this certainly gives black people in Florida the impression that they can be shot with impunity....with the excuse that black people are threatening enough to shoot.

 

[protectionist]

Guilty or not guilty, these incidents are going to keep occurring because whites are getting tired of being harassed, threatened, and victimized by these thugs.

There's some truth in that, seems to me.
White people though need to get some tolerance, patience, and cool, calm and rational thinking...and make sure they always obey the law.
Penalties for breaking the law can be very severe, especially in America.

Retreat is often the wisest part of valour.

But that's my point, they've shown amazing tolerance for decades and it's running out. Whites were willing to give up discrimination but blacks don't want to let the past go. Most of the people who discriminated in the past are dead. Most whites today have never practiced discrimination but are being targeted as though they have. How long can they be expected to put up with it?

What makes it even worse, and amazing, is that we minorities are accorded affirmative action by the white establishment. We are given the right to jump ahead of them in lines for jobs, promotions, college admissions and financial aid, etc. Yet still these anti-white knuckleheads act like they are being oppressed, and mouth off angrily, at every available time. Maybe somebody in heir own ranks ought to tell them to shut the hell up. If anybody has a right to be angry, it's the whites.

 

[protectionist]

If he walks...this certainly gives black people in Florida the impression that they can be shot with impunity....with the excuse that black people are threatening enough to shoot.

No it doesn't. The only impression it would give (to an intelligent mind) is that if a killing cannot be proven to be something other than self-defense, then there cannot be a conviction. It's about time for everybody (including Blacks) to stop acting stupid.